Limbo land
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Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Limbo land
I have posted before,
recap: My RAH has been dry for almost 7 weeks. We are separated but in the same house. We no longer fight and are cordial and are attending MC together but taking it very very slowly.
Today in MC he said he was glad of the space because he needs to work on his own alcoholism and cannot be in a position where he uses arguments, my displeasure etc as a trigger to drink. I feel he is still making excuses. He says he has just 'graduated' step one. At this rate it will be 2 years before he finishes the 12 steps program. Meanwhile I feel I will just be on the back burner till he recovers .
Is this completely normal? We don't really talk much except have lunch or dinner once a week and do most of our talking in MC. I am going to IC for myself and continuing with my own life as far as possible.
What i want to know is should i put a timeframe on his recovery? At the moment this is all very new.
I sometimes feel very lonely and to be honest feel that I am suffering because of his choices and not because of my own yet he is making these comments and I have no say. This is my life too.
I have spent many years with a shell of a marriage and am very jaded, some days I just want to jack it all in and move on.
Wont it be even more difficult to reconnect as a married couple after a long period of time, I may not even want to?
I also notice that MC causes me to waiver in my committment to staying the course as it digs up so much stuff.
What do others think? or how did you handle it?
recap: My RAH has been dry for almost 7 weeks. We are separated but in the same house. We no longer fight and are cordial and are attending MC together but taking it very very slowly.
Today in MC he said he was glad of the space because he needs to work on his own alcoholism and cannot be in a position where he uses arguments, my displeasure etc as a trigger to drink. I feel he is still making excuses. He says he has just 'graduated' step one. At this rate it will be 2 years before he finishes the 12 steps program. Meanwhile I feel I will just be on the back burner till he recovers .
Is this completely normal? We don't really talk much except have lunch or dinner once a week and do most of our talking in MC. I am going to IC for myself and continuing with my own life as far as possible.
What i want to know is should i put a timeframe on his recovery? At the moment this is all very new.
I sometimes feel very lonely and to be honest feel that I am suffering because of his choices and not because of my own yet he is making these comments and I have no say. This is my life too.
I have spent many years with a shell of a marriage and am very jaded, some days I just want to jack it all in and move on.
Wont it be even more difficult to reconnect as a married couple after a long period of time, I may not even want to?
I also notice that MC causes me to waiver in my committment to staying the course as it digs up so much stuff.
What do others think? or how did you handle it?
Member
Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Lakeside, Ca
Posts: 10,208
so as to get the train back on track
Originally Posted by Amms 
Wont it be even more difficult to reconnect as a married couple after a long period of time, I may not even want to?
"the waiting is the hardest part"
It's a rough spot for anyone to be in.
Only you know how much you can take
and for how long you can take it.
Is the thought of the possible outcomes worth your time spent ?
Are both parties willing to give 100 % ?
Sure takes a lot on both sides of the fence at this stage
so as to get the train back on track.
I do wish you well,
Bob
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Iowa
Posts: 3,050
I'm curious about what your personal recovery looks like. Are you attending any meetings yourself, like Alanon? Or maybe doing some individual counseling? You can use this space as well, and pursue your own recovery from the effects of living with alcoholism. You don't have to wait for him to "graduate" the steps, lol. There's really no graduating. The 12 steps are tools that anyone interested in recovery can apply to their life.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
You've asked some great questions & I'm in agreement with Lady - you'll struggle a lot more when you focus on measuring his progress in some way. There is no magic ending when a person completes the steps & I've heard many people say that they've gone through them again, at a later point in their recovery.
I absolutely felt the same frustrations that you talk about & it only eased in relation to growth in my OWN recovery. Being "forced" to recovery irritated me in & of itself, so I struggled against THAT idea for a while too.
The surprising thing was that once I DID start my healing process, *I* was the one who wanted/needed more space. *I* was the one who was a bit erratic as I uncovered new labels, new definitions, new ideas. It was uncomfortable at best & downright painful at times. For us, we HAD to figure ourselves out individually to see what was even left to bring to the table of our marriage. And yes, doing that while still IN the relationship is hard work - I felt like leaving the marriage more after he started recovery than I did before. It seemed a lot less complicated some days to just make a clean break & start over.
IN the first 90 days of recovery I felt like we were better off NOT talking as much as possible. We were speaking different languages & needed to focus on different things even if we were working toward the same goal. We may have had a common problem, but our solutions were very, very different.
I absolutely felt the same frustrations that you talk about & it only eased in relation to growth in my OWN recovery. Being "forced" to recovery irritated me in & of itself, so I struggled against THAT idea for a while too.
The surprising thing was that once I DID start my healing process, *I* was the one who wanted/needed more space. *I* was the one who was a bit erratic as I uncovered new labels, new definitions, new ideas. It was uncomfortable at best & downright painful at times. For us, we HAD to figure ourselves out individually to see what was even left to bring to the table of our marriage. And yes, doing that while still IN the relationship is hard work - I felt like leaving the marriage more after he started recovery than I did before. It seemed a lot less complicated some days to just make a clean break & start over.
IN the first 90 days of recovery I felt like we were better off NOT talking as much as possible. We were speaking different languages & needed to focus on different things even if we were working toward the same goal. We may have had a common problem, but our solutions were very, very different.
Member
Join Date: May 2010
Location: USA
Posts: 13,560
One of the most frustrating things about recovery is that it cannot be measured in time. Think about how long it took him to get here. Seven weeks is nothing.
It's much better for him to actually do the steps the right way than to rush through and don't get anything out of it, which leads to relapse. Recovery is a selfish time, and many times the spouse or sig. other cannot deal with it.
I encourage you to work on yourself, to examine what you can do for your own happiness during this time.
Keep coming back to SR, you are not alone!
It's much better for him to actually do the steps the right way than to rush through and don't get anything out of it, which leads to relapse. Recovery is a selfish time, and many times the spouse or sig. other cannot deal with it.
I encourage you to work on yourself, to examine what you can do for your own happiness during this time.
Keep coming back to SR, you are not alone!
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Amms......have you considered having an individual counselor for yourself (yourself, only).......either, in addition to or instead of MC?
In marriage counseling....the marriage is the "patient"......
While it may sound "selfish" to you (lol)....this is a time when you need to have yourself and your own welfare front and center.
Like you said...."It is my life, too".
Indeed, it may be too little/too late.....sometimes, that is the case....
That is one of the things that you will have to decide.....
I CAN say that your happiness is just as important as his.
Relationships need to feel equitable to BOTH parties....if they are to be functional.....
By "functional"...I mean a place where both parties can thrive...and, not just to exist.....
I hope that these thoughts are helpful to you....
dandylion
In marriage counseling....the marriage is the "patient"......
While it may sound "selfish" to you (lol)....this is a time when you need to have yourself and your own welfare front and center.
Like you said...."It is my life, too".
Indeed, it may be too little/too late.....sometimes, that is the case....
That is one of the things that you will have to decide.....
I CAN say that your happiness is just as important as his.
Relationships need to feel equitable to BOTH parties....if they are to be functional.....
By "functional"...I mean a place where both parties can thrive...and, not just to exist.....
I hope that these thoughts are helpful to you....
dandylion
Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 5,103
What i want to know is should i put a timeframe on his recovery? At the moment this is all very new.
Some people find the need to attend AA meetings every day for the first year. Some people need to work the steps over and over and over again. Recovery will always depend on HIS need that day.
It’s very important for you to also seek your own recovery program and focus on you.
Sober since 10th April 2012
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: Perth, Western Australia
Posts: 6,047
We often see posters saying how up-beat their recovering partners are, full of energy, talking the talk, treating them like royalty etc. This mood often doesn't last and when it crashes, so does the RA.
Real recovery can be different. The RA might be withdrawn, lack energy for relationships, selfish, concentrating most of their energy on their own struggle. Whatever the outcome, right now your RAH seems to be giving it a genuine try.
I second the others in their suggestion that you concentrate on your own recovery from everything his alcoholism has put you through. Maybe see your own counsellor, and live as independent a life as you can, building up other relationships with friends and family so you're not lonely just because he isn't available to you emotionally right now.
Sometimes when the pressure comes off is the hardest time, as all the emotions we have suppressed show themselves. That's why your own counsellor might help you process these.
Possibly MC might be more productive later on?
Real recovery can be different. The RA might be withdrawn, lack energy for relationships, selfish, concentrating most of their energy on their own struggle. Whatever the outcome, right now your RAH seems to be giving it a genuine try.
I second the others in their suggestion that you concentrate on your own recovery from everything his alcoholism has put you through. Maybe see your own counsellor, and live as independent a life as you can, building up other relationships with friends and family so you're not lonely just because he isn't available to you emotionally right now.
Sometimes when the pressure comes off is the hardest time, as all the emotions we have suppressed show themselves. That's why your own counsellor might help you process these.
Possibly MC might be more productive later on?
A Day at a Time
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Grand Rapids MI
Posts: 6,435
There is a lot of disgreement within AA about how quickly the steps should take so I can only speak for myself.
My first sponsor was not in any rush for me to do the steps but I did talk to him everyday and went to a meeting almost everyday. At about 9 month sober rational thought had returned and I started to see the big picture of what AA was.
It was then I started to go through the steps over the next 9 months. For myself this worked our very well and have been sober for 6+ years.
Recovery may have a beginning but it has no end. I work on my recovery everyday. This post is me working on my recovery.
I will never be fixed I will just be better than I was. Each day is a baby step but I have found you can go a hell of a long way taking baby steps.
I would work on your recovery because he seems to be working on his
My first sponsor was not in any rush for me to do the steps but I did talk to him everyday and went to a meeting almost everyday. At about 9 month sober rational thought had returned and I started to see the big picture of what AA was.
It was then I started to go through the steps over the next 9 months. For myself this worked our very well and have been sober for 6+ years.
Recovery may have a beginning but it has no end. I work on my recovery everyday. This post is me working on my recovery.
I will never be fixed I will just be better than I was. Each day is a baby step but I have found you can go a hell of a long way taking baby steps.
I would work on your recovery because he seems to be working on his
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by ladyscribbler
I'm curious about what your personal recovery looks like. Are you attending any meetings yourself, like Alanon? Or maybe doing some individual counseling? You can use this space as well, and pursue your own recovery from the effects of living with alcoholism. You don't have to wait for him to "graduate" the steps, lol. There's really no graduating. The 12 steps are tools that anyone interested in recovery can apply to their life.
I do read Courage to change and have started to read (again) Melodie Beatie's Co dependent no more. I also go to IC so I am doing pretty ok I think. I just do not like being in this stage of not knowing how it will end. Perhaps I need to be more patient.
I have an endgame for myself in terms of my career, etc but I am talking about the marriage. I have been married for 24 years.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
What i want to know is should i put a timeframe on his recovery? At the moment this is all very new.
a time-frame until WHAT happens.....what is it YOU are expecting to happen here?
a time-frame until WHAT happens.....what is it YOU are expecting to happen here?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by FireSprite
You've asked some great questions & I'm in agreement with Lady - you'll struggle a lot more when you focus on measuring his progress in some way. There is no magic ending when a person completes the steps & I've heard many people say that they've gone through them again, at a later point in their recovery.
I absolutely felt the same frustrations that you talk about & it only eased in relation to growth in my OWN recovery. Being "forced" to recovery irritated me in & of itself, so I struggled against THAT idea for a while too.
The surprising thing was that once I DID start my healing process, *I* was the one who wanted/needed more space. *I* was the one who was a bit erratic as I uncovered new labels, new definitions, new ideas. It was uncomfortable at best & downright painful at times. For us, we HAD to figure ourselves out individually to see what was even left to bring to the table of our marriage. And yes, doing that while still IN the relationship is hard work - I felt like leaving the marriage more after he started recovery than I did before. It seemed a lot less complicated some days to just make a clean break & start over.
IN the first 90 days of recovery I felt like we were better off NOT talking as much as possible. We were speaking different languages & needed to focus on different things even if we were working toward the same goal. We may have had a common problem, but our solutions were very, very different.
I absolutely felt the same frustrations that you talk about & it only eased in relation to growth in my OWN recovery. Being "forced" to recovery irritated me in & of itself, so I struggled against THAT idea for a while too.
The surprising thing was that once I DID start my healing process, *I* was the one who wanted/needed more space. *I* was the one who was a bit erratic as I uncovered new labels, new definitions, new ideas. It was uncomfortable at best & downright painful at times. For us, we HAD to figure ourselves out individually to see what was even left to bring to the table of our marriage. And yes, doing that while still IN the relationship is hard work - I felt like leaving the marriage more after he started recovery than I did before. It seemed a lot less complicated some days to just make a clean break & start over.
IN the first 90 days of recovery I felt like we were better off NOT talking as much as possible. We were speaking different languages & needed to focus on different things even if we were working toward the same goal. We may have had a common problem, but our solutions were very, very different.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by AnvilheadII
What i want to know is should i put a timeframe on his recovery? At the moment this is all very new.
a time-frame until WHAT happens.....what is it YOU are expecting to happen here?
a time-frame until WHAT happens.....what is it YOU are expecting to happen here?
Community Greeter
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 16,246
Amms.....for what it is worth---I think that MC is the perfect place to say just what you said to us. straight out--cards all on the table.
What would it hurt? Would the earth stop spinning on it's axis? Would the locusts come?
Why is it that you have no say while he gets to say anything he wants?
Just in case no one has ever said this to you: You have every right to exit a marriage because you want to.
A marriage is a contract that is intended to satisfy the needs of both p artners.
If your needs are not being met....things like--your need to be heard, to feel valued, to know that your thoughts and feelings matter...that YOU MATTER..
you have the right to acknowledge that the contract is not being met.....
Live is short...and, I th ink that we are on this earth to thrive...not just to survive...
I h ope that you don't feel offended.
I have empathy for your situation.....
There is no point in being less than honest with yourself....we can evade everyone else....but, we can't evade ourselves...because way, way, down deep we always know the "truth"......
dandylion
What would it hurt? Would the earth stop spinning on it's axis? Would the locusts come?
Why is it that you have no say while he gets to say anything he wants?
Just in case no one has ever said this to you: You have every right to exit a marriage because you want to.
A marriage is a contract that is intended to satisfy the needs of both p artners.
If your needs are not being met....things like--your need to be heard, to feel valued, to know that your thoughts and feelings matter...that YOU MATTER..
you have the right to acknowledge that the contract is not being met.....
Live is short...and, I th ink that we are on this earth to thrive...not just to survive...
I h ope that you don't feel offended.
I have empathy for your situation.....
There is no point in being less than honest with yourself....we can evade everyone else....but, we can't evade ourselves...because way, way, down deep we always know the "truth"......
dandylion
Member
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: The Beach
Posts: 1,106
My XAH and I were together for 26 years, married for 22. Two kids. Nice home, great pets, lots of toys... the first 20 of those years together were good years...the last 6 of those years were a roller-coaster ride from hell.
I got to a point I just had to get off the ride, it was making me SO sick. FOR ME there was a realization that I did not have the strength to constantly be waiting for the other shoe to fall anymore... even when he was sober I lived in constant fear of when would be the next lie, next broken promise, next fall off the wagon, next tearful suicidal manipulation... personally I just couldn't live like that and stay sane. Perhaps counselling will help you find your path through that chaos.
I wish both you and your husband strength in your recoveries, whatever that entails.
I got to a point I just had to get off the ride, it was making me SO sick. FOR ME there was a realization that I did not have the strength to constantly be waiting for the other shoe to fall anymore... even when he was sober I lived in constant fear of when would be the next lie, next broken promise, next fall off the wagon, next tearful suicidal manipulation... personally I just couldn't live like that and stay sane. Perhaps counselling will help you find your path through that chaos.
I wish both you and your husband strength in your recoveries, whatever that entails.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2015
Location: Singapore
Posts: 23
Originally Posted by SmallButMighty
My XAH and I were together for 26 years, married for 22. Two kids. Nice home, great pets, lots of toys... the first 20 of those years together were good years...the last 6 of those years were a roller-coaster ride from hell.
I got to a point I just had to get off the ride, it was making me SO sick. FOR ME there was a realization that I did not have the strength to constantly be waiting for the other shoe to fall anymore... even when he was sober I lived in constant fear of when would be the next lie, next broken promise, next fall off the wagon, next tearful suicidal manipulation... personally I just couldn't live like that and stay sane. Perhaps counselling will help you find your path through that chaos.
I wish both you and your husband strength in your recoveries, whatever that entails.
I got to a point I just had to get off the ride, it was making me SO sick. FOR ME there was a realization that I did not have the strength to constantly be waiting for the other shoe to fall anymore... even when he was sober I lived in constant fear of when would be the next lie, next broken promise, next fall off the wagon, next tearful suicidal manipulation... personally I just couldn't live like that and stay sane. Perhaps counselling will help you find your path through that chaos.
I wish both you and your husband strength in your recoveries, whatever that entails.
I believe my AH benefited very much from my childhood woundedness because I asked little of him, he took and I gave. If that makes sense. I don't want to divorce now and I don't have to make that decision, I just have to focus on me until I am ready to decide what I want to do. Thank you for listening.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Originally Posted by Amms
......are you still married and if yes, how long did it take to get to a more stable and comfortable place?
)He fights the process until he exhausts all other options while I embrace every aspect of recovering and getting healthier. I run at my recovery head-on, 24/7.
I got to a more stable place for me after a couple of years, and it was because I had developed enough self-trust/love/respect to create stability for myself. I got more comfortable in the marriage when I started seeing him really putting his recovery talk into actions over the next couple of years.
That means that standing here just shy of 5 yrs into this process, it took about 2 yrs for me to demolish and rebuild my foundation and my growth has been steady since then, with a huge focus on not just surviving, but thriving. Last year I took my recovery to a whole new level and challenged myself in ways I couldn't have foreseen when I first began. (If you're interested you can dig it up in my post history, I shared it all here with my SR family. )
One thing that I think would help you is for you to stop thinking of any of this having an 'endgame' or a finish line. Recovery is a forever thing when you do it properly, it changes how you live your life every day; it doesn't go away, it just sort of bleeds into everything else. And no matter how recovered a person becomes, the potential for relapse is always a reality and something you have to truly be able to accept.
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