FindingPeace1

Howdy.
So, I found this board when I found out my husband was a secret alcoholic. Super functional for 10 years, but lying about it and hiding it.
Long story short, I divorced him.

I read a lot (on the F&F board, as well as books and other websites) about alcoholism.

I felt like I learned a lot.

It's been 4 years.

I have had 3 sexual partners. The first was a fling. I didn't want to get serious, even though he is so so kind and fun and sweet. That went fine.

The second was a guy that left me after a week to go back to his ex (former? porn addict).

The third was a guy I fell really hard for who was phenomenal, then in 4 months, went off his anti-depressants, got into medical school and completely de-prioritized me to the point that I broke it off with him. (Former pot addict, obsessive about school and exercise to the point he said he refused to make me a priority in the face of his schooling).

I dropped back into it with Mr. Fling, and we both have been getting a bit googly-eyed with eachother...and that sounds super fun...EXCEPT...he drinks too much and does drugs, too. Even though he's super functional, too.

I feel great when I am with him and super worried and concerned when I go home. Red flags. Don't do it! But he's so sweet and great and fun...you know the drill.

I feel like all these guys (my "wasbund" included) were addictive personalities.

Did I mention my dad's an alcoholic? Still highly functioning at 74. No problems (that I know of).

I didn't grow up with my dad. He wasn't the abusive alcoholic that I read about here...my mom kicked him out when I was 3.
I DO think that messed me up. I do think the unspoken rules about not speaking applied...

OH! And I just met a guy online. In our first phone conversation he tells me he is 8 years in recovery.

WHAT THE HELL MAN!?!!

I guess I am asking to tell me more about me laser-selecting addicts. How...?? What do I do about it? Help.

And...what do you think about a guy in recovery? A step up or more trouble?

NWGRITS

I'm gonna shoot straight here since you aren't coming in blind: our pickers are broken as ACoA. That's a sign that a relationship with yourself needs to come before a relationship with someone else. Why do you gravitate toward addicts? Why did I throw myself headfirst into emotionally dysfunctional fixer-uppers? Therapy and Al-Anon helped me a ton there, and may not be a bad idea for you, either. Until we can be comfortable with ourselves and love who we are - with complete acceptance of our faults - we can't possibly love another person in a healthy way. I'm glad you've found us, but sorry that you had a need to in the first place. This is a wonderful site with great people. We get it, and we're here to help.

NWGRITS

As for the RA... well, if he's working a good program and is capable of rigorous honesty, then why not? But (there's always a but), I'd refer to my previous post about getting right with yourself and your higher power first. No reason you can't be friends, right? You work your program, and if he's still working his, then maybe later a relationship built on a solid foundation could happen. Never say never.

happybeingme

Well, since your asking I will give my opinion. You say you have been divorced 4 years and in those 4 years you have had 3 relationships. I think you are moving too fast. Its great that you have a good understanding of alcoholism but do you have a good understanding of who you are?

If I were you I think I would spend some time on my own. Learning about myself, working on friendships. Things like that. Than I would consider slowly getting into dating

Eauchiche

I ask myself now who I want and need in a friend. For me, getting involved sexually with someone I barely know would be not be true intimacy, and would cloud my judgement about my priorities.

Maybe you can act sexually with someone and not get hooked. I can't.

Kialua

It is said that before we really deal with ourselves honestly, "We Become One, or Marry One". It is what we are used to, whether we like it or not, our subconscious gravitates to disfunction. It's great that you are now recognizing it, then you can start to deal with it by either programs or counseling or both. Good luck, if you'd like to document your progress this is a great place.

kudzujean

"We are comfortable with the familiar, even if it is painful."

A counselor told me that years ago, and it is so true.

MikeH

I was in and out of 1-2 year relationships until I was 40. I started to realize that I'd chase after the women that weren't nice to me, and walk away from those that were... and, looking back, at least 2 of the 3 that weren't nice to me are divorced (and the 3rd might be- I don't know), and all 6 of the women that were nice to me have all been married 30+ years... My mother was abusive to me and that's what I gravitated to... As Kudzujean says:

FindingPeace1

It's funny you say that (about the nice ones). Because that's not it for me. It's weird to have a dad whose worst offense is he gets sweet and sappy when drunk. That's it, really. He gets a bit fuzzy, weepy, apologetic, and emotional.
The next day, he is back to his other self.

It's nightly. My sister and I say, "Don't call after 9." That's because we know dad will be loopy by then. The fact that he can be more emotionally available when drunk feels worse than the emotionally disconnected sober-dad, you know?

He's never had any repercussions from drinking. He never had a problem with his job (that I know of).
Many of the partners that I have chosen through the years have been just like that. Sweet, ineffectual, and drinkers.
it feels like I shouldn't complain much.

But the characteristics of an ACA...I recognize them in myself!
* Weird with authority
* Fuzzy identity
* Over-responsibility for others
* Guilt when asserting oneself/avoidant of saying no - I'd rather try to take on everything, then I get overwelmed, then I start forgetting things, losing things, missing appointments, not turning things in on time, breaking commitments because I am behind, forgetful and overwhelmed. (this is my go-to behavior when I'm stressed)
* addiction to drama
* Love often bound up with pity
* stuffed feelings
* PROCRATINATION
* Incredible difficulty/anxiety with decision-making/strong desire to make the "right" choice (Don't even get me started!)
* ANXIETY about a lot of things
* fear of abandonment
* picking alcoholics
* reactive rather than proactive
* neglecting of/avoidant of/anxious about my own work, needs, tasks (!!!)
* smile a lot (even when I don't feel it)
* lack of follow up/follow-through; breaking promises/AVOIDANCE (if I get overwhelmed)
* shoulding on myself and guilt/SHAME around that (constantly)
* self judgement/negative self talk (yep)
* SCATTERED/lack of focus and concentration (often)
* overwhelm
* JUDGEMENTAL/do other's inventory (all the time)
* lying (in the past, not so much now)
* overreaction to changes over which I have no control
* constant seeking of approval and affirmation
* feeling "different" and less-than
* impulsivity
* put aside my own interests (or not even know I have them) in favor of others' needs
* OVERSHARING advice (without being asked)/saying too much/too honest
* afraid of criticism and super SELF-JUDGEMENTAL around critique
* repeatedly find addicts to partner with
* OVERWORK/lack of good time management/lack of boundary setting

Other things I haven't seen on webpages/ACA lists but apply:
* weird with presents/birthdays/expectations (so much anxiety that I avoid them)
* huge fear of/avoidance of the calendar/planning/to do lists and piles (eg. returning items from online shopping, appointment making, anything with paperwork and steps)
* see people's potential rather than dealing with who they really are. This can be really nice for people (who feel like superheros), and often is disappointing for me.
* problem-stacking - when I get upset about one thing, I end up thinking about a long list of things that are messed up (about the situation or me)
* inability to self motivate/lack of self-discipline


This sounds like an inventory! Do any of you have those other things?

makomago

I once received similar words and ignored it... as you know a lot of my story, I won't repeat it. What you don't know is I jumped from one relationship to the next, not always immediately but that was not for want of trying.

I never took time to be myself because I suffered from a chronic sense of being alone, I simply couldn't function being with alone with myself because I (thought) I needed others around me.

Upon reflection what I think I was doing was trying to fix my being abandoned earlier in my life. As I developed codependent behaviour patterns and characteristics I (to quote a mutual acquaintance) came to define myself by the significant other in my life.

I identify strongly with the 14 traits, the Laundry list .. these ones;

4. We become alcoholics, marry them or both, or find another compulsive personality such as a workaholic to fulfil our sick abandonment needs. (my emphasis)

(in my case other codependents - I was the alcoholic).

9. We confuse love and pity and tend to "love" people we can "pity" and "rescue."

12. We are dependent personalities who are terrified of abandonment and will do anything to hold on to a relationship in order not to experience painful abandonment feelings, which we received from living with sick people who were never there emotionally for us.

That's my experience.

For what its worth. I'm not the same person today. And I wouldn't change what happened... "I do not regret the past, nor wish to shut the door on it"

DesertEyes

No worries, FindingPeace. I have found that the damage done by "toxic" parents is not what they _did_ to us when we were children, it's what they did _not_ do. Children can recover from the most horrid physical injuries if they have a loving, supportive family.

I recoverd just fine from my physical abuse, it's was the absence of a role model, the lack of any kind of positive feeling towards me, the lack of direction and guidance as I grew up, which resulted in my being pretty much a "feral" child.

So, yes, you have plenty to complain about.

YES!!! Totally me.

Me again. It's what got me into al-anon, after _two_ relationships with lovely women that had great potential.

uh-huh. Me again. Although I call it "awful-izing". There is no problem so big that I cannot find something about that is even worse.

The good news is that, thanks to recovery, I have turned that "awful-izing" skill into an asset. I am absolutely _great_ at making disaster recovery plans at work. _Nobody_ can come up with all the stuff that might go wrong the way I can

Mike

OGK

Desert eyes sez,
"I recoverd just fine from my physical abuse, it's was the absence of a role model, the lack of any kind of positive feeling towards me, the lack of direction and guidance as I grew up, which resulted in my being pretty much a "feral" child."

Absolutely devastating revelation I found in Acoa-introspection. I used to try to "power through" memories of physical traumas and chalked it up to " I survived, no problem here". It never occurred to me that the absence of guidance and direction could leave me with such catastrophic behavior as an adult. Thank you for sharing this.
OGK

OGK

Mako sez,
"came to define myself by the significant other in my life. "

So true for me. I have heard this many times before but I shelved the thought as it didn't relate completely with my spouse. It wasn't until I could apply this quote to my insatiable need to always want to be someone else, that I could start to begin to love who I already was. That's when some of the good stuff started to appear.
Thanks for sharing this.
OGK

OGK

Happy sez,

"If I were you I think I would spend some time on my own. Learning about myself, working on friendships. Things like that. Than I would consider slowly getting into dating"

Good advice. Question though, to anyone as well. How have you found the personal work one does in recovery while still in a committed relationship/marriage? I had a very hard time relating to single people sharing in ACoA and AA that were adamant about not engaging in intimate relationships while "doing the work". I admittedly beat myself up in early recovery in thinking that how in the world am I going to do this (recovery), be a Father, be a Husband, be a provider, etc. Etc. I'm exhausted again just thinking about it.
Thanks for sharing happy.
OGK

Hawks

I think your avatar sums it up.

Be the type of person you would like to be with (might take some changes)

Is there a reason as to why unstable guys seem to keep crossing your path.?

We often attract what we are. Not even knowing why.

thotful

My wife is not an alcoholic, but my father, me, and possibly several of my siblings ARE alcoholics.

It is definitely challenging to work on yourself while in a relationship, but I disagree from pulling away completely. I believe that working on my communication, and working on my marriage is actually part of my recovery process. I have heard that two addicts are supposed to separate because they would potentially sabotage each others recovery. However, I don't think there's always only one way to do things:

We're supposed to have sponsors, but people can recover without one.
We're supposed to choose a higher power - some people recover without it.

That's what I like about Al-Anon, AA, ACOA, etc. We take what we like and leave the rest. They are to only be suggestions. I personally do not like participating in the lord's prayer at the end of an AA meeting, so I hold hands, but I do not recite the prayer. It works for me.

It's a beautiful thing for me to realize that there aren't any rules...really. Just experiences, ideas, expectations, etc.

The challenge is not to find the perfect/right answer or choice. The challenge, in my opinion, is to figure ourselves out (what works best for me?) - plus, it's ok to be imperfect - feels good to say that. Who AM I? what do I like? What do I not like? What's mine and what is not mine? It is work that I have been doing that I believe has actually improved my relationship with my wife.

My wife's counselor tried to convince me in a session that life has all of these buckets around us and the sober bucket was just one of them and that my marriage was another bucket. I completely disagreed with him. Sobriety and recovery (whether an addict or not) is defining how I operate with the buckets. It is a WAY OF LIFE. My recovery actually incorporates dealing with my marriage (better communication, making amends, promptly admitting fault when it is mine, etc).

I do worry that I've picked someone completely contingent on being ACOA. That I don't really love my wife and I just pity her (or that I confuse the two). However, I also get pissed when I think of that. I think, BS, I truly love my wife and ACOA is not all that I am. I definitely still worry though. When am I enabling? When am I trying to rescue? When do I take the courage to change the things I can?

The number one thing that has helped me is to realize that MOST if not ALL of my issues simply need to turn back to me. Work the steps, try to figure myself out (how am I feeling here? do I like this? do I not? what will I do? I can't control other people, remember). Like another slogan: Let it begin with me.

happybeingme

Well, in a nut shell OGK I just had to and still have to do it. Sometimes I share with my husband where my head is but honestly I think the best help has been online support. It enables me whenever I have a moment to talk things out, share, vent whatever.

I never would have been able to do the traditional meetings and all of that. My family wouldn't have been able to deal with it. Online has made my recovery possible

Payne

Oh man before really working the ACOA program and really getting to know me I had so many people unhealthily obsessed with things, alcohol, smoking, danger, cocaine, sex, I had myself convinced I just wasn't made for anyone nice, so finally I just gave in and started dating these people. I had two fantastic guys in my lifetime, one left because I couldn't get over a clearly ill fitting ex, and the other I am with now. The one now has a beautiful balance of enjoyment and responsibility in life and is an ACOA who has also worked very hard on himself. The bonus to his ACOA past is that nothing i do really shocks or worries him, we have both progressed to a much healthier lifestyle and we take eachother issues and strengths in stride. It also makes it very easy for us to communicate and understand that sometimes the other needs space because even though we have grown we are still finding ourselves in a way most teens are trying too instead of 30 year olds.
I guess the gist is I agree with the first response, I was attracted to dangerous partners when I was dangerous to myself. In taking the time to become happy, comfortable, and generally learn to like myself MOST OF THE TIME I found someone who complimented me. If our lives don't find forever I can still comfortably say that atleast this one isn't an addict! So I guess that's a win!

Kialua

I've been married for decades to the same guy. Work on myself was quite early and then dropped and picked up again recently. It never really stops. But yeah, you can make it being married, I think it only helps the relationship if you are working on yourself and hopefully, improving.

kudzujean

This is a keeper. It is so true for me.