Stories of how kids handled the situation in the long run...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: back woods USA
Posts: 171
Stories of how kids handled the situation in the long run...
I would love to hear from any of you who have been around for awhile as to how it turned out between the kid and the A parents....after all the damage.
Where they able to establish healthy relationships after the fact?
Where they able to establish healthy relationships after the fact?
Engineer Things; LOVE People
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,707
Yeah, not so bad.
Ala-teen HELPED a lot. Mrs. Hammer went totally psycho with me the night after I took our (then 10, now 11 y.o.) daughter. She also tried a LOT of manipulation around her not going back. Daughter kept going and got some really good help. Now daughter is mostly just running a mini Social Work program at her school.
9 y.o. Son just started Alateen. Been to two meetings, now. Mrs. Hammer just found out when the 6 y.o. mentioned it. She played it cool this time. Son really loves it as well.
As far as Mrs. Hammer and the kids. I think it has helped. Makes the Disease the problem . . . and not so much Mom Is The Problem. Does that make sense? Visiting and meeting other kids and trading "management techniques," seems to help them a lot, too. Suppose just as it does for us, huh?
So we are NOT "in the long run," yet by any means, per your question.
We still have the Hurricane ready to go at will.
Difference is now we do not go with it.
Ala-teen HELPED a lot. Mrs. Hammer went totally psycho with me the night after I took our (then 10, now 11 y.o.) daughter. She also tried a LOT of manipulation around her not going back. Daughter kept going and got some really good help. Now daughter is mostly just running a mini Social Work program at her school.
9 y.o. Son just started Alateen. Been to two meetings, now. Mrs. Hammer just found out when the 6 y.o. mentioned it. She played it cool this time. Son really loves it as well.
As far as Mrs. Hammer and the kids. I think it has helped. Makes the Disease the problem . . . and not so much Mom Is The Problem. Does that make sense? Visiting and meeting other kids and trading "management techniques," seems to help them a lot, too. Suppose just as it does for us, huh?
So we are NOT "in the long run," yet by any means, per your question.
We still have the Hurricane ready to go at will.
Difference is now we do not go with it.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
Working on it. We're no where near long-term yet, but it's a definite effort on BOTH parts for DD & RAH to rebuild. RAH was better than many A's I read about, but you simply cannot stop collateral damage no matter what you do or how much you love your kids when you are an active A.
DD still struggles with believing RAH - too many times he let her down by not showing for something at the last minute or prioritizing other things ahead of her needs, etc. For example, it took her a long, long time to trust that he would be there to pick her up after school when he said he would. Mind you, he only ever "forgot" her once but too many times to count he would change plans midday & ask me to get her instead. The disappointment was always obvious on her face when she'd see me there to get her instead. 2+ yrs into his recovery she still has a "We'll see" attitude when it comes to expecting him to walk his talk. She is, in many ways, more unforgivable than I am.
Her biggest thing is opening up & talking to him. She told me that she is just not comfortable yet, sharing every little thing with Dad no matter how far he has come. To her, *I* have always been there - "ALWAYS, always, always, Mom! You have never NOT been there when I need something whether it's a band aid, dinner or someone to talk to." She simply trusts me more.
It hurts RAH's feelings at times - like when she has a big audition for the school play & would rather practice her solo with me instead of her musician dad even though he can help her much more than I can. But hey, progress not perfection applies to her too. I encourage her to be flexible & to accept the changes he has shown her but I don't push her.
DD still struggles with believing RAH - too many times he let her down by not showing for something at the last minute or prioritizing other things ahead of her needs, etc. For example, it took her a long, long time to trust that he would be there to pick her up after school when he said he would. Mind you, he only ever "forgot" her once but too many times to count he would change plans midday & ask me to get her instead. The disappointment was always obvious on her face when she'd see me there to get her instead. 2+ yrs into his recovery she still has a "We'll see" attitude when it comes to expecting him to walk his talk. She is, in many ways, more unforgivable than I am.
Her biggest thing is opening up & talking to him. She told me that she is just not comfortable yet, sharing every little thing with Dad no matter how far he has come. To her, *I* have always been there - "ALWAYS, always, always, Mom! You have never NOT been there when I need something whether it's a band aid, dinner or someone to talk to." She simply trusts me more.
It hurts RAH's feelings at times - like when she has a big audition for the school play & would rather practice her solo with me instead of her musician dad even though he can help her much more than I can. But hey, progress not perfection applies to her too. I encourage her to be flexible & to accept the changes he has shown her but I don't push her.
Living in a Pinkful Place
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,545
I hate to say it but my girls do not have a relationship with my ex AH.
My story is together we had 5 girls - 3 his, 2 mine and none of them are in contact with him. Last year when his mom passed away ~ it was the first time in almost 3 yrs 4 of the girls had seen him. 1 of the girls was not able to come from out of state to the services.
They tried right after the divorce to keep a relationship going with him, but the disease & his behaviors would not allow it. It just wasn't healthy for them.
So as far as I know, I don't think he has seen the last 2 of his grandchildren ever ~ Sadly it won't be long the others probably won't even remember him.
the damage is done and unless something changes ~ it will be a very sad story about losses ~ The healthy man I knew at one time really loved & adored his daughters & grandchildren. I know the girls miss that man who doesn't exist anymore.
pink hugs
My story is together we had 5 girls - 3 his, 2 mine and none of them are in contact with him. Last year when his mom passed away ~ it was the first time in almost 3 yrs 4 of the girls had seen him. 1 of the girls was not able to come from out of state to the services.
They tried right after the divorce to keep a relationship going with him, but the disease & his behaviors would not allow it. It just wasn't healthy for them.
So as far as I know, I don't think he has seen the last 2 of his grandchildren ever ~ Sadly it won't be long the others probably won't even remember him.
the damage is done and unless something changes ~ it will be a very sad story about losses ~ The healthy man I knew at one time really loved & adored his daughters & grandchildren. I know the girls miss that man who doesn't exist anymore.
pink hugs
Bunnies!
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,905
I have no relationship with my AM, and either no relationship or very little to do with family members who just sat there and let it all happen. It was always "She's your MOTHER. You have to talk to her/respect her/throw yourself into a forced relationship". That did more damage to me than if I had just been allowed to have nothing to do with her at a younger age. I wanted away and was forced to play nicey-nice because they were family and "you just don't do that to family," even though they did it to me first. Anyway, I'm definitely not a case where everyone is happy and rainbows shine over us every day. I'm still bitter towards my FOO for keeping the cycle going. I didn't know about Alateen as a kid, or I may have gone. I'm a lifer in therapy and probably will be in Al-Anon, too. Don't speak to the family except in emergencies, and don't care much if that changes at all.
Engineer Things; LOVE People
Join Date: Sep 2009
Posts: 3,707
Thanks, Grits.
You and others with the now-adult-looking-back view help me see things from the kids' future eyes.
The place where I should keep my focus.
,
My daughter tells me that after 16, do not plan on seeing too much of her. I sort of have the same reverse plan for her. Ready to fully and successfully launch into college at 16 with a recovery / delay plan of 2 years (18).
She says if I am still with mom, maybe she will stop by every other Christmas or so. I completely understand.
Thank you, again.
You and others with the now-adult-looking-back view help me see things from the kids' future eyes.
The place where I should keep my focus.
,
My daughter tells me that after 16, do not plan on seeing too much of her. I sort of have the same reverse plan for her. Ready to fully and successfully launch into college at 16 with a recovery / delay plan of 2 years (18).
She says if I am still with mom, maybe she will stop by every other Christmas or so. I completely understand.
Thank you, again.
Member
Join Date: Jun 2012
Posts: 1,452
My story is similar to Ms. Pink Acres. My XAH and I had 5 kids together, 3 his and 2 mine. The youngest is now 30, the oldest almost 40.
His own daughters refuse to see him or speak to him. They blame his bad behavior toward them when they were children. They make sure he does not know where they live. They make sure that he will never see his grandchildren.
Neither my son or daughter will ever see or talk to my XAH, their step-father, again. My son, now 30, will protect his children from ever being around someone he found very abusive when he was a child. My daughter was damaged emotionally from her step-father's behavior toward her and will never talk to or see him again. She still has nightmares about him.
His oldest child, his son, is himself an alcoholic and gambler. He still sees and talks to his dad occasionally. But he keeps everyone at a distance.
My grown son and daughter were horrified when I ran away from my husband and they learned how bad his abuse of me had become since they had gone to college and left many years before. They were and are incredibly supportive to me. In the early days after I left, our roles reversed, and they took care of me emotionally as I processed what I had suffered. I am very careful to protect my daughter and try to limit what I tell her for her own emotional health. She has been a wonderful support to me as I have built my new, peaceful and happy life in a chaos free zone.
My son was available to talk to me whenever I wanted or needed to for the 45 minutes his commute home from work took. I could and did talk about anything that had happened to me, and he listened with great compassion. He was my major sounding board about decisions that I had to make. His mind is incisive, and his capacity to take in a complex situation quickly and sort through my AH's b#llsh%t helped me time and again to emerge from my emotional devastation and make sound rational decisions.
Beyond that commute time, my son and I kept his wife and young children free from all involvement in the devastation my AH had created. He asked that of me when I first fled, and it was a good boundary, and I respected and respect it. Enough damage had been done, and we created a firewall to protect the future from the insults of the past.
We are closer than we have ever been, and we share the happiness now that I imagine more normal families always had.
I have deep grief at how much my children suffered living with their step-father and his direct abuse of them, and living with my depression and my incapacities from his abuse. I lost myself, almost completely, and I didn't know it. It was so much worse than I understood, for everyone. I wish that I had had the insight I have now and had left so many years sooner.
I feel that God has blessed me that my son and daughter are healthy and happy despite the parts of their childhood home life that my alcoholic husband impacted. I always loved them deeply, and they know - and knew - that. I did the best I could with what I understood at the time, I could have done so much better if I had had the knowledge to leave before so much damage happened.
I lived with an alcoholic father and a sociopathic mother and while for God knows what reason, I emerged without addiction or psychological damage beyond depression, I wish I had been rescued when I was very young. It was h*ll. Furniture would tossed around the living room, chairs up-ended, the home landscape deeply disturbed. Yet in the morning when I came down to go to school, everything would be neat, immaculate, and in its place as if it had always been that way. I was left to wonder what was true and what was not. Did I believe my eyes and ears, or did I believe what I saw before me like a theater set?
From my experience, children know what is going on very very early; they are like homing pigeons who always come home to the truth. The problem is that they can't interpret what they know as we can as adults. And that leaves them with the conundrum of feeling responsible for someone else's bad behavior...... Why, in their minds, would mommy or daddy treat me so badly? I must have done something bad, I must be bad for the person I love most in the world to hate me....... I must have imagined that there was fighting and violence here last night because today in the daylight, it looks just like it should. I cannot trust what I know to be true.......
The sooner you can take your children and leave, the better. A compromise may feel okay to you as an adult, but children don't truly understand that an adult abuses them because of the adult's problem. Inside, no matter how okay they seem, they are blaming themselves. And an inner emotional template is forming and being reinforced for them that says that if they only could figure out how to be more worthy, they would be loved more.
From my experience, the costs are subliminal and they are huge and enduring. Not the legacy we want for our children; not the legacy we wanted for ourselves.
ShootingStar1
His own daughters refuse to see him or speak to him. They blame his bad behavior toward them when they were children. They make sure he does not know where they live. They make sure that he will never see his grandchildren.
Neither my son or daughter will ever see or talk to my XAH, their step-father, again. My son, now 30, will protect his children from ever being around someone he found very abusive when he was a child. My daughter was damaged emotionally from her step-father's behavior toward her and will never talk to or see him again. She still has nightmares about him.
His oldest child, his son, is himself an alcoholic and gambler. He still sees and talks to his dad occasionally. But he keeps everyone at a distance.
My grown son and daughter were horrified when I ran away from my husband and they learned how bad his abuse of me had become since they had gone to college and left many years before. They were and are incredibly supportive to me. In the early days after I left, our roles reversed, and they took care of me emotionally as I processed what I had suffered. I am very careful to protect my daughter and try to limit what I tell her for her own emotional health. She has been a wonderful support to me as I have built my new, peaceful and happy life in a chaos free zone.
My son was available to talk to me whenever I wanted or needed to for the 45 minutes his commute home from work took. I could and did talk about anything that had happened to me, and he listened with great compassion. He was my major sounding board about decisions that I had to make. His mind is incisive, and his capacity to take in a complex situation quickly and sort through my AH's b#llsh%t helped me time and again to emerge from my emotional devastation and make sound rational decisions.
Beyond that commute time, my son and I kept his wife and young children free from all involvement in the devastation my AH had created. He asked that of me when I first fled, and it was a good boundary, and I respected and respect it. Enough damage had been done, and we created a firewall to protect the future from the insults of the past.
We are closer than we have ever been, and we share the happiness now that I imagine more normal families always had.
I have deep grief at how much my children suffered living with their step-father and his direct abuse of them, and living with my depression and my incapacities from his abuse. I lost myself, almost completely, and I didn't know it. It was so much worse than I understood, for everyone. I wish that I had had the insight I have now and had left so many years sooner.
I feel that God has blessed me that my son and daughter are healthy and happy despite the parts of their childhood home life that my alcoholic husband impacted. I always loved them deeply, and they know - and knew - that. I did the best I could with what I understood at the time, I could have done so much better if I had had the knowledge to leave before so much damage happened.
I lived with an alcoholic father and a sociopathic mother and while for God knows what reason, I emerged without addiction or psychological damage beyond depression, I wish I had been rescued when I was very young. It was h*ll. Furniture would tossed around the living room, chairs up-ended, the home landscape deeply disturbed. Yet in the morning when I came down to go to school, everything would be neat, immaculate, and in its place as if it had always been that way. I was left to wonder what was true and what was not. Did I believe my eyes and ears, or did I believe what I saw before me like a theater set?
From my experience, children know what is going on very very early; they are like homing pigeons who always come home to the truth. The problem is that they can't interpret what they know as we can as adults. And that leaves them with the conundrum of feeling responsible for someone else's bad behavior...... Why, in their minds, would mommy or daddy treat me so badly? I must have done something bad, I must be bad for the person I love most in the world to hate me....... I must have imagined that there was fighting and violence here last night because today in the daylight, it looks just like it should. I cannot trust what I know to be true.......
The sooner you can take your children and leave, the better. A compromise may feel okay to you as an adult, but children don't truly understand that an adult abuses them because of the adult's problem. Inside, no matter how okay they seem, they are blaming themselves. And an inner emotional template is forming and being reinforced for them that says that if they only could figure out how to be more worthy, they would be loved more.
From my experience, the costs are subliminal and they are huge and enduring. Not the legacy we want for our children; not the legacy we wanted for ourselves.
ShootingStar1
Bunnies!
Join Date: Aug 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,905
Originally Posted by Hammer 
Thanks, Grits.
You and others with the now-adult-looking-back view help me see things from the kids' future eyes.
The place where I should keep my focus.
,
My daughter tells me that after 16, do not plan on seeing too much of her. I sort of have the same reverse plan for her. Ready to fully and successfully launch into college at 16 with a recovery / delay plan of 2 years (18).
She says if I am still with mom, maybe she will stop by every other Christmas or so. I completely understand.
Thank you, again.
You and others with the now-adult-looking-back view help me see things from the kids' future eyes.
The place where I should keep my focus.
,
My daughter tells me that after 16, do not plan on seeing too much of her. I sort of have the same reverse plan for her. Ready to fully and successfully launch into college at 16 with a recovery / delay plan of 2 years (18).
She says if I am still with mom, maybe she will stop by every other Christmas or so. I completely understand.
Thank you, again.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,243
My children are grown and I divorced their addictive (drugs) and cheating dad when they 1 and 6 respectively. They had sporadic visitation with their father when he was stable enough including stints of supervised at times.
I was in therapy at the time of my divorce and I learned that it was important that the kids always understood that their father was not rejecting them and they were loved. Secondly it was stressed that I didn't tear down their father verbally as kids know that they are a part of their parents.
On a negative note my XH would manipulate the children to use them as pawns to get me to take him back and so my youngest daughter resented that I refused to remarry him and allow him back into our home. She was far too young to understand the issues and her dad told a different story to her of a workaholic mom. This went on until she was in early puberty before she started seeing through him and understood. The abusive, controlling, addictive part of his personality started shining through in their teen years (its easy to be superdad for a weekend or a day visit).
Both went through stages of anxiety worrying about his addiction and lifestyle as kids. Later, as they grew up and they both became very successful, well adjusted, highly educated young adults the roles changed. They became parental figures for their pathetic dad and my son even keeps a savings account for his father that stays drained. Their father has borrowed money from them that he never pays back and they have zero respect for him as a person. They see him once every couple of months for dinner and that is about it.
I don't know what I would have done differently... the kids and I have talked and they revealed that many times they didn't really want to go with their father for weekends but they felt sorry for him! They pitied him and they went and suffered because of guilt not to speak up.
They certainly don't feel rejected as he is almost a clingon and they both have relationships with him... but... my bad picker gave them a sorry dad for life. Of course, the comforting thing is that if it wasn't for him they wouldn't be on the planet at all! In space, time and history eggs and sperm met and 9 months later they were welcomed into my messy life!
Counseling for me and my kids helped sort out life with an addictive parent. They turned out great and do not have bad pickers nor are they addictive. The cycle was broken....
I was in therapy at the time of my divorce and I learned that it was important that the kids always understood that their father was not rejecting them and they were loved. Secondly it was stressed that I didn't tear down their father verbally as kids know that they are a part of their parents.
On a negative note my XH would manipulate the children to use them as pawns to get me to take him back and so my youngest daughter resented that I refused to remarry him and allow him back into our home. She was far too young to understand the issues and her dad told a different story to her of a workaholic mom. This went on until she was in early puberty before she started seeing through him and understood. The abusive, controlling, addictive part of his personality started shining through in their teen years (its easy to be superdad for a weekend or a day visit).
Both went through stages of anxiety worrying about his addiction and lifestyle as kids. Later, as they grew up and they both became very successful, well adjusted, highly educated young adults the roles changed. They became parental figures for their pathetic dad and my son even keeps a savings account for his father that stays drained. Their father has borrowed money from them that he never pays back and they have zero respect for him as a person. They see him once every couple of months for dinner and that is about it.
I don't know what I would have done differently... the kids and I have talked and they revealed that many times they didn't really want to go with their father for weekends but they felt sorry for him! They pitied him and they went and suffered because of guilt not to speak up.
They certainly don't feel rejected as he is almost a clingon and they both have relationships with him... but... my bad picker gave them a sorry dad for life. Of course, the comforting thing is that if it wasn't for him they wouldn't be on the planet at all! In space, time and history eggs and sperm met and 9 months later they were welcomed into my messy life!
Counseling for me and my kids helped sort out life with an addictive parent. They turned out great and do not have bad pickers nor are they addictive. The cycle was broken....
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 183
My RAH is in his 4th year of recovery and our only child is 19.
You know? I don't know about the long term effects on DS. There was a period of about 2-3 years towards the end of RAH's drinking where he'd come home, drink, go to bed at 8:00 and repeat that every day. Prior to that, if you didn't know him really well you'd have no idea he drank more than the average person. When he went into recovery person after person was like, "really, I had no idea!" The only ones who had a clue were my DS and me. I guess we were fortunate? I don't know.
DS didn't respect RAH for many years. My husband has always tried to be close to him and DS kept him at arm's length. He's in college now and he and his father text every day and talk once or twice a week. I'd say that their relationship is still more distant than RAH would like, but better than it was. It's taken a long time to regain the trust and respect.
I don't get the sense that DS is angry at RAH. RAH is definitely angry at himself.
Well, that wasn't helpful! Sorry for babbling!
You know? I don't know about the long term effects on DS. There was a period of about 2-3 years towards the end of RAH's drinking where he'd come home, drink, go to bed at 8:00 and repeat that every day. Prior to that, if you didn't know him really well you'd have no idea he drank more than the average person. When he went into recovery person after person was like, "really, I had no idea!" The only ones who had a clue were my DS and me. I guess we were fortunate? I don't know.
DS didn't respect RAH for many years. My husband has always tried to be close to him and DS kept him at arm's length. He's in college now and he and his father text every day and talk once or twice a week. I'd say that their relationship is still more distant than RAH would like, but better than it was. It's taken a long time to regain the trust and respect.
I don't get the sense that DS is angry at RAH. RAH is definitely angry at himself.
Well, that wasn't helpful! Sorry for babbling!
Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
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Well, we're sort of still in the thick of it.
My kids have all decided they wan't nothing to do with their father. The courts have agreed with them that that is in their best interest (although it took blasted long and lots of trauma to get them that damn restraining order against them, good God!).
I am long-term wishing that they will re-establish a relationship with him. But I'm not sure if I'm wishing that for their sake or because it would make me less guilt-ridden if they could find a way to reconcile, kwim?
Right now, their therapists and psychiatrists question my mental health when I bring the subject up. They are comparing my children to soldiers with PTSD, and saying that forcing them to have contact with their father would be like sending a soldier with PTSD back into combat.
I don't know what to expect long-term, but I try to take it a day at a time.
My kids have all decided they wan't nothing to do with their father. The courts have agreed with them that that is in their best interest (although it took blasted long and lots of trauma to get them that damn restraining order against them, good God!).
I am long-term wishing that they will re-establish a relationship with him. But I'm not sure if I'm wishing that for their sake or because it would make me less guilt-ridden if they could find a way to reconcile, kwim?
Right now, their therapists and psychiatrists question my mental health when I bring the subject up. They are comparing my children to soldiers with PTSD, and saying that forcing them to have contact with their father would be like sending a soldier with PTSD back into combat.
I don't know what to expect long-term, but I try to take it a day at a time.
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Join Date: Oct 2006
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I learned that it was important that the kids always understood that their father was not rejecting them and they were loved.
Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
Posts: 6,780
I think everyone brings up great points in this thread - the age of the child during the most abusive years, their age when the A quits, how much work the A puts into earning back their respect, how aware & emotionally available their sober parent is & how active they are able to be about seeking recovery on behalf of the child.... all these things play a part.
DD was young when RAH started recovery & her exposure to abuse is much less than many other children of A's. That said, I could see how if she were older, had lived in it longer, if I were less active in my own recovery, etc... could all make it much more difficult for her to be able to mend the relationship or even WANT to. I think Lillamy's comparison to PTSD is spot-on for many kids. When you label it like that it totally changes the tone of what we can/should expect out of the kids, doesn't it?
DD was young when RAH started recovery & her exposure to abuse is much less than many other children of A's. That said, I could see how if she were older, had lived in it longer, if I were less active in my own recovery, etc... could all make it much more difficult for her to be able to mend the relationship or even WANT to. I think Lillamy's comparison to PTSD is spot-on for many kids. When you label it like that it totally changes the tone of what we can/should expect out of the kids, doesn't it?
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: Florida
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I keep reminding RAH that he *thinks* he has all these years left to save his relationship with DD9, but in reality he has precious few years to make enough of an impact to affect their long-term mutual respect. He thinks of her being "gone" in terms of going off to college but to me, that's just geography.
He'll "lose" her long before that to hormones, school, friends, life.... right now is THE time IMO, to make his amends so that she has that solid foundation of respect & trust to fall back on later. I told him that even given his relapse, etc, he can do this rebuilding. She doesn't expect perfection, she expects honesty & respect.
He'll "lose" her long before that to hormones, school, friends, life.... right now is THE time IMO, to make his amends so that she has that solid foundation of respect & trust to fall back on later. I told him that even given his relapse, etc, he can do this rebuilding. She doesn't expect perfection, she expects honesty & respect.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: back woods USA
Posts: 171
Thanks for all of your shares...its sad that there are no "happy endings" with these As and their kids. I have often wondered how people walk away from their kids and If it really happens that way. I guess I am finding out that it does....really really sad.
Im sad for my boys and embarrassed that I made that mistake again ...that I let someone in their life who ended up disappointing them again. In my boys eyes I was always this supper independent woman, really confident and self reliant. Since all of this started I have become so unsure of myself and our relationship has changed. I can see that there is not the same respect that there was...almost like I am human to them now and not up on my pedestal any more...
Im sad for my boys and embarrassed that I made that mistake again ...that I let someone in their life who ended up disappointing them again. In my boys eyes I was always this supper independent woman, really confident and self reliant. Since all of this started I have become so unsure of myself and our relationship has changed. I can see that there is not the same respect that there was...almost like I am human to them now and not up on my pedestal any more...
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I think Lillamy's comparison to PTSD is spot-on for many kids. When you label it like that it totally changes the tone of what we can/should expect out of the kids, doesn't it?
I think my kids' therapists have, unfortunately, been better advocates for them than I have at times. I've been stuck in "they have a right to their father" and "their father has a right to see his children" and now I look back and go "if ANY OTHER PERSON in the universe treated my children the way this man has -- I would SLUG anyone who said 'they need to spend quality time with that person'."
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: back woods USA
Posts: 171
If anyone else on this earth treated my kids the way my XRAH has I would hunt them down....when you put it that way it almost sounds abusive to try to make them spend time with them...
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I know, right?
It's been easier for me in a way because there was abuse and there were death threats -- and the children (though minors and legally not in a position to be allowed to make that call for themselves) have been dead set against seeing their father.
But even with that, I've felt like I'm "robbing" them of something. Their therapist says it's better for them to have no father and provide them with good male role models (coaches, teachers, pastors, family friends, stepfather) than to try to force a relationship with an addict.
It's been easier for me in a way because there was abuse and there were death threats -- and the children (though minors and legally not in a position to be allowed to make that call for themselves) have been dead set against seeing their father.
But even with that, I've felt like I'm "robbing" them of something. Their therapist says it's better for them to have no father and provide them with good male role models (coaches, teachers, pastors, family friends, stepfather) than to try to force a relationship with an addict.
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Join Date: Oct 2013
Location: Southern US
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I've purposely stayed away from this thread because it makes me too sad for my children. I think I'm barely hanging onto a relationship with ds15 despite major effort on my part, and I see his father making what he deems an 'appropriate effort' but what ds deems barely an effort for show only. It makes me sad because they were so close when ds was little. Oldest ds's relationship with his father is tenuous at best and now it looks like the same is happening with youngest ds. It makes me sad.
I do think there can be happy endings. My father is an alcoholic. He was also a workaholic for the majority of my life (60-100 hrs/wk.) Call me dense, but it's only been this last year that I've realized what an impact his alcoholism (didn't even call it that before this year) and my mother's codependency had on me. I am in the process of working through it but approach it more from the viewpoint of x caused y than from a blaming viewpoint, if that makes sense. They've apologized for certain things from my childhood and I've long ago accepted that they aren't perfect because really, there are no perfect people or perfect relationships.
Despite everything, we have a good relationship. No, it's not perfect. Sometimes I have to remind them of my boundaries, but overall, I would consider it a good relationship. The main thing that differs between my relationship with my parents and my children's relationship with their father is the lack of abuse. My parents were not verbally abusive. I was always aware that they loved me, even when Dad was drunk and Mom was nagging. My children wouldn't say the same of their father. That makes me really sad
I do think there can be happy endings. My father is an alcoholic. He was also a workaholic for the majority of my life (60-100 hrs/wk.) Call me dense, but it's only been this last year that I've realized what an impact his alcoholism (didn't even call it that before this year) and my mother's codependency had on me. I am in the process of working through it but approach it more from the viewpoint of x caused y than from a blaming viewpoint, if that makes sense. They've apologized for certain things from my childhood and I've long ago accepted that they aren't perfect because really, there are no perfect people or perfect relationships.
Despite everything, we have a good relationship. No, it's not perfect. Sometimes I have to remind them of my boundaries, but overall, I would consider it a good relationship. The main thing that differs between my relationship with my parents and my children's relationship with their father is the lack of abuse. My parents were not verbally abusive. I was always aware that they loved me, even when Dad was drunk and Mom was nagging. My children wouldn't say the same of their father. That makes me really sad
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Join Date: Sep 2011
Location: back woods USA
Posts: 171
justagirl...your post made me think, and Im so worried that this would be a post that my S16 will post years from now. I worry that my codependency will have more of an impact then his fathers drinking. I have to start focusing on that ..I don't want him to think of me the way you see your mother. thanks for that viewpoint.
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