spintires

Gonna be long..

Hello, I'm a 26yo guy from Hungary and my father has been an alcoholic for almost 2 decades now. Not a really hardcore one who is literally always plastered, kinda on-off, good weeks bad weeks (he is aware and has been fighting). A little background: his father was an alcoholic, too- but he was a very hardcore one, literally wasted all the time, he smoked too, these two thing combined had taken their toll on his health and died in 1990. My father obviously hated him (once he chased his whole family in the garden with an axe), but once he died and my father saw the coffin being raised down, a horrific amount of guilt and sorrow took control of his life, that's when he started drinking to numb the feeling and escape reality. He started questioning himself "why wasn't I there for him, etc", the usual..
Later he (my father) was diagnosed with severe depression, bipolarity and Borderline.

He told me numerous times he loves me/us, but what he's been doing to us doesn't justify it.
I cannot believe how a man can do this to his family for so long, the family he IS SUPPOSED TO LOVE and support..
In my understanding, he's really selfish and irresponsible, he established a family 25 years ago and completely abandoned them mentally/physically.. he was always busy with his own addiction, not caring for me/us.

I've read (and my mother told me) about how my feelings are gonna change once he dies (the same way his feelings did), I'll be having immense guilt and sorrow about how I hated him when he was alive, how I didn't help him, etc.
But right now, I cannot even imagine how that can happen. I feel like my words (my whole existence actually) are useless to him, it won't change anything if I tell him "you can do it, I believe in you", if he himself doesn't realize what he must and mustn't do, nothing and nobody helps.

Obviously I'm plagued by my own mental problems, so I know that the way I acknowledge this whole situation is not healthy either, but still..

My brother is completely different in this sense, he somehow doesn't seem bothered by this, he works a lot, so he leaves the home at 7am and gets back at 7pm, he's busy all the time so maybe he doesn't even have the time to care.

My biggest question is: CAN ALCOHOLISM OVERRIDE LOVE? I have no idea how powerful addiction it is (I loathe alcohol in general).
Obviously I should also acknowledge what he went through with his father, but that was almost 30 years ago, why cannot he just move on finally???

"He can only give as much love as he received" is this true?

Do you think I'm just very unhappy with myself (the way I live, in terms of work and relationships) and I just TAKE EVERYTHING OUT ON HIM or am I justified to feel like this (unloved and abandoned by him)?

Spence7471

Question about love of family vs love of alcohol...

I struggled with this when my wife's addiction came to light... how could she do this to our family??? She loves the drugs more than the family???

Well, I will let you know.. when she is sober, she loves nothing more than the family... when she is active in her addiction, she still loves the family, but the drugs convince her to love them more.... It is taken me awhile to get over that fact... now she is sober again, i see her hurt and pain over what the addiction has done to our family, and know she loves the family.

It is hard to not take it personally, because it is personal. Stay strong and just love them for who they are... not what they are...

T

spintires

Unfortunately I feel like this is gonna be a never ending circle.. guilt because of drinking, sober (but only because he feels his body cannot take more or no money), feelings hit him, guilt again, more drinking... this has been going for like 16-18 years.
My whole youth was ruined because of this. He failed as a father figure and never showed me how to do this or that.

You know, if I were him, I would've moved out like 10 years ago, because I would've realized I'm unable to stop, and I don't wanna ruin my family.. I resent him very very much because of this.

He will be going to a addiction center mid-February and will stay there for 6-12 months (not allowed to visit home). I feel like I'll move out this spring/ summer and when that happens, I wish to never ever see /hear from him again in my entire life.
I know his youth was the same (even worse than mine actually), but again, that cannot justify what he did to me/us.
Maybe 5-10 years later, when I'll have the life I want and will be content, I might forgive him.. maybe.

LillyRose7

I honestly think this concept is the hardest to accept. I understand that addiction is a disease but its so hard when you're constantly being let down and broken to see that some times it is not their fault.

Spence7471

spintires,

You have the will to choose what relationship you want with your father now... that is part of being an adult... he also has a choice about what relationship he wants with his family... maybe him seeking treatment is about realizing that.. maybe not. Regardless, it is about you focusing on what is best for you at the moment. you will have to find forgiveness in your heart for your father's actions towards you and the family. It will not be an easy journey, especially because of the length of the active addiction. As you said, give it time.. but try not to close that door permanently...

Best wishes on your journey going forward and your father's new journey also.

Vandermast

alcoholism is one of the most powerful destructive forces around.

at times unfortunately yes it is stronger than love.

those afflicted, myself included, need treatment and structured support in order to get well, and it sounds great your father is doing this

we damage our loved ones in ways we cannot begin to understand or repair till we sober up and get a good hard dose of reality.

this takes time and carries on over a lifetime.

it is perfectly understandable you feel the way you do, though over time this may change.

often our family members if badly hurt benefit from ongoing help/counselling /support also.

I relate to what you are saying on so many levels.

we are here for you for together we heal.

love and light

vandermast

Berrybean

Yes, it can override love. It makes alcoholics emotionally unavailable.

The thing to ask yourself now, rather than about whether you are prepared (now or possibly in the future) is whether you want to find happiness and freedom from your past. The first step to recovery is wanting it. Whether that is recovery from being an alcoholic, or being ACoA.

Have you explored the ACoA handbook yet? That could be a good first step if not.

I hope you choose to seek peace. Letting go of resentments is different from forgiving the person. Holding on to the resentment is like drinking poison and expecting the other person to die. Our resentments poison ourselves and our lives. Effectively re-sending each painful episode over and over, like being stuck in a vortex.

BB

spintires

I've read a few posts about young men/women whose alcoholic parent(s) died, and I really fear that no matter how much I hate him now (not him actually, his ACTIONS!), that'll turn into guilt and sorrow as soon as he dies.
The very same thing happened with him and his father, and you what they say: smart people learn from others' mistakes.
Obviously I don't want that, I'm plagued with a lot of other things in my life, that would just push me too much into an emotional whirlwind.

So what I have to learn is to let go of these negative emotions, and try to think of all the positive experiences I've had with him (there are just a few, unfortunately, but still).

After a serious drinking binge (which ends because of the lack of money, not because he came to his senses), I can see the broken man he is and how this addiction ruled his whole adult life. I'm trying very hard to understand.
But when you are 13yo and you see your father being drunk for a straight week and he doesn't even bother to greet you, let alone ask anything about school, etc.. that HURTS.

tromboneliness

I was 47 when my Dad died, and the situation is undoubtedly different... but I didn't find that anger gave way to guilt -- and certainly not sorrow. I kind of wish it had, but 7 years later, I still have a long of anger that I'm processing. It's kind of fading into the rearview mirror, but I think more than anything specifically directed at my parents, I'm finding that my background self-hate and depression (so pervasive that I told a psychiatrist, a few years ago, that I don't even consider it "depression" per se, but rather a permanent character trait)... are getting pretty bad. And that's with a lot of tools to deal with this, from 22 years in Al-Anon! This really is hard, and there is no easy target to work on....

T

spintires

I'm really unsure about my feelings.. when I see him drunk, I hate him very much (it's always been like this).
But when he's sober, there's absolutely nothing wrong with him (apart from not working, not helping at home, just watchin TV all.day.long, but that's still better than being blackout drunk).

I really should read some AlAnon paperwork to understand the physics.

Maudcat

I think Al-Anon meetings and/or literature could really help with perspective.
It did for me, anyway.
Good thoughts.

spintires

I myself also struggle with depression, so that's why I'm always questioning myself if what I feel is full-blown depression, and I'm just taking my feelings out on him or he's really that guilty and I would be a completely different person if it wasn't for him.

My mother has a whole lof of AA papers so I might as well read those (she suggested me, too)

tromboneliness

Who said it had to be one or the other? It's probably some of each! The other thing I've found a great help is Adult Children of Alcoholics (ACA, or it used to be referred to as ACOA -- either one works). It's another 12-step program that started as an offshoot of Al-Anon in the '80s (or so). If there's a meeting in your area, it would be a big help -- but it's pretty intense... The meetings I've been to get a lot of "graduates" from AA and Al-Anon who say those programs didn't address adult-child issues directly enough. AA tends to discourage too much focus on other people like parents, because they consider it "avoiding responsibility" for an alcoholic's own actions. But I say that's nonsense -- and so do a lot of AA members who get sober, but find themselves "stuck" when they try go to deeper into why they started drinking in the first place, because AA tells them not to "blame" their parents. Anyhow, ACA is a great source of recovery: adultchildren.org can find you a meeting, if there is one in your area.

T

Berrybean

And if there are no meetings near you, the handbook is likely to be helpful.
I got mine via Amazon for my kindle. It's a dark red with the ACA logo on it, entitled Adult Children Of Alcoholics/Dysfunctional Families.

BB