honeypig

I debated whether to post this or not, as I don't want to just be flogging the dead horse of "oh, A's are so selfish. I felt like I "got it" about the selfishness, but I don't know that I really truly did until just now. And it helped me see what a truly F'd up place they are coming from--and I can feel at least some compassion about that:

Today we went shopping, and my A ran into his old friend who works at the store, who we haven’t seen in a number of years. The friend was feeling down b/c it’s near the 3-year anniversary of his daughter’s death, and his wife just died this past August. My A said, and I still cannot quite believe this, “that’s NOTHING! Wait till you hear what’s going on w/ME…” and proceeded to tell his litany of health issues, most of which are self-induced.

I CANNOT believe he said “that’s nothing” to someone who has lost their wife and child. I am beginning to get a glimpse of the degree of self-involvement that an alcoholic has, even in “recovery.” And I am simply stunned. What would it be like in full-blown active drinking? But if this is what it is, I can see why he never batted an eyelash about stealing from our savings, lying to me, or any of the rest of it.

I can't say I understand, but I do begin to see, I think...

pinkpeony

wow.

honeypig

Yeah, that's pretty much where I was at, too, at first. And yet this is not a man who appears outwardly selfish...he holds doors open for people, he returns loose shopping carts to the store. But there is this--cancer, or something--at the heart of him, and it is so deep-seated and so terrible.

Seren

Words fail me....

Hawkeye13

I don't know if this is all addiction.
This may be deeper and part of the hidden self he is.

I don't think I could have ever said or done something like that
even in the worst of my own addiction.

honeypig

Thanks for this insight, Hawkeye. I have wondered this too, and I appreciate your experience in this area.

I keep wondering if I could possibly have heard things wrong, but I was right there...

Back when I told him I felt I needed to file for divorce, he said "well, you have to do what you have to do", and I was taken aback by that. Some weeks later, I mentioned this to him and how it made me feel. He got somewhat defensive and said that he didn't mean it that way, he just really didn't know what to say.

Is this just the complete ignorance of how to function w/o his DOC? Is this how someone acts who has simply never dealt w/feelings, his own or others? And I don't say this to excuse him but just for me to try to put it in some kind of context, which I'm having a lot of trouble doing.

dandylion

Honeypig....this smacks of narcissism (to me), if it is coming from someone who is sober.

A true Narcissistic Personality does not comprehend the impact that their actions (or words) have on other people. Thus the lack of compassion.

I sure can understand how you would have been horrified.

dandylion

happybeingme

Honeypig, that isn't alcoholism that is azzholism. When I was an active alcoholic that would have been my excuse to drink more. It would have looked like this " oh my poor friend, I am such a bad friend, poor him, poor me, pour me another drink."

Sorry but your husband is selfish

knowthetriggers

Um yeah...double. WOW!!!

Katchie

That is insane.

Jodie77

Narcissist

PippiLngstockng

Personally, I found the alcoholism a lot easier to come to grips with than the abusive personality/narcissism. There seemed to be hope for my marriage when I was just focusing on the drinking. I look back at my early Al Anon days fondly. I didn't know much back then and was blessed with a certain innocence.

lovesymphony

Narcissism, my first thought as well

aboutdone

Absolutely!

KariSue

I'm curious if you brought it up with your A when you left the store. If so, how did he respond?

I would have had to. Not meanly but just ask him why in the world he would dismiss his old friend's feelings that way and how much it shocked me that he did.

Wow. I just wonder if he had any insight later. If so, I would suggest he call or go see him and apologize.

Kari

honeypig

Thank you all for your input. I feel like my eyes have been opened on a new level. For almost the entire time we've been together, he's had the habit of talking over me--and not in that way of "finishing my thought", or of impatience to get on to the next thing, but in a way as if he didn't even realize (or care?) that I was talking. He would introduce a new subject right in the middle of my sentence on the previous one.

The pattern was always that I'd stuff my hurt feelings and annoyance about this for a while, then blow up when I'd reached my limit. And he'd never ever apologize for his actions. He'd say "well, I can't CHANGE! How can I just CHANGE?" He might act marginally different for a while, but then we'd be back on the merry-go-round in a week or two. I can't even tell you how many, many times we repeated this cycle over the years.

The talking-over thing happened again this AM, and for the first time, I have a context to place it in, along w/yesterday's encounter w/his friend. I finally really get that the behavior has not a single thing to do w/me and everything to do w/him.

I may learn slowly, but I'm not going to forget! Thanks again to those who offered thoughts here.

honeypig

I considered this but decided that it was HIS life, HIS friend and none of MY business what he did about it. (Thanks, SR and Alanon--I could not have kept my fingers out of it 2 years ago, no way...)

readerbaby71

You're not bashing alcoholics, you're pointing out and realizing that your husband is a self-centered a-hole, even sans alcohol. I'm sorry. I really cannot believe he said that to his friend. Just goes to show how clueless he really is.

Sending much love and hugs your way. xoxoxo

honeypig

Thank you for understanding that, RB. It's such a strange place for me to be in--on the one hand, it's kind of frightening to realize the depth of the dysfunction and how long it's taken me to even begin to get a hint about how wrong things were/are.

On the other hand, this revelation has done so much to remove my anger, my feeling of being "less than" or being slighted. Anger has always been my most accessible emotion, probably b/c I take everything personally. Now that I see that this is all HIS, it makes about as much sense for me to be angry and resent his actions as it does for me to resent the snowstorm or the cold wind outside.

I'm not saying his behavior is now acceptable to me, or that I will continue to allow myself to be treated this way. Not at all. I'm simply saying that I think I've come one more step along the path of detachment and compassion, and that is something I never thought could happen, given my fear, pain and anger in the beginning.

So much looks so different. If you've been around here for a while, thanks for your help. If you're new, you can see--there IS hope.