seasaw

I haven't been going to Al-Anon meetings - I've been focussing on other aspects of recovery lately - and this little text from an old family friend was the nudge I needed.

This woman was kind of like my other mom, growing up - sane, reliable, wonderful, smart, silly, functional - my NC AM kicked her out of her life when I was a teen and I had to stay in touch with her in secret! So effed up. I love Anna; we haven't been in very close touch the last five years, and I want to repair that. She was there when my mom wasn't, and is generally a great person who I admire a lot.

I have sort of tried to tell her where I'm at right now - depressed and grieving, but ALSO working being proactive about my own recovery. Anna's mother was a very cold, self-centered woman who drank herself to death, so she can relate to some degree. Her response was not what I thought it would be - though she has expressed empathy about having an alcoholic mother, and acknowledged how wacky my mom has always been, she warned me against 'analysis paralysis' and reminded me that my "parents loved me very much" implying that I should just be grateful for that, and that the idea that I owe myself my own recovery is to deny... I guess how good I had it compared to other people? I got the impression she was a little impatient, like she thought I was wallowing by going to meetings and reading books about being ACOA. And well... since I'm pretty messed up about it all right now, I guess it does look like wallowing.

I wrote her something about how 'it wasn't always so great growing up' and gave her a few examples, events and behaviors she said she didn't know about... and that was that.

That was a month or so ago. I just texted her and said, "Hi ****, how are you?" And she said, "Hi sweets, I'm good - are you feeling better now?"

Sigh. This is a woman with a ton of empathy and who knows my mother backwards and forwards (i.e. knows she's nuts), but has had to pull herself up by her bootstraps to get away from her own mothers' deadliness.

I just don't know what to say, and still be honest. I don't want to feel ashamed of having a hard time. I know she wouldn't want me to feel that way. I guess some people don't understand how long it can take... but you would think SHE could.

I would love thoughts/feedback. This is a really important relationship to me!!

happybeingme

Make sure you post this in the Adult Children forum as well. She sounds a lovely lady but a few things to keep in mind. She was your mom's friend. She will have a different perception of things. If you are looking to have a friendship. Keep it as a friendship. She should not be someone you go to about your ACOA stuff. She is also older than you and from a different era. In her mind your life may not have been that bad.
Just be accepting of her feelings and keep your expectations low

seasaw

Thanks happybeingme - my thoughts too basically. I guess i should add that my mom cut anna out of her life in a really ridiculous, painful and dramatic way - anna feels no loyalty toward her, just the compassion she would feel toward anyone drinking themselves to death alone in a swamp. But, you're right, they were friends for decades, and she is from a different generation. Keeping that in mind.

Also- should i doublepost into acoa?

DesertEyes

No need to double post, I moved the thread over here.

Mike
Moderator, SR

tromboneliness

What we went through... is hard for others to understand. After my Dad died, I talked to a number of my parents' old friends, and very few (almost none) of them had any clue as to why it would have been hard, being their kid. Why? Probably because most of my parents friends were a lot like them -- hard-drinking non-introspective people without a lot of capacity for empathy. It took awhile for this to dawn on me -- why should I be surprised that most of my parents' friends are just like them, and "take their side" in any discussion of what my life with them was like?

As for "wallowing," well, either you can look at this stuff and work the program, or you can "move on" and pretend it never happened -- which, contrary to popular belief, does not make it go away!

T

makomago

I've found real difficulty in explaining my recovery to those that are not in recovery.

My partner for example who was also brought up in an alcoholic/dysfunctional house, who can relate to the experience on one level still considers recovery and meetings to be 'wallowing in self pity'.

To be honest, I've found the best way to talk about it (unless specifically asked) is to talk to those who understand and identify. My experience is that is mostly others who are in recovery, or who have had therapy (at least) - that's largely because of the people I know, I'm not saying that it is my opinion of the general population. I've found that the number of people that I know, that are willing to listen and are capable of empathising on any level to be few and far between...

Having said that, I know a lot of people in AA (for example i.e. in recovery) who express a similar view i.e. they consider any such notions of ACA recovery to be either wallowing in self pity, blaming others, or breaking the golden rule of talking ill of ones parents.

... IN FACT this Tuesday night an AA friend of mine said his AM was coming to visit, I said I wouldn't have my AM mother over and he was appalled "Your own Mother? That's disgusting" ... For some denial is still strong and I've stopped denying people their denial.

Another example: A friend showed me the belt scars from her father whipping her as a child, she said "some people MIGHT even consider that that is some sort of abuse"... I thought "some people" "might" "some sort of abuse" holy cow, that is abuse there can't be many who would think that way. Strong denial indeed.

My point: I've found I can have relationships with people without bringing my recovery into it. Sometimes, mostly in fact, in my experience it's better for the relationship that way. If they don't 'get it' or don't want to their questioning, their denial, or their denial of MY truth I find too disruptive to my serenity....

I'm not sure if that approach is best, but I haven't found a better one.

ajarlson

I personally think it's still the old stigma of "but it's your MOTHER" and those great words "she did the best she could". My mom has a friend who completely understands what she's doing to herself and understands that I have a hard time with it, but I have to couch it in phrases she'll understand, as in "I can't watch her drink herself to death" and stuff like that. She is from a different generation where it didn't matter what your parents did or do, they're your parents. So while she is a wonderful person and has been a wonderful family friend (she is one of my kids godmother) I don't talk to her often. I didn't cut her off, and I never really talked to her that often so it doesn't seem odd. I just don't talk to her about the "things" that happened and that I'm trying to move on. Seems to be working - so far. Now, if she was judgmental about my decisions, I would probably make the choice not to have any contact with her.

Kialua

I've found it very hard to be around those who expect me to deny or not acknowledge my past. And not to be in active recovery. Sometimes it just slips out because my abuse was constant non stop. It was my entire growing up period. Some people who can't understand offer platitudes and that's fine, I take that with the grain of salt, they just don't understand. Some are impatient that I should even refer to my experiences but I have nothing else to refer to when it comes to the past because that is my past. I am not morose and don't go on at length blaming and asking anyone to take my side. It is what I lived and I have no other reference when they talk about "back then". I often joke about it in fact but it's a bit too dark humored for some. Sometimes it's not even something I can control.

So those are the people I have less and less to do with. This unfortunately includes FOO and old friends. But it's a great way to vet people quickly. If they squirm or chastise they will never be my close friends. If they acknowledge and understand they are the inner circle.

AnybodyNobody

Hi Seasaw, not much to add but wanted to give you some support, it is hard when those you feel close to on the one hand just don't/can't understand you and what you have been through and are still processing. It is incredibly invalidating when people don't get that recovery and processing trauma is a long journey. I have had some family members who just never could see what it was really like at home for us kids growing up.

But I did have one family friend who also did plumbing for our family when I was a child, and as an adult (and my employer for a time) he said to me "Your house was a hell-hole. How awful it must have been for you to live in that toxic environment." I imagine this is what you wish you could get from your friend. I am sorry she is not able to give you that validation.

But you are doing your recovery work, doing the important work of feeling your feelings, and that process can be separate from your continuing a friendship with her. Like others have said, maybe that is just not an area that you can share with her since she can't meet you on your level. ((hugs))