Hardest Guilt To Get Over
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NE Wisconsin USA
Posts: 6,223
Hardest Guilt To Get Over
Little girl shot 5 times tossed on the road and I couldn't save her.
Man caught in cross fire I couldn't save.
Motorcycle accident couldn't save.
Weighs heavy on my mind.
Man caught in cross fire I couldn't save.
Motorcycle accident couldn't save.
Weighs heavy on my mind.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,323
Originally Posted by wiscsober 
Little girl shot 5 times tossed on the road and I couldn't save her.
Man caught in cross fire I couldn't save.
Motorcycle accident couldn't save.
Weighs heavy on my mind.
Man caught in cross fire I couldn't save.
Motorcycle accident couldn't save.
Weighs heavy on my mind.
sponsee shooting heroin, I couldn't save.
Weighs on my mind, and I need to drop the rock.
They had a higher power and it is not me. Oh No. Acceptance is the anwer.
sober since 04/06/1986 Thank you for my thoughts coming out of your mouth.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: NE Wisconsin USA
Posts: 6,223
Originally Posted by grtgrandpa
2 daughters died drunk, I couldn't save.
sponsee shooting heroin, I couldn't save.
Weighs on my mind, and I need to drop the rock.
They had a higher power and it is not me. Oh No. Acceptance is the anwer.
sober since 04/06/1986 Thank you for my thoughts coming out of your mouth.
sponsee shooting heroin, I couldn't save.
Weighs on my mind, and I need to drop the rock.
They had a higher power and it is not me. Oh No. Acceptance is the anwer.
sober since 04/06/1986 Thank you for my thoughts coming out of your mouth.
Fellow Traveler and Seeker
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Toronto, Ontario
Posts: 2,408
These are heavy duty things - I can't compare these to anything in my life - so forgive me for stating an opinion rather than experience with stuff like this.
In so much of the things that I have felt guilt over in the past - affairs, theft, hurting others, etc. and for feeling guilty about stuff that I didn't do, but still felt guilty about, I had to look at these things in my inventory and in general. Was it a case of I couldn't help, or wouldn't help? In some cases, for me, it was a case of I wouldn't do something, and then I had a part in it, for sure. If it was a case of I couldn't do something, then I had to accept that I couldn't do anything and not carry the burden of it. My ego took it on to take on things that weren't mine to take on. Because that fueled my self-pity, and boy did I love self-pity. Obviously I am not diminishing those terrible things you speak of, but certainly one person cannot expect to save everyone? I thought like that, on many levels, taking other people's woes and trying to rescue them (maybe I am a candidate for CoDA?) and took it to (deep) heart when it didn't work out my way. So I took responsibility and saw my part in the things I did have a part in and made amends, etc. as needed. I had to learn to let go of the things that weren't my luggage set. Still doing that.
Anyway, I am sorry to hear about those things, and I know I am not adding anything of value to your post, but you had me thinking here, and wanted to express these.
In so much of the things that I have felt guilt over in the past - affairs, theft, hurting others, etc. and for feeling guilty about stuff that I didn't do, but still felt guilty about, I had to look at these things in my inventory and in general. Was it a case of I couldn't help, or wouldn't help? In some cases, for me, it was a case of I wouldn't do something, and then I had a part in it, for sure. If it was a case of I couldn't do something, then I had to accept that I couldn't do anything and not carry the burden of it. My ego took it on to take on things that weren't mine to take on. Because that fueled my self-pity, and boy did I love self-pity. Obviously I am not diminishing those terrible things you speak of, but certainly one person cannot expect to save everyone? I thought like that, on many levels, taking other people's woes and trying to rescue them (maybe I am a candidate for CoDA?) and took it to (deep) heart when it didn't work out my way. So I took responsibility and saw my part in the things I did have a part in and made amends, etc. as needed. I had to learn to let go of the things that weren't my luggage set. Still doing that.
Anyway, I am sorry to hear about those things, and I know I am not adding anything of value to your post, but you had me thinking here, and wanted to express these.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,323
I was wrong
too many thoughts in my mind to relate properly to the posts. I tried to connect too many dots and my reply did not come out right. I need to reserve my comments on death for face to face sharing otherwise my meaning is lost and misunderstood. Your sharing is great. Please disregard my previous reply.
12-Step Recovered Alkie
Join Date: May 2010
Location: West Bloomfield, MI
Posts: 5,797
Eckhart Tolle's book "Power of Now" has some fabulous concepts on acceptance. Prior to hearing it, I believed acceptance to mean I put a stamp of approval on it. Now I understand it to mean something much deeper. I can vehemently disapprove of something I've accepted completely, but I digress.....
On the issue of getting over guilt, I'll re-post part of a post I made in another thread. I do so out of simplicity rather than because I think what I typed was particularly moving:
If I recall correctly, "self esteem" hit just about every 3rd column of just about every inventory I wrote in my first couple years. I noticed the repetition but didn't know much about why or what to do about it. Then, I heard a Joe H. talk where he mentioned that in his estimation no alkie has low self-esteem. What? I was sure that's what I had. Heck, it was in EVERY darn inventory I wrote.
Joe talked about how what HE had was overly high self esteem. In his living life day to day he thought, subconsciously, that he was above anything bad happening to him. That he was above doing anything wrong. That he was above anyone treating him in any way that wasn't kind, loving and accepting. Too-high was his opinion of himself.
With the theories above as a base, and moving into inventory where I'm instructed to look for causes and conditions (rather than just at the "wrongs" themselves) I began to see that my guilt was built around a false belief that I could or should have done something different at the time. The reality is, I (and I think WE, a lot of the time) always do the best I can do at every moment based upon the amount of power I have, the amount of Power I'm able to connect to, and my abilities.......at that moment. Could I handle the situation better today with better access and less blockages to a power Greater than myself, I believe so. Though I didn't like to look at myself this way, when I'm a third-grader spiritually I can only do third grade work. If I'm a third grader and falsely view myself as a graduate student, I set myself up for guilt and/or shame.
Looking at my history though, guilt and shame appear so frequently that I view them as normal states of being for me. If I don't do something perfectly, which my ego always suggests I'm capable of doing, I'd either feel guilt or shame as a result. To make matters worse, if I didn't feel guilty about it......then I would typically feel guilty for not feeling guilty.
In my case, this never ending round-robbin came from a false ego-based belief that I AM able to to precisely what's necessary all the time.
Inventory pointed all of this out to me...... application of the third step, once I was able to swallow the second step in this area, was the beginning of the way out. I had to see that this was another area I tended to play God and it sure as heck wasn't working. Six and seven were the solution but it took a lot of step six praying for the willingness to let it go because when I was honest with myself, I liked that I felt guilty - it seemed to be right or proper.
On the issue of getting over guilt, I'll re-post part of a post I made in another thread. I do so out of simplicity rather than because I think what I typed was particularly moving:
If I recall correctly, "self esteem" hit just about every 3rd column of just about every inventory I wrote in my first couple years. I noticed the repetition but didn't know much about why or what to do about it. Then, I heard a Joe H. talk where he mentioned that in his estimation no alkie has low self-esteem. What? I was sure that's what I had. Heck, it was in EVERY darn inventory I wrote.
Joe talked about how what HE had was overly high self esteem. In his living life day to day he thought, subconsciously, that he was above anything bad happening to him. That he was above doing anything wrong. That he was above anyone treating him in any way that wasn't kind, loving and accepting. Too-high was his opinion of himself.
With the theories above as a base, and moving into inventory where I'm instructed to look for causes and conditions (rather than just at the "wrongs" themselves) I began to see that my guilt was built around a false belief that I could or should have done something different at the time. The reality is, I (and I think WE, a lot of the time) always do the best I can do at every moment based upon the amount of power I have, the amount of Power I'm able to connect to, and my abilities.......at that moment. Could I handle the situation better today with better access and less blockages to a power Greater than myself, I believe so. Though I didn't like to look at myself this way, when I'm a third-grader spiritually I can only do third grade work. If I'm a third grader and falsely view myself as a graduate student, I set myself up for guilt and/or shame.
Looking at my history though, guilt and shame appear so frequently that I view them as normal states of being for me. If I don't do something perfectly, which my ego always suggests I'm capable of doing, I'd either feel guilt or shame as a result. To make matters worse, if I didn't feel guilty about it......then I would typically feel guilty for not feeling guilty.
In my case, this never ending round-robbin came from a false ego-based belief that I AM able to to precisely what's necessary all the time. Inventory pointed all of this out to me...... application of the third step, once I was able to swallow the second step in this area, was the beginning of the way out. I had to see that this was another area I tended to play God and it sure as heck wasn't working. Six and seven were the solution but it took a lot of step six praying for the willingness to let it go because when I was honest with myself, I liked that I felt guilty - it seemed to be right or proper.
It`s ok to stay sober
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Central NC
Posts: 20,902
you couldn`t save them but you may be able to save the next one
keep trying
it ain`t all about us
I am sure the ones who didn`t make it and their family's had it worst
Maybe we can be grateful we was able to try
keep trying
it ain`t all about us
I am sure the ones who didn`t make it and their family's had it worst
Maybe we can be grateful we was able to try
Laozi Old Man
Join Date: May 2008
Location: Detroit, MI
Posts: 6,665
Originally Posted by DayTrader
Eckhart Tolle's book "Power of Now" has some fabulous concepts on acceptance. Prior to hearing it, I believed acceptance to mean I put a stamp of approval on it. Now I understand it to mean something much deeper. I can vehemently disapprove of something I've accepted completely, but I digress.....
A person who is psychologically detached will say something like;
1. "I don't care about the situation anymore".
2. "It's none of my business what happens".
On the other hand, a person who is Spiritually detached will say;
1. "I do care about the situation".
2. "I will make an effort to help the situation if possible".
3. "I must recognize that I can only do so much".
4. "It's none of my business what the outcome is".
Getting back to the O.P. Spiritual detachment means it's OK to care about the situation. It's OK to try and be helpful where possible. It's not OK to take either credit or shame for any results. In other words... We do our part. We trust our HP to do it's part. Then we detach from the outcome.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,323
Originally Posted by DayTrader
Eckhart Tolle's book "Power of Now" has some fabulous concepts on acceptance.
Looking at my history though, guilt and shame appear so frequently that I view them as normal states of being for me. If I don't do something perfectly, which my ego always suggests I'm capable of doing, I'd either feel guilt or shame as a result. To make matters worse, if I didn't feel guilty about it......then I would typically feel guilty for not feeling guilty. In my case, this never ending round-robbin came from a false ego-based belief that I AM able to to precisely what's necessary all the time.
Inventory pointed all of this out to me...... application of the third step, once I was able to swallow the second step in this area, was the beginning of the way out. I had to see that this was another area I tended to play God and it sure as heck wasn't working. Six and seven were the solution but it took a lot of step six praying for the willingness to let it go because when I was honest with myself, I liked that I felt guilty - it seemed to be right or proper.
Looking at my history though, guilt and shame appear so frequently that I view them as normal states of being for me. If I don't do something perfectly, which my ego always suggests I'm capable of doing, I'd either feel guilt or shame as a result. To make matters worse, if I didn't feel guilty about it......then I would typically feel guilty for not feeling guilty.
In my case, this never ending round-robbin came from a false ego-based belief that I AM able to to precisely what's necessary all the time. Inventory pointed all of this out to me...... application of the third step, once I was able to swallow the second step in this area, was the beginning of the way out. I had to see that this was another area I tended to play God and it sure as heck wasn't working. Six and seven were the solution but it took a lot of step six praying for the willingness to let it go because when I was honest with myself, I liked that I felt guilty - it seemed to be right or proper.
________________
04.06.1986
Member
Join Date: Sep 2013
Location: Maryland
Posts: 3,323
Originally Posted by Boleo
Eckhart Tolle had some fabulous concepts on acceptance but it was his namesake Meister Eckhart who had some fabulous concepts on Spiritual Detachment. Spiritual detachment is similar to psychological detachment in the sense that both express the concept of "It's none of my business". They differ however when it comes to compassion.
A person who is psychologically detached will say something like;
1. "I don't care about the situation anymore".
2. "It's none of my business what happens".
On the other hand, a person who is Spiritually detached will say;
1. "I do care about the situation".
2. "I will make an effort to help the situation if possible".
3. "I must recognize that I can only do so much".
4. "It's none of my business what the outcome is".
Getting back to the O.P. Spiritual detachment means it's OK to care about the situation. It's OK to try and be helpful where possible. It's not OK to take either credit or shame for any results. In other words... We do our part. We trust our HP to do it's part. Then we detach from the outcome.
A person who is psychologically detached will say something like;
1. "I don't care about the situation anymore".
2. "It's none of my business what happens".
On the other hand, a person who is Spiritually detached will say;
1. "I do care about the situation".
2. "I will make an effort to help the situation if possible".
3. "I must recognize that I can only do so much".
4. "It's none of my business what the outcome is".
Getting back to the O.P. Spiritual detachment means it's OK to care about the situation. It's OK to try and be helpful where possible. It's not OK to take either credit or shame for any results. In other words... We do our part. We trust our HP to do it's part. Then we detach from the outcome.
I believe that HP speaks to me from the hearts of fellow sufferers, and your sharing eases my pain. With my small amount of humility and compassion I will attempt to pass it on to those I meet "trudging on the happy road to destiny." 
Member
Join Date: Apr 2012
Location: northern michigan. not the U.P.
Posts: 15,281
causing the death of another human while drunk was very hard on me for many years. it wasn't until i got into recovery that i finally faced it and let the emotions flow. i had to accept accountability for it. i admitted and accepted i am powerless.i believed in a power greater than myself could help. i turned it over to that power. i saw the self pity. i talked to another about it while letting my higher power listen. i wanted the self pity gone. i gave it up. i made a list of who i harmed. made amends where possible.
it still surfaces occasionally. we all have demons.not all of them just disappear. but today i don't have to let my demons control me like i used to. when it comes up, the best thing for me to do is look at it,thank my HP im not that person any more, then get into action helping someone else.
it still surfaces occasionally. we all have demons.not all of them just disappear. but today i don't have to let my demons control me like i used to. when it comes up, the best thing for me to do is look at it,thank my HP im not that person any more, then get into action helping someone else.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Gulf Coast, Florida USA
Posts: 5,731
Originally Posted by tomsteve
causing the death of another human while drunk was very hard on me for many years. .
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
