NorCaliGal

Hi all -

I am struggling with how to apply the principle of detachment. I feel that I have set and communicated my boundaries, but when it comes to detachment I'm having a problem doing it "with love." Because I AM angry. And my detachment feels like I'm trying to punish my ABF. But even if I try to remain neutral, he takes my detachment as coming from anger and then twists it around so I'm wronging him. Gah!

Can someone provide real life examples of how you've detached and managed not to have it feel - for both you and your A - like it's based in anger?

NCG

dandylion

NorCaliGal---my As did not like it when I detached (adult alcoholic children). They were angry and accusatory and all manner of negative reactions. I judged that to be "QUACKING" on their part--and treated it accordingly. Of course, they didn't like my detaching because it meant that I would no longer be enabling them (they were living in our family home, at the time). But.....I persisted, because, I knew that it was the best thing for them and for me...ultimately. There is where the love part came in---the BEST thing for them and the BEST thing for me. Finally, I kicked both of them out and refused to even talk to them on the phone unless they were ABSOLUTELY sober and respectful. I also refused to do anything to enable them.

You have no control over your boyfriend's reaction to your detachment--that is his to deal with as he sees fit. Detachment if for you and to benefit you. Although, if you get out of his way----he may reach for recovery sooner.....but, even that is not guranteed.

Detachment is not easy--especially, if we are very co-dependent on the relationship--but, it will give you some breathing space to think and focus on yourself more. Give some little island of peace, for you, in the storm.

dandylion

Stung

Detachment is hard and I can't really do it person, you're still living with your ABF, right?

The way I detach in person is to simply walk away. When I'm mad (no one can make me mad quite like my husband can) I cannot pretend that I'm not mad and I don't know how to not allow myself to be mad when he starts talking nonsense to me, specifically when he says things like "I never did/said that!" and in fact he did do/say whatever we're talking about. On the phone I just tell him that I need to go and end the conversation. Much easier on the phone than in person.

m1k3

In the beginning I detached with rage, now I don't see it as detachment with love but detachment with compassion. I have a Buddhist view of compassion now. I see it as recognizing another's suffering. Doesn't mean I have to own it or fix it but I can understand that they are suffering.

Your friend,

NorCaliGal

I find myself being compassionate when he's hungover or going through withdrawals, because I know just how crappy he's feeling, and I worry about his physical health at that point. I have a hard time mustering up compassion while he's drunk though!

spiderqueen

Hi NorCaliGal,
I could only finally feel the compassion when I let go. Of course, this meant letting go of all hope and expectations of a healthy relationship. I realized it was just not possible to achieve this with an actively drinking alcoholic. So I stopped struggling and fighting to make it happen.

Good luck to you. (hugs)

Chantal88

NorCaliGal,

First off, from my own experience I have learned that anger often times has a purpose. It's a human emotion and even though it can feel overwhelming and negative at times, it's important to feel it fully.

When I was going through my own experiences detaching from several different addicts in my life, I learned that I needed to protect myself. The anger actually acted as a guard during this time. I didn't know how to properly set boundaries because I had never really set them in my life before, so the anger was a sign to me that my boundaries were being crossed.

Distance for me, was essential to my well being. I limited my time actually seeing my friends who were addicts. I kept most contact to the phone or through text messages. And when I did see them, it was on my terms.

When I was able to finally work through my anger which took many years, I was then able to give love in a way that wasn't clouded by resentment. I wrote letters expressing my emotions, and I meditated and prayed for the addicts in my life.

I'm still a work in progress. There are some times I back track and slip into my old mindset. But in general loving detachment to me means - loving people while protecting and providing for myself. It means having peace and happiness on my own no matter what is happening in the lives of the people around me.

My journey to this point cannot be separated from my faith. I credit a lot of the progress that I've made to my connection to God and the ways in which he has guided me.

Every person is different. Spirituality may not be for you. But for me personally, I don't know where I would be without it.

C

choublak

I'm beginning to think the "with love" part was added just to be polite.

fluffyflea

I couldn't afford to be angry, for myself, so I had to find a way to let the anger go which I did through acceptance of the situation and taking care of myself. And also understanding that anothers compulsions have absolutely nothing to do with me.

CodeJob

Think of detachment with love like trying to do an ice skating jump. You have the skating capability and strength to do it, but you are assuredly going to fall learning the jump. You are going to get frustrated learning this new skill, but you are ready. Detachment with love naturally is not perfect at first. You've learned how to set and express your boundaries. But your A is testing them and twisting them trying to make you fall and give in. Give yourself credit for where you are. If you start to get angry, walk away. Journal it. Vent it here. Go for a run or walk. Peace to you!

Hammer

Sports Metaphors . . .

somebody . . . . has been watching the Winter Olympics.

For the rest of us . . . this is more like Mud Wrestling.

FireSprite

I'm not sure that I have ever successfully detached while I was angry (especially "with love")... those feel like conflicting emotions so I'm not sure I could pull both off at the same time.

For me, the "with love" part came later, after I'd gotten a better handle on steering my own recovery through this mess. While I was angry the best I could usually do was to not make things worse, so like others have said, that often included physical distance as well.

If you search "detachment" and "detaching with love" for this forum, you should turn up a lot of great old posts about this topic.... it comes up pretty regularly & there have been come wonderful threads about it.

firebolt

Yeah - I have troubles with the "with love" part also.

Here's where I'm at though:

His drinking drives me crazy in SO many ways, so I have removed myself from it. I didn't talk to him about it, i just did it. Easy for me - no kids, not married. When he is drinking, I go to the gym, visit a friend, read a book, go on a walk, watch tv in a different room, and work in the garage. That means we haven't spent much time together lately AT ALL.

It makes me sick to my stomach to kiss alcoholic breath. My kisses and affection are almost non existent when he's been drinking to protect myself from that smell, and the anger I develop from it, so I quit doing it.

This weekend he sat me down and asked me if I was cheating on him. I said, wow, no - where did you get that idea?! He said you're home late from work every day, then you take off, and for the first time in 3 years, I feel like I have to steal kisses from you.

In my most calm, matter of fact voice and face, I said, it is no fun for me anymore to spend time with you when you are drinking, so I will not. Also, now that I am not smoking, the smell of what alcohol has done to your body is negatively affecting me, so I am staying away from it.

That was the end of the conversation. Line. In. Sand. The last few days have been great with him after that conversation, but we aren't talking about him right now so I'll leave it at that

There isn't much "with love" in that conversation or my actions, however, I was FINALLY able to speak to him calmly, respectfully, matter of factually, and without any crying or yelling, and without any "i needs" or "i wants". He's heard all that before - I am done repeating myself. I don't know where my action and calm manner came from. Maybe I am just over it enough to finally take care of myself first.

I am trying to remember that I do love him. We all have problems. With him or not, I need to take care of myself first. Since rationalizing that working on me and FOR me has nothing to do with him, it has been much, much easier to take him as a person when it is healthy for me, and stay away from him as a person (rather than this big evil dark monster that I have often thought of him as) when it is not healthy for me to be around him.

Good luck - please let us all know if you discover the "with love" part. It sounds wonderful!

Oh and ps - sorry that got long winded, I get so excited about breakthroughs in this struggle and get all word slutty and type too many! lol

FireSprite

Firebolt ---- "word slutty"??.... OMG, I am dying.

Thank you for that!

P.S. - great example for this thread though & congrats on your breakthrough!!

Recovering2

When I first started practicing detachment, it was to save my own sanity. There was no announcement from me, I didn't verbalize my boundaries. I decided for myself how I would handle things at home. If I came home and he was drunk/ugly, I left again. I would go to a friends, get a bite to eat, go to the gym. Anything to stay away a few more hours. When he tried to pick a fight, I wouldn't engage. I would say "okay" and walk away. I didn't ask where he was going anymore. I didn't check around for bottles. I didn't hide wallet/keys etc to try and stop him.

I didn't do this with love. It was self preservation. I was warned by my counselor that it would take my AB a couple of weeks to realize what was happening, and then it would get worse before it got better. He was right. I felt calmer when I got used to not engaging. But when he finally figured out something was different, he really ramped up the attempt to push my buttons. Thankfully, I was prepared. The harder he tried, the more detached I was. He finally settled back down.

I think the love part may be that I didn't do it to punish him. I did it to say myself, so it was love for me. I learned to get out of his way, and take care of me.

Florence

Personally, I think "detachment with love" is meant to be a short-term survival strategy, not another impossible codie standard to hold yourself to. You are not detaching with love *at* him, and if so I will question the "with love" part of the plan, so his reaction is not yours to manage or fret over.

To me, the big, over-arching idea of detachment with empathy meant recognizing that he was in pain, and that I could not do anything about his pain. His pain was his to manage. His pain was and is mostly within the locus of his control. Once I had accepted this, it was quite easy to go about my business without worrying about what he was up to.

He's an adult -- he gets to build up and/or ruin his life if he wants to. The big question, ultimately, is how much his decisions will affect you now and into the future.

Does his emotional state rule your household? That really stinks. A good boundary would be, "I will not be in a relationship with someone who does not respect my needs, desires, and boundaries."

Also something to consider is that you're angry because he's been so awful for you, and maybe you're having a completely healthy reaction to a bad relationship.

Both of these things would require you to take action to put youself in a healthy space. Neither of them involve curbing your needs to better suit your alcoholic boyfriend.

NorCaliGal

Firebolt - don't apologize for being long winded, and word slutty (love that!)

I think your experience is very similar to mine. We are not married, no children, but have lived together since October. One of my boundaries is that I don't want to be around him when he's drunk, therefore, like you, we are not doing much together these days. I also can't stand the smell (what brilliant person came up with vodka doesn't smell - what a load of cr*p!)

I am totally in favor of leaving the house when he's drunk, - but it makes me angry too. Why should I have to leave when I just want to relax in my own home? Mostly, I just try to stay in a separate part of the house.

This weekend he was drunk pretty much from the point I got home on Friday, until late Saturday/early Sunday morning when he began to sober up because he had to go to work on Sunday morning. So all day Saturday I tried to avoid him, all the while trying to get housework done, etc. And he decides he wants to go out to breakfast, to a restaurant that we wanted to try together (never mind that, after we'd decided we'd try it together, he's gone there several times by himself when I was not available.) And I refused to go, and I told him that the reason was that I didn't want to go with him when he was drunk. I'd also already had breakfast, and I wasn't hungry. Oh, then it started , the BF says "well, that's too bad because we'd talked about going together, and we haven't had a chance, and now that we do YOU don't want to go," and blah, blah, blah...trying to make me into the bad guy and poor him all he wanted was a nice breakfast out with his girlfriend. And he decided he'd still go by himself. So I reminded him that another limit I've communicated is that I would not bail him out if he got a DUI (he's had two in the past, prior to our dating.)

Even though I did not go with him because he was drunk, and because I've set a limit that I didn't want to be around him when he's drunk, I was also very aware of how angry I was that he was drunk at all. So that's where it gets confusing. I definitely didn't feel like I was detaching out of love, and he definitely didn't take it that way. And there wasn't much love later, when after he spent the remainder of the day drunk and watching tv on the couch while taking multiple trips to the garage where he stashes his booze, I refused to let him share the dinner I'd made for myself. Because, although he was still drunk and I still didn't want to be around him to eat dinner, honestly, I wanted to punish him too.

Oh and of course on Sunday he was no good company because after he worked for six hours or so he comes home and says he doesn't feel well. Wonder why - who can drink 100 proof Vodka for 36 hours straight, and still feel good the morning after?

I also think that a lot of my frustration is that when we moved in, he had completed a outpatient treatment program and was going to AA meetings. And it was great. Then he decided to drink again, almost immediately after we moved in. He "doesn't care" for the word relapse - to hear him explain it, he enjoys his drinking periods and he enjoys his periods of sobriety, and the periods of sobriety are getting longer, and there is a possibility he may try a sober period in the future but he can't say when that will be and even then he guarantee that he'd not go back to drinking again. So he just completely justifies his relapses, in advance, because he is not promising he'll never drink again. (That was really rambling, hope it made sense!) And all this makes me feel like I've been duped, because I thought he was taking his sobriety seriously when we moved in together. Little did I know it was just a sober "period" not a life goal. And that makes me not very compassionate or loving.

Wow, looks like I'm a long winded word **** too!

NCG

NorCaliGal

Hi Florence -

Hmm, I really do believe he's in pain. I think he's got some stuff from his past that he hasn't come to terms with, and alcohol is his coping mechanism. Unfortunately, I think he really need professional one-on-one counseling to identify and address this stuff, and he's not going to get that going to group based rehabs. And I tend to be a hard-a** about stuff like that - if you have stuff in your past you need to work through, and access to counseling to work through it, then by all means get to work on it! I've been to counseling twice in my adult life and found it extremely helpful, and will go again if needed (regarding this situation with my BF, for example!)

I definitely know that I don't cause his drinking, and can't cure it. I think I'm a little slow on the can't control it part ... because when I see something that needs to be addressed, I address it! So, I need to work on accepting that nothing I say or do is going to result in controlling his drinking.

I think trying to remember that he is in pain will be helpful. I have tended to forget that because I am so angry that I have allowed myself to be placed in a situation where I'm living with an active alcoholic, and that makes me angry with him.

NCG

NorCaliGal

And thank you to all who have responded - you've really helped me start to sort through this.