Overwhelmed, what now?

Old 10-10-2014, 08:01 AM
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Overwhelmed, what now?

I confronted AH this morning. I had to stay home from work in order to find a semi-sober moment to talk with him. I told him he can't drink around us anymore. I tried to be as supportive and loving as I could but yet still be firm in that he can't be like this around us anymore. Man! He's pissed. I can tell he's also scared. He's going with the neighbor up to their cabin this afternoon (I'm at work now), so I know I won't see him for the weekend. I just don't know what to do now?

Also, are there any words that drunk people hear? What's effective?

I am prepared to leave if he won't. Should I talk to my daughter now and let her know what's going on so she's not blindsided by me packing us up and going to stay somewhere else suddenly on Sunday if he refuses... Ugh, so much to think about and I don't know where to start.

I do have somewhere to go if it comes to that.

Please help!
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:07 AM
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If you told him that and mean it (I say this bc I said similar things to my now xAH and yet never followed through) then let your daughter know matter of factly of your plan and then do it when he drinks again (because sadly I think it is a given he will).

Your daughter will thank you for swiftly taking action and removing her from the environment. I regret terribly that I did not leave any of the many times I said I would and should have...
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:16 AM
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Hey there -- very well done, my friend. It's natural to feel overwhelmed right after we say something we've been holding onto for awhile. We want to know right away what effect our revelation has had, and it can be frustrating not to know.

You will not know for awhile what the long-term effect of what you said will be. This will be a lot for him to process and that will take time. Future tripping about what he is going to do will only keep your wheels spinning and you on edge. You put your boundary out there and the ball is in his court.

As much as possible try to focus only on the things you can control (i.e., not him or his reaction or choices). Like really being prepared to leave the house if and when he drinks. I am sorry I don't remember how old your daughter is or how aware/vocal she is about her dad's drinking, so I don't have any clear thoughts on how to prepare her. It might behoove you to have an emergency bag packed with everything you would need if you had to leave suddenly, including cash, medicine, etc.

Just try to focus on doing the Next Right Thing, not ALL of the Next Things. You have time. Sending you strength and patience and a lot of big deep breaths!
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:26 AM
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I remember that wobbly feeling when I told my AH that I was leaving. I did not give an ultimatum; I simply left when I knew that I had to. I did talk to my DD17 before hand, and gave her the option of being away when I had the discussion with AH. After that, I simply had tunnel vision and did what I had to do. It did no good to think about things too hard after I made my decision...I didn't want to second guess myself.
Use this weekend to prepare for what is likely the inevitable. Copies of important papers, making sure that you have enough cash, clothes and other essentials for at least a week. Might even be a good opportunity to look at rentals? (Don't know how far along you are) Just breathe and take one step at a time.
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:34 AM
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How old is your daughter?
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:53 AM
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She's 11.

And thanks everyone for the input. I'm all ears! Trust me, I can't get enough advise. Please keep it coming. Personal experience, advice, helpful hints, I'll take anything! I can't thank you all enough for this support.
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Old 10-10-2014, 08:59 AM
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Have you ever talked to your daughter about dad's drinking before? Or has she ever talked to you?

I'm not a mom, but I was that daughter once. No one ever talked to me about Mom's drinking. I just thought she was angry all the time and that it was normal. I thought tip-toeing around her and trying to be perfect so she wouldn't explode was normal. So I cannot give you advice from the parent perspective and I wouldn't dare to say what is age-appropriate, I can only tell you that I wish someone had decided NOT to keep it a secret, or assume I understood, or that I wasn't affected or whatever. I wish someone had told me it wasn't my fault and there was nothing I could do about it, and that it really didn't have anything to do with me. I am confident others will be along with better advice about what to tell your daughter.
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:03 AM
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She's old enough for an honest talk about the disease of alcoholism. Not badmouthing your AH, but just to let her know that her dad has a disease and nothing going on is her fault or reflects on her in any way.
I grew up in an alcoholic home. That kind of honesty would have gone a long way in helping me understand why my mom left my dad and why he behaved the way he did.
At 11 she is old enough for Alateen meetings. Not sure if you are involved in Alanon at all, but those meetings have helped me a great deal, both in dealing with my ACA issues and in dealing with my ex.
As others have said, get important papers together, prepare to meet resistance from him. I made similar boundary- I will not live in a home with active alcoholism- and I ended up leaving my relationship because my ex was not ready for recovery. I had to act to protect myself and my children.
Big hugs to you. Stay strong and keep posting.
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:14 AM
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That is a hard conversation to have. Allow youself some time to decompress.

Also, are there any words that drunk people hear? What's effective?
They can't hear us. There are no effective words. Actions are effective - at least for our own sake. Trying to reason and talk will only make you crazy IME.

I am prepared to leave if he won't. Should I talk to my daughter now and let her know what's going on so she's not blindsided by me packing us up and going to stay somewhere else suddenly on Sunday if he refuses.
.

At 11yo I think I would have a conversation about her dad's drinking and your decision that it is best for you and her to not be around it. When he next drinks you'll go somewhere else. Make sure she knows that it is OK to love her dad and that her dad will be fine! Kids so often worry about leaving a parent - they learn to care take from the best. Let her ask questions.

Be prepared. We would all like to think that the kids will sigh with relief and be on board with our plans but I discovered that was not always the case. One of my kids was full of anger and rage directed at me and he thought I was ruining everyone's life and making huge mean mistakes - and he shared those feelings with his actions and his words for quite some time.

The fighting between him and his brother was increased 20 fold and it was all their emotions coming out in the only way they knew how. There are stories where there is immediate calm and peace - but that isn't how it always works out. I was completely unprepared for that so just a share from a different angle.

It did work out btw and the kids saw the big picture in time. We do have a calm, loving, and peaceful household today.
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:14 AM
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I have a 9 yo and a 6 yo.

They both knew long before I said anything to them about their dad, that there was an issue.

They didnt know about the drinking but they did know about the excuses he made to bail on plans, the sleeping elsewhere when he lived at home with us rather than admit to having been drinking, the short temper, the cold/hard attitude toward anything and anyone other than what he wanted in the moment....

So by the time I spoke to them and then later, a therapist spoke to them, about the disease and why we would not live in the same house with him anymore and what the deal about visits was (court order), they already knew....

Kids are VERY perceptive and get it. My kids are far far far less anxious with limited interaction with their father than they are when they see him more often.

I applaud you for setting a boundary about what you and your daughter will tolerate and for planning to stick with it.

The silent tension and walking on eggshells and wondering what might happen from one day to the next that is all life with an A, is intolerable to us as adults and we have the ability to come here and talk and ask questions and read and understand. Imagine being a kid and sensing all the same stuff and wondering what's going on but having no knowledge of what is happening and how scary and confusing that has to be.

You're giving your daughter a gift by setting a limit with your AH. Bravo to you!
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:19 AM
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Originally Posted by Thumper View Post
Be prepared. We would all like to think that the kids will sigh with relief and be on board with our plans but I discovered that was not always the case. One of my kids was full of anger and rage directed at me and he thought I was ruining everyone's life and making huge mean mistakes - and he shared those feelings with his actions and his words for quite some time.

The fighting between him and his brother was increased 20 fold and it was all their emotions coming out in the only way they knew how. There are stories where there is immediate calm and peace - but that isn't how it always works out. I was completely unprepared for that so just a share from a different angle.

It did work out btw and the kids saw the big picture in time. We do have a calm, loving, and peaceful household today.
+1 This is the same experience I have had... But I would prefer 100x over that my kids be struggling (I know that sounds insane) and sad and angry and expressing that all now than have them be adults who were forced to stifle emotions and keep up an act as kids and who fall apart at age 40 (like me) because that's the first time they were free to actually express any real feelings...

It sucks to have your kids screaming that they hate you and wish you were dead (been there, done that) but the fact that that comes after visits with Dad, or after therapy appts when they have had to deal with lots of hurt and confusing emotions, is, well, expected in a way...

Great post Thumper because I think it is easy for us to think that kids will be all happy and fine when we go and that it will be all roses... Definitely not.

One thing I always try to think is this: is there really anything that is worthwhile doing that is easy and smooth sailing? I cant think of a thing... Expecting to make changes and wanting there to be shifts in how things work but also wanting it to be easy and pain free is sort of magical thinking in its finest. And I for one am guilty of having had that mind set for a long time...
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:40 AM
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Yes! I should add that I think the decision was correct and the right one. Kids don't know what is best for them - that is why they have parents . They also have a right to be confused and express emotion.

My house was much more calm *prior* to the separation but it was also way way more dysfunctional. The first year was a tumultuous one with many changes and challenges but it was the right decision. The only thing I could have done differently was seek my own recovery prior to things getting so far and there was 2 months when my ex got out of rehab and came back home before he left for good. He was a person I did not know and the ranting and crazy that happened in those two months was more than any of us had experienced previously combined. I'm sure it was traumatizing for them. It was traumatizing for me.

If I had been more together I would not have had him back home those two months and I'd have been more stable and able to absorb their emotions after the move too.

We did have counseling which was valuable. I read a couple books to my older boys that helped - especially the oldest. He was 10/11yo at the time.

It is rough - no doubt about it - but there is something to be said for working through the rough times instead of avoiding them.
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Old 10-10-2014, 09:52 AM
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I was very open w/my daughters about their fathers alcoholism. I did so b/c of their safety and well being. Secrets do not make a healthy relationship. My daughters and I are very, very close (they are 8 and 15). I explained alcoholism in a very age appropriate way. I also told them the signs to look for and made sure they both have cell phones they are required to carry at all times, including school so they can contact me if things seem amiss. I also put a free app on their phone called the ASPIRE app, look into that, it's a great thing for any girls and woman to have.

Unfortunately, our marriage did not work out and I did have to kick him out. I had anti drinking language packed very tight in to my divorce decree. He had a choice to agree or I would go to court and fight for supervised visitation only. I had video and other correspondence as well as a journal of things that had happened that would support me in court if needed.

I can only say, say what you mean and mean what you say. Alcoholics are like naughty children. If you say no drinking here, and you let him do it anyways, even once, he will manipulate the crap out of you. I did not let my X drink at home for a while, but the drinking and driving would be an issue. I changed that and would not stay in the house w/him drinking. That got old b/c we would not go home and just go do stuff, but eventually you need to go home. And why should I leave my home and my girls leave our home so he can stay there and be a drunk. Nope. So it just did not work.

I wish you all the luck. I will pray for you and your daughter.
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Old 10-10-2014, 10:16 AM
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Alcoholism is also about SO much more than the drinking... So if he "stops" and happens to not be swallowing alcohol but still acts like he's drinking (irritable, selfish, not able to care about anyone but himself-- not sure if any of those things are occurring but I think its fair to say they are typical A behaviors both active A's and dry ones who aren't recovered emotionally too) you have EVERY right to say that those behaviors are equally intolerable as the drinking and you dont have to stay and tolerate it.

Too often (I know I thought this) alcoholism is talked about in terms of the actual drinking.

The mind set is far worse a problem I think than the actual drinking and does more of the damage in my opinion. And that mind set is there whether the alcohol is in the alcoholic or not unless they strive to change it.
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Old 10-10-2014, 10:40 AM
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I applaud you for setting a boundary that you sound like you are ready to enforce. That is something I still haven't been able to do in my relationship. As long as you are choosing to do it for yourself and your child instead of trying to control his recovery, you are on the right path.
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Old 10-10-2014, 11:00 AM
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Good for you to set the boundary. Now have a plan to enforce it, which can be harder to do than actually setting the boundary. My RAH tested the boundary the next day after I set it. It also helped me to let a few people I am close to know that I had set my boundary and know I could reach out to them no matter what time of day or night if I had to leave. In my case my AH left instead of the kids and I leaving when he crossed the boundary.

My DD is 7, but I had filled her teacher in on what was happening at home in case she brought it up. Something to consider even if your AH comes back after the weekend and doesn't test the boundry you set.
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Old 10-10-2014, 11:19 AM
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So Tonsoffaith, do you think that he will come home after a fun filled weekend, and won't drink on Sunday? Really, with those Great Bloody Mary's that are out there for brunch.

He will smoke a cigar, chew gum, breath mints, or anything, to not have you smell his alcohol. So do you really want to set him up for this, as you know he will fail, because he is an A and that's what A's do, DRINK...

Just my thoughts - Sounds like you are ready and prepared. Why are you waiting for a big fight, have your daughter see this and leave. If you are ready and comfortable with your decision do it on your time frame, don't wait. Make it comfortable for you and your daughter, if you have a place to stay. Why sit and wait for a fight, to do what you now needs to be done. Be prepared for a very angry man though.

I had 2 daughters, they are 22 and 20. They are the best things that ever happened to me. From the time they were little they new Dad had a drinking problem. They always new Dad had a beer with him, and always smelled like liquor. Their Grandfather was an A, and I told them they had their Dads DNA. Very good chance that they would be allergic just like their Dad. So neither of my kids drink. My older one is 22 and has maybe had 3 drinks her whole life. She asked me the other day how i can drink beer because of the smell. I just admitted to them that he smokes pot. My younger daughter kept asking me why dads lighter smelled like pot all the time. I would always protect him. I finally confessed that he smokes daily and that is why he can't go get another job because of drug testing. They know stuff......

You have to be open and honest with your daughter. They hear the fights and they are very smart kids. Don't hide anything, you will be surprised on what she will share with you that she has seen. You might be very sad when she tells you things that he did behind your back. (my daughter told me dad use to drive with a beer in the car)

Just have a plan. If you leave what are you doing with this - Divorce, or separation because if you are only doing it to make him get sober, it will not work. If you leave and he gets sober good for you, if you leave and he doesn't get sober good for you.

You will be in my prayers this weekend. Good luck and believe in yourself as you know what you need to do and how to do it. ((((((((((((((((hugs))))))))))))
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Old 10-10-2014, 11:27 AM
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I think that I would talk to her about what is going on. I would tell her that you are not willing to raise her in a home with an alcoholic who is drinking. Explain that you love her too much to let this happen.

Tell her that you have told Dad that if he drinks alcohol in your home, that you won't be staying. My daughter is pretty worldly-wise at 11, and she would be likely to argue with me, so be prepared for that.

He will also be playing on her sympathies, so it's important that you let her know that Dad knows the rules of living with y'all, too, and has been told what to expect.
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Old 10-10-2014, 11:55 AM
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Bless you, BLESS YOU for your courage. Your daughter will thank you later.
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Old 10-10-2014, 06:45 PM
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I recently asked for some advice on how to introduce the topic of my AH's drinking to my 7 year old son. I thought Bernadette's reply to my post was incredibly helpful. It made it clear just how important it is to have these discussions and gave me the perfect words with which to open the conversation...

If someone, ANYONE, any level headed adult had just once put their arm around my shoulder and told me "this is alcoholism, you didn't cause it, it doesn't mean you can't love your dad, or that he doesn't love you, it just means he is caught in a world where alcohol makes him sick but he can't stop drinking it. It's an addiction. And I am always here for you because you may have many questions, or you may get scared, and that's normal."
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