When is it time for the bottom line..
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posts: 467
When is it time for the bottom line..
Just curious....what are your thoughts about tolerating someone who is constantly repeating the same pattern over and over? Where do you draw the line in the sand, if someone is not willing to help themselves. When do you stop listening to all the excuses even after many have given good strong, wise words of advice? What is the answer? I have watched Intervention and the Interventionist's have their bottom line. Why do some feel the need to support & defend someone because that person might get their feelings hurt? I would love to hear what you think....
Member
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 4,251
I think everyone has their own personal line heaven. If you are as bothered by someone as you seem to be- this is also your repeated pattern, posting in frustration about this one person- I would suggest making use of the ignore button. You really don't have to live like this. This should be a safe place for you where you come to support your recovery, not a place to come and get frustrated. I know it is hard, like the train wreck thing, it is hard to look away, but I would really suggest for your mental health that you just take the plunge and click ignore.
As for why some feel the need to support and help someone who continues to struggle and struggle I guess a number of things come into play. One, it is just being nice on the internet. I really don't see the point of being mean to someone. If I don't have anything nice or helpful (which is not always "nice" for the other person to hear) to say I make it a point to not jump in. It appears that the majority of others here feel that way because for the most part this seems to be a really kind, supportive, helpful place.
Secondly, I think that the struggle is so real to a lot of us. You may be one of the fortunate ones who just decided to get sober and then did, but a lot of us alcoholics really struggle to get there. Some of us are in.so.deep. I went through my fair share of groundhog days and waffling and making mistake after mistake. But I kept coming back, I kept showing up (even if in my own way), I kept trying to figure it out. It wasn't that I was stupid, or that I didn't want it, or that I didn't understand the severity, I just was having a hard time breaking free from my addiction. So when I see others having a hard time- time and time again- I can see clearly with my sober eyes what they should and should not do, but I also understand what it is like to be in their shoes, how the "seeing" is difficult when so deep in it. Or if I do not completely understand what it is like to be in their shoes I make use of empathy.
Next, I guess it comes down to patience. Some days I also don't have a lot of patience- here or anywhere, and I choose who and how I will interact with people accordingly. Some days I post, and other days I don't. If I don't feel I can be kind of of help I give it a pass.
Because lastly, internet bullying is real and although I have never come even remotely close to that I would never want a quick, two line, snide comment to harm someone emotionally or be the cause of suffering for someone. Not to even get into people who harm themselves because they feel like the one place they have a safe haven (among others who suffer from the same affliction as them) is no longer welcoming just because their idea of trying at the moment doesn't match up perfectly with what several other users think it should look like.
All of the above said, tough love does have it's place and sometimes people need to hear the truth loud and clear. But I believe there are two ways to say things, the nice way or the mean way. Tough love can be just that, tough, but it doesn't have to be mean, unhelpful, irritated or pointless.
I'm glad you are here heaven and I do hope for your sake that you consider the ignore function. I have been in your shoes before (not on this board, but online) where something was really grating my nerves to the point it was disturbing my peace of mind. When I backed out of the situation I felt much better.
As for why some feel the need to support and help someone who continues to struggle and struggle I guess a number of things come into play. One, it is just being nice on the internet. I really don't see the point of being mean to someone. If I don't have anything nice or helpful (which is not always "nice" for the other person to hear) to say I make it a point to not jump in. It appears that the majority of others here feel that way because for the most part this seems to be a really kind, supportive, helpful place.
Secondly, I think that the struggle is so real to a lot of us. You may be one of the fortunate ones who just decided to get sober and then did, but a lot of us alcoholics really struggle to get there. Some of us are in.so.deep. I went through my fair share of groundhog days and waffling and making mistake after mistake. But I kept coming back, I kept showing up (even if in my own way), I kept trying to figure it out. It wasn't that I was stupid, or that I didn't want it, or that I didn't understand the severity, I just was having a hard time breaking free from my addiction. So when I see others having a hard time- time and time again- I can see clearly with my sober eyes what they should and should not do, but I also understand what it is like to be in their shoes, how the "seeing" is difficult when so deep in it. Or if I do not completely understand what it is like to be in their shoes I make use of empathy.
Next, I guess it comes down to patience. Some days I also don't have a lot of patience- here or anywhere, and I choose who and how I will interact with people accordingly. Some days I post, and other days I don't. If I don't feel I can be kind of of help I give it a pass.
Because lastly, internet bullying is real and although I have never come even remotely close to that I would never want a quick, two line, snide comment to harm someone emotionally or be the cause of suffering for someone. Not to even get into people who harm themselves because they feel like the one place they have a safe haven (among others who suffer from the same affliction as them) is no longer welcoming just because their idea of trying at the moment doesn't match up perfectly with what several other users think it should look like.
All of the above said, tough love does have it's place and sometimes people need to hear the truth loud and clear. But I believe there are two ways to say things, the nice way or the mean way. Tough love can be just that, tough, but it doesn't have to be mean, unhelpful, irritated or pointless.
I'm glad you are here heaven and I do hope for your sake that you consider the ignore function. I have been in your shoes before (not on this board, but online) where something was really grating my nerves to the point it was disturbing my peace of mind. When I backed out of the situation I felt much better.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2016
Location: Wareham, Mass
Posts: 7,067
I think we all have our “enough” moment.
That moment when we just feel that we have to make a change, that we cannot keep doing what we are doing.
That was how it was with me and alcohol, anyway.
I was so tired of it controlling me, my decisions, my behavior.
Alcohol was winning and stealing my life from me.
I wanted it back.
Peace.
That moment when we just feel that we have to make a change, that we cannot keep doing what we are doing.
That was how it was with me and alcohol, anyway.
I was so tired of it controlling me, my decisions, my behavior.
Alcohol was winning and stealing my life from me.
I wanted it back.
Peace.
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Join Date: Aug 2015
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 8,674
In person or online? If the latter, I agree with Mera.
If in person- which is imminently harder - I would have different answers (to a degree) if it were a sponsee v a friend or family member (Ie someone I am close to apart from AA). With a sponsee - the burden is on her to want to get sober; period. I am there to help, guide and support as she works the steps and think I teach in the way of my recovery, which includes how I learned and grew (and found "what [I] want" from my two sponsors (esp the current one) and those in my program.
I cannot get emotionally involved with a sponsee. I cannot take responsibility for her sobriety. Of course, I should (IMO) be a positive and motivating and kind shepherd. It is easier to draw lines when someone has said, "yes, I want to get sober and will go to any lengths to get it" and set guidelines (ie, when to check in, meeting expectations, etc) in this scenario.
With a friend or such....it is harder, IME. I am thinking of one person who I have known and cared about for years, as a friend. He knows he is an alcoholic; he has even been to AA a few times, mostly around his mandatory DUI terms. He also tells me how proud and awed he is by my recovery. He just....won't start his own. After almost two years sober, I have pretty much stopped asking if he wants to go to a mtg or how things are going- he knows I'm here if he gets ready.
Bottom line for me is that AA is a program of attraction not promotion- so I am best off living my own best recovered life and trusting that others notice it if they need help, and there is an opportunity for us to connect.
If in person- which is imminently harder - I would have different answers (to a degree) if it were a sponsee v a friend or family member (Ie someone I am close to apart from AA). With a sponsee - the burden is on her to want to get sober; period. I am there to help, guide and support as she works the steps and think I teach in the way of my recovery, which includes how I learned and grew (and found "what [I] want" from my two sponsors (esp the current one) and those in my program.
I cannot get emotionally involved with a sponsee. I cannot take responsibility for her sobriety. Of course, I should (IMO) be a positive and motivating and kind shepherd. It is easier to draw lines when someone has said, "yes, I want to get sober and will go to any lengths to get it" and set guidelines (ie, when to check in, meeting expectations, etc) in this scenario.
With a friend or such....it is harder, IME. I am thinking of one person who I have known and cared about for years, as a friend. He knows he is an alcoholic; he has even been to AA a few times, mostly around his mandatory DUI terms. He also tells me how proud and awed he is by my recovery. He just....won't start his own. After almost two years sober, I have pretty much stopped asking if he wants to go to a mtg or how things are going- he knows I'm here if he gets ready.
Bottom line for me is that AA is a program of attraction not promotion- so I am best off living my own best recovered life and trusting that others notice it if they need help, and there is an opportunity for us to connect.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2017
Location: Calgary, Alberta Canada
Posts: 467
Originally Posted by Meraviglioso 
I think everyone has their own personal line heaven. If you are as bothered by someone as you seem to be- this is also your repeated pattern, posting in frustration about this one person- I would suggest making use of the ignore button. You really don't have to live like this. This should be a safe place for you where you come to support your recovery, not a place to come and get frustrated. I know it is hard, like the train wreck thing, it is hard to look away, but I would really suggest for your mental health that you just take the plunge and click ignore.
As for why some feel the need to support and help someone who continues to struggle and struggle I guess a number of things come into play. One, it is just being nice on the internet. I really don't see the point of being mean to someone. If I don't have anything nice or helpful (which is not always "nice" for the other person to hear) to say I make it a point to not jump in. It appears that the majority of others here feel that way because for the most part this seems to be a really kind, supportive, helpful place.
Secondly, I think that the struggle is so real to a lot of us. You may be one of the fortunate ones who just decided to get sober and then did, but a lot of us alcoholics really struggle to get there. Some of us are in.so.deep. I went through my fair share of groundhog days and waffling and making mistake after mistake. But I kept coming back, I kept showing up (even if in my own way), I kept trying to figure it out. It wasn't that I was stupid, or that I didn't want it, or that I didn't understand the severity, I just was having a hard time breaking free from my addiction. So when I see others having a hard time- time and time again- I can see clearly with my sober eyes what they should and should not do, but I also understand what it is like to be in their shoes, how the "seeing" is difficult when so deep in it. Or if I do not completely understand what it is like to be in their shoes I make use of empathy.
Next, I guess it comes down to patience. Some days I also don't have a lot of patience- here or anywhere, and I choose who and how I will interact with people accordingly. Some days I post, and other days I don't. If I don't feel I can be kind of of help I give it a pass.
Because lastly, internet bullying is real and although I have never come even remotely close to that I would never want a quick, two line, snide comment to harm someone emotionally or be the cause of suffering for someone. Not to even get into people who harm themselves because they feel like the one place they have a safe haven (among others who suffer from the same affliction as them) is no longer welcoming just because their idea of trying at the moment doesn't match up perfectly with what several other users think it should look like.
All of the above said, tough love does have it's place and sometimes people need to hear the truth loud and clear. But I believe there are two ways to say things, the nice way or the mean way. Tough love can be just that, tough, but it doesn't have to be mean, unhelpful, irritated or pointless.
I'm glad you are here heaven and I do hope for your sake that you consider the ignore function. I have been in your shoes before (not on this board, but online) where something was really grating my nerves to the point it was disturbing my peace of mind. When I backed out of the situation I felt much better.
As for why some feel the need to support and help someone who continues to struggle and struggle I guess a number of things come into play. One, it is just being nice on the internet. I really don't see the point of being mean to someone. If I don't have anything nice or helpful (which is not always "nice" for the other person to hear) to say I make it a point to not jump in. It appears that the majority of others here feel that way because for the most part this seems to be a really kind, supportive, helpful place.
Secondly, I think that the struggle is so real to a lot of us. You may be one of the fortunate ones who just decided to get sober and then did, but a lot of us alcoholics really struggle to get there. Some of us are in.so.deep. I went through my fair share of groundhog days and waffling and making mistake after mistake. But I kept coming back, I kept showing up (even if in my own way), I kept trying to figure it out. It wasn't that I was stupid, or that I didn't want it, or that I didn't understand the severity, I just was having a hard time breaking free from my addiction. So when I see others having a hard time- time and time again- I can see clearly with my sober eyes what they should and should not do, but I also understand what it is like to be in their shoes, how the "seeing" is difficult when so deep in it. Or if I do not completely understand what it is like to be in their shoes I make use of empathy.
Next, I guess it comes down to patience. Some days I also don't have a lot of patience- here or anywhere, and I choose who and how I will interact with people accordingly. Some days I post, and other days I don't. If I don't feel I can be kind of of help I give it a pass.
Because lastly, internet bullying is real and although I have never come even remotely close to that I would never want a quick, two line, snide comment to harm someone emotionally or be the cause of suffering for someone. Not to even get into people who harm themselves because they feel like the one place they have a safe haven (among others who suffer from the same affliction as them) is no longer welcoming just because their idea of trying at the moment doesn't match up perfectly with what several other users think it should look like.
All of the above said, tough love does have it's place and sometimes people need to hear the truth loud and clear. But I believe there are two ways to say things, the nice way or the mean way. Tough love can be just that, tough, but it doesn't have to be mean, unhelpful, irritated or pointless.
I'm glad you are here heaven and I do hope for your sake that you consider the ignore function. I have been in your shoes before (not on this board, but online) where something was really grating my nerves to the point it was disturbing my peace of mind. When I backed out of the situation I felt much better.
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