ladyscribbler

I've been involved in a relationship now for about 5 months, so a relatively new one. This has been a different experience for me than any other relationship that I've had since I started dating as a teenager.

The pace is slower, there's lots of emphasis on getting to know one another, appropriate timing of meeting members of the other person's tribe and just generally feeling comfortable in each other's company.
At first I thought it was weird- this came up in another thread, about normal interactions feeling bizarre after dealing with so much unhealthy behavior. Now I'm having lots of "aha!" moments about my relationship behavior in the past. And also some facepalm moments, mostly relating to why and how I stayed with my AX for so frigging long.

Most of the good times I remember with exes came at a price. That might have been sex before I was ready, always letting them choose restaurants or activities, focusing on their interests, their moods, wants, needs...I know you all get it. Now a lot of that was probably just me and nothing that they asked for. I grew up thinking I had to be perfect in order to deserve love and approval (conditional love), so I always tried to be that perfect partner to the point of avoiding all conflict and trying to anticipate their needs in advance, to solve every problem (whether they asked for my help or not) and basically just sublimating my very self for the sake of a relationship. I was so desperate for love that it drove away anyone healthy or sane enough to see my crazy while drawing in those who knew they could take advantage and string me along with crumbs and scraps of caring for a long time before I finally got fed up.

I didn't realize how much my recovery work had changed me until I started trying to date. All I could see was how far I had to go, not how far I had already come. My old, dysfunctional comfort zone is no longer entirely comfortable. But neither is dating a normie (my therapists got a kick out of that term when I explained it). I still have some of those old thoughts and behaviors of wanting to be that "perfect partner." More than once my gentleman friend has seen me start spinning my wheels and said, "You don't have to be anyone other than who you are for me to want to be with you." (unconditional love) He's a farmer and a truck driver and just generally a very sensible, down-to-earth guy, which is refreshing after all the past fireworks and rockets of potential that crashed and burned so spectacularly.

It's taken me a long time (3 years) to even be comfortable with the idea of dating again. It's been a substantial test of my recovery, and really shined a light on those dark, cobwebby corners where I need to do more work. But so far it's been worth it.

Good times don't have to come at a price. Never think that you have to give up a part of yourself to please someone else. And if you're with someone who doesn't know your favorite kind of pie and has never bothered to ask, even though you have their personal preferences memorized, then you might be settling for conditional love.

firebolt

Amazing post, and wonderful for me to read today - helps me feel like I'm on somewhat of a right track.

Thanks LS - amazing to see your recovery in action!

honeypig

LS, I still don't think XAH knows what day my birthday is. On occasion, I'd be searching the house for an article of clothing I couldn't find, something I wore all the time, and if I asked him if he'd seen it, he'd act as if he had no idea what I was talking about (and maybe this was b/c he didn't want to get involved, not b/c he truly didn't remember). But there was so much he either didn't know or got wrong about me, even after all these years.

One of the things that I haven't been able to reconcile is how this same person could do such thoughtful things for me. For instance, I returned from being gone overnight to a race w/my brother several years ago to find that XAH had rearranged my room to let me make better use of the big windows looking out to the back yard and had put up blinds there too. When I was gone to my mom's over Memorial Day, I returned to find that XAH had come over and filled the bird feeders and mowed the (large) lawn.

I still find this confusing. At times, it seemed as if to him, I was some sort of effigy-me, a cutout paper doll, that had some of my characteristics but lacked any desires or feelings or depth or dimensions of its own. He was willing to do what he was willing to do for it/me, but if it/I made any requests of its/my own, that was a whole different story. Does anyone else know what I mean about this?

ladyscribbler

That interesting Honey. I know that both my most recent exes-by far the most serious relationships I ever had, the fathers of my sons- after I ended things with each of them, they found replacements for me in short order. Not only that, but both of them started doing all the things for these new partners that I had asked them to do. Trips I'd wanted to take, remodeling and home repairs I'd asked for, all kinds of things.

It was hard not to feel hurt and envious of those new women, living "my" ideal life. The one I'd been denied. But that was just it. They were getting the things *I* had asked for, which probably had no relation to what they wanted.

Every once in awhile my needs would get met in these relationships, but it was usually in a haphazard "broken clock being right twice a day" kind of way. Some people don't truly see others as individuals with wants and needs of their own. They are so centered on themselves that it's impossible.

dandylion

Honeypig....do you ever wonder if he had a mild for of Asperger's?.......

dandylion

honeypig

He does have a great need for routine and order and sameness (I've posted other places about needing to make sure drawers were shut absolutely tight, blinds were at exactly the same height, etc.), so I suppose that could be a possibility, dandy. I always figured it was his defense against an alcoholic FOO--the whole "control" thing, you know.

And ls, this below is important for me, I think. Thanks.

Liveitwell

Lady-friend, this is such an amazing post!!! I love every word. It is so true that things do feel weird-but weird in a good way-bc YOU are getting healthy.

Love this. Just, big hugs to you!!!

firebolt

I know what you mean - so much.

I can't discount the sweet things my XABF did for me. He gave GREAT gifts and could be very, very sweet with his words at times. Flowers like clockwork on V Day and anniversaries, and he built me some thoughtful things....garden boxes and a step for my corgi to get into bed.

But - if I needed anything emotionally - support, for him to be there during a family event, or god forbid, for him to be sober to do something with me (like to stay sober in case I need a ride to the ER when I was a bleed risk), then it was hell on earth. THOSE requests were just obscene of me to ask of him.

Looking back, he had a hard time managing himself emotionally. Randomly - small inconveniences were absolute atrocities to him. Like someone cutting him off in traffic, or a transient asking for change. Physical illness or limitation crippled him, and he was absolutely able to ask for support and receive it from me. The reverse made me the A hole of the world.

I think he could never validate or support me emotionally because his own emotions were so out of whack, ya know.

Regardless of the reason, it is still dehumanizing to us, and we deserve better

I agree - I feel like I was just an accessory to him - only there to make his life better and with no regard to any depth in my own.

Liveitwell

^ yes yes!!!

bluelily

Actually I´ve always felt like this with my father, who is quite narcissistic. It´s like I´m wearing a mirror in front of my face and he likes to look at his reflection when he looks at me, not at the person behind the mirror. It´s strictly forbidden to take the mirror off, he´d have to see me instead of himself.

I suppose my last romantic relationship,with xabf, was a new version of these dynamics. Everything revolved around him. However, the thing that shocked me was that at some point I realized he DID see me, he was very capable of getting to know me, he just didn´t care. That was probably my cue to run away, not an easy thing when you´re used to live hidden by a mirror.

honeypig

You know, I've been thinking about this thread since posting yesterday, and while I said this

about the way I felt XAH saw me, I saw myself in that same way, to at least some extent. One of the things that I'm working with in recovery is (re)discovering who I am, and I know I've read plenty of other posts here over the years from other members who have come to the end of an unhealthy relationship and found themselves not knowing who they themselves are, what they like, what they want, b/c they've spent so long totally focused on other people's likes, wants, needs.

Thanks for the thought-provoking thread.