AH Relationships

Old 06-11-2016, 09:58 AM
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AH Relationships

Take it from someone who's been on the amusement park ride for well over a decade... married to one. This is what I learned:

1. AHs aren’t revealing their true self until sober for at least a year. You are planning a life with an addiction, not a person. AH is a powerful, mind-altering substance.
2. AHs cannot fall in love. They are already in a deep relationship with AH, and you’ll never replace that. You merely enable their affair.
3. AHs have v. low self-esteem and live in a world of self-pity and blame. No matter your devotion, you will be the one blamed in the end.
4. AHs drinking will conjure a gentle approach from you to start, then as they continually lie, your firm and understandably angry reaction is now cause to drink even more heavily. You are now the cause.
5. AH’s that sober up run away from problems in their past, and look “toward their future”. Years of caring for them mean nothing. You’re now merely a problem from the past, and accountability is a negative concept.
6. AH’s notoriously lie whether drinking or not. It’s their nature, and has been a rewarded behavior that’s now deeply ingrained in their personality. Don't believe sobriety will change this.
7. AHs justify all bad behaviors, even when sober. Your negative reaction to their lies and deceit will be a primary justification to do whatever they want, because their sober brain now knows all.
8. AH’s are notorious for falling off the wagon. The cycle then repeats… forever.
9. AH's can be extremely resentful of your efforts to help them quit. They will take what they can from you before they leave. Do not feel sorry for an AH and marry them.
9. YOU DESERVE A NORMAL RELATIONSHIP with mutual love and affection and devotion. AHs, by their inherent nature, are not capable of this.

Do not marry an AH, period. No matter how much you love him/her, they only love the bottle. They may say they love you, but they are not there mentally. If you marry this person, you will suffer and will be forever regretful once you realize the end is not pretty, and you are deemed the cause, regardless of whether they were an AH before they met you.

AH lie, manipulate and deceive to get their next drink. They don't care about you. You will begin to become a person you do not like when you realize this and react to their drinking in negative ways (who wouldn't eventually after all the lies). Then their issues becomes YOUR anger management problem, and this yet another excuse to drink. Trust me, this is the pattern that you will be in until you divorce this individual.

AHs are self-centered, inherently selfish, pity-partiers. They take no responsibility for their actions, even if they say they do. Truth lies in future actions, and the pattern will repeat with the next binge. Nothing is their fault. If they do rehab/quit, they will move on to remove themselves from your "negative energy" and any accountability for what they've done in the past. Their newly sober euphoric "pink cloud" dry-drunk mantra is, "the past is the past, let it go... look toward the future". You are the past they are referring to, and will not be part of that future. Even if you are, there's a very high probability that they'll fall off the wagon and the whole cycle starts again.

You will see that they make bad decisions even after quitting. Lying was part of their sober, base personality as well. They will justify their errant behaviors as they did when drunk. They will tell you that this is the real person that you've been trying to change.

They will become extremely resentful of your efforts to help them quit and look at it as attempts to control them. They will take what they can from you before they leave. Do not feel sorry for an AH and marry them, it's a lose-lose situation.

Run away now, before you get the lawyers and priests involved. Run as fast as you can toward a normie that can love, respect, and devote their life to

Good Luck.
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Old 06-11-2016, 10:17 AM
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Oh Rocky, I totally get where you are coming from. A lot of what you say is absolutely right, but I also think that it's more complicated than all of that. I do believe my AH (short for Alcoholic Husband...as opposed to an AW (alcoholic wife)) loved me. I don't think he loved me the way I deserved to be loved, and I believe his disease makes it impossible to behave in a way that is truly respectful of me.

I also believe (and know) that many recovering alcoholics who are in true recovery don't fit into your statement in #5. There are MANY alcoholics in recovery who have learned (and continue to learn) how to take responsibility for their actions in the past and the present.

I agree whole-heartedly that the best thing someone can do is to stay far, far away from an ACTIVE addict. But I also don't think it's fair to demonize those people, or to paint RECOVERING/sober addicts with the same brush.

I know it has been a grueling stretch for you, and your AW is treating you terribly. I hope that, with time, your anger and resentment will fade.
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Old 06-11-2016, 10:35 AM
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Rocky.....a good description of alcoholic behaviors of those who are not in genuine recovery (the key word here, is "genuine").......

Now, Rocky.....I give you a ginormous challenge: Try to get a newly "in love" person to believe and heed what you have just presented!!......lol......it is like trying to pull a sword from a stone.......
Most just won't do it....

While alcoholism is powerful...very tenacious....so are the forces of early attraction and "love". Attraction, also, has very powerful bonding hormones on it's side. It is written into our biology...necessarily, by Mother Nature...(long story)......
In addition, it also has culture on it's side......the th ousands of messages...both subtle and overt....that say "Do It"......"It is written in the stars"......"Soul Mates"...."The One"......visions of gossamer wedding dresses and picket fences....the whole 9 yards....."growing old together".......

Then, there are individual pathol ogies to consider.....this list is several pages long.
Fears of abandonment; "Codependency"; Pattterns learned from family of origin; Poor personal coping skills; Ignorance of the disease; Slot-machine reasoning "I've already invested soo much"; The FOG (fear, obligation, guilt); The very, very, lonely; Trauma bonding (in abuse);
etc.......

It is good to present your material, Rocky....Lord knows, we do it over and over, here on SR.....and, I am right in front of the line......lol....

Good Luck!

dandylion
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Old 06-11-2016, 10:13 PM
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I can certainly relate to what you say about an alcoholic's relationship with the bottle. I used to tease my STBXAH about his "mistress," Sky (vodka), who he seemed to love more than anyone else.
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Old 06-12-2016, 04:15 AM
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I absolutely agree with your description of an active alcoholic. I would never recommend anyone Marry or involve themselves in any way with someone who is alcoholic.

In my experience a true recovered alcoholic does not fit this description. My husband is the most honest person I know, sometimes too honest lol. He lives daily to make me happy, he serves our marriage and relationship with much effort.

He's the best person I know. I'm sorry for what you have endured.

The statement in your post "Do not feel sorry for your AH and marry him". I think so many people do, they think if they don't that their partner will delve deeper into alcoholism. They think they will change. They think it can't get worse. Guilt causes us all to make very poor decisions at times. Marriage is one of the most serious commitments we will ever make - it shouldn't be done out of guilt, and certainly not with an active alcoholic or addict. Thank you for pointing that out.
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Old 06-12-2016, 05:43 AM
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Very timely post, Rocky
I have had some time to contemplate my own illness as a codependent, and am starting to see the chain of events, family of origin, friends, and finally my ex in that light.

The fact that we chose to marry alcoholics says a lot less about them than us. The fact we chose them was no accident. We picked them on purpose, usually for reasons that seemed very noble at the time.

This began our addiction to them, where we were pre-occupied with changing them and saving them. For us codies, genuine recovery is happening when we lose our attraction to people like that. When I look back at people who really used to turn me on, there was a bottle of something close by.

In some ways, I think recovery from a substance might be easier than recovery from codependency, because codependency is all wrapped up in human attachments and sexual desire- normal human impulses.

Glad you are here among us. you contribute so much.
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Old 06-12-2016, 04:22 PM
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Checking back in...

Originally Posted by Eauchiche View Post
In some ways, I think recovery from a substance might be easier than recovery from codependency
Eauchiche, Thanks for the reply. I'm reading Codependent No More, by Melady Beattie. Prior to the 90s there really was not much on CDs. She broke new ground, and the book is amazingly on point. Good luck with your situation... a day at a time.

To the others, thanks for the input. Some are claiming that I'm painting with a broad brush. Note that this was my experience with an AH spouse.

Peace
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Old 06-12-2016, 04:37 PM
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Wow. You said so much but all that leapt out at me was unadulterated RAGE.

I am so sorry for your pain. No one deserves what you have been through- your last word is what we all deserve, "peace." Your post really touched something in me- maybe related to my parents marriage (my alcoholic, bipolar mom) and their recovery, my own recovery, I dont know and that is for my future reflection- and my heart goes out to you.
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Old 06-14-2016, 06:58 AM
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Thanks for the input August. It' hard to read tone in a written message, which is low on the hierarchy of communications, so I can understand your take on it. My goal in the post was to be as clear as possible, seeing all the inquiries on SR about whether or not someone should continue a relationship with an AH.

Sometimes you need to use crayons to get your message across to the love struck. In this case, you need to use hand grenades to wake them up to the life-changing disaster they're facing if they make the wrong choice. Harsh, but hopefully effective.

Peace
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Old 06-14-2016, 10:21 AM
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Originally Posted by CoDnoMore View Post
Do not feel sorry for an AH and marry them, it's a lose-lose situation.

Run away now, before you get the lawyers and priests involved. Run as fast as you can toward a normie that can love, respect, and devote their life to

Good Luck.
I need to read this every single day for the rest of my life. EVERY SINGLE DAY. I have been feeling sorry for my Alcoholic soon to be ex fiance for a while now. So tempted to trust him this one time and get married to him. But No, he had his chance. We were engaged for a year and were planning our wedding when he relapsed, not once, not twice, but five times. I only wish I had not gotten engaged to him - By getting engaged I got my family and friends involved in this. They were as excited about our wedding as me, if not more. Why, why did this happened to me
He is so manipulative though.. every time he calls me, he makes promises, talks about what a lovely life we will have together, we will be married with kids, we will travel together. And my heart starts to melt. Then I come to this forum for strength. Thank you to all you wonderful people here.
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Old 06-14-2016, 10:25 AM
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Hoping what would happen if you backed off on so much contact while you figure out what you want and whether this person can give it to you? We all need time and space sometimes -- I know you have distance, but all this contact just keeps your head spinning...
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Old 06-14-2016, 11:40 AM
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Originally Posted by SparkleKitty View Post
Hoping what would happen if you backed off on so much contact while you figure out what you want and whether this person can give it to you? We all need time and space sometimes -- I know you have distance, but all this contact just keeps your head spinning...
I get very anxious SparkleKitty when I don't talk to him. This is crazy. Is this how addicts feel when they are unable to get to their drug of choice??

I am doing everything - staying busy with friends/family, reaching out for support, seeing a therapist, researching codependency but every time I fight the urge to talk to him, I get super exhausted, anxious, sad, depressed. I was never like this before. This does not mean that I will cave in. I will keep trying and fight harder.
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Old 06-14-2016, 11:59 AM
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To be honest, Hoping, it sounds exactly like an addiction.

Lots of us have been there.

I had to stop feeding my addiction to another person with constant contact. I know just how hard it is, because I've been there. I can tell you that it got easier the longer I was able to resist contacting the object of my addiction. If it helps. I think you're doing really well considering how hard this is.
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:07 PM
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Like I tell my 6-yr old: you don't have to do it perfectly, but you MUST give it your best effort.

You're making progress. Progress is always good.
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Old 06-14-2016, 12:35 PM
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Originally Posted by SparkleKitty View Post
To be honest, Hoping, it sounds exactly like an addiction.

Lots of us have been there.

I had to stop feeding my addiction to another person with constant contact. I know just how hard it is, because I've been there. I can tell you that it got easier the longer I was able to resist contacting the object of my addiction. If it helps. I think you're doing really well considering how hard this is.
Originally Posted by CentralOhioDad View Post
Like I tell my 6-yr old: you don't have to do it perfectly, but you MUST give it your best effort.

You're making progress. Progress is always good.

Thank you so much for the encouragement. You are helping me a great great deal! Big hugs!!
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Old 06-17-2016, 07:48 AM
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Hoping, you wrote,

"We were engaged for a year and were planning our wedding when he relapsed, not once, not twice, but five times. I only wish I had not gotten engaged to him - By getting engaged I got my family and friends involved in this. They were as excited about our wedding as me, if not more."

This is EXACTLY what happened to me. I clearly remember voicing my concern that I had a bad feeling about marrying her with my best man a week before the wedding, and him saying it was just normal to feel that way.

Oh, how I wish I had not let the pressure of the family, etc. push me toward the alter. To think you're heading this advice makes me feel better... to have helped even one person not make the same life-changing mistake I did. Good luck, and stay strong. Don't let friends or family guilt you into a bad decision that will haunt you.

Peace
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Old 06-17-2016, 08:20 AM
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Originally Posted by CoDnoMore View Post
Hoping, you wrote,

"We were engaged for a year and were planning our wedding when he relapsed, not once, not twice, but five times. I only wish I had not gotten engaged to him - By getting engaged I got my family and friends involved in this. They were as excited about our wedding as me, if not more."

This is EXACTLY what happened to me. I clearly remember voicing my concern that I had a bad feeling about marrying her with my best man a week before the wedding, and him saying it was just normal to feel that way.

Oh, how I wish I had not let the pressure of the family, etc. push me toward the alter. To think you're heading this advice makes me feel better... to have helped even one person not make the same life-changing mistake I did. Good luck, and stay strong. Don't let friends or family guilt you into a bad decision that will haunt you.

Peace
Thank you CoDnoMore - Slowly but surely, I am moving away from him one day at a time. You and amazing people like you in SR are changing my life for the better.
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Old 06-17-2016, 08:28 AM
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"You and amazing people like you in SR are changing my life for the better."

Amen to that!!
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