No chance for hope?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 9
No chance for hope?
I am very confused with the postings on SR.
Majority of the postings claim that there is just simply no hope for the abuser. That we on the other side should leave cause they won't change or it will only get worse.
But isn't that a negative feeling? And if we are throwing those feelings to the abuser wouldn't that make them loss faith as well? The reason why I say this is because my abuser has always asked me to keep the faith and never give up on him.
But then I read about success stories about how people that stop drinking and are able to recover, many with relapses.
I am confused on how to feel bout his recovery.
Majority of the postings claim that there is just simply no hope for the abuser. That we on the other side should leave cause they won't change or it will only get worse.
But isn't that a negative feeling? And if we are throwing those feelings to the abuser wouldn't that make them loss faith as well? The reason why I say this is because my abuser has always asked me to keep the faith and never give up on him.
But then I read about success stories about how people that stop drinking and are able to recover, many with relapses.
I am confused on how to feel bout his recovery.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: W Washington
Posts: 11,589
about the only time it is suggested that someone consider leaving is when abuse is involved.....emotional, physical, financial abuse. or in the case where the addict has stated categorically they have NO intention of quitting and the situation has become untenable....especially if there are children involved.
you ask how you are supposed to feel about his recovery?
let me ask you this.........WHAT recovery? is he sober today? is he doing anything, taking any viable tangible ACTION to address his drinking?
your history with him is fraught with problems and less than optimal decision making by both parties. sometimes enough water has passed under the bridge and it's time to accept what truly IS not what we wish or hope or dream.
you ask how you are supposed to feel about his recovery?
let me ask you this.........WHAT recovery? is he sober today? is he doing anything, taking any viable tangible ACTION to address his drinking?
your history with him is fraught with problems and less than optimal decision making by both parties. sometimes enough water has passed under the bridge and it's time to accept what truly IS not what we wish or hope or dream.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Chicago
Posts: 5,450
Addiction is cunning, baffling, and powerful. There is a big difference between supporting someone who is actively seeking recovery, and supporting someone who talks about recovering but never actually does anything about it.
I don't think anyone here thinks there is "no hope for the abuser". We all hope our addicts will experience the enlightenment needed to embrace recovery. It's more a question of how one wants to spend their one precious life--waiting for someone else to make a change that may not happen, or empowering themselves to find happiness with or without the addict.
All the love and support in the world will not give someone else the willingness to change. Change is hard work, and we can't do it for them. What does your abuser do after he asks you never to give up on him? Go to a meeting? See a therapist? Pour out the booze? There's a difference between giving up on someone who is active in the fight for their own life and letting go of someone who continues to be all talk and no action, piling up consequences year after year.
This isn't an easy road you're on. Keep asking questions. We're all here for you.
I don't think anyone here thinks there is "no hope for the abuser". We all hope our addicts will experience the enlightenment needed to embrace recovery. It's more a question of how one wants to spend their one precious life--waiting for someone else to make a change that may not happen, or empowering themselves to find happiness with or without the addict.
All the love and support in the world will not give someone else the willingness to change. Change is hard work, and we can't do it for them. What does your abuser do after he asks you never to give up on him? Go to a meeting? See a therapist? Pour out the booze? There's a difference between giving up on someone who is active in the fight for their own life and letting go of someone who continues to be all talk and no action, piling up consequences year after year.
This isn't an easy road you're on. Keep asking questions. We're all here for you.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Central O-H-I-O
Posts: 1,689
I guess my question would be - WHY would you even WANT to stay with someone who is abusing you?
Leaving them is not a negative feeling or a negative response, it's call self-preservation.
You can have faith and hope from afar, letting them do what they need to do to get healthy, or not.
COD
Leaving them is not a negative feeling or a negative response, it's call self-preservation.
You can have faith and hope from afar, letting them do what they need to do to get healthy, or not.
COD
Member
Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 6,902
MJ. There is only hope where there is willingness. Willingness to do what it takes to get sober and stay that way. If hes not going to get willing.... well, then there is no hope.
Have you tried AlAnon or similar for yourself? Perhaps it would be worth a try. You can't change him.
BB
Have you tried AlAnon or similar for yourself? Perhaps it would be worth a try. You can't change him.
BB
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
No person on this site or any other can tell you to leave or stay. It's a matter of what you can live with yourself. And the reality is, many leave because they cannot take it anymore.
You deserve more.
You deserve more.
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Marijo.....first of all, I don't think that this forum is representative of the general population....The majority of people who post on here have been in their situation with the alcoholic for many years...and, the alcoholic has, also, spiraled pretty far along in their disease....
Those who are in good recovery don't go looking for forums like this, most of the time...they are busy enjoying their life....
There are millions who are in recovery...and you will meet them in the course of your daily life....and, you may never have any idea that they are in recovery!
You will find them in AA meetings---especially, the step meetings....
(lol..we DO have a few of them who post on here, too---and, they add so much to the experience here...as they give such a realistic perspective for the loved o nes)
Believe it or not---a person can get into recovery at any stage along the way.
I am giving you the following link to our library...it is extensive, and has so many excellent articles....I hope that you will take the time to read through them...
Knowledge is power.
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...c-reading.html (Classic Reading)
Your hope, your faith, your l ove...will not lead him into recovery. The motivation has to come from within him. He has to want it enough to do what it takes to get into genuine recovery....
Most everyone here on this forum gave all the hope, faith and love that they had to give....
Those who are in good recovery don't go looking for forums like this, most of the time...they are busy enjoying their life....
There are millions who are in recovery...and you will meet them in the course of your daily life....and, you may never have any idea that they are in recovery!
You will find them in AA meetings---especially, the step meetings....
(lol..we DO have a few of them who post on here, too---and, they add so much to the experience here...as they give such a realistic perspective for the loved o nes)
Believe it or not---a person can get into recovery at any stage along the way.
I am giving you the following link to our library...it is extensive, and has so many excellent articles....I hope that you will take the time to read through them...
Knowledge is power.
https://www.soberrecovery.com/forums...c-reading.html (Classic Reading)
Your hope, your faith, your l ove...will not lead him into recovery. The motivation has to come from within him. He has to want it enough to do what it takes to get into genuine recovery....
Most everyone here on this forum gave all the hope, faith and love that they had to give....
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
But isn't that a negative feeling?
Example, fear is a feeling, not a fact. Your fear in leaving him will make him worse off, that fear is you’re feelings and the fact is no one can or can’t make someone else drink, let alone drink harder.
I am confused on how to feel bout his recovery.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 9
Originally Posted by SparkleKitty 
Addiction is cunning, baffling, and powerful. There is a big difference between supporting someone who is actively seeking recovery, and supporting someone who talks about recovering but never actually does anything about it.
I don't think anyone here thinks there is "no hope for the abuser". We all hope our addicts will experience the enlightenment needed to embrace recovery. It's more a question of how one wants to spend their one precious life--waiting for someone else to make a change that may not happen, or empowering themselves to find happiness with or without the addict.
All the love and support in the world will not give someone else the willingness to change. Change is hard work, and we can't do it for them. What does your abuser do after he asks you never to give up on him? Go to a meeting? See a therapist? Pour out the booze? There's a difference between giving up on someone who is active in the fight for their own life and letting go of someone who continues to be all talk and no action, piling up consequences year after year.
This isn't an easy road you're on. Keep asking questions. We're all here for you.
I don't think anyone here thinks there is "no hope for the abuser". We all hope our addicts will experience the enlightenment needed to embrace recovery. It's more a question of how one wants to spend their one precious life--waiting for someone else to make a change that may not happen, or empowering themselves to find happiness with or without the addict.
All the love and support in the world will not give someone else the willingness to change. Change is hard work, and we can't do it for them. What does your abuser do after he asks you never to give up on him? Go to a meeting? See a therapist? Pour out the booze? There's a difference between giving up on someone who is active in the fight for their own life and letting go of someone who continues to be all talk and no action, piling up consequences year after year.
This isn't an easy road you're on. Keep asking questions. We're all here for you.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 9
Originally Posted by Berrybean
MJ. There is only hope where there is willingness. Willingness to do what it takes to get sober and stay that way. If hes not going to get willing.... well, then there is no hope.
Have you tried AlAnon or similar for yourself? Perhaps it would be worth a try. You can't change him.
BB
Have you tried AlAnon or similar for yourself? Perhaps it would be worth a try. You can't change him.
BB
Member
Join Date: Nov 2017
Posts: 89
As others have said, actions speak volumes more than words.
My soon to be XAW often says that if only I supported her more, or loved her more, or showed that I care more often, that she could stay sober. That’s her putting the responsibility for her recovery on me. That ain’t my job. My job is to protect myself and our son from the verbal and emotional abuse she’s put us through for four years. She has yet to sincerely apologize or even acknowledge that she did that.
Only you know when or if it’s bad enough to leave.
But read all you can, know what the disease is and how it can manifest.
My soon to be XAW often says that if only I supported her more, or loved her more, or showed that I care more often, that she could stay sober. That’s her putting the responsibility for her recovery on me. That ain’t my job. My job is to protect myself and our son from the verbal and emotional abuse she’s put us through for four years. She has yet to sincerely apologize or even acknowledge that she did that.
Only you know when or if it’s bad enough to leave.
But read all you can, know what the disease is and how it can manifest.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 284
My STBXAH says that the only way he will get sober is if I take him back...meanwhile while we were together he couldn't/wouldn't/didn't want to stay sober which is why I filed for divorce. There are so many excuses and its always everyone else's fault but theirs.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 2,792
Mj,
My axh reached out 6 months ago (3 years post divorce). He told me that I pushed him away so he ran...... Obviously he is still drinking and digging a deeper hole that he can't get out of. But for 34 years I lived in that deep dark hole with him. I choose to no longer live that life.
We are not giving up on our addicts, we are having enough respect for ourselves to put on our oxygen mask first and save ourselves. Our addicts want us to be their biggest supports of all the hxll they put us through. Always there to forgive them, or help them from the messes that they got into. At some point, for our well being, we have to say no. Give it time, educate yourself and you will see the games they play. Hugs!
My axh reached out 6 months ago (3 years post divorce). He told me that I pushed him away so he ran...... Obviously he is still drinking and digging a deeper hole that he can't get out of. But for 34 years I lived in that deep dark hole with him. I choose to no longer live that life.
We are not giving up on our addicts, we are having enough respect for ourselves to put on our oxygen mask first and save ourselves. Our addicts want us to be their biggest supports of all the hxll they put us through. Always there to forgive them, or help them from the messes that they got into. At some point, for our well being, we have to say no. Give it time, educate yourself and you will see the games they play. Hugs!
Member
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 1,144
There is always hope but that's not our only action available to us, to hope. I must face the fact, is he improving to a base that is acceptable to me? My husband is sober and still has the alcoholic mind that he's had for decades. He will not change over night even with a program. Is he changing or is it just another day? Those are questions I still ask myself daily along with the trust factor. If he's late is he still drinking? Do I want to live this way? Is it negativity or just my truths?
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
Terrible manipulation and a grand show of that his recovery would never work because he does not want it for himself.
Originally Posted by BAW81
My STBXAH says that the only way he will get sober is if I take him back...meanwhile while we were together he couldn't/wouldn't/didn't want to stay sober which is why I filed for divorce. There are so many excuses and its always everyone else's fault but theirs.
"O you must wear your rue with difference".
Join Date: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,146
Not all addicts are abusers. The ones that are in recovery, go to AA meetings or Narc anonymous, stay away from drink/drugs, admit their faults, try to make amends, continue to be honest in their sessions with their psychologists or other doctors, those people have hope. You don't have to carry the hope for them. You can both hope for continuing recovery together.
An addict who is an abuser is going to lie, cheat, steal, gaslight you, which is a special type of lying, and may or may not become violent and may or may not throw you under the bus when the going gets real tough. An addict who is an abuser doesn't want your hope, they find it patronizing because they don't respect you as their ability to respect anyone, including themselves has diminished while their desire to drink or drug has grown (or maybe they never respected you and that is why they are abusing you).
It is not easy to do, but you should leave an addict who is an abuser. Addiction and abuse are not mutually exclusive although it is common. If an addict is NOT an abuser and is actively seeking help and not just "talking about it", that is someone who wants you to hope with them, not just someone who insist that the burden of recovery is on your shoulders while they get black-out drunk day after day.
Bear in mind that I've been really grouchy lately, so when I say this, it's because I've been grouchy... there are a certain percentage of people, I don't know what percentage exactly, but there are people who get into their addiction because they generally think that the rules in society don't apply to them. They think they have it all figured out and that everyone else around them is "illogical". It is true that they may or maybe not have attendant psychological issues or mental health issues, but generally they have a pre-existing flaw in their morality or reality "programming". You don't have to have hope for these people. They are happy as they are. Anything they say about wanting you to have hope for them, is just them trying to fulfill what they deem to be the spoken aspect of the social contract, which they think is illogical anyway.
An addict who is an abuser is going to lie, cheat, steal, gaslight you, which is a special type of lying, and may or may not become violent and may or may not throw you under the bus when the going gets real tough. An addict who is an abuser doesn't want your hope, they find it patronizing because they don't respect you as their ability to respect anyone, including themselves has diminished while their desire to drink or drug has grown (or maybe they never respected you and that is why they are abusing you).
It is not easy to do, but you should leave an addict who is an abuser. Addiction and abuse are not mutually exclusive although it is common. If an addict is NOT an abuser and is actively seeking help and not just "talking about it", that is someone who wants you to hope with them, not just someone who insist that the burden of recovery is on your shoulders while they get black-out drunk day after day.
Bear in mind that I've been really grouchy lately, so when I say this, it's because I've been grouchy... there are a certain percentage of people, I don't know what percentage exactly, but there are people who get into their addiction because they generally think that the rules in society don't apply to them. They think they have it all figured out and that everyone else around them is "illogical". It is true that they may or maybe not have attendant psychological issues or mental health issues, but generally they have a pre-existing flaw in their morality or reality "programming". You don't have to have hope for these people. They are happy as they are. Anything they say about wanting you to have hope for them, is just them trying to fulfill what they deem to be the spoken aspect of the social contract, which they think is illogical anyway.
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