Is alcohol a choice or an addiction
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Join Date: Jun 2015
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Is alcohol a choice or an addiction
As I have been reading the threads I constantly find people relapsing, and telling stories of their drinking pasts. I am starting to wonder if alcoholic behaviour is our choice as opposed to an addiction. There are many stories of people going 10 and 20 days sober then relapsing and then stopping and then relapsing, like a yo-yo back and forth. If we can stop for days between binges are we really addicted. For example , a heroin addict goes through intense cravings and withdrawals , they need their heroin or opiates or they get sick. I realise the chronic alcoholic is the same way, he will get sick as well. However many of the stories I am reading on SR, describe people who to me do not seem like they are addicted to alcohol but they have a problem with it. Any comments would be helpful to clarify this for me.
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Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 431
I am starting to understand that addictive behaviour is learned and conditioning of neural pathways. Some people have a nature that is more predisposed to addiction than others due to psyhcological issues.
The positive side is we can train our brains to form new neural pathways and overcome the addiction. To do that we also need to address what is missing at a spiritual level.
The positive side is we can train our brains to form new neural pathways and overcome the addiction. To do that we also need to address what is missing at a spiritual level.
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Join Date: Jun 2015
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Thank you , Gerard that's what I am starting to learn , we need to retrain our brains so to speak. I had very bad habit of binge drinking every weekend for 40 years, I can not actually recall when it started to become unpleasant , probably a few years back , hangovers were worse , anxiety and self hatred set in and my tolerance was slipping and I was getting drinker every weekend. I actually remember early on drinking for social aspect , my drinking became my obsession in the end , so now I am on my sober journey.
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Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: Australia
Posts: 1,499
To Gerard's point, scientists are beginning to understand that there is a physiological aspect to psychological addiction. Once an alcohol is past the physical withdrawals, they should be able to choose not to drink, yet many do, out of habit.
The habit loop is key: cue, routine, reward. Cue is what we call "trigger" here on SR. The cue leads to the routine (i.e. drinking). The reward is feeling good, or numbing out, etc.
When faced with a cue, change the routine and keep the reward. So, replace the drinking with exercise, say. The reward is you still feel good.
This is how to replace a habit.
This is all described in Charles Duhigg's book The Power of Habit. He spends a bit of time talking about AA in his book.
The habit loop is key: cue, routine, reward. Cue is what we call "trigger" here on SR. The cue leads to the routine (i.e. drinking). The reward is feeling good, or numbing out, etc.
When faced with a cue, change the routine and keep the reward. So, replace the drinking with exercise, say. The reward is you still feel good.
This is how to replace a habit.
This is all described in Charles Duhigg's book The Power of Habit. He spends a bit of time talking about AA in his book.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 349
Originally Posted by MissPerfumado 
The habit loop is key: cue, routine, reward. Cue is what we call "trigger" here on SR. The cue leads to the routine (i.e. drinking). The reward is feeling good, or numbing out, etc.
When faced with a cue, change the routine and keep the reward. So, replace the drinking with exercise, say. The reward is you still feel good.
When faced with a cue, change the routine and keep the reward. So, replace the drinking with exercise, say. The reward is you still feel good.
I delayed sobriety for many years as I held an ongoing internal debate questioning whether or not I was an “alcoholic”. I came to realize that label, for me, was not relevant. The fact was I had a nasty habit that ate up hours of each and every day and was making me miserable.
I know I can’t drink like normal people, because my goal when drinking was never a laughing lunch at a cafe with friends. I drank to oblivion. The label isn’t necessary for me to accept that drinking, for me, is not an option.
Breaking that habit has taken time and effort to put other activities in the place of those wasted hours and find other ways to deal with the emotional fallout that got me to that problem in the first place. All that to say, I didn’t have to resolve the addiction vs. habit vs. disease debate for myself to accept that it was time for change.
-bora
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Location: Atlanta
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Glad you are sharing....I think the key thing you shared is that you aren't ready to quit for good. Until I got to that point, the other "stuff" didn't matter. We are here to support you in your journey and have plenty of experience to share about what action we took beyond feeling strong (then not...). Hope you join us.
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
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Hi Bunchie
One thing that doesn't often come up in threads like these is that people change
Drinking was a choice for me for many years (a bad choice sure but still a choice) then It stopped being a choice and became a necessity...and after a lot of work and effort it became a choice again and now it's simply not an option no matter what.
I'n glad that you're asking questions but if I may suggest - try to not think too much about other people and their journeys.
None of us can really know another's struggle from a few internet posts.
D
One thing that doesn't often come up in threads like these is that people change
Drinking was a choice for me for many years (a bad choice sure but still a choice) then It stopped being a choice and became a necessity...and after a lot of work and effort it became a choice again and now it's simply not an option no matter what.
I'n glad that you're asking questions but if I may suggest - try to not think too much about other people and their journeys.
None of us can really know another's struggle from a few internet posts.
D
Member
Join Date: Jul 2018
Location: UK
Posts: 431
For me it is important to know what it is so I can address it. A great fear is that I will be left a feeling that something is missing and be a dry drunk. From what I have found I do not think that will be the case.
The thought that we have the ability to change our habits physiologically and psychologically is empowering particularly at the beginning of the journey.
The thought that we have the ability to change our habits physiologically and psychologically is empowering particularly at the beginning of the journey.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: MN
Posts: 8,704
In the middle of a serious bender I would be inclined to say you are addicted. When sober and we take that first drink which turns into a bender, to me that's a choice.
Overall I come from the school of thought that thinks alcoholic drinking is a choice.
Overall I come from the school of thought that thinks alcoholic drinking is a choice.
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by Dee74
One thing that doesn't often come up in threads like these is that people change
Drinking was a choice for me for many years (a bad choice sure but still a choice) then It stopped being a choice and became a necessity.
i was able to make the choice when i was in an early stage of alcoholism. then i crossed the line,took a step into a deeper stage of alcoholism, and gave up the power of choice- even when i didnt want to drink, i couldnt not drink.
not everyone that comes here is a full blown alcoholic that lost the power of choice.
theres a mental and physical addiction to both alcohol and heroin.
Member
Join Date: Oct 2017
Location: Minnesota, USA
Posts: 1,468
Drinking for me has always been a choice. I chose to drink and then I had to face the consequences of the night before. My life became unmanageable with alcohol involved, so I removed alcohol and my life is far from unmanageable.
I made the choice to feed the beast, the beast then took over with cravings, never having enough, and then wanting more drugs (coke). It was an ugly DARK place to be in. To keep the beast at bay, I no longer feed it.
I don't have to drink to have a good time.
I don't have to drink to rid social anxiety.
I don't have to drink to be around certain people.
I don't have to drink for stress relief
I don't have to drink as a reward
I don't have to drink because the sun is out
I don't have to drink.
I like being free from the constant nagging of drink... When can I drink next, will I be able to control my drinking this time, I am not going to have too much, I am not going to black out...- That worked a few times but mostly I would set a boundary and FAIL epically.
I like being able to drive at all times of the day
I like being ME- clear mind all the time.
I do remember about 7 years ago when I first went to AA how I thought after a few months I was cured!!!! I could drink, I made it a few months, I am good!!! I have no problem, see I can make it this long a true alcoholic couldn't make it this long without a drink...
So, I went out and drank for 6 more years. Got a DUI, got banned for life from 1 bar, kicked out for a year from another bar, got put in handcuffs AGAIN this time with a charge- that eventually got dropped, drove drunk even after the DUI, put my son's life in danger as I was blacked out while he was sleeping. UNMANAGEABLE. PROGRESSIVELY WORSE
The only option for me (for most) was (is) sobriety.
If I sit and ponder the why's I can convince myself of anything.
I made the choice to feed the beast, the beast then took over with cravings, never having enough, and then wanting more drugs (coke). It was an ugly DARK place to be in. To keep the beast at bay, I no longer feed it.
I don't have to drink to have a good time.
I don't have to drink to rid social anxiety.
I don't have to drink to be around certain people.
I don't have to drink for stress relief
I don't have to drink as a reward
I don't have to drink because the sun is out
I don't have to drink.
I like being free from the constant nagging of drink... When can I drink next, will I be able to control my drinking this time, I am not going to have too much, I am not going to black out...- That worked a few times but mostly I would set a boundary and FAIL epically.
I like being able to drive at all times of the day
I like being ME- clear mind all the time.
I do remember about 7 years ago when I first went to AA how I thought after a few months I was cured!!!! I could drink, I made it a few months, I am good!!! I have no problem, see I can make it this long a true alcoholic couldn't make it this long without a drink...
So, I went out and drank for 6 more years. Got a DUI, got banned for life from 1 bar, kicked out for a year from another bar, got put in handcuffs AGAIN this time with a charge- that eventually got dropped, drove drunk even after the DUI, put my son's life in danger as I was blacked out while he was sleeping. UNMANAGEABLE. PROGRESSIVELY WORSE
The only option for me (for most) was (is) sobriety.
If I sit and ponder the why's I can convince myself of anything.
bona fido dog-lover
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: SF Bay area, CA
Posts: 99,753
When I first started drinking, it was a choice, then down the road it became necessary when I became addicted. It was hard to break the addiction, but now that I have, drinking is again a choice and I choose not to drink.
Member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Posts: 2,966
When I first came here I could go days/weeks and be "ok"..eventually,after continued drinking, I got mentally caught in a 'circular thought pattern' and everything revolved around my drinking. Even my not drinking revovled around my drinking. That's how twisted up my thoughts had become. It took me about a year to fully get out of that mindset.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 149
Originally Posted by Dee74
Hi Bunchie
One thing that doesn't often come up in threads like these is that people change
Drinking was a choice for me for many years (a bad choice sure but still a choice) then It stopped being a choice and became a necessity...and after a lot of work and effort it became a choice again and now it's simply not an option no matter what.
I'n glad that you're asking questions but if I may suggest - try to not think too much about other people and their journeys.
None of us can really know another's struggle from a few internet posts.
D
One thing that doesn't often come up in threads like these is that people change
Drinking was a choice for me for many years (a bad choice sure but still a choice) then It stopped being a choice and became a necessity...and after a lot of work and effort it became a choice again and now it's simply not an option no matter what.
I'n glad that you're asking questions but if I may suggest - try to not think too much about other people and their journeys.
None of us can really know another's struggle from a few internet posts.
D
At the AA meetings they are telling me to stop pondering why, ? I understand their point , I think we are all alcoholic if we goto meetings or visit SR, there are just different phases or stages, perhaps I am in the middle stage right now and if I continue to drink I will end up doing it everyday when I retire which I am concerned about , it happens to a lot of retirees on my job , so I am on my sober journey and I feel good , a little bored at times but I have been exceeding and fishing and reading also signed up for adult education class in mathematics , always loved math wish I pursued it when I was younger but really am enjoying it , a little rusty but it will come back. Thank you
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Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 149
Originally Posted by bunchie
Hi Dee,
At the AA meetings they are telling me to stop pondering why, ? I understand their point , I think we are all alcoholic if we goto meetings or visit SR, there are just different phases or stages, perhaps I am in the middle stage right now and if I continue to drink I will end up doing it everyday when I retire which I am concerned about , it happens to a lot of retirees on my job , so I am on my sober journey and I feel good , a little bored at times but I have been exceeding and fishing and reading also signed up for adult education class in mathematics , always loved math wish I pursued it when I was younger but really am enjoying it , a little rusty but it will come back. Thank you
At the AA meetings they are telling me to stop pondering why, ? I understand their point , I think we are all alcoholic if we goto meetings or visit SR, there are just different phases or stages, perhaps I am in the middle stage right now and if I continue to drink I will end up doing it everyday when I retire which I am concerned about , it happens to a lot of retirees on my job , so I am on my sober journey and I feel good , a little bored at times but I have been exceeding and fishing and reading also signed up for adult education class in mathematics , always loved math wish I pursued it when I was younger but really am enjoying it , a little rusty but it will come back. Thank you
Member
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 7
I've always wondered the same thing. My alcoholic sister would go for months living sober but she never "got a life" . She spent the entire day sitting in front of tv and then would go back to drinking because she had nothing else in her life.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2011
Posts: 543
I would consider drinking a choice AND an addiction. They are not mutually exclusive.
Drinking is a choice... and the addiction contributes to us not making smart or logical choices about drinking.
Also, each and every drink we consume in one sitting gradually weakens our inhibitions and leads to us making bad choices.
Drinking is a choice... and the addiction contributes to us not making smart or logical choices about drinking.
Also, each and every drink we consume in one sitting gradually weakens our inhibitions and leads to us making bad choices.
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