Alternate AA options?
Stay positive.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 84
Alternate AA options?
I have gone back and forth about posting on this topic because it is such a sensitive one. I wanted to post because I have not been able to find any information online about what I am looking for, and I am hoping someone can help.
I feel like a huge part of my relapse was that I was not going to AA and not seeing my counselor as much as I should have, but I have legitimate reasons. Now here is where the sensitive part comes in. I am agnostic. I am spiritual and my higher power is the universe, not God. I found that after attending AA meetings, it was extremely religious-based. There were posters of God hanging up all over the room, prayers being read, and people referring to God as their higher power, and almost every step in the 12 steps has to do with God. Please know that I have NO problem and I respect everyone's beliefs; to each their own. It is just very hard for me to be in AA and having to listen to things that I don't believe in.
I guess I just don't understand why religion has to be involved in recovery and why it can't just be neutral. I understand that religion works for most people, and that God is the majorities "higher power", but he is not mine.
I am frustrated because I can't find meetings anywhere near me that are for agnostics or non-believers. I even looked online and can't find anything either as far as online forums go. I have tried three times to go to AA and even sat through the prayers (held hands too) in the last meeting and I just couldn't do it.
I don't want to start a war on here about religion and AA and whose right and whose wrong, I just want to know if there are any alternate options for me. Thanks.
I feel like a huge part of my relapse was that I was not going to AA and not seeing my counselor as much as I should have, but I have legitimate reasons. Now here is where the sensitive part comes in. I am agnostic. I am spiritual and my higher power is the universe, not God. I found that after attending AA meetings, it was extremely religious-based. There were posters of God hanging up all over the room, prayers being read, and people referring to God as their higher power, and almost every step in the 12 steps has to do with God. Please know that I have NO problem and I respect everyone's beliefs; to each their own. It is just very hard for me to be in AA and having to listen to things that I don't believe in.
I guess I just don't understand why religion has to be involved in recovery and why it can't just be neutral. I understand that religion works for most people, and that God is the majorities "higher power", but he is not mine.
I am frustrated because I can't find meetings anywhere near me that are for agnostics or non-believers. I even looked online and can't find anything either as far as online forums go. I have tried three times to go to AA and even sat through the prayers (held hands too) in the last meeting and I just couldn't do it.
I don't want to start a war on here about religion and AA and whose right and whose wrong, I just want to know if there are any alternate options for me. Thanks.
Guest
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: The Deep South
Posts: 14,636
If you like parts of AA, I recommend taking a look at AAAgnostica. It's a whole bunch of people in AA who are agnostic, atheist, humanist, freethinker, etc.
Administrator
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Dancing in the Light
Posts: 61,497
Here are some options:
SMART
Self Help Addiction Recovery | SMART Recovery®
LifeRing
LifeRing - LifeRing
Secular Organizations
S.O.S. Secular Organizations for Sobriety
Women for Sobriety
Women for Sobriety, Inc.
SMART
Self Help Addiction Recovery | SMART Recovery®
LifeRing
LifeRing - LifeRing
Secular Organizations
S.O.S. Secular Organizations for Sobriety
Women for Sobriety
Women for Sobriety, Inc.
Say cheese!
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Scotland
Posts: 3,379
When I went to AA my higher power was mother nature, what they ask for is u seek something higher not only god, u determine ur own higher power or spirituality its again not all god in AA. hope that helps.
Chances
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: Gosford, NSW
Posts: 110
Hi blueyes,
Not being a 'meeting' person and both indifferent / atheist in terms of religion I have no first hand experience in such areas. However, I would suggest having a look at the website 'smartrecovery.org'. They seem to be a large group which assists all types of addictions and behaviours including alcohol. They offer meetings in some areas (you'll have to check yours). They are not at religious and claim to adopt a scientific approach to support which accepting all beliefs - so very open minded?
Being in Australia I can't say much about your local AA and whilst I have not attended one I have been told that many here are very 'non religious' or full of members like yourself and I. Maybe if you speak to your AA facilitator or members they may know of other AA groups (different in age or location) which are not as religious). People in these organisations are generally selfless and giving so I'm sure they will let you know if their vast experience has a possible answer for you.
Good Luck and strength to you
Not being a 'meeting' person and both indifferent / atheist in terms of religion I have no first hand experience in such areas. However, I would suggest having a look at the website 'smartrecovery.org'. They seem to be a large group which assists all types of addictions and behaviours including alcohol. They offer meetings in some areas (you'll have to check yours). They are not at religious and claim to adopt a scientific approach to support which accepting all beliefs - so very open minded?
Being in Australia I can't say much about your local AA and whilst I have not attended one I have been told that many here are very 'non religious' or full of members like yourself and I. Maybe if you speak to your AA facilitator or members they may know of other AA groups (different in age or location) which are not as religious). People in these organisations are generally selfless and giving so I'm sure they will let you know if their vast experience has a possible answer for you.
Good Luck and strength to you
Self recovered Self discovered
Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Toronto Canada
Posts: 5,148
Point your browser at Rational Recovery and AVRT. See if that has any appeal for you. If it does, there is much discussion and support for you at the Secular Connections forum. It is a twelve-step and Higher Power free zone.
AVRT says you can have religious or even a spiritual faith if you choose, and you may even be better for it, but it is outside of this particular discussion of sobriety and judged irrelevant. We all know religious and spiritual drunks, I do anyway. I was one. I'm still religious, but now I'm sober.
Hope you swing by.
AVRT says you can have religious or even a spiritual faith if you choose, and you may even be better for it, but it is outside of this particular discussion of sobriety and judged irrelevant. We all know religious and spiritual drunks, I do anyway. I was one. I'm still religious, but now I'm sober.
Hope you swing by.
Member
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Sweden
Posts: 1,649
Yes it is a faith based program. It started as a spin-off of a popular religious movement called the Oxford group. The group had some pretty cool ideas: absolute love, absolute peace, purity: it actually wasn't tied to any organized church and was rather a free spirit movement that opposed organized religion, go figure, huh? The founders of AA liked the Oxford ideas and established the steps on it.
It does indeed surprise a lot of people when they discover AA is a faith based program. Spirituality (not religion, there is a difference) was how it started, so the program has stayed that way.
But in answer to your question, no of course a recovery program doesn't have to be based on faith. There are lots of alternatives, and you can find references and links here on SR, as previous posters have pointed out. I am in AA, but I certainly can understand when someone may not feel comfortable with the program. The most important thing is to find a program that works for you.
Kudos to you for showing a desire to recover and an interest in finding a program- with that good attitude, you have a really good chance of recovery!
It does indeed surprise a lot of people when they discover AA is a faith based program. Spirituality (not religion, there is a difference) was how it started, so the program has stayed that way.
But in answer to your question, no of course a recovery program doesn't have to be based on faith. There are lots of alternatives, and you can find references and links here on SR, as previous posters have pointed out. I am in AA, but I certainly can understand when someone may not feel comfortable with the program. The most important thing is to find a program that works for you.
Kudos to you for showing a desire to recover and an interest in finding a program- with that good attitude, you have a really good chance of recovery!
Guest
Join Date: Sep 2014
Location: Melbourne, Australia
Posts: 1,476
Is it a little contradictory to say "I have no problem with "..... But it's causing difficulty and discomfort.
What's happening there is that it's all about you.
Your thoughts, your comfort levels, your wishes, your feelings, your this your that.
Try going to meetings to see what you can contribute to others.
Be glad for those who say God has helped them, not upset because they talk about it and you get annoyed (despite saying it is not a problem)
My experience was just like yours until someone pointed out the above.
So I'm not saying what I said to be nasty or a dick, just that the attitude you take into meetings is all important.
Learn to co-exist with your fellow man.
If you were here saying "all the people at the meeting are black skinned and I'm white, I just feel so uncomfortable about this"
How would that roll?
Prejudice is prejudice no matter which way you spin it.
You are prejudiced towards the people because of their beliefs instead of their skin colour.
What's happening there is that it's all about you.
Your thoughts, your comfort levels, your wishes, your feelings, your this your that.
Try going to meetings to see what you can contribute to others.
Be glad for those who say God has helped them, not upset because they talk about it and you get annoyed (despite saying it is not a problem)
My experience was just like yours until someone pointed out the above.
So I'm not saying what I said to be nasty or a dick, just that the attitude you take into meetings is all important.
Learn to co-exist with your fellow man.
If you were here saying "all the people at the meeting are black skinned and I'm white, I just feel so uncomfortable about this"
How would that roll?
Prejudice is prejudice no matter which way you spin it.
You are prejudiced towards the people because of their beliefs instead of their skin colour.
AA member
Join Date: Dec 2014
Location: UK
Posts: 872
The only requirement for AA membership is a desire to stop drinking.
No need for you to believe in God,just think of the word God as,good orderly direction or group of drunks.
The meetings I attend would have nobody at them if you had to believe in God,people that do are very much in the minority.
Can you look for another meeting to attend that is not so religious?
No need for you to believe in God,just think of the word God as,good orderly direction or group of drunks.
The meetings I attend would have nobody at them if you had to believe in God,people that do are very much in the minority.
Can you look for another meeting to attend that is not so religious?
totfit
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: Ft Collins, CO
Posts: 1,273
Sometimes one can also find support, friendships and a new way of life at gyms, book clubs, running clubs, classes, community organizations and functions and many other ways. One doesn't always have to seek and limit themselves to "recovery" organizations. If one can fully internalize that drinking has nothing to offer, they just need to fully involve themselves with life.
Stay positive.
Thread Starter
Join Date: Nov 2014
Location: PA
Posts: 84
Thank you all for your responses. I have checked out some of the sites you all mentioned and the forum on here, and they are helpful. Just still trying to find a meeting near me that is not religious based, but until then I think I will try another meeting and just leave at the end before the prayer. @heath48, your GOD acronyms made me chuckle, I will definitely keep that in mind at the next meeting I attend. And @hawk, I do not find myself prejudice toward anyone's belief. I have friends, family members and colleagues that are of all different religions. Does not bother me one bit. However, if I am trying to recover from a sickness and heal myself I want to make sure I am benefiting from every meeting. I don't want to be in a meeting and be silently disagreeing whenever someone makes mention of God. We can all agree to disagree, but this is my life and my recovery. I feel that I will benefit the most from being around fellow non-believers, but until then I won't give up.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: NC
Posts: 1,737
Originally Posted by blueyes618 
Now here is where the sensitive part comes in. I am agnostic. I am spiritual and my higher power is the universe, not God. I found that after attending AA meetings, it was extremely religious-based. There were posters of God hanging up all over the room, prayers being read, and people referring to God as their higher power, and almost every step in the 12 steps has to do with God.
I too am in AA, and my idea of spirituality would be a tough sell in most churches. My take on it is that the divine is so much larger than anything we can conceive that to define god is to limit god. It sounds like the AA meeting you are attending is a pretty religious one. Perhaps you should seek out other meetings and/or another sponsor who is more aligned with your spirituality.
Regardless, your agnosticism is not inconsistent with AA in my experience. After all, the term means you simply don't know. Anybody who claims to KNOW is either delusional or a BS artist. That's why it is called faith - there is no proof.
Have you tried to talk about this to anyone who appears to be open to the agnostic perspective in your group or your district?
Member
Join Date: Jul 2010
Posts: 10,912
Hi blueyes.
I'm one of those whose subjective opinion is that we don't necessarily need to use/follow any one established program of recovery to be successful. I certainly did not use any method as "prescribed". For me it was really experimenting in the beginning. I still do if I find something appealing. I also find that for me, mixing up my recovery tools every now and then really helps -- I like variety. But I already knew this about me, that I like to make my own "programming" in everything and figure out what works. I have respect for all the well-known methods because I see them working for a good bunch of people. But eventually, if we really take a close look, I think most people end up using an individualized approach that includes at least small subjective adjustments. So my advice is usually: explore, if you feel something is not enough, add more, or try a different approach! We can also do it like focus on one method for a while... then a different one... go back to the first... and so on.
I'm one of those whose subjective opinion is that we don't necessarily need to use/follow any one established program of recovery to be successful. I certainly did not use any method as "prescribed". For me it was really experimenting in the beginning. I still do if I find something appealing. I also find that for me, mixing up my recovery tools every now and then really helps -- I like variety. But I already knew this about me, that I like to make my own "programming" in everything and figure out what works. I have respect for all the well-known methods because I see them working for a good bunch of people. But eventually, if we really take a close look, I think most people end up using an individualized approach that includes at least small subjective adjustments. So my advice is usually: explore, if you feel something is not enough, add more, or try a different approach! We can also do it like focus on one method for a while... then a different one... go back to the first... and so on.
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