darkstar

Well now, this is something new for me. I feel like today I have it under control. I will go to a meeting after work, talk with some people and then home. Thing is I am struggling with the "God" thing. I'm not sure if I am agnostic or an atheist or what. It is so tough being in a meeting and hearing "god" this and "god" that. Someone help me with this please.

2dayzmuse

Many of us had the same problem with the "God" thing in the beginning. We deal with it in our own ways. The Big Book helps deal with how to come to terms with your HP and beliefs. For myself it was easy. Without faith, I had nothing. I had faith that there had to be a better way other then my own. Had to be a better purpose for myself and my lifestyle. I took the leap of faith and my life has become more fulfilling. More manageable and at ease. I had nothing to lose and everything to gain. It's really quite simple. As soon as I quit fighting the word "God", and started to take action, things became to fall into place and make sense. Our minds are an amazing thing to put to use. It can also become our biggest road block to pass by. Clear the rubble and it's smooth sailing ahead. Good luck on your meeting tonight. It does get easier and less confusing. Acceptance is part of the process.

LeAnne

sherbear5104

You are not alone. As Leanne said, many of us had a problem with the "God" thing. There have been a few suggestions I've heard at AA. For now, it can be the group as a whole. A group of people is a higher power than one person. You can also use the words Good Orderly Direction. It will come in time. If you can get a 12 steps and 12 traditions book (12+12) there is alot of good stuff on this in step 2. Best wishes in your journey, and have a good meeting tonight.

Sherry

exlibris

I know what you mean about the "God" thing. I was raised a Catholic and had a hard time dealing with "God" in the meetings I attended.

I think there is some form of Creator or Higher Power. I'm not sure how to define it but it is something very personal. It's as though I have my own personal God/Goddess. So in a meeting, when someone says "God" I think that it's the God/Goddess I understand.

That's what worked for me.

I hope it's helped.

Phinneas

Darkstar-- I too had doubts and reservations, not about god, but about AA. However, after failing every time on my own, I decided to emerse myself in meetings, the steps and recovery. I got a sponsor who is absolutely terrific. So, I basically got to a place where I was WILLING to do 12 step recovery to heal and to save my life. Let's not forget that this is about literally saving our lives. Looking at it that way, I urge you and anyone else struggling with these issues to be honest, open and willing. And, about the god issue: the 12 steps are not a religion or a cult, they simply ask each person to have a god of their understanding. This can mean nature, the group, a wise woman/man, native american traditions, cosmology... anything that is bigger than you and I are individually. I would suggest that you get a sponsor if you don't have one already who can also help you explore this as well.

jojo

P.S. Someone else on these boards said that god can be Good Orderly Direction or Group Of Drunks. Both work for some!

darkstar

thanks everyone, this place here is such a help, i will press on, and not try and figure everything out

subliminalurge

Good plan. One of the guys at my meetings is fond of the phrase "Fake it 'til ya make it". What he means by that is, at the beginning, just get to the meetings, plant your butt in a chair, and work the program as best you can even if you have reservations. The rest will come when it's time for it to come.

findingout

darkstar,

Remember "The only requirement for membership is the desire to stop drinking." Your higher power does not have to be the same higher power as the person sitting next to you. You don't have to think exactly like everyone else to be a member.

I too had a problem with the God thing. Finally, I asked myself "self, what is it that makes you so uncomfortable listening to another human describe their relationship with their higher power?"

For me, the tables are the best evidence of a higher power I have found. Something is bringing/has brought all these hurting, selfish, and confused people together to help each other. Whether I choose to give that higher power a name or share that name with others is completely up to me.

Out of all the A.A. catch phrases I think "Fake it 'til you make it" is the one that grates on me the most. Perhaps because I spent 25 years "faking it" about too many things. If you have "reservations", think carefully about what they are and why you really have them. For me, my early reservations turned out to be misconceptions or worse, thinly vailed excuses to allow me to return to drinking.

Your higher power gave you a brain, so it is OK to use it. Just don't "think" your way out of recovery. Accept the fact the you didn't become an alcoholic over night and that you are not going to understand everything about the program or recovery in one week.

Be open, honest, and willing and you WILL make it. One day at a time just like the rest of us.

Jah Bless

mill

This is what keeps me away from AA meetings. Sounds more like cult indoctrination and I can't deal with that. Never understood the need for religious people to push it on others. Heck I can barely stand weddings. Doing well at the moment on my own though, just need to keep buying toys and staying busy.

Is there such thing as AA meetings that don't rely on "higher powers"? Higher power didn't make me a drunk, shyness and the desire to overcome it through any means I found did. I did. Not God, not somone else, not the beer fairy, me, my big stinking liver and I. I have a weakness that most people do not. I think the biggest flaw, we, as drunks, ever have had, is denial of personal responsibility, and relying on a "higher power" is more of the same.

I really do not mean offense, if believing in a God makes you have purpose, good for you, but there are alot of us out there who believe in tangible things and science alone. If there was a God, why would he allow people to be drunks in the first place, when he would have to help you become sober anyway? /boggle.

The people in this forum, have helped, by listening, some very nice private messages, and even some tough, harsh ones. That, is as close to a "higher power" as I am willing to admit, a collection of individuals helping people with similar problems.

Thanks,

Mill

findingout

Oh yes. The Cult of AA. My father actually believes I have joined a cult. The following is excerpted from

http://la.essortment.com/whatisdefiniti_rjli.htm

"To avoid careless labeling which could be harmful to a group and its adherents, it is important to know just exactly what a cult is, and how it is defined. A cult, by modern standards, is any group that incorporates mind control to deceive, influence and govern its followers. The mind control, or brainwashing, exerted by cults often take the form of at least several of the following elements:

A totalitarian control over the lifestyle and time of its members - Many cults tend to dictate exactly what its followers should read, eat, how and with whom they should spend their time, and even what they should do in off hours.

A charismatic, self-appointed leader with complete authority - Cult members are taught not to question the teachings, practices, or ideas of the leader. Many cult leaders truly are charismatic people, and are able to influence people to believe them. It is common that a cult member is not told everything up front when joining the group, but that they are taught increasingly controlling ideas and teachings as they go.

A focus on withholding truth from non-members - Many cults teach their followers to be completely open and truthful within the group, while at the same time they are encouraged to be secretive and evasive when questioned by people outside of the group."

OK, this describes Scientology fairly well but I can't find a whole lot of A.A. or N.A here.

Certainly there are many ways over the mountain and as long as you get to the other side, it really doesn't matter how you did it.

Jah Bless

lulu70

Mill--Keep doing what you are doing, and you will keep getting what you are getting. If I had tried to hold on to the idea that I knew what was best for me and that my way was the best way, I would be drunk or stoned right now. Just my two cents worth.

Moontime

Mill, I'm curious how long have you been clean and has it been a good road or a bad one? Most of the people who I know that are closed-minded to anything that would help them, usually suffer daily. I was in your shoes once, and it was very painful until I saw hope and I saw a non-religious, yet spiritual program save many peoples lives. I felt so ignorant that I kept fighting something that has saved 1,000's upon 1,000's of lives. Yet, I that was for the "other" people, until my life got so miserable clean and sober. I wasn't using, but I might as well have been, I was in so much pain.



(((((9If there was a God, why would he allow people to be drunks in the first place, when he would have to help you become sober anyway? /boggle.)))))

Why are you blaming god for what people are doing. Who's drinking? God or people? Don't get it twisted.


((((Higher power didn't make me a drunk, shyness and the desire to overcome it through any means I found did. I did)))))

Exactly, If you kept doing what your doing and your going to get what you always got. You controlled your life, how did that go, since you've been in the drivers seat?