360startstoday

Good morning,

I have been reading in this group a whole lot lately. I will not give way too much background. But I think you guys are honest and can help me in some ways I am having trouble helping myself.

In February my husband and I had a big blow out. He got violent and tore up the house in a bad way. I threw his stuff out in the garage, (I own the house on my own) and told him he had ten minutes to get out or I was calling the police (my children were home and they have no business witnessing that junk). He didn't believe me, I called, he left before they got there.

That night the texts and calls and voicemails started coming, he was flooding me. I was not responding. I made a decision that I was not drinking anymore. Ever again when all this happened. (I had not drank when this all occurred. I am now sober and loving it and working on it daily. That is another story). In these messages over the next 3 days, he said he was done drinking, smoking and only going to take this time to fix himself. He was going to change for him. (I was still not responding, he had no idea of my decision, this was his decision). He was going to prove to me that he could and would be the man and father he should be. He wanted us to start going to church together, he had given up his life and would prove it. At the time, I thought he was just using my faith against me. Over the next week I slowly started to talking to him, he was sending flowers to my office (out of character completely, he had not done that before). He met the boys and I for walks on the river. Went out to dinner with us. He had this amazing peace about him. So, of course, brilliant me, I let him come home within 2 weeks.

For about 6 weeks everything was great. He really did seem to be a different person. But slowly, he stopped doing the good things.... anger seemed to creep back in. After a solid bad week, I confronted him, I know people have bad days, but what is up with this? He said that I should be able to "fix" him, say what he needs to hear and make everything better. I then told him I could not. This was not my job, he has to do this with himself, and only he and God could fix him. He has held onto this and brings it up constantly, throwing it in my face. I can just walk away. I know I can't fix him.

There are many many things that have happened. His jealously and insecurity are back with a vengeance, I am cheating on him or want to a lot. ( I am not and never have, he has been caught). Bringing up things that happened when I wasn't with him.

We didn't have the kids a few weeks ago. He was picking fights, he said he was going to buy a six pack. I told him fine, do what you will, but you will not bring it here, you can stay somewhere else.

Last night at a birthday party, they asked if he was still sober (been 4 months, I honestly can't tell you if he is sober or not, I know he is hiding something, but do not know what it is), he says yeah. He can't drink, he doesn't have his balls anymore. He is essentially blaming me for his sobriety.... if that even makes sense.

So, I believe, pretty much. I am living with a "dry drunk". He is resenting me for what he said was HIS decision. There is so much more to this but I won't bore you all. But maybe you can point things out to me that I am not seeing?

I am constantly trying to figure out what I did wrong. What is my part in this? I almost always end up taking the blame. I figure out how I somehow cause his anger, sarcasm and passive aggressive stuff. I looked up the term gaslighting the other day after one of you posted it.... There could be something there.

I know I am not perfect and I do have genuine empathy for him and his past. But I can't live like this or subject my boys to whatever this is anymore. I want to tell him to take his balls, go get drunk, stoned, watch his porn and figure out which life it is he wants to live. But I don't think that will work either.

Help?? Sorry for the novel. Just tell me what this is.

firebolt

I'm sorry you are going through that kind of pain.

What would happen if you told him you needed some time apart, and that you didn't want to try again until he gets a year of recovery under his belt.

I say a year, because that seems to be a median timeline of when people in recovery start to plane out - myself included....and I am not an alcoholic!

Maybe he's ready to be done with it, maybe he's not - either way, his behavior TODAY is unacceptable to you. You deserve better, and you seem to see this very clearly. I know the action is the hard part!!

Best to you!

dandylion

360....from my view....it is alcoholism. Alcoholism in a person who is not ready to to accept that fact and is unwilling to do what it takes to enter genuine sobriety.

What he did when you kicked him out was to do all the things that he knew would suck you back in. He put out the bait....and, you bit.....

He was white knuckling....not doing the things he would have to do to maintain sobriety. He was not "doing it for himself" like he said. He did what it took to get you to let him return to the status-quo. I would not be surprised if he has not been sipping on the side,,,,,,

If would help you if you read more about the the way alcoholism works...
I suggest that you do some reading in the sticky at the top of the page, called,,,,"Classic Reading"......as well a getting yourself a copy of "Co-dependent No More".....(for yourself)......
Knowledge is power......

I am glad that you understand how destructive this is for your kids.....

dandylion

hopeful4

So he romanced you into thinking he is a different person, when really you are stuck with the same a$$hole you started with, that is what I am hearing.

What I learned about my X is that I don't like who he is, drunk or sober. He's a bad person. Alcohol does not make someone cheat, lie, and be abusive. It can make it worse, but those things are choices he has made.

You deserve more, as do your children. Now the decision has to be, what are you going to do about it?

You don't have to decide anything today, that is important to remember. Do things to form healthy boundaries for yourself and your children should be the #1 concern.

I encourage you to seek counseling from a counselor who specializes in helping families with addiction. For you only, and likely your children separately. That way, no matter what decisions come next, you are in the right frame of mind to handle that.

Tight hugs. I know it's hard.

360startstoday

I was thinking about the counseling thing this morning. Maybe it will be a good idea.

I read the red flags list and had to laugh.... There are few that do NOT apply.

I am afraid I know what has to be done. We were apart with no contact for 18 months.... nothing changed. I am an idiot for getting sucked back into this. I just wish he really was that good guy that was around for awhile.

One thing I am really struggling with, is my faith says.... put God first, others second and us last. With my kids I don't give it a second thought, that's what moms do. But I feel that by having him leave, I am not holding up to what I should be. That I am giving in to something wrong rather than persevering.

dandylion

360....the way I look at it....the Universal force (God) resides in all of us....in all of the creatures of the Universe....
So, doing the best thing for myself or my kids is the right thing to do.....

I don't know of any religion that forbids divorce of separation at all.....

I also know of people who permanently separated and never bothered to get divorced.
for what it is worth........

dandylion

****about counseling....I have long noticed that those who were willing to get help and support are the ones who were most likely to heal and arrive at peace.....

SparkleKitty

By removing your kids from this situation, you ARE putting others first. The ones who do not have any choice in the matter. Nothing good will come of having this role model in their lives. No higher power would want you to endanger the emotional well-being of children for the sake of protecting someone who has done nothing to help themselves.

Liveitwell

He is an abuser....not just an alcoholic. God allows for us to leave abusers-the Bible is pretty clear on his a husband should treat and love his wife. Also, alcoholism in a marriage is a third party/it's the same as if he had cheated on you-alcohol is his mistress. A marriage cannot survive with three parties. Btw, I understand-I tried to persevere for years-push through-stand strong in my marriage-all I got was a boat load of lies, more and worse abuse, a lying cheat that manipulated his way back in each time (using the same exact methods you described-literally-which is why I knew it was a crock of ****-it's textbook!)..,, and my children losing the innocence of their childhood and put in very unsafe and scary situations. You're persevering to put your kids first, and you, in front of this monster. Marriage is supposed to reflect Gods love-don't think your marriage does that at all (and mine didn't either).

Hugs, but at least you are on the right path...for you and your kids.

360startstoday

I actually never looked at it like that. As a third party. That's exactly what it is.

Thank you for your response. I do believe you are exactly right.

360startstoday

Another question. When he did all this "change" he said he was going to get outside help. He did not. So these are my two thoughts/ideas on what is coming next, I am supposed to talk to him tonight.... Originally I was thinking he just needs to go, but I had another thought.... I do appreciate all of your honesty.

1. He needs to go and lets just be done with this.

2. He follows through on his word and does get help. That is the only way to possible salvage this, is through help.

Has anyone even had a positive experience with the second category? Or am I just setting myself up for temporary change and then disaster again? I know that some people can and do change, I have changed tremendously over time.... but I wanted it for ME. I feel as like, if I give him those two options, its not HIS choice, so nothing real will come of it... thoughts?

Wisconsin

Many people here have said that a good rule of thumb is a year of solid sobriety and recovery. Given the way he is abusing you (and doing it in front of children, which is child abuse in my opinion), if it were me I would demand he move out immediately. What he chooses to do at that point is his business. If you want to tell him "show me a year of sobriety and recovery and counseling and then we'll talk," that's up to you. But I think for everyone's emotional health, a physical separation could be a huge benefit. I stayed for far too long, and my children have been deeply emotionally scarred by the way they saw my STBXAH emotionally abuse me. Don't doubt that time is of the essence for their emotional health.

His actions will show you where his heart is, and the truth will always come out in the end. He couldn't fake those "changes" for more than a few weeks before, and he won't be able to fake it now, either. If you see meaningful change over a period of many months, then perhaps that will indicate he is working his recovery.

Liveitwell

I agree with W-for you and your children's well being it is imperative some separation be made. If he's sincere, you'll know. If it's all an act , you'll know that too. And really - regardless of what HE does, what matters is what's best for you and the kids....right now you are letting HIM be in the drivers seat of your life-he's still steering the ship! You can take your life back.

SparkleKitty

The best predictor of future behavior is past behavior.

You have seen a perfect example of what happens when someone tries to change FOR someone else. The backslide is inevitable. He has to want it for himself. That may or may not ever happen. How long can you wait and see? How long can your kids wait and see?

If you are not ready to let go completely then consider an actual no-chance-of-caving-early separation. See what he does when you are not in the picture and when you are not going to be back in the picture in at least a year.

Yoga

It's emotional,mental,verbal abuse.

He's blame shifting,trying to make his choices your fault.

"Why Does He Do That, In the Minds of Angry and Controlling Men by Lundy Bancroft.

Great read and will answer all your questions about what you are living.

Liveitwell

Yoga-great recommendation-that book explained all I needed to know about my ex husband ( husband at the time when I read it). 360-there is a great part in Lundy's book that talks about how to assess whether an abuser has changed-so vitally important to understand this and the difference between true change and what your hubby is doing to you/abuse, lying, blsmeshifting, projecting, gaslighting. All of these are NOT on the list!

Liveitwell

Btw-if you do plan on leaving, do not tell him of your plans-and please have a plan in place prior to leaving.

360startstoday

I will go look for that now. Both of the book recommendations. My secretary is reading co-dependent no more... how ironic lol.

I am not looking forward to this evening's conversation. I have been intentionally putting it off, but last nights non-sense made it clear I had to talk to him today. I so appreciate any and all input from you guys.

I am not trying to look like a victim at all. Although it probably comes across that way. I am just desperate to get to the bottom of this. I have made mistakes, I just want my boys to be raised happy and healthy is all and I will not take detours from that any longer not for comfort of anyone, including myself.

360startstoday

I am not leaving. It is my house. I'm not exactly how to come up with a, you need to go plan. Thinking into this a little further.... he has been intentionally starting fights.... maybe he will be happy to leave? Maybe this is exactly what he is fishing for?

Wisconsin

You won't know until you raise the issue. However, even though the house is in your name alone, your jurisdiction may have laws that protect his right to live there. If that's the case, and he refuses to leave, you may need to file a formal eviction notice or proceeding even though is name is not on the deed. Just an FYI--you may need to contact a lawyer if he refuses to go.

And my experience was that after a remarkably calm, sober conversation, my STBXAH agreed to move out of our rental (both our names were on the lease), but the next day he acted as if nothing had happened. So just keep your radar up, and don't take anything at face value. And if he DOES move out, change the locks RIGHT AWAY.

AnvilheadII

i think you are dealing with MORE that just untreated alcoholism.....the man's got ISSUES coming out his ears. and some seem to be about dominating and controlling women - his anger and suspicion about your behaviors and the porn are top two. and so a couple therapy sessions, or a stint in rehab, or just NOT drinking are not going to FIX things.

even if he started TODAY to truly address his anger, rage, control, etc, he would not be stable or trustworthy as a partner or parent for a LONG time. i wouldn't want someone who tore up a house IN FRONT of children around those children. again. ever.

KIDS COME FIRST. period. and they deserve a safe sane home. they also have NO choice in how their parents conduct themselves, or what they are subject or witness to. but they absorb it all. don't filter your decisions on what MIGHT work for HIM, concentrate solely on what is truly best for the children.

i agree that you must makes plans but not SHARE them with him. don't hand the guy with the gun any more bullets. be safe, be smart.