SWIM has never been more afraid in his life
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Startex, SC
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SWIM has never been more afraid in his life
SWIM was never the kind of person who needed drugs. SWIM drank socially maybe three or four times per year. Smoked weed once in a blue moon. SWIM never ever thought he'd wind up addicted to drugs.
SWIM will be 30 on the 24th of April and has always been a happy and active person who never suffered from depression or anxiety.
But SWIM started trying hydrocodone pills as early as 2010 just for recreation and to deal with some minor stress. SWIM wasn't taking them regularly until 2012 though. SWIM started switching between hydrocodone and Tramadol. Whenever he'd run out of one, he'd go to the other.
But never in high doses. Average dose of Hydrocodone was about 20mg and the average dose of Tramadol was about 100-150mg. Recently, SWIM got to a point where he needed about 30-40mgs of Hydrocodone to get through the day and now he realizes he has to stop.
But he never knew just how dangerous stopping was.
Now he's reading about how some people go through PAWS for the rest of their lives. About how PAWS never really goes away. SWIM is terrified he'll never be normal again.
See, when SWIM tries to quit, he doesn't even experience the acute withdrawals. Some irregular bowel movements, minor aches and pains, and maybe stomach cramps.
The physical is nothing to SWIM. The mental is the killer. Anxiety and depression are the worst. That feeling of being unable to be happy even when SWIM is doing something he LOVES drives him crazy. The insomnia is a pain too, but this can be alleviated with dramamine or antihistamines.
SWIM is just terrified that he'll never be normal again and that he'll have to deal with anxiety and depression for months or years. SWIM needs to stop now because SWIM is raising his niece and nephew and they NEED SWIM.
SWIM knows what to expect when he stops - but for how long? SWIM is very afraid right now and doesn't want to live in hell or hate being alive. Can someone please help?
SWIM will be 30 on the 24th of April and has always been a happy and active person who never suffered from depression or anxiety.
But SWIM started trying hydrocodone pills as early as 2010 just for recreation and to deal with some minor stress. SWIM wasn't taking them regularly until 2012 though. SWIM started switching between hydrocodone and Tramadol. Whenever he'd run out of one, he'd go to the other.
But never in high doses. Average dose of Hydrocodone was about 20mg and the average dose of Tramadol was about 100-150mg. Recently, SWIM got to a point where he needed about 30-40mgs of Hydrocodone to get through the day and now he realizes he has to stop.
But he never knew just how dangerous stopping was.
Now he's reading about how some people go through PAWS for the rest of their lives. About how PAWS never really goes away. SWIM is terrified he'll never be normal again.
See, when SWIM tries to quit, he doesn't even experience the acute withdrawals. Some irregular bowel movements, minor aches and pains, and maybe stomach cramps.
The physical is nothing to SWIM. The mental is the killer. Anxiety and depression are the worst. That feeling of being unable to be happy even when SWIM is doing something he LOVES drives him crazy. The insomnia is a pain too, but this can be alleviated with dramamine or antihistamines.
SWIM is just terrified that he'll never be normal again and that he'll have to deal with anxiety and depression for months or years. SWIM needs to stop now because SWIM is raising his niece and nephew and they NEED SWIM.
SWIM knows what to expect when he stops - but for how long? SWIM is very afraid right now and doesn't want to live in hell or hate being alive. Can someone please help?
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
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Hi BiffdaBearKille 
I under the reasoning behind SWIM (Someone Who Is not Me) but let me reassure you this is a very safe welcoming and confidential place.
I've never heard anyone say PAWs never goes away. I think that's some bad info there.
The worst prognosis I've read is up to two years. Most people find the timespan is much less than that.
This link is a good one - it also has some real tangible ways that people can lessen the effect of PAWs:
PAWS | Digital Dharma
D
I under the reasoning behind SWIM (Someone Who Is not Me) but let me reassure you this is a very safe welcoming and confidential place.
I've never heard anyone say PAWs never goes away. I think that's some bad info there.
The worst prognosis I've read is up to two years. Most people find the timespan is much less than that.
This link is a good one - it also has some real tangible ways that people can lessen the effect of PAWs:
PAWS | Digital Dharma
D
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Startex, SC
Posts: 7
Thanks, Dee.
SWIM ... er... I don't experience the crazier parts of PAWS. I don't get dizzy, I can control my emotions (no matter how bad the kids get, I can always control my temper and stress level), I don't get confused, and I don't experience memory problems.
I don't even really suffer from the "flu-like" symptoms that everyone talks about. I just lack energy and motivation and I feel depressed and anxious. I'd trade that anxiety and depression for the other stuff in a heartbeat! LoL
And of course, trouble sleeping. Restless leg syndrome is my mortal enemy - but again, I can control this with antihistamines and/or dramamine.
It hasn't helped that I got a cold from the kids while I was trying to quit this last time. XD
But it just feels good to talk to someone about this. That was what attracted me to forums like this in the first place. I don't feel comfortable talking to my friends about this because they just don't understand. Their advice for dealing with depression and anxiety is "Be happy and relax". WELL GEE WHY DIDN'T I TRY THAT!? *slaps self on the forehead*
SWIM ... er... I don't experience the crazier parts of PAWS. I don't get dizzy, I can control my emotions (no matter how bad the kids get, I can always control my temper and stress level), I don't get confused, and I don't experience memory problems.
I don't even really suffer from the "flu-like" symptoms that everyone talks about. I just lack energy and motivation and I feel depressed and anxious. I'd trade that anxiety and depression for the other stuff in a heartbeat! LoL
And of course, trouble sleeping. Restless leg syndrome is my mortal enemy - but again, I can control this with antihistamines and/or dramamine.
It hasn't helped that I got a cold from the kids while I was trying to quit this last time. XD
But it just feels good to talk to someone about this. That was what attracted me to forums like this in the first place. I don't feel comfortable talking to my friends about this because they just don't understand. Their advice for dealing with depression and anxiety is "Be happy and relax". WELL GEE WHY DIDN'T I TRY THAT!? *slaps self on the forehead*
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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I haven't started yet.
My latest attempt started early last month. I took my last hydrocodone -
(I'd like to add that I have come to hate hydrocodone. I hate the artificial high it gives me and the false euphoria. I just want to feel NORMAL again.)
and then I started using Tramadol to get through the hydro withdrawals. I was very naive and I believed because Tramadol didn't really cause a euphoria for me, it was a weak opiate, and I was taking a low dose (averaging about 100mgs per day), and I felt "normal" when I had it - that it was going to work.
After two weeks of this with no hydro in between, I was convinced I could quit the Trams and feel no ill-effects.
Wrong. Tramadol is every bit as addictive as other opiates. When I stopped the Tramadol, I immediately went into the depression/anxiety.
At the time, I was under the belief that there had to be a way to get back to normal without enduring weeks of depression and mind-numbing anxiety.
Since then, I've gone back to hydro. I'm taking 10-20 mgs per day. This amount keeps me from being completely miserable, but I obviously can't keep up like this.
So I just need the courage to get started and give this up once and for all. I'm just afraid to make that jump because the PAWS terrify me to my very core.
My latest attempt started early last month. I took my last hydrocodone -
(I'd like to add that I have come to hate hydrocodone. I hate the artificial high it gives me and the false euphoria. I just want to feel NORMAL again.)
and then I started using Tramadol to get through the hydro withdrawals. I was very naive and I believed because Tramadol didn't really cause a euphoria for me, it was a weak opiate, and I was taking a low dose (averaging about 100mgs per day), and I felt "normal" when I had it - that it was going to work.
After two weeks of this with no hydro in between, I was convinced I could quit the Trams and feel no ill-effects.
Wrong. Tramadol is every bit as addictive as other opiates. When I stopped the Tramadol, I immediately went into the depression/anxiety.
At the time, I was under the belief that there had to be a way to get back to normal without enduring weeks of depression and mind-numbing anxiety.
Since then, I've gone back to hydro. I'm taking 10-20 mgs per day. This amount keeps me from being completely miserable, but I obviously can't keep up like this.
So I just need the courage to get started and give this up once and for all. I'm just afraid to make that jump because the PAWS terrify me to my very core.
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,386
Ok - PAWs is Post Acute Withdrawal Syndrome - not everyone gets it, but if it kicks in at all, it kicks in after the regular withdrawal period: anywhere after 30 days clean and sober or so.
I'm no Dr but I think what you're dealing with here is plain old fashioned withdrawal Biff.
D
I'm no Dr but I think what you're dealing with here is plain old fashioned withdrawal Biff.
D
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Join Date: Apr 2014
Location: Startex, SC
Posts: 7
I don't know. I know that I don't really get the horrible physical symptoms of the first stages, just the mental/emotional symptoms. I don't even know what the withdrawals are from. Hydro or Tramadol? I just know that it won't get any better until I quit and just go through the hell. I feel like I'd be better off after a few days clean no matter what. All I need is some energy and the ability to be happy again. I just want to get back to being "super uncle" for my kids.
It's just so scary to deal with the mental/emotional anguish and then I read these horror stories about it taking months or years to feel right again and it destroys my resolve.
It's just so scary to deal with the mental/emotional anguish and then I read these horror stories about it taking months or years to feel right again and it destroys my resolve.
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Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Australia
Posts: 211,386
I've never taken the drugs you mention but I found there was definitely a mental and emotional component to withdrawal.
I know it's scary and it seems endless and terrifying but try at least to consider the possibility this is not PAWs and you're not going to be this way for 2 years, let alone the rest of your life.
D
I know it's scary and it seems endless and terrifying but try at least to consider the possibility this is not PAWs and you're not going to be this way for 2 years, let alone the rest of your life.
D
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Join Date: Apr 2013
Location: Lakeside, Ca
Posts: 10,208
Originally Posted by BiffdaBearKille 
SWIM knows what to expect when he stops - but for how long? SWIM is very afraid right now and doesn't want to live in hell or hate being alive. Can someone please help?
seek out your clean and sober game plan
and make a firm decision
MM
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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Posts: 7
Dee, I look at your post and I look at the list of withdrawal symptoms and I think you may actually be right. I may not even have to deal with PAWS. I wasn't taking that long, I didn't abuse too many, and I only started recently.
In fact, I'm reminded of a night back in December when I had already gone two or three days without and my mom brought me a Monster Energy Drink and within thirty minutes of downing the drink while watching an old episode of How I Met Your Mother, I felt remarkably better. I was energetic, happy, and I even played a few hours of Banjo-Kazooie with my nephew. I went to bed, slept a little, and when I woke up I was able to play and enjoy Skyrim.
Nothing came of that though, because that morning I got my prescription refilled. v_v
If I do get PAWS, who's to say it won't be mild and I won't be able to power through it!
In fact, as I said before - I never needed drugs! People used to ask me "what are you ON!?" when they'd meet me because they thought I was on something because I was just naturally peppy all the time.
So for all I know, I can be done with this in a week or two! I won't know until I try, right! I want to thank you guys so much for everything! This does make me feel so much better!
In fact, I'm reminded of a night back in December when I had already gone two or three days without and my mom brought me a Monster Energy Drink and within thirty minutes of downing the drink while watching an old episode of How I Met Your Mother, I felt remarkably better. I was energetic, happy, and I even played a few hours of Banjo-Kazooie with my nephew. I went to bed, slept a little, and when I woke up I was able to play and enjoy Skyrim.
Nothing came of that though, because that morning I got my prescription refilled. v_v
If I do get PAWS, who's to say it won't be mild and I won't be able to power through it!
In fact, as I said before - I never needed drugs! People used to ask me "what are you ON!?" when they'd meet me because they thought I was on something because I was just naturally peppy all the time.
So for all I know, I can be done with this in a week or two! I won't know until I try, right! I want to thank you guys so much for everything! This does make me feel so much better!
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Join Date: Dec 2013
Location: Minneapolis, MN, USA
Posts: 164
You have recognized the problem, and know that the solution is to quit. Try not to worry about withdrawal symptoms and long term effects like PAWS- that only gets in the way of doing what you need to do, which is quit. I have no personal experience with narcotics, but I know PAWS will be the least of your problems if you keep doing what you are doing. Good luck and post back and let us know how you are doing.
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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Posts: 7
UPDATE: Thanks to the support and information everyone gave me (which allowed me to make the common sense realization that I was nowhere near PAWS yet) I'm more excited than nervous about detoxing! I'm sure that'll all change when I'm getting chills and sitting on the couch trying to force myself to enjoy movies that used to be hilarious...
Still, as I said before, my entire family is suffering from a bad cold right now - most of us are out of the woods, but my mother has taken it the worst. Until she gets healthy, I can't start my detox. As I said before, my mom and I are raising my sister's kids. My sister is NEVER around and NEVER helps. My mom is the only one who can take care of the kids in my stead.
I mentioned before that I am fortunate enough to be able to move around and get things done while I'm detoxing. I was even able to go jogging during one attempt. But I obviously won't be able to give the kids my full 100% and I'll need her healthy in order to keep up with them.
So as soon as she's back to 100%, I'm going to go through with this and get clean.
Still, as I said before, my entire family is suffering from a bad cold right now - most of us are out of the woods, but my mother has taken it the worst. Until she gets healthy, I can't start my detox. As I said before, my mom and I are raising my sister's kids. My sister is NEVER around and NEVER helps. My mom is the only one who can take care of the kids in my stead.
I mentioned before that I am fortunate enough to be able to move around and get things done while I'm detoxing. I was even able to go jogging during one attempt. But I obviously won't be able to give the kids my full 100% and I'll need her healthy in order to keep up with them.
So as soon as she's back to 100%, I'm going to go through with this and get clean.
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Join Date: Nov 2012
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Hey BBK,
I got sober off 10 years of benzos, almost 20 years of Ambien and alcohol last June. I too scared the bejesus out of myself by reading about protracted withdrawal on the internet. I read about people who were on minuscule doses compared to what I was taking, who were titrating down over the course of years…I wigged myself out.
I detoxed off of everything in a detox facility under medical supervision. And yeah, I've hit patches, my biggest complaint is lack of motivation. But honestly, when I think about that fuzzy out of it feeling it makes my stomach turn. I am enjoying being present so much. I am loving being tuned into what my body really wants, sleep, food, company, solitude, even water. And when I do have flat days I try not to give them too much emphasis, I know things are working themselves out.
There is a lot of support here, and honestly I haven't read any horror stories here about PAWS lasting forever, and there are a lot of people with a lot of time. It is great that you found your way here and I wish you well on your journey.
I got sober off 10 years of benzos, almost 20 years of Ambien and alcohol last June. I too scared the bejesus out of myself by reading about protracted withdrawal on the internet. I read about people who were on minuscule doses compared to what I was taking, who were titrating down over the course of years…I wigged myself out.
I detoxed off of everything in a detox facility under medical supervision. And yeah, I've hit patches, my biggest complaint is lack of motivation. But honestly, when I think about that fuzzy out of it feeling it makes my stomach turn. I am enjoying being present so much. I am loving being tuned into what my body really wants, sleep, food, company, solitude, even water. And when I do have flat days I try not to give them too much emphasis, I know things are working themselves out.
There is a lot of support here, and honestly I haven't read any horror stories here about PAWS lasting forever, and there are a lot of people with a lot of time. It is great that you found your way here and I wish you well on your journey.
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Join Date: Apr 2014
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Posts: 7
It is now 9 AM. I haven't had anything since about 2 AM. And that was 5mgs of Percocet. I'm already starting to feel withdrawal, and I have nothing left to take.
So I guess this is where it will start.
I've been reading online again, and all that does is get me scared and raise my blood pressure. I'm so afraid that it will take months for my anxiety and depression to go away.
The only reassurance I have is that one moment of happiness after 48 hours of cold turkey when I was playing video games with my nephew back in January.
I'm trying to convince myself that if I stick it out for 3-7 days I'll feel much better.
Does anyone know if it's possible the depression and anxiety can end about the same time the acute withdrawal does?
Still, I read horror stories from people who are a month in and still can't sleep and still depressed and anxious.
I know they're probably on higher doses than me, or have taken longer than me, but it still scares me.
So I guess this is where it will start.
I've been reading online again, and all that does is get me scared and raise my blood pressure. I'm so afraid that it will take months for my anxiety and depression to go away.
The only reassurance I have is that one moment of happiness after 48 hours of cold turkey when I was playing video games with my nephew back in January.
I'm trying to convince myself that if I stick it out for 3-7 days I'll feel much better.
Does anyone know if it's possible the depression and anxiety can end about the same time the acute withdrawal does?
Still, I read horror stories from people who are a month in and still can't sleep and still depressed and anxious.
I know they're probably on higher doses than me, or have taken longer than me, but it still scares me.
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