Tired of stepwork
Administrator
Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,384
Hi no time - I think if you follow AA by the book then yeah - a belief in its methods and ideals and the 12 steps is pretty much essential.
If you don't think you have it in you to do that, maybe other methods are for you?
There's many different approaches and methods of recovery around - here's some links to some of the main players, including but not limited to AA:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...formation.html
I recommend you visit the Secular Connections forum if you think you may benefit from a non 12 step approach.
Welcome to SR
D
If you don't think you have it in you to do that, maybe other methods are for you?
There's many different approaches and methods of recovery around - here's some links to some of the main players, including but not limited to AA:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...formation.html
I recommend you visit the Secular Connections forum if you think you may benefit from a non 12 step approach.
Welcome to SR
D
No Dogma Please
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,562
I couldn't turn my will over to God and all that jazz. Just not in me. Thus AA is ending up not being my thing.
I'm doing the "searching and fearless moral inventory" with my therapist. It's a good exercise.
We don't use the phrase "character defects" though.
I'm doing the "searching and fearless moral inventory" with my therapist. It's a good exercise.
We don't use the phrase "character defects" though.
DOS: 08-16-2012
Join Date: Mar 2016
Location: Central Iowa
Posts: 365
Originally Posted by NoTime 
Do I have to do a searching and fearless moral inventory? Do I have to turn my will over to God or make a decision to do it?
12 Step Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,613
Well, nobody forced me to do it. By starting with the earlier steps, 1 = the problem, 2 = the solution 3 = decision to act 4 = the first practical action to recover from alcholism.
As I took each step I came to see the need, and found the courage, to move onto the next step. I also saw the warnings, that legions of alcholics before me had tried to avoid some of this stuff, and ended up drunk as the result. So I just took their word that it was necessary, took the steps and recovered.
The only solid proof I know of having taken step three, is getting on with step four. If we are stuck, it is likely we have npot understood step one and/or two.
The big thing for me was that no actual belief in God was required to progress with these steps. That belief came to me as the result of working the steps. Until step 5 I had no belief at all, and didn't understand any of it.
You wouldn't be alone though. Many people balk at step 4 and leave AA never having taken the medicine. Sometimes I wouldn't blame them when step four, intended to be a simple exercise with sponsor and sponsee, gets turned into some kind of epic novel or an undertaking that sounds so daunting that peopel become paralized with fear.
My fourth was taken on a Saturday with the help of my sponsor. It took about four hours as I needed a lot of help understanding it. The next day I took step five, and my life really beagn to change. The external world looked better, but internally I was beginning to feel OK too. That was the remarkable thing, I felt strongly that I was on the right track at last, and so it proved to be.
As I took each step I came to see the need, and found the courage, to move onto the next step. I also saw the warnings, that legions of alcholics before me had tried to avoid some of this stuff, and ended up drunk as the result. So I just took their word that it was necessary, took the steps and recovered.
The only solid proof I know of having taken step three, is getting on with step four. If we are stuck, it is likely we have npot understood step one and/or two.
The big thing for me was that no actual belief in God was required to progress with these steps. That belief came to me as the result of working the steps. Until step 5 I had no belief at all, and didn't understand any of it.
You wouldn't be alone though. Many people balk at step 4 and leave AA never having taken the medicine. Sometimes I wouldn't blame them when step four, intended to be a simple exercise with sponsor and sponsee, gets turned into some kind of epic novel or an undertaking that sounds so daunting that peopel become paralized with fear.
My fourth was taken on a Saturday with the help of my sponsor. It took about four hours as I needed a lot of help understanding it. The next day I took step five, and my life really beagn to change. The external world looked better, but internally I was beginning to feel OK too. That was the remarkable thing, I felt strongly that I was on the right track at last, and so it proved to be.
12 Step Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,613
In respect to the decision to turn your will over etc, that is really dealt with in step two. It asks the question :do I now believe or am I even willing to believe that the same power that helped you (in AA) could possibly help me? This is about deciding whether to take the spritual path to recovery or not. The book says we did this 'because we honestly wanted to and were willing to make the effort".
There is nothing that says we have to agree with this position. It is just a point of decision, spiritual path or other path. Nothing wrong with choosing another path. Frankly it would have been kinda nuts for me to stay with AA if I wasn't willing to take the medicine.
There is nothing that says we have to agree with this position. It is just a point of decision, spiritual path or other path. Nothing wrong with choosing another path. Frankly it would have been kinda nuts for me to stay with AA if I wasn't willing to take the medicine.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 8,637
I didn’t do it quite that way.
Over the course of time.... I’ve used the searching and fearless moral inventory step as a guide to deeepening my own sense of moral self. I’ve used it to address things in counseling, to make some amends, to confront things about myself and will continue to do so.
I didn’t turn everything over to a higher power, though I’ve leaned on faith and given prayers and asked for help. My belief in a higher power is less clearly defined than many who say ‘God’.
I’ve not followed the steps exactly as a purist would have you do.... yet they’ve been valuable tools in my sobriety. I’m not a full-on AA, but without AA I’m sure I would still be suffering.
The bottom line for me was that AA gave me community, suggestions and a framework to look at my life and my problem through, and offered valuable guidelines in the steps for being free from my struggle. I’ve used those tools in my own way and through my own interpretation, and it has worked.
Over the course of time.... I’ve used the searching and fearless moral inventory step as a guide to deeepening my own sense of moral self. I’ve used it to address things in counseling, to make some amends, to confront things about myself and will continue to do so.
I didn’t turn everything over to a higher power, though I’ve leaned on faith and given prayers and asked for help. My belief in a higher power is less clearly defined than many who say ‘God’.
I’ve not followed the steps exactly as a purist would have you do.... yet they’ve been valuable tools in my sobriety. I’m not a full-on AA, but without AA I’m sure I would still be suffering.
The bottom line for me was that AA gave me community, suggestions and a framework to look at my life and my problem through, and offered valuable guidelines in the steps for being free from my struggle. I’ve used those tools in my own way and through my own interpretation, and it has worked.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Location: Boston, MA
Posts: 205
Absolutely not. You can achieve sobriety by various means. I used AA the first year but never did the steps. I saw a therapist weekly. I have been sober for thirty five years. Different strokes for different folks.
12 Step Recovered Alcoholic
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 6,613
Originally Posted by soupcon
Absolutely not. You can achieve sobriety by various means. I used AA the first year but never did the steps. I saw a therapist weekly. I have been sober for thirty five years. Different strokes for different folks.
I was in the group of 8. By the time 12 months had passed, I was the only one still alive. I did the AA thing and have been sober ever since.
That is not to say certain types of problem drinker don't sort out their problems on their own. l believe large numbers probably do. This is why step one is so important. It identifies the true nature of our problem. Maybe you fit in the category of drinkers who can stop or moderate if they have a good enough reason. That wasn't me. I couldn't leave it alone no matter how great the wish.
The medical profession and all those devoted people working in the field of alcholism have yet to come up with a solution for the likes of me.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
Originally Posted by NoTime
Do I have to do a searching and fearless moral inventory? Do I have to turn my will over to God or make a decision to do it?
Member
Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: US
Posts: 5,095
Maybe rather than look at what you should or shouldn't do, will or won't do, what I did or didn't do....look at why? Ask yourself why a moral inventory is something you question doing or why you question turning your 'will' over to a higher power? That might help you get to what the real issues are. Might help you understand whether AA is right for you or not.
AA is a great resource and if you're in early recovery (less than a year-ish) then the meetings and community can be a life saver. I see so many people turn away from AA as a knee jerk reaction to some of the principles and beliefs. They close the door before they even know how to open it for themselves. Maybe focus on what draws you to AA, don't drink each day and more will be revealed?
AA is a great resource and if you're in early recovery (less than a year-ish) then the meetings and community can be a life saver. I see so many people turn away from AA as a knee jerk reaction to some of the principles and beliefs. They close the door before they even know how to open it for themselves. Maybe focus on what draws you to AA, don't drink each day and more will be revealed?
Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Baton Rouge, La.
Posts: 15,236
I first formally work the steps, then
with each passing sober day, i went
to step meetings, big book studies,
discussion, conventions, etc to continue
listening, learning, absorbing and
applying many more helpful, useful,
informative suggestions to incorporate
in my everyday life to achieve, health,
happiness and honesty.
Living a sober life is an on going education
where we are forever learning to live life
to the fullest. To be the best person we can
be not only to ourselves but for others around
us.
We never stop learning.
Work the steps then live them.
with each passing sober day, i went
to step meetings, big book studies,
discussion, conventions, etc to continue
listening, learning, absorbing and
applying many more helpful, useful,
informative suggestions to incorporate
in my everyday life to achieve, health,
happiness and honesty.
Living a sober life is an on going education
where we are forever learning to live life
to the fullest. To be the best person we can
be not only to ourselves but for others around
us.
We never stop learning.
Work the steps then live them.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 419
As the BB says "Alcohol is but a symptom of our disease" I believe this to mean that we basically drank to not feel the life that we were living whether it be in deceipt, deception, resentment etc. Personally i think that the steps are necessary in order to help clear up the wreckage that years of alcoholism can create. Step 4 we do a fearless moral inventory of ourselves and Step 9 we make amends to those we have wronged. We ask God to remove our defects of character in Step 7. This is just my opinion and i know it is work hell it took me over 8 months to finish my 4th step and i gotta say some of that time was procrastinating. Going off of what i've seen in the rooms of AA if you do the work you WILL get the miracle although i've got to be patient. Good luck to you!
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Posts: 25,373
I'm with Frickaflip...I guess I would ask what exactly it is about a moral inventory that is off-putting? You can reflect on that and if you are honest with yourself you will figure out the "why."
Every single human has character defects. I've lied, I've stolen, I've cheated, I've envied other peoples' good fortune and resented those who wronged me. I was angry, ungrateful, lazy and lustful. It's just the nature of the human animal if left unchecked and without discipline; and it's magnified when alcohol/drugs are in the equation.
As a result of the pain all those behaviors/defects of character caused me, I'm doing my best day by day to change. I pray for help and read spiritual literature, because I tend to make messes of stuff if I'm not being guided by some kind of moral compass on a daily basis.
Every single human has character defects. I've lied, I've stolen, I've cheated, I've envied other peoples' good fortune and resented those who wronged me. I was angry, ungrateful, lazy and lustful. It's just the nature of the human animal if left unchecked and without discipline; and it's magnified when alcohol/drugs are in the equation.
As a result of the pain all those behaviors/defects of character caused me, I'm doing my best day by day to change. I pray for help and read spiritual literature, because I tend to make messes of stuff if I'm not being guided by some kind of moral compass on a daily basis.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Colorado
Posts: 202
Originally Posted by NoTime
Do I have to do a searching and fearless moral inventory? Do I have to turn my will over to God or make a decision to do it?
Member
Join Date: Mar 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 12,000
Here is what you can do if you don’t want to “do the steps”. You can borrow from them.
Learn the ‘serenity prayer’ – you can leave god out of it too.
Do a “step1” work sheet. You can find it online or at any meeting that puts out literature.
Do “step 4” to the best of your ability – you don’t even have to write it down if you don’t want to. But it helps to see it and get it out of your head. Then burn the paper if you wish.
Do “step 8” – actually if you did step 4 correctly, you already should have completed step 8 – by my opinion. Whether you wish to address this list further is entirely up to you – read step 9 for how to do this. But I caution that bringing up “old memories” may be more harmful than any good it might accomplish.
And most importantly, if you don’t do any of the other “steps” do step 10 every day. This alone will awaken you to yourself and it will keep you on your toes. You will become the guardian of your behaviors.
I’m not an expert nor do I speak for aa as an authority. But I did do all of the things I mentioned above.
Learn the ‘serenity prayer’ – you can leave god out of it too.
Do a “step1” work sheet. You can find it online or at any meeting that puts out literature.
Do “step 4” to the best of your ability – you don’t even have to write it down if you don’t want to. But it helps to see it and get it out of your head. Then burn the paper if you wish.
Do “step 8” – actually if you did step 4 correctly, you already should have completed step 8 – by my opinion. Whether you wish to address this list further is entirely up to you – read step 9 for how to do this. But I caution that bringing up “old memories” may be more harmful than any good it might accomplish.
And most importantly, if you don’t do any of the other “steps” do step 10 every day. This alone will awaken you to yourself and it will keep you on your toes. You will become the guardian of your behaviors.
I’m not an expert nor do I speak for aa as an authority. But I did do all of the things I mentioned above.
No Dogma Please
Join Date: Jul 2017
Location: SoCal
Posts: 2,562
The Serenity Prayer is huge for me, even though most of 12 Step does not resonate.
I did work Steps 2 & 3 in a fashion with a temporary sponsor. I cannot turn my will over to something I don’t really believe in. What I did come to realize is that there are many things in the Universe that are beyond my control, and that much unhappiness and addiction was due to selfish and childish behavior thinking that I could. Not changing things that I can that don’t work in my life is usually due to fear, often grounded in events so long in the past that I don’t remember them. The key to sobriety and a successful life is that wisdom of knowing the difference.
But I don’t name a universe that I cannot control and surrender to it.
I disagree with those that insist if you don’t faithfully work the steps you are not following a spiritual path to recovery, or even that a spiritual path to recovery is necessarily essential.
I firmly believe that, for me, what AA calls a searching and fearless moral inventory is essential, I just take the good/bad judgement out of it. Which behaviors in the past have worked in life and which have not. Even if someone hands you an accurate map, you can’t find your way home without knowing where you are.
Fearless honesty is required to work the 12 Step programs. It is also essential to leading a successful, happy, and sober life. Regarding my addiction, I first realized that drinking and using were compulsive and irrational and one started, drunken and addicted me really couldn’t control or limit the drinking and drugging. This path lead to other paths that weren’t working in my life. That took self honesty. Second I pretty much tell everyone that I am now sober because I had a drinking issue, and let them know what my behavior really was, rather than what I put forward to the world. No judgement. I had a problem and I fixed it by using every tool at my disposal. There is nothing shameful in that.
You can get and remain sober through other paths than a 12 Step program. You cannot without acknowledging behaviors that were destructive and where you didn’t behave courageously to change the things that you could.
I did work Steps 2 & 3 in a fashion with a temporary sponsor. I cannot turn my will over to something I don’t really believe in. What I did come to realize is that there are many things in the Universe that are beyond my control, and that much unhappiness and addiction was due to selfish and childish behavior thinking that I could. Not changing things that I can that don’t work in my life is usually due to fear, often grounded in events so long in the past that I don’t remember them. The key to sobriety and a successful life is that wisdom of knowing the difference.
But I don’t name a universe that I cannot control and surrender to it.
I disagree with those that insist if you don’t faithfully work the steps you are not following a spiritual path to recovery, or even that a spiritual path to recovery is necessarily essential.
I firmly believe that, for me, what AA calls a searching and fearless moral inventory is essential, I just take the good/bad judgement out of it. Which behaviors in the past have worked in life and which have not. Even if someone hands you an accurate map, you can’t find your way home without knowing where you are.
Fearless honesty is required to work the 12 Step programs. It is also essential to leading a successful, happy, and sober life. Regarding my addiction, I first realized that drinking and using were compulsive and irrational and one started, drunken and addicted me really couldn’t control or limit the drinking and drugging. This path lead to other paths that weren’t working in my life. That took self honesty. Second I pretty much tell everyone that I am now sober because I had a drinking issue, and let them know what my behavior really was, rather than what I put forward to the world. No judgement. I had a problem and I fixed it by using every tool at my disposal. There is nothing shameful in that.
You can get and remain sober through other paths than a 12 Step program. You cannot without acknowledging behaviors that were destructive and where you didn’t behave courageously to change the things that you could.
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
Course you haven't.
I did eventually. When I realised that I really did want those promises to come true, and that the sobriety fairly wasn't ever just come sprinkle me with recovery dust while I sat drinking a coffee in a meeting one day as I'd hoped.
When I first got a sponsor and started the step work I still wasn't ready to do step 4. But I didn't need to be. I just needed to be ready and willing to do step 1 thoroughly. But the time that was done I was ready and willing to do step 2 and 3. And then after I'd done them, I quite unexpectedly found myself ready and willing to start on step 4. How peculiar! Seems like those steps are in the order they are for a reason.
If you've done step 3 and still can't find the willingness to start on step 4 it might be worth considering whether you've been completely honest with yourself and sponsor on steps 1 to 3.
If you haven't done steps 1 - 3 yet, I'd suggest you quit worrying about step 4 as its needless worry. First things first and all that.
If you haven't done any step work and don't want to, then that's your choice. Your recovery. Your life. You're the only one who has to live in you and with you 24/7 after all.
BB
I did eventually. When I realised that I really did want those promises to come true, and that the sobriety fairly wasn't ever just come sprinkle me with recovery dust while I sat drinking a coffee in a meeting one day as I'd hoped.
When I first got a sponsor and started the step work I still wasn't ready to do step 4. But I didn't need to be. I just needed to be ready and willing to do step 1 thoroughly. But the time that was done I was ready and willing to do step 2 and 3. And then after I'd done them, I quite unexpectedly found myself ready and willing to start on step 4. How peculiar! Seems like those steps are in the order they are for a reason.
If you've done step 3 and still can't find the willingness to start on step 4 it might be worth considering whether you've been completely honest with yourself and sponsor on steps 1 to 3.
If you haven't done steps 1 - 3 yet, I'd suggest you quit worrying about step 4 as its needless worry. First things first and all that.
If you haven't done any step work and don't want to, then that's your choice. Your recovery. Your life. You're the only one who has to live in you and with you 24/7 after all.
BB
Trudgin
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 6,348
Some will say meetings won't keep you sober. My experience was that the fellowship did indeed keep me sober for a period of time until my brain cleared.
I appreciated simple at first and ya'll told me to keep coming back and that's what I did. The book says we meet frequently so the newcomer may find the fellowship they seek. I found this to be be true and appealing.
Keep coming back and breathe.......
I appreciated simple at first and ya'll told me to keep coming back and that's what I did. The book says we meet frequently so the newcomer may find the fellowship they seek. I found this to be be true and appealing.
Keep coming back and breathe.......
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