Littlebear

Hi all. Although I don't (yet?) contribute much to the forums in posts...I do - like a lot of others read constantly. This helps me loads. I notice lots of you who have a lot of experience of trying to abstain...talking about the relapses getting worse. So my question is...why do relapses get worse? Why when you try to quit is it difficult, but them after a time if you drink then stop again is it likely to be so much more difficult?

I'm not thinking of starting drinking again (soooo...grateful for that) but intrested in the surety of which many of you have that the more your relapse the worse it gets?

Dee74

Hi littlebear

this may help explain some of the science behind it - read about 'kindling':

http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...lly-again.html

D

FreeOwl

for what it's worth....

my sobriety got a lot easier when I started worrying less about why.

Honestly - a lot of my 'why's were quietly about my own search for a way to keep drinking. If I could just "figure it out", I could find the loophole.

Not that I don't still read about addiction and find the theories interesting.... just that I don't really worry much about the "why" part.

The answer, for me, was simply "because".

"Because I clearly have a pattern of ever-worsening consequences to my life."

"Because all my attempts at moderation wound up eventually back to uncontrolled drinking".

"Because I've had TWO DUIs"

"Because I've seen that alcohol causes me more misery than good"

"Because the list of negatives far outweighs the list of positives"

"Because the continued use of alcohol is for me totally irrational"

"Because in sobriety - my life is SO much better"

I'll leave the "why" to scientists and researchers. For me, it really doesn't matter. I know that my addiction IS. And that's enough.

LonelyShadow

I'd agree with FreeOwl in that you can drive yourself nuts thinking about the hows and why's, we have the strongest evidence there is learned through terrible, bitter experience that whatever the reason, drinking again leads to disaster. So abstinence is the only way, whatever your method.

I will say though, that for me, the feeling of failure can make it hard to stop drinking again if you start. If you drink after a long period of sobriety the feeling of guilt and hopelessness can be a bit overwhelming and therefore keep you stuck in the hole. So the answer is to not start. I don't miss it at all.

alaina742

It just does. I don't know why, but I know it's true and it's not something to mess with because you will be brought to your knees in record time.

I start exactly where I left off- no few days to just enjoy the experience. Where I left off was basically hell, so I start there.

tomsteve

Alcoholism is a progressive disease. I have heard many people come back after drinking,after some time sober( I believe to have one of these relapses a person has to have first stopped drinking for a period of time- long enough for change to have occurred, and "being of sound mind" sober)say " alcoholism was doing push ups waiting for me."

Thepatman

There is the physical withdrawal cumulative effect.

And for me, every relapse was harder to come from because they eroded my resolve.

Soberwolf

I agree with D great link aswell

Littlebear

Thankyou D - I will look the link up.

Thanks also to all other responses. I am not worrying myself to death about it - as has been implied by some responses. And certainly not looking for any excuses to make it easier to relapse. I anticipated that might be the assumption and its why i reassured in my post - that there is no hidden motive in me asking about relapse occurances. I just have a mind that if I constantly come across something all you good folk say/talk about - that as a newcomer i 'don't know' - then I simply wish to be able to ask. Reading and understanding isn't taking the place of the 'doing', getting through the moments and hours, or having a plan, etc...but learning about all this stuff is (for me) part of the context of understanding how it all goes. Forgive me if I sound a little perplexed...it's because - I am.

So hopefully the link will help.

Mountainmanbob

I have known some that died while relapsing. To me it seems that their tolerance to alcohol was practically none existent due to the time away from drinking and when they returned to the drink they drank as much as in the old days which led to alcohol overdose.

MM

Dee74

I took your post as natural curiosity little bear - nothing wrong with that

D

IOAA2

Hi.
First I don’t think there is one answer as we are all different yet have common threads.
When I was in a steady relapse mode I felt very guilty I’d let the fellowship and myself down. Remember alcohol does not create the mental properties of a rocket scientist.
Having the 1st drink for whatever reason sets up the compulsion for more usually with the thought of stopping tomorrow which is always over the horizon.
Being emotional people we seem to fall back in what seems to be a painless way of dealing with situations as opposed to using that energy to live sober in recovery.

Unfortunately the majority of well meaning good people from ALL walks of life can’t get back after relapsing because it’s a progressive, powerful, cunning, baffling and insidious disease.

BE WELL

DrunkTx

I'm a little contrarian than most, in that I believe the why is fairly important. In my case, I have concluded with some certainty that I am all stocked up on crazy. I have an order to taking a shower, I have a huge ego, my pride overwhelms my sensibilities, my insecurities in physical/mental/professional aspects are tremendous. The crazy list does go on for several more paragraphs. For me, liquor was a brief respite, followed by compounded anxiety. I learned that by drinking it would shut down my crazy numbing it, but once it wore off, it heightened it ten fold because I never dealt with any of my crazy I only deferred it.

Imagine being anxious about a big presentation at work the next day. Drink, drink, drink - stop worrying and go to bed. Wake up at 3am and realize that instead of practicing the night before, I completely flaked and ignored the whole event. If I was anxious before, imagine my terror at 3am.

After 3+ years of sobriety, what I learned is: I am bat shiz crazy, so if I'm anxious about the presentation, the only thing that will work is to keep practicing until I'm not. So why does knowing matter? Because I have to be true to myself in knowing that I drank to quiet the crazy. But I also had to be true to myself in acknowledging that what I thought was quieting was more like heightened terror deferral. I have no greater fear in my life than picking up a bottle again and stroking my crazy further!

FreeOwl

me too... Just also sharing how my own curiosity sneakily killed my sobriety cat.

Mentium

I have found it harder and harder. This last time the 'acute' phase of feeling awful lasted an extra couple of days I am sure. I am just beginning to feel some sort of normal at day six.

In terms of stopping what for me has been a cycle of stopping and relapsing I am doing a number of things. The two most significant for me I think are seeing an addiction counsellor (two sessions complete) and writing it all down. I keep going back to the writing I did in my 'journal' on the start of Day One. I tried to be as descriptive and detailed about how ill and awful I felt. I was honestly thinking I might not live for another couple of months - paranoia and anxiety induced as much as health concerns. I have read that passage a couple of times a day since.

Jdvivre

Hey LittleBear,

Thanks for asking - I find the information all over the place to be so overwhelming that it's nice to have a central place where people have shared interests.

Personally, I think it's great that you are trying to understand more. With all respect who prefer to give it up to a higher power. I personally find learning and understanding things to be the most important part of life. And yea, it can drive you crazy. But it can also help you understand what you're goingg through, reading studies and journals and articles help to see that these things are real - everywhere. Acing that imformation, for me, acts as a springboard from which I can work toward a better life.

Keep reading, keep asking. You're in the right place for it.

Be well x

Lance40

Hi Littlebear - before I had a relapse I imagined that the longer I was sober the more the clock would turn back so that if I drank it might be like it was 1, 5 or 10 years ago. What I found out is that it doesn't work that way. Alcoholism is progressive and not drinking doesn't remove the disease. After a week or two of trying to drink moderately I was drinking more than ever.

I think it's normal, natural and even healthy in early recovery to be curious and learn all you can about alcoholism. As you mature in your sobriety you can expect to experience what FreeOwl posted, and that is a place where all the questions, theories and need / want to understand don't even come up or matter anymore because being sober is just a fundamental part of who you are. It's a powerful place to be, and if you keep on doing the work you'll get there. Keep on reading and posting! :-)

justinJustQuit

Everything gets worse with each relapse for me. For instance a year ago, I'd shake a little during withdrawal. Now as I'm sure everyone has seen, it requires a doctor's appointment and medication to get off of it.

Also a year ago, I got withdrawals around 5 p.m. Nowadays it's right when I wake up. A year ago, I just knew I drank way too much and couldn't do it anymore. Around December last year, I almost killed myself by jumping off of a parking garage. But while contemplating that, I was chugging vodka in that parking garage crying my eyes out because I couldnt even make it till 9:00 AM sober.

I can't explain why it gets worse but it does.

clayton621

Something I was told involves a study done with mice, and mice were used for the study since they have a similar lymptic system in their brain (the part of the brain responsible for instinct). They took mice and place them under a box, lifted the box off the mice in a very brightly lit room, and the mice would run as fast as they could to some sort of cover or concealment from the light (their natural instinct to survive). They began giving the mice alcohol in small doses and found that overtime, the mice would run to the alcohol source, overriding their brains natural survival instinct. That what happens when alcoholics reach that imagineary line that is talked about with alcohol. You get to a point where instead of having Food, Water, Fight/Flight being your natural survive instincts alcohol gets added into your brains chemistry as "i need this to survive". It made sense to me... heaven knows when i was drinking if I had 10 bucks and was hungry I could tell you without hesitation what I would of spent that 10 dollars on, and it wouldn't have involved much chewing.

Littlebear

Hi to you all again. I'm so pleased to see your further experiences about relapsing coming to me (and all others reading quietly in the background). And, of course I read Dee's link (gosh I suddenly felt there like being 'the good student'!). All this led to me finding and reading much more besides about the subject. It really helps to have learnt more...(i hadnt even heard of kindling).

I know knowledge isn't the answer, but for me it's part of the answer. For example, until I started this thread, no part of my thinking was that there are bodily functions and differences that have already taken place in me from many years drinking that will play an influential role in how I might recover or how much more damage i might do to myself - if I ever were to relapse and keep relapsing. In practice (not just theory) - that scares the hell out of me! Which then adds to my resolve not to drink. And so may it continue...

My goodness, I can't believe I'm today 35 days sober after 30+ years drinking! It's only my first time ever 'stopping'. But I prefer to think that I have stopped - for ever. Its incredibly hard mostly. I am really focused on how hard my life is (and always was) before and with the alcohol and that somehow (god only knows how at this stage) I need to repair or find a way of living differently with enough of that to make it feel different. I know, I probably should have put this para in a new, different thread...anyway...it's tucked in here now. Thankyou again for all your comments xx