Bluehawaii

And they have lots to say and questions.
He manipulated us for years and triangulated our lives.
Why do I feel I'm in trouble if I speak.
Why do I feel scared to break the silence.
Why do I feel this will be turned on me that I'm trying to turn kids against him when I know I'm not and we are just talking truth.
I know they need to talk and I don't want to shut them down but they are realizing his manipulations now and things are flooding there memories
Today my youngest shamed him and called him out on Facebook
A fake a liar an abuser a man who uses God to look like the best guy ever helping others while abusing his family for years .
She was hopping mad and would not take it down but finally a friend convinced her. I was devastated she did this .
Yes she is in counselling but this is all new...

CentralOhioDad

Personally, I would think it was wrong if you DIDN'T talk to them about it, and not keep it a big secret anymore. It seems, from your post, that it won't be a surprise to anyone, so there might be some healing for all if the communication is open and starts to flow.

I think this is a time to come together - not as an attack against the father, but as a rallying place where people can just talk together, and not suffer and stew in silence.

Just my .02

firebolt

Agree with COD ^

If they are adults, and see the issues, you can all heal together. Best to you, that would be so hard.

hopeful4

I would answer their questions and talk to them. However, I would not lean on them for your own support and be careful of that. That is a counselor's position.

I think all parents need to be very careful of that.

theuncertainty

A question that you may want to explore, BlueHI: Why were you devastated? That's a huge feeling. Were you embarrassed that your life was exposed? Were you wanting to protect him / his image? Why? What was behind you feeling devastated? Please know I'm not expecting any answer here; just something to ponder.

I know that AXH had drummed it into me that we don't discuss his abusive behavior or addiction with others before I even knew they were issues. I'd be harassed and berated by him for sharing anything about our family with anyone. A simple discussion with a customer who had retired from a job on the North Slope, which included a caution that slope jobs were really hard on new families, ended up with a screaming bout from AXH when I mentioned the conversation to him. How dare I bring outsiders into our private lives?! If I couldn't even mention something that was basically nothing, I certainly couldn't discuss anything negative. Only he got to share stuff.

It took a while before I could talk about life with him without fear that what I was doing was wrong. And I'm sometimes still kind of afraid of repercussions. It takes time.

You mention that your daughter is in counseling. Are you? Those would be good questions to explore with a counselor or therapist. And they'd be able to help you handle discussions with your kids in a constructive manner. That's not to say your separated RA couldn't, or wouldn't, say you're trying to alienate the kids from him, but you'd have a bit more confidence that you're handling the matter in a good way.

While I have no idea exactly what she posted to FB, and agree that it may not be the best medium, I actually think it was pretty amazing that she felt safe enough to do so. ((((hugs))))

Bluehawaii

Thanks for the insight...
I have been listening to mostly about the lies and manipulation and the physical abuse they endured.
We have shared together all the different ways he manipulated.
And how genius he was at it. They have seen me upset is that leaning on them?
I was wondering why I was so devastated to and have a hard time understanding my feelings as they have been shut down so long but I think embarrassed for sure ...I'm seen as so strong by many...feeling stupid I allowed this for so long...and most of all scared that I would be blamed for this....
She did apologize to him today and he of course acted like it was all ok.
As usual.super sweet and understanding.
She really exposed him.
I've been asking him by email this morning to come to agreement with the separation agreement contents so we can move forward and of course he does not respond,which really scares me.
I know he must be so mad and it will be my fault.

CentralOhioDad

Him being mad is not your fault - his reaction to the situation is his own doing. He can be mad at himself for all the things he's done (which he won't because A's don't have accountability).

You did what you have to do. Good for you!

mylifeismine

I am sorry you are going through this, it is a difficult and
vulnerable time for you and your kids. Have you considered
a few sessions of family counseling with you & kids? An
objective professional could get everyone headed in the
right direction so no one, you especially, gets thrown under
the bus. (((hugs))))

hopeful4

Seeing you upset is not leaning on them in my opinion. However, if you need to talk about it to get it off your own chest, and need support over what you have endured, that in my opinion is not where you get it from your kids.

Be calm, be truthful. This is just my .02

My 16, almost 17 yr old said the other day that her friend's mom does this to her and that it's too much yet her friend feels badly to tell her mom that it's too much for her to hear, that she really wishes she would get a counselor.

My DD was telling her friend about their counselor, etc when all of this came up. I was listening and it really made me open my eyes to how people can lean on their children, adult or not, way too much. That is not a burden for them to bear. However, if they are at a time in their life that they want to ask you questions, I do think I would answer.

This is all just my .02 friend

Yoga

It's normal to feel in "trouble" when leaving an abusive relationship.

Don't forget, years of manipulation by the abuser to scare you into keeping silent. It's a way of control for them.

CentralOhioDad

My parents put me in the middle constantly - mom trashed dad, dad trashed mom. They couldn't talk to each other effectively, so I was the guinea pig. Sucky place to be.

theuncertainty

No. Letting them see you grieving, or hurt, is showing them that it's OK to be human and have your own feelings. AXH (and I think abusive partners, in general) doesn't really want anyone to have their own feelings - any feelings we show that are counter to what he wants us to feel are wrong. I think it's really important to show our kids that it's OK to experience our own feelings.

The therapist I started seeing after I left AXH, but before the divorce, asked me once what I was feeling and I looked at her with what must have been the blankest look. I had. absolutely. no. idea. After a very long pause, my response ended up being something along the lines of that I 'felt' like a robot. And I think I really was just moving around on autopilot all the time for a very long time. When I did start experiencing feelings again, I thought I must be bipolar. The happy's felt SUPER, SUPER high. The lows felt like I was drowning at the bottom of the Mariana Trench. I couldn't even put a name to anything in between. Personally, I think the highs and lows just felt that gigantic because I was so used to not feeling anything. My T assured me it was a normal thing and it'd even out; things wouldn't always feel quite so extreme. (She was right.)

I kind of forgot that's how it felt until just now thinking about that time again, so I didn't even consider that it might be something similar with your emotional response to your daughter's FB post. Maybe similar?

If, like I did for a while, you're feeling like you're at the mercy of your "new" emotions, it really helped me to start picturing my overwhelming feelings as waves crashing over me - it might feel super extreme *right now*, but it'll recede, it'll change into something else - I wasn't really buried at the bottom of a sea filled with a single scary emotion.

Sorry, I really don't mean to "talk" forever, but writing it out is helping me - I hope something there might help you, too.

maia1234

BH,
No this is not going to be easy, especially when you have kids involved, when getting a divorce. Of course AH is going to blame you for everything. Your kids sound old enough to see everything, and over time you will not be there to hide this BS from them as you had your whole marriage.

They will see who he really is, in "real" time. If they ask, I would not hide or shield them from anything. You might be surprised at what they saw.

Sending you hugs and support. Be patient as this is a long journey.

Ladybird579

I would be very careful how you tread with this. My adult kids had a hard time believing their dad was any worse than he had ever been when we finally divorced. They resented me bitterly for breaking up the family, as they saw it, and he did a good job of looking like the wronged victim. He lied and still does. My two youngest who live with me can see him for what he is now but they still live in hope of a happy ending. ( they won't get one ..he's very ill now) Some of my other kids think he was better when he was with me and blame me for him drinking more cos we divorced.

I would try counselling rather than family talks. It gets too emotional and hurtful. I spent many nights crying in the garden in the pitch dark trying to understand my kids point of view and take their criticism of my failings as they saw them on the chin. It was all turned on me. I was the scapegoat for all he did. According to them I should have stopped him, kept money from him, took bottles off him, not argued with him, not got upset...basically every reason he drank was down to me in their eyes cos he told them so. I was left raw and devastated and with this feeling nothing I had done was good enough. I will live with that forever. I lost 3 of my lovely daughters over this cos they said if you split up we will never talk to you again and they never have.. They turned their backs on me. My other kids still see me but it will never be the same again.

Bluehawaii

We have been going separately but you know I think this is a good idea and my DD has been saying we should.
I think I will include both DD.
Even though they are older I think this is good advice...thank you

Bluehawaii

It's weird I never saw myself as abused as he was always so kind to my face... I still have trouble thinking I'm the crazy one. For letting him go...someone else is going to love him!!
And think I'm nuts for wrecking my family but then I wrote a few things down to help me remember IM NOT IMAGINING THINGS...but I've been in denial for so long I have to keep telling myself don't forget the truth...

Expanding

The manipulations can be covert and happen slowly over time. He was nice to your face but what could he have been saying behind your back? One of the ONLY reasons I was able to do an about face was when someone finally spilled to me how he spoke about me for YEARS! He made me sound crazy and like he was always the victim. Some A's do what is called a "smear campaign" and it is to protect their image in such a way that they can dump all the blame on you when things go south. Do not fall for this! I doubted my perceptions for months (and sometimes still do) because my axbf was "so nice". I was looking for validation outside myself from his friends and family (BIG mistake) that his drinking really was that bad. He is going to have supporters who believe every word he says

I too, had to keep lists, and still do, in order to hold onto myself. YES, it was that bad. NO, you were not imagining things. You know how you felt and that is what you need to hold on to. I think we often fall for their words because we can't accept their actions. It will get easier and with time and space things will become clearer.