nbay2013

I just read my first thread on this forum from three weeks ago. Wow...I was really in a rage!! Pretty much stomping my feet and yelling. I did lots of biking and photography and more biking and then I got sick. Having a bad cold for a week kind of took the fire out of me. Just couldn't muster the energy. But I have spent much time reading this forum and absorbing so much wisdom and honesty and real raw emotions.

Here is my thought today. I was thinking that I have this really awful ongoing conversation with my XAB in my head all the time. I kind of go into a trance and realize yet again; I am having this imaginary debate with him. I shake my head and have to force my mind elsewhere. And I realize in the 5 years of our relationship at least 2 1/2 years I have had this internal thing with him going on. And now it's maddening. It's like he is still here; but it's just me continuing on engagement with him. I guess it's because of all the confusion and me constantly trying to figure him out; his moods, his problems, the mixed messages etc. And then I think that maybe it's some dysfunctional way to hold on to him. Like as long as I obsess on him we are still having a relationship. Oh...I just don't know.

My question is, how does one walk the line in healing from this bad experience and yet not letting the experience run our lives? What is the difference between a healthy processing of our relationship with the ex and an unhealthy obsession and hanging onto negativity? I can promise you one thing...my ex-ab is NOT on a forum discussing our relationship. I don't want to be selfish like him but I could use a bit more of that kind of selfishness. I guess I am trying to figure out what happened because I am so scared it will happen again.

Any thoughts/opinions are so appreciated.

thislonelygirl

Wow. I cant answer your question. No ex here and still struggling in my relationship BUT
Im glad to know im not the only crazy one lol
Ill be up after drunk ah paases up and have imaginary conversatioms.
I think I do this because im still walking on eggshells and have alot. I need to say...feeling that beed to be addressed and since I cant properly communicate them to him...I do with myself or reply thibgs hes said that drive me crazy.
Given any thought to counseling or. Confronting ex. Bf?

nbay2013

Hi LonelyGirl; That makes sense what you said; not being heard is crazy making; so in our heads we keep on trying and trying to be heard.

Yes, I am getting counseling. No to confronting ex. We were reconciling after a year of his sobriety and then he went awol. Disappeared for several days and then emailed that he didn't want to continue. He basically waited until I said yes, and then disappeared. Doesn't help with the internal conversations.

That must be so tough with your AH. Are you going to Al-Anon and/or counseling? I guess I was lucky I was spared seeing my XAB drunk. We did not live together and he was completely in the closet with it. I actually never saw him loaded.

Argnotthisagain

Oh nbay, I was JUST thinking about something I just *grokked* myself!!

First, let me just say that you just described exactly the battle with my own fantasies that I've been struggling with. Except that my obsession problem is sorrowful victimized feelings and images, "snapshots" of moments I miss over and over in my mind.

Anyway, what I JUST grokked is that we have to fully grieve the good as well as be angry about the bad.

Personally, I have a hard time getting to the appropriate anger that would help me. But the romantic obsessing that I am doing also is about holding on, as is your obsessive angry conversations that are keeping you in anger.

I definitely think we have to keep feeling the waves of emotion AND keep practising the skill of getting them back under control.

And also I guess we gotta give ourselves the time too. Even though I wish I felt *fabulous* right now. Dammit.

But I just realized that before I myself am ready to feel the anger at him, (which would be appropriate), I need to grieve the good and become ready to say goodbye to that. All of it. Because that's where MY fantasies get stuck and hang on and on and on.

So for you, I'd say the angry conversations serve the same purpose as my snapshots. They DO keep him alive in your head/heart. Keeps the emotional *hit* going.

I guess we just have to keep striving to let go because in the endn letting go WILL feel better. And when we're ready, we will.

Just ain't a whole lot of fun.....

Huggsss

thislonelygirl

I was going to alanon. Been swamped and sort of fell off my recovery wagon. No counseling but need to go.
It is crazy making by far. Everyone should have a voice. Pity in addiction the cycle takes away that voice and leaves us the gaga left
Well I am very glad you were spared from seeing it first hand. Hopefully that helps you heal more than would have. Its not pleasant seeing it at all. Best luck

Argnotthisagain

Great point about being unable to communicate with them, lonelygirl. So true. I see now!: It's a familiar feeling for me too! From way back--- family of origen stuff. Having NO voice because you're talking at a very mixed up person. Disturbed.

So I keep getting involved with people I got crazy mixed messages from and I'm *familiar* with the feeling of trying to be heard by someone who doesn't and can't hear you.

I'm having a lot of "Aha moments" tonight!

Wavy

For me the difference between healthy processing and unhealthy obsession is awareness. When I have those conversations contained in my head and they are real to me and consume my thoughts then thats unhealthy. When I can notice I'm having a pointless internal conversation and acknowledge that it is me trying somehow to get a handle on things then that is healthy because I know its not real, just something I am trying to work through. Be gentle with yourself about it, notice what's happening, have some compassion for yourself for the suffering that's caused a need for these internal conversations and know that they are not reality, but still serve a purpose. That attitude helps me accept it and let it go. I have those conversations too (I haven't left ABF yet, but am planning to in the next few days), sometimes they keep me awake all night, but knowing they are not real, just me trying to make sense of things helps me to not be so hard on myself for seemingly going round in circles, and most importantly stops me being tempted to believe those conversations, which can be pretty upsetting!

m1k3

One thing that really helped me when I was having this same situation was whenever I caught myself doing the conversations with AW in my head was to say to myself "who are you talking to?" This gave me a chance to jump off the hamster wheel in my head before I really got going. After a while I could catch myself before I even got on the wheel at all. It just takes time and practice.

Another thing that helped me was remembering that just because I think it doesn't make it true and emotions aren't facts.

Google mindfulness and MBSR (mindfulness based stress relief) for some more awareness tools.

Your friend,

AnvilheadII

Why Ruminating is Unhealthy and How to Stop
By MARGARITA TARTAKOVSKY, M.S.
Associate Editor

Why Ruminating is Unhealthy and How to Stop
Ruminating is like a record that’s stuck and keeps repeating the same lyrics. It’s replaying an argument with a friend in your mind. It’s retracing past mistakes.

When people ruminate, they over-think or obsess about situations or life events, such as work or relationships.

Research has shown that rumination is associated with a variety of negative consequences, including depression, anxiety, post-traumatic stress disorder, binge-drinking and binge-eating.

Why does rumination lead to such harmful results?


For some people, drinking or binge-eating becomes a way to cope with life and drown out their ruminations, according to Susan Nolen-Hoeksema, Ph.D, a psychologist and professor at Yale University.

Not surprisingly, ruminating conjures up more negative thoughts. It becomes a cycle.

Nolen-Hoeksema’s research has found that “when people ruminate while they are in depressed mood, they remember more negative things that happened to them in the past, they interpret situations in their current lives more negatively, and they are more hopeless about the future.”

Rumination also becomes the fast track to feeling helpless. Specifically, it paralyzes your problem-solving skills. You become so preoccupied with the problem that you’re unable to push past the cycle of negative thoughts.

It can even turn people away. “When people ruminate for an extended time, their family members and friends become frustrated and may pull away their support,” Nolen-Hoeksema said.

Why People Ruminate


Some ruminators may simply have more stress in their lives which preoccupies them, Nolen-Hoeksema noted. For others, it may be an issue of cognition. “Some people prone to ruminate have basic problems pushing things out of consciousness once they get there,” she said.

Women seem to ruminate more than men, said Nolen-Hoeksema, who’s also author of Women Who Think Too Much: How to Break Free of Overthinking and Reclaim Your Life. Why? Part of the reason is that women tend to be more concerned about their relationships.

As Nolen-Hoeksema observed, “interpersonal relationships are great fuel for rumination,” and ambiguities abound in relationships. “You can never really know what people think of you or whether they will be faithful and true.”


How To Reduce Rumination


According to Nolen-Hoeksema, there are essentially two steps to stop or minimize rumination.

1. Engage in activities that foster positive thoughts. “You need to engage in activities that can fill your mind with other thoughts, preferably positive thoughts,” she said.

That could be anything from a favorite physical activity to a hobby to meditation to prayer. “The main thing is to get your mind off your ruminations for a time so they die out and don’t have a grip on your mind,” she advised.

2. Problem-solve. People who ruminate not only replay situations in their head, they also focus on abstract questions, such as, “Why do these things happen to me?” and “What’s wrong with me that I can’t cope?” Nolen-Hoeksema said.

Even if they consider solving the situation, they conclude that “there is nothing they can do about it.”

Instead, when you can think clearly, “identify at least one concrete thing you could do to overcome the problem(s) you are ruminating about.” For instance, if you’re uneasy about a situation at work, commit to calling a close friend so you can brainstorm solutions.


Positive Self-Reflection


Nolen-Hoeksema has also studied the opposite of rumination: adaptive self-reflection. When people practice adaptive self-reflection, they focus on the concrete parts of a situation and the improvements they can make.

For instance, a person may wonder, “What exactly did my boss say to me that upset me so much yesterday?” and then come up with, “I could ask my boss to talk with me about how I could get a better performance evaluation,” Nolen-Hoeksema said.

honeypig

This is what I think, too, for what it's worth.

I found and downloaded a guided meditation in which you picture yourself as steadfast and grounded as a mountain. You take notice of the blizzards, of the rainstorms, of the blazing sun, of all the creatures and their dramas, but yet the mountain remains steadfast and grounded.

I keep returning to this, knowing that the answer is not to shut down all emotions, but also knowing that I cannot continue to ride the roller coaster and expect to make good decisions and be who/what I want to be in life, either.

I don't know if this is exactly what you're struggling with and don't know if you'd find it helpful right now, but maybe somewhere down the road something like this could give you some space and peace.

m1k3

I have a similar meditation. I am a mountain and my thoughts and emotions are clouds.

The mountain doesn't grab the clouds and the clouds don't move the mountain.

Your friend,

nbay2013

These are great suggestions. Last night I tried one tool..before bed I wrote my stream of consciousness down on paper, without editing or judgement. And it worked! For that moment; enough to fall asleep my mind was free. I am excited about trying these other methods. I would much rather be thinking about art and photography.