dionysos803

So, I guess I (as well as my 2 younger siblings) have been affected by an alcoholic father father since our parents divorce (8 to 9 years ago-which obviously his alcoholism dates further back, but our mother helped hide it from us). The first four years were easy as he landed an IT contractor position in Afghanistan for the US Army. He'd only come home for 1 month out of the year, where he drank every sip he could get his hands on the whole time he was home, but worked on a dry base over seas. He left that position 4 years ago and has been on a mission to destroy himself eversince.
I'm 30, and lived on my own well before he came back, my 18YO brother lives with him and has a co-dependent relation ship with our father in that he is a HS drop out that doesnt work or really do anything besides smoke weed (which im not against-but it doesnt help his cause) and a few other drugs on an occasional basis. Then my sister lives with our mother and our stepfather (a truly wonderful man). Over these last 4 years, my sister already blocked him out of her life, I try to have as little contact with hims as possible other than b-day f-day, xmas and no more than 2 other visits throughout the year.
As I'm sure you all know, family members are intertwined weather we like it or not, and one way or another there is no means of just avoiding him.
On fathers day this year we took him to a Phillies game, he was so wasted he couldn't find us or his seats when he's get up and go for a smoke (we were in the very first row of seats at the top where the people check to see you have tickets in that section). Since then, he emailed me and his 18 year old son letting us know of his life insurance policy (sounded like a suicide threat to me), so I got his only living relative involved (the other three of his siblings all died of some type of substance abuse). She came down for 1 weekend and broke down and left she couldn't handle seeing him in his condition.
About 4 weeks ago, he had to go to the er where he spend 10 days on a ventilator and 5 days in ICU (and not for alcohol...). He was diagnosed with Hepititis from alcohol, COPD and a few infections in his lungs. After 5 days of being awake there, he signed himself out against the Dr recomendations. Over the next 7 days he became more aggitated with everyone trying to help him, and continued his verbal assult in a more vicious manor than normal, and bam. Back in the ER where he stayed for 4 days and signed himself out again. Then 4 days later, he was trying to bribe a pharmacist for more xanax after he downed 5 of them earlier in the morning (prescribed by ER visit # 2). But of course they could not give him anymore unless he got a new script. So he left went to his primary care provider which is located in the same plaza as a liquor store. Went into his Dr office, and passed out. Woke up in the ER, though he drove himself there...And signed himself out within 2 hours of being conscious....Now we are a week since ER trip # 3. For the first three days after this trip he was relentless on verbally berating my brother, sending inconstant texts to my sister and I to drawl in a fight. AND I HAD ENOUGH of him treating all of us this way.
So I SNAPPED! The last 5 days I've made it my mission to destroy him. I have pointed every one of his moments out, his affects he has on his daughter that is in counseling...Everything. He wants to be miserable and drink himself to death FINE! I will give him something to drink about. He still amazingly has his license, so I made all surrounding townships he lives in aware if they see a car matching his to pull him over...
I started to feel bad about how despicable and grotesque in what I've said to him (but truthful). Then, I drove my sister to get shoes for homecoming this afternoon, and that's where she brought up him as the subject and flat out said I think it would be easier if he'd just pass away already"
WOW.... I know what she means I feel the same way, and still do. It's just weird hearing it from someone else as well.
As of now I could care less about what I've said, and I am going to continue to berate him for his behavior for the foreseeable future.

Kialua

Welcome to our corner of the forum.

I snapped many times when I lived at home with my alcoholic dad, almost daily sometimes. Did no good for me. But if it helps you to emotionally disconnect then it has a purpose. Actually it served him, it gave him a "reason" in his mind to hate me. His alcohol soaked brain couldn't process anything correctly. I can say it is a relief when he died, but I had long forgiven him for his atrocities against me and my siblings. I don't think it would be the same if I hadn't. Don't misunderstand that forgiving him made me accept what he did or made me weaker, it just freed me from all the angst and turmoil in me, and helped me move on.

happybeingme

Before you.embark on a journey of revenge dig two graves. Why? That much rage will kill you probably before the booze kills him.

I am sorry you have been so hurt by your father. It isnt fair. Why make it a mission to hurt him emotionally? He has already done that to himself. Barring a miracle he will probably be gone.in a year due to his physical health and continuing drinking. Lett it go and try to heal yourself

dionysos803

I know I shouldn't. At this point the guy has gone on for years being a raging alcoholic with zero real world consequences. To get a DUI although he drinks and drive everywhere. He's got to be told how much of a piece of s he is without being overly confrontational to the point that everyone gives up speaking to him.
and I would agree unless some miracle of nature comes about he is most likely going to pass away in less than a year. Before he passes away I want him to know how crappy he's been. he's the one that chose to destroy his wife and be as depressed as possible to provide an excuse for his drinking. I'm just making sure before he passes away he really is miserable and he knows how bad he's treating his kids and family. No matter what we say or do is not going to stop his drinking so we might as well let him know what our problem with him is. Or else we'll never have the chance to tell him.

hopeful4

Wish I had any answers, but I don't. I can only say I am here, reading this, supporting you. You and your family are in my prayers.

happybeingme

Sure. I can see telling him how you feel if it will bring you peace or closure. But, to want to make him suffer? Why? Alcoholism is an illness of the mind, body, and spirit. Trust me when I tell you that whatever pain he has caused you he has has dumped a hundred times that much on himself. And he does it every time he picks up. How do I know? I am a recovering alcoholic myself. My self hatred was so great I couldnt bear it so I dumped all my anger and self hatred on my husband and kids.

And I continued doing that until I hit my bottom. I was facing suicide or surrender. I surrendered. Many if not most alcoholics dont

dionysos803

I think that's where I'm having my problem Iwhat to look at it so its his choice instead of being illness.
Also if he doesn't hit his bottom he will die if he doesn't change. So I guess it's more so that I am making sure I say what I fan before he passes away and trying to speed up the process of getting him as low as as he can go because I don't think he can consume much more alcohol in a day.

happybeingme

I can understand that. If it is an illness than you have to let go of the anger. If it were a choice you could exact revenge. But, it is an illness. You might want to also read some of the other forums here so you can better understand alcoholism. This group of forums is the most comprehensive place I have yet that deals with addictions.

I do hope you stick around and continue to post. We all get hope and help for ourselves when others join the group. Be well

Raider

Ouch. The amount of hurt and anger you have is apparent. Sweetie I think it would be best to take care of that anger independent of making your Dad more miserable than he already is. I'm sorry you are so hurt.

dionysos803

I guess the question that comes to mind at this point is how come it is so bad or wrong to bring such people down even more. We know there is now way they will change unless they are ready for change and that doesn't come until they hit rock bottom. So again I ask why not bring them to that bottom quicker than they'll get to it on their own?

happybeingme

I can only speak for myself but where I was had my family did that to me I woulddnt have hit my bottom. I would commited suicide instead.

If you were wanting to confront your dad from a place of love rather than your anger I would definitely encourage you to sit him down and tell him how you feel. But, your anger is so great it is dangerous to your own health and confronting him from that anger would probably be an emotionally dangerous thing for both of you.
You cant force a person to hit bottom. It is a unique situation for each person. There are millions of recovering alcoholics globally and if you could ask each one what their bottom was you would never hear the same story twice

dionysos803

The way I see it, there's 3 possible outcomes. 1. Theyou get the push they need to get their bottom and seek help. 2. Nothing changes, and they remain on the same course. 3. They dive deeper into their illness and ultimately bring it all to an end a bit faster....so from my view any of the three options puts me in a better place than where I was before(remaining silent avoiding conflict and keeping distance). And to be fully truthful options if the first choice doesn't happen the 3rd would be the next best thing...I don't believe that's a terrible thing to say either. In his condition he continues to suffer through his illness, so why would it be a terrible thing to whish it would all come to an end for them sooner, just as we would for those terminally I'll in sever paid. Every aching moment ultimately leading all their final memories to be of nothing more than what is happening to thwm.
If option 2 is the outcome then at least I get my chance to say what I need to say before cutting them off and waiting to get the call when they finally pass.
So why is it bad for us to treat them they way they treated us for years?
We've all tried love we've all tried silence why cater to them?
I mean thus with no disrespect but if the alcoholic affecting our lives does try to commit suicide (as with all other aspects of the illness it's rather easy to see patterns or changes in behavior so this will be easier to spot than in most other cases) we then have new options available for getting them help.

Raider

Because it's just not your job. And you don't know what's going to bring him to his knees. Your message is a painful one. I am sorry.

happybeingme

I guess at this point it is a matter of beliefs. I dont believe in causing another pain sbecause the caused me pain. In the end I know myself and that attitude won't bring me peace.

As far as likening an alcoholic to someone else with a terminal illness. Well I dont believe in extending the suffering but I dont believe I have the right to make that decision. Only the person suffering has that right. I have spent time twice with loved ones during their final days. There isnt always pain and suffering. There can be great peace and grace.

As for suicide. Your are assuming your father would be unsuccessful. I have family members who were successful the first time. They had spouses, children, and grandchildren. And no one suspected a thing.

In the end you will be the one who has to live with your consequences. I hope for your sake you chose to let go of your anger and walk away.

Kialua

I don't think it would do any good to tell him off at this point, you said you already have and now you want to continue to berate him. He already knows. And-it won't make any difference. Believe me I tried it all. My dad drank till he was 80 and only stopped because he was incarcerated and put in locked up treatment.

We have a saying here:
You didn't cause it
You can't control it
You can't cure it

You can't.

NWGRITS

You're going to do more damage to yourself if you continue down this path. Your words spoken in anger will only fuel his self-hatred and likely give him an excuse to go deeper into the bottle. Alcoholics hate themselves enough, they really don't need our help in the feeling like a pile of dog **** department.

Families aren't entwined no matter what. That's a lie most codependent families tell to make you believe you have no options. And your family is plenty codependent. You have the choice to cut him out of your life completely, which, judging by the looks of things, probably wouldn't be a bad idea. You aren't obligated to maintain a relationship with anyone who doesn't bring positivity and good health to your life. I haven't talked to my mother since July 2012. I don't see myself talking to her ever again. Totally cool with that. But that's where Al-Anon becomes an invaluable resource.

dionysos803

I thank you all for the advice and support given so far. I truly do! And while I sound completely cold and angry in my posts above, don't mistake it for heartless or ignorant. If that were the case I wouldn't be on a forum in the first place.
Yes, I am angry with the way he turned out and the emotional scares he inflicted upon his three kids. I completely understand what everyone is trying to tell me about just closing the door on him. I mean beside the last 3.5 months, the only direct contact i had with him was for less than 30 minutes on xmas. Then father's day came around this year where his three kids took him to the Phillies game and i was needed to drive because he couldn't drive them their himself. Buthe since then his behavior took a dark unavoidable change. His email with a suicidal undertone, I sent it to his sister. I never contacted him. She came down to talk to him and left the day after she was heart broken over his conditiin.
Between this period of time my sister sustained a trams tic injury to her ankle that is so rare there are only 10 surgeons that perform it, we live within proximity of the world's top 2 surgeons for such injuries.2 days after her surgery my mother which she lives with had to go to a viewing of her husband's family member. She asked him just to sit at the house and stay in case she woke up so in pain to get her a pill. Well no sooner do they leave for the ciewing, he grabbed her phone and put it on the dinning room table and left to get booze. He never came back and she laid there screaming in pain for 4 hours until mom got home.
3 or 4 weeks ago he got sick skipped 2 days of work before his ex who is a nurse went over just to check his vitals and found he was very sick. And that's where he agreed to go to the er. He spend 14 days in the hospital the first time. Signed him self out for 7 days before he got sick again and spent 5 days in the er before signing himself out and then 5 days before he drove around looking for Xanax and passEd out in a Dr office where he was sent to the er and signed himself out a few hours later. Now he's been out for a week and who knows what his condition is.
He's verbally abused my brother which is a whole other story. Whenever things get bad my brother than uses me as an outlett. So it's not nearly as easy to close the door to him because of his affect he still imposes on my two siblings.

happybeingme

Iunderstand your anger on behalf of your siblings and what your dad did to your sister was terribly wrong and inexcusable. But, it sounds like they are adults which means it is their responsibilty to decide what kind of relationship they want to have with your dad. Your dad can only continue to cause them pain and saddness if they let him. If you allow your brother to vent to you about your dad thats your fault. All you have to do is tell your brother you wont listen to any more whining about your dad. Its called establishing a boundary.

I think you are too emeshed in these other relationships and are taking on a burden that is really not yours. The best way to help your siblings now is by modeling for them what it means to be an emotionally healthy adult.

Kialua

Yes, I understand your anger too. You would have to be half dead to not be angry with what he did/does. But they should have never even asked an alcoholic to do anything for them, it ALWAYS ends in disaster. It sounds like a codependent relationship they have, and denying the reality of the situation. Emotionally disconnecting to your dad will help. And the rest of your family of origin has to take responsabilty for the chaos they invite from him.

Have you read any of the stickies above? They have a lot of help in them.

makomago

I remember when I was drinking, I would often remind my partner of my very fine life insurance policy. They would have been taken care of financially. In my case this wasn't a suicide threat.

Upon reflection, in my case, it was an admission of my own sense of failure and not necessarily to them. More that even though I felt (not without justification) that I was useless at least I was doing the only thing I felt capable of. To look after them when I was gone.

It said more about how I was feeling about myself than a statement of anything else. It was me saying I'll look after you because I love you all even though I didn't feel capable, or worthy of having people to look after.

.... Of course, whilst I was drinking alcoholically I was completely insane and the symptom (drinking alcoholically) and such statements were mere attempts at trying to make myself feel better than I actually did (at the time).

Such distractions kept me from recovery though!!