Roles and expectations
Member
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: The Jungle
Posts: 5,435
I think my son has acted in the way I allowed him to for a very long time. His behavior became predictable.....but then......so did mine. We got caught in an unhealthy dynamic but I was as much a part of that dynamic as he was.
I "expected" him to act like an ass and he did because I had no boundaries. When I established boundaries......the behavior escalated to try to get me back into the behavior he expected of me. And early on it sometimes worked. As I became stronger in my own recovery and was able to hold my boundaries firmly.....he adapted and his behavior improved. He now knows that I will simply have no contact with him if he behaves irrationally. As a result, our relationship has improved. Is it perfect? ....no......but it is light years better than it was.
I used to volunteer working with families of addicts in a recovery center. A mother asked "When will he stop manipulating!?!"........my response was "When you stop allowing it to work."
I "expected" him to act like an ass and he did because I had no boundaries. When I established boundaries......the behavior escalated to try to get me back into the behavior he expected of me. And early on it sometimes worked. As I became stronger in my own recovery and was able to hold my boundaries firmly.....he adapted and his behavior improved. He now knows that I will simply have no contact with him if he behaves irrationally. As a result, our relationship has improved. Is it perfect? ....no......but it is light years better than it was.
I used to volunteer working with families of addicts in a recovery center. A mother asked "When will he stop manipulating!?!"........my response was "When you stop allowing it to work."
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: west coast
Posts: 1,068
I am not sure about the relationship of acts versus expectations, but I have realized there are definite behavior PATTERNS on both sides of the equation. I am most familiar recently with the rescuing pattern - I didn't realize I was rescuing the first time it happened . . . he just showed up on my doorstep at almost midnight (from another town) and I took him in. I had no idea what the alcohol medical withdrawal process entailed - no idea . . . then very similar scenarios unfolded - I was unaware of my role . . .
It is hard when you love someone and see they need medical assistance to turn them away. I have not been able to do that. I did give a strong message not to show up on my doorstep again. It triggers my worst nightmare and makes me think I cannot cope - the whole thing is very heartbreaking, as we all know.
I wish there were easy, practical solutions, but I have not found any.
A missing piece is available social services. It would be nice if there were free detox centers that had bed availability (in a very populated city 30 minutes from me there are ten beds - and you have to call to check for availability - and you can't be too drunk or too sober or they won't take you).
Alcohol withdrawal can be deadly, so it's not like you can just slam the door and tell them to sleep it off (though I think some people are able to do this). With a severe alcoholic, it is super dangerous - hence people on the other side can find it more difficult to deal with.
It's all very depressing.
It is hard when you love someone and see they need medical assistance to turn them away. I have not been able to do that. I did give a strong message not to show up on my doorstep again. It triggers my worst nightmare and makes me think I cannot cope - the whole thing is very heartbreaking, as we all know.
I wish there were easy, practical solutions, but I have not found any.
A missing piece is available social services. It would be nice if there were free detox centers that had bed availability (in a very populated city 30 minutes from me there are ten beds - and you have to call to check for availability - and you can't be too drunk or too sober or they won't take you).
Alcohol withdrawal can be deadly, so it's not like you can just slam the door and tell them to sleep it off (though I think some people are able to do this). With a severe alcoholic, it is super dangerous - hence people on the other side can find it more difficult to deal with.
It's all very depressing.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 379
Very, very, very depressing indeed. The US does not care about mental illness and sees drug abuse purely as a moral failing and matter of "choice." As a result, our jails and prisons are teeming with the mentally ill and substance addicted.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 379
I know.... It only gets talked about when there is a tragedy (too numerous to list) and then everyone asks why? how could this happen?
Apparently, the Sandy Hook shooter's family was exactly in the same boat my family is currently in. They were trying and trying to get him inpatient help but kept hitting obstacles.
Denied - CBS News
Apparently, the Sandy Hook shooter's family was exactly in the same boat my family is currently in. They were trying and trying to get him inpatient help but kept hitting obstacles.
Denied - CBS News
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2015
Posts: 379
I really wonder how much of a role the family plays in what is considered a "family disease." For example, B's mom once suspected B of doing crack, years ago. I don't think he had done crack up until then, but shortly after she voiced her suspicion, he did use it at least once. Another example, years ago, I wasn't sure if B understood the penalties for check fraud so I talked to him about it. A couple of years ago, he committed check fraud. Now, he is suspected of using synthetics. If he hasn't been using them, will he now start since that is the expectation of him?
It is said that doing something for one's child that they could/should otherwise be doing for him/herself creates a feeling of incompetence, inadequacy, dependence, and depression in the child. But when you have someone who cannot or at least is not making good choices and the choices that are being made are causing repeated hospitalizations, is it not the authorities' (drug court, substituted judgment by next of kin, etc) duty to impose decisions on him?
It's all so confusing!
I hope to make some sense out of this nonsense by educating myself more on the subject. I'm reading the book Clean by David Sheff who wrote Beautiful Boy a true story about his addicted son. He's done his research and explains how and why we have utterly failed at the "war on drugs" but also offers realistic solutions. I'm also going to soon read Beyond Addiction by Jeffrey Foote, a book that also provides research based effective solutions to the cycles of substance abuse and dependence (SMART and CRAFT).
It is said that doing something for one's child that they could/should otherwise be doing for him/herself creates a feeling of incompetence, inadequacy, dependence, and depression in the child. But when you have someone who cannot or at least is not making good choices and the choices that are being made are causing repeated hospitalizations, is it not the authorities' (drug court, substituted judgment by next of kin, etc) duty to impose decisions on him?
It's all so confusing!
I hope to make some sense out of this nonsense by educating myself more on the subject. I'm reading the book Clean by David Sheff who wrote Beautiful Boy a true story about his addicted son. He's done his research and explains how and why we have utterly failed at the "war on drugs" but also offers realistic solutions. I'm also going to soon read Beyond Addiction by Jeffrey Foote, a book that also provides research based effective solutions to the cycles of substance abuse and dependence (SMART and CRAFT).
Member
Join Date: Oct 2014
Location: BC Canada
Posts: 30
I recognize a ton of unrealistic or perhaps naive expectations I have had all along....regarding addiction, recovery, behaviours of both him & I.
For me they seem to lead to disappointment and resentments.
Human emotions & relationships are complex add addiction/recovery into the mix and it seems to compound that.
I struggle with ensuring I have, set, &/or maintain healthy boundaries vs expecting certain behaviours from others. It's a learning curve, as the treatment from or behaviour of that I would expect, or rather what I would/would not tolerate from anyone else has been challenged endlessly & I have made endless concessions/exceptions surrounding that looking different & I repeatedly ask myself why. I sometimes get angry that my ever wavering/almost non-existent boundaries are being trampled on when I focus on what my expectations are/were.
I never in a million years expected to be having the very same conversations/experiences repeatedly for almost 3 years and that yields high frustration but I notice when I refocus on my own boundaries it shifts more to being mildly annoyed that what I would generally "expect" as behaviour from a grown adult isn't what occurs and it's unsettling to be met with behaviours & the impulse control equivilamt a toddlers when dealing with an adult.
Lots of historical experiences or tapes so to speak on what "rules of engagement" are/should be/will be acceptable or feeling that I would behave/act a certain way in certain situations and my mind just "expects" that as normal, but sadly it's not been the case and its been an adjustment each day.
For me they seem to lead to disappointment and resentments.
Human emotions & relationships are complex add addiction/recovery into the mix and it seems to compound that.
I struggle with ensuring I have, set, &/or maintain healthy boundaries vs expecting certain behaviours from others. It's a learning curve, as the treatment from or behaviour of that I would expect, or rather what I would/would not tolerate from anyone else has been challenged endlessly & I have made endless concessions/exceptions surrounding that looking different & I repeatedly ask myself why. I sometimes get angry that my ever wavering/almost non-existent boundaries are being trampled on when I focus on what my expectations are/were.
I never in a million years expected to be having the very same conversations/experiences repeatedly for almost 3 years and that yields high frustration but I notice when I refocus on my own boundaries it shifts more to being mildly annoyed that what I would generally "expect" as behaviour from a grown adult isn't what occurs and it's unsettling to be met with behaviours & the impulse control equivilamt a toddlers when dealing with an adult.
Lots of historical experiences or tapes so to speak on what "rules of engagement" are/should be/will be acceptable or feeling that I would behave/act a certain way in certain situations and my mind just "expects" that as normal, but sadly it's not been the case and its been an adjustment each day.
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