allinon

Hello all,

I just discovered this site and have been reading your stories and collective wisdom over the past few days.

I just want to say THANK YOU!

I see myself in your stories.... but to some degree I don't know that I have a right to my feelings. I've been to two F2F Al-Anon meetings, I've been reading everything I can find on codependency and alcoholism. I realize I am codependent and have been since my teen years as the oldest child of divorced parents and a narcissistic mother. I made sure my two siblings (a younger brother and sister) were taken care of.....well into their young adult years! And just realize to some extent, my ABro to this day.

My husband is alcoholic, yet he is what I believe is a highly functioning one. (HFA). He has a powerful job, wakes up and goes into work every day, doesn't drink every day....BUT he drives thru the daiquiri shop on the way home 3 out of 5 days (we live in LA. Law says you can't drink it while driving. They don't put straw in cup, but hand it to you still wrapped. ) We've been married for 30 years. I learned he had anger issues after a few years. He would have outbursts for what seemed to me to be no reason. I learned to be quiet.... now I try to keep topics of conversation to things like weather.

Over the past several years he's been staying away from home more and more, coming home from work late like 7 or 8 pm on a daily basis. He plays golf both sat & sun, playing extra rounds. Then hangs at my brothers' house for hours, stopping by unannounced. Bro has a "man cave" that is like a neighborhood bar.

So I might see him 1 hour in morning. 2 hours at night, few hours on weekends. For the most part, we are like roommates sharing this big newly emptied nest (I have a 19 yr old daughter in college and a 23 year old son in grad school). He has verbal out bursts from time to time, but most of the time he just ignores me. In fact, he's more loving with our dog than he is with anyone else. But he's not getting DUIs, not hitting me, not having work issues, .....just all relationship ones. I've just been enduring it, but now that I've been reading about HFA I think it's just going to get worse.

I've never yelled and scream for him to spend more time at home. I have tried to control him though by telling him to spend more time with kids (especially daughter who is home this summer). I also tell him to call his siblings, (and his mom when she was alive), go see doctor, return phone calls, etc. I've handled his tickets (speeding), I handle EVERYTHING with the house and cars. He mows grass and works.

But when he does get home, he sits in chair and within about 30 minutes, he's passed out. I also wake him up and make sure he goes to bed.

So in reading through this site and in the Al-Anon materials I know that I need to work on changing ME while I stop doing things for him so he feels consequences of his behavior. He has no idea that he drinks too much.... Two of his sisters are alcoholics. One went thru AA the other didn't. We've talked about her in past. He thought she could change herself.....so I know he won't do anything about this. And he has high blood pressure and high cholesterol, but refuses to go to doctor even though I have encouraged him to do so. He hasn't seen one in over 9 years!

So my question (yes sorry for long background to get to this point) is how do I do a 180 on my actions? I've been doing so much for him. How do I stop without him freaking out? He's out of town this week. I've been able to go to Al Anon meetings.... but I'm afraid to tell him.

Is there a list of tools or strategies somewhere to use while the A in your life rages at you? I think if I left home he would flip out..... I don't want to speak up or engage him too much while my D is home. She'll be leaving in a few weeks and I should be in better position to do more then. Or should I just start now?

Thanks for those of you who've read all this..... I appreciate any help!

lillamy

Welcome, and I'm glad you found us. First of all, I would like to address this:
You ALWAYS have a right to your feelings. Feelings are never right or wrong. Feelings just are what they are. Feelings don't mean you automatically should do one thing or the other. I tend to see feelings as a symptom, like a runny nose or a headache -- what I do about it is my choice.

My AXH was also high-functioning for a very long time. Unfortunately, I think that an A who is already breaking the law is well on his way to sliding down that slope to not being high-functioning anymore. And frankly, I'm not surprised he doesn't think his drinking is a problem -- I've found that the vast majority of people who haven't had first-hand experience of living with an A think that alcoholics are those dirty pee-smelling bums who live under highway overpasses... so clearly, if he still has a job, he can't possibly be an alcoholic, right? (I hear that again and again from people!)

How do you to a 180? Well... I look at the list you posted:

How about just not doing those things anymore? Let him determine how much time he spends with your daughter while she's home. Don't remind him of calling his siblings or sending birthday cards. Don't handle his tickets. Don't handle his car. Handle yours.

But I think more than the practical things, maybe the first thing to think about is changing your thinking. It sounds like you already think of the two of you as separate beings (don't laugh, I didn't -- I thought of us as a couple and AXH's problems being mine) so that's a good start. How about what you are responsible for and what you can control? You're trying to control his relationship with the kids. They're all adults -- could you handle telling yourself that his relationship with them is none of your business? How about his relationships with his siblings?

If you can let those things go, maybe you'll have more time to focus on yourself? It sounds like you're not satisfied with the way things are in your marriage. What do YOU want out of the rest of your life? Or, if that's too big a bite -- what do you NOT want?

I had to start by making a list of what I DIDN'T want (addiction, anger, unpredictability, etc) before I could figure out what I wanted.

As for what to do when an alcoholic rages -- the advice I was given was to simply say "I'm sorry you feel that way" and walk away. Not engage. The person who gave me the advice is a martial arts teacher: He said in martial arts, part of what you learn is that sometimes, you don't even have to fight back -- you can simply let the attacking party fall by their own force; stepping out of the way is always the simplest way to foil an attack...

I'm sure there are many people here with better advice and thoughts about this -- but I just wanted to tell you that I'm happy you're here and I know you'll find lots of help from the folks who post here!

isitme

I second almost everything Lillamy said.

I very much know the state that you're in. My A too is very high functioning, doesn't have any legal troubles and in fact has started to cut down on the drinking from time to time. Recently started on some meds and seems to be well. However, I still feel like poo!

All of lillamy's ideas are perfect, I think baby steps are more important than a total 180 and making small changes shouldn't send him into a tailspin either. Just start doing little things for yourself. If you find yourself watching TV with him because that's what you just do.. just remind yourself you don't have to. (I'm pretty much speaking to myself there, but you get the idea)

I sometimes think the most confusing part about Alcoholism is the ups and downs, the cycle. It keeps you hooked. That magical thinking that maybe this time will be different. And maybe I should let go of my past hurts. But then I remember every time I let go of my past hurts it seems I'm just opening myself up for more of the same. It's a double edged sword I haven't quite figured out yet.

I'm glad you're going to Al anon, it helped me a lot when I was going. I just recently started back and think I need to make it a priority. Welcome to SR, someone with much more strength and wisdom will be along shortly.

dandylion

allinon....I would suggest that you become clear in your mind about what is behavior that you don't like from an active alcoholic and what is actual abuse. I mention this because you have indicated him raging at you.

Perhaps, do some reading-up on what actually constitutes abuse....and, yes, verbal abuse is still abuse....and can have very detrimental effects.

Alanon does not...(nor do I).....suggest to tolerate abusive rages. There are certain tools that can protect you from "QUACKING". But, when verbal encounters become abusive....the best action is to protect yourself and stay safe. You are the one in the actual situation and you have to judge what it takes to keep yourself safe....some of the usual "tools" may not be appropriate in instances of actual abuse.

The bottom line is that you have to make the decision as to what is best for you in your particular situation.

There is a lot of information on abuse in the stickies at the top of the main page--as well as a lot of web sites devoted to discussions about it.

It may be that it seems like I am doing an "overkill" here, and....may well be so. On the other hand, it never hurts to educate ourselves....(my philosophy...LOL.)

dandylion

ladyscribbler

Hi allinon, and welcome. I know the feeling you have. You have the wisdom and insight to name your problem, you've identified it and admitted it to yourself and others both here and in your meetings. Now you feel that absolute imperative to FIX IT! Right now!
Part of what I learned in Alanon is "easy does it." You've already taken some huge powerful strides in your awareness, even if it doesn't feel like much now. You've already made great progress. Have you talked to many people at your meetings? Gotten a phone list? You can stay in contact with people between meetings in addition to posting here for support. If there's someone you click with, maybe ask that person to help you work a couple of the steps, when you feel ready.
Pace yourself, this is a marathon, not a sprint. Just doing one small thing for yourself every day will give you big results. Hugs.

thotful

When it comes to the disease, we can certainly get in the way of recovery in my opinion. Clean up the messes they have made and we keep them from experiencing the consequences of their actions.

Remember, you did not cause it, cannot control it, and you cannot cure it.

What still amazes me at how powerful it is, but it has worked for me every single time. WORK ON YOU. You are an amazing, wonderful, person that deserves love, happiness, and some peace in your life. What that looks like is totally up to you. You are the only one that truly lives in your life. Who is with you 7 days a week, 24 hours a day? Your spouse? Nope. You. You. You.

Who lives in your heart? You.
Who lives in your brain? You.
Who lives in your spirit? You.

I discovered through Al-Anon that what I lost with the very normal symptoms of an alcoholic in my life was ME. I lost who I was. Al-Anon helped me find myself. It is BY FAR, the most powerful and amazing feeling to acquire. To work on me and figure out who I really am. What do I like? What do I not like? What's acceptable to me? What's not?

In my opinion, all of the 12 step programs focus on one thing, and that is cleaning up OUR OWN lives - it is a process of self-discovery. And absolutely amazing.

It doesn't happen overnight, and it will be a life-long journey that's really worth it. We appreciate progress and accept that we will not be perfect.

For me personally, I was often confused as to the why (probably still am), but found that my only answer was "keep going to the meetings" - it's why we often say, "keep coming back". It's not something that can be explained quickly and simply understood. I believe you have to live it. Hearing other people's stories can help tremendously. Sometimes what helps so much is something as simple as not feeling alone. You're not alone in your feelings.

Me TOO. My father is a high functioning alcoholic (so am I...go figure). The difference is that I'm in recovery and he is not.

Just like you've described (and thanks so much for this!), my father has everything made in every department, except for relationships. I rarely hear from him. I'm estranged from two of my siblings and he's said NOTHING to me about it. Not even a "I feel really sad about this - this sucks". He doesn't call me for lunch. Doesn't send me e-mails. Any of these things would take like 5 minutes, by the way. I don't think it's because my father doesn't love me. I would actually argue that he's having enough trouble loving himself. And without that love for his own being, he has very little left to give. This might be the case with your spouse. It certainly is with me - when I started loving myself more, all of these things I used to think weren't related, CHANGED completely.

At this time, I'm waiting for the disease to get worse (as it inevitably is supposed to) for my dad. Or maybe, I'm not waiting? I guess I'm focusing on working on me. Course, I don't live with the alcoholic, so I would guess that makes things a lot easier.

Sorry about my rambles. My suggestion would be to consider more and more Al-Anon meetings or reading on SR a whole bunch! It helps. Step work is really amazing too though - for me personally, that came later after months of being in program, but for others, sponsorship comes much earlier.

As for the "180", for some people, it comes gradually, and for others, it pops in these moments of "spiritual awakening". For me, I just sometimes look back and realize the growth I've experienced.

I would note something I thought was a great quote from another Al-Anon member. He said, "I've seen members gain the strength to leave difficult relationships and I've seen members gain the strength to stay in difficult relationships". There are no musts in Al-Anon.

Hang in there, we're all in this similar situation too. Wishing you some peace and serenity. Take what you like of what I've said - leave the rest.

hopeful4

You have gotten great words of wisdom so far. I just want to drop in and say Welcome. Keep coming back, SR will help you in so many ways.

Very glad you are here!

allinon

Thank you all so very much..... Yes lots of wisdom. I do want to "fix it" right away.... but I know I need to take things one day at a time. Thank you for that reminder. I need to go back and re-read everything over and over again!