In the right place?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
In the right place?
I posted the following (gleaned from various posts) in the "newcomer" thread. As I listened to some of the very helpful responses there, it occurred to me that I might be better served asking my questions here. So...here I am. I look forward to your responses to my post, below:
After years of drinking 3-6 beers per night, with extended breaks only for Lent, I recently realized that there was no one to blame for my drinking patterns -- neither the demands from my special needs son nor my wife nor, even, my mother's alcoholism -- but myself. Since then, I have stopped drinking during the week, and have limited my consumption on nights I do drink. Still, I have ended up drunk on a couple of occasions despite my intentions (lower tolerance, higher ABV beer than expected).
While I think this is a step in the right direction, I don't feel like it goes far enough to address what I think is the core issue I'm having: namely, that I want to be able to live out what I believe is my family cross to bear, a history of problem drinking and alcoholism, in order to show my son what needs to be done to carry this burden and still have peace.
I don't know if it's the guilt of not having quit completely, the anxiety that underlies my self-medicating, or what. But it's becoming pretty clear to me that my skepticism about my ability to heal is a result of my mother never having overcome her addictions. Thus I never experienced the peace that I always knew/hoped/prayed would come to me as a kid if she ever managed to quit. My drinking is much less severe than my mother's, and I think my kid has only seen me drunk maybe twice (also never missed any of his school functions, therapy sessions, etc., etc.). Still, kids with his disability (autism spectrum) will almost inevitably face social anxiety, and I fear he'll eventually turn to alcohol to help. Do you think my "example" will be a big help, even though he may not necessarily notice while he is growing up that I have a problem? Am I in the right place, posting here and thinking about going to an ACOA meeting? Thanks in advance.
After years of drinking 3-6 beers per night, with extended breaks only for Lent, I recently realized that there was no one to blame for my drinking patterns -- neither the demands from my special needs son nor my wife nor, even, my mother's alcoholism -- but myself. Since then, I have stopped drinking during the week, and have limited my consumption on nights I do drink. Still, I have ended up drunk on a couple of occasions despite my intentions (lower tolerance, higher ABV beer than expected).
While I think this is a step in the right direction, I don't feel like it goes far enough to address what I think is the core issue I'm having: namely, that I want to be able to live out what I believe is my family cross to bear, a history of problem drinking and alcoholism, in order to show my son what needs to be done to carry this burden and still have peace.
I don't know if it's the guilt of not having quit completely, the anxiety that underlies my self-medicating, or what. But it's becoming pretty clear to me that my skepticism about my ability to heal is a result of my mother never having overcome her addictions. Thus I never experienced the peace that I always knew/hoped/prayed would come to me as a kid if she ever managed to quit. My drinking is much less severe than my mother's, and I think my kid has only seen me drunk maybe twice (also never missed any of his school functions, therapy sessions, etc., etc.). Still, kids with his disability (autism spectrum) will almost inevitably face social anxiety, and I fear he'll eventually turn to alcohol to help. Do you think my "example" will be a big help, even though he may not necessarily notice while he is growing up that I have a problem? Am I in the right place, posting here and thinking about going to an ACOA meeting? Thanks in advance.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
Going to an AOCA meeting is a great idea. Have you read much about it yet? We have a lot of information in the stickies above. Coming to terms with what you lived with growing up is essential for you to begin your healing. There is also a thread with the book that have helped us. You can read my blog posted here under my name to the left.
I will say that from me and my siblings we only had one of us that had a prolonged problem with drinking and that was a long time ago. I had a big problem with drinking during high school and i haven't drank since. All that to say, you are not fated to be an alcoholic. The sooner you start dealing with it the sooner you can begin healing and break the tradition for your son.
I will say that from me and my siblings we only had one of us that had a prolonged problem with drinking and that was a long time ago. I had a big problem with drinking during high school and i haven't drank since. All that to say, you are not fated to be an alcoholic. The sooner you start dealing with it the sooner you can begin healing and break the tradition for your son.
Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 318
Welcome!
Even though you had a miserable childhood, you are not destined to remain in misery like your mother did.
You can break the chains, if you want to!
ACOA meetings are a great help, these forums are great, and there are so many great books out there to read.
It all boils down to which path you want to walk down. The choice is yours.
You can break the chains, if you want to!
ACOA meetings are a great help, these forums are great, and there are so many great books out there to read.
It all boils down to which path you want to walk down. The choice is yours.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 923
I am doing the same. This site has been so helpful and all the steps...I did alanon for a long time, but this suits better most of the time. glad you are here...i am not the drinker but the codependent...so it still comes with lots of issues. the fear kills too...so hopefully you will find peace here.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: it's complicated
Posts: 99
Some ACoAs juggle various compulsive ways of managing pain, with a different numbing strategy for every waking hour of the day (work/shopping/tv/computer/sexual behavior/eating/alcohol/smoking/codependency drama/animal hoarding/_________) and some settle on one or two strategies and eventually cross over into outright alcoholism or what have you. I personally think the codependents end up sicker than the drinkers, perhaps because we can hide how we get twisted and still manage to look good (until we are caught in a situation in which we show our true colors).
The pain of living as an ACoA without recovery and without some numbing compulsive behavior is intolerable.
The way you write about your drinking, it could be that you are trying to keep it in your life as a way to feel better about your pain so long as you don't expose your son to drunkenness. I am guessing that truly moderate drinking (defined as, you don't really care if you have it or not, alcohol doesn't provide your ability to relax and be comfortable in your own skin, you can do that holding a glass of water) would probably depend on addressing your pain somehow.
If we don't address the pain we end up doing crazy and hurtful things to live with it.
I think the pain of living in alcoholic family system ways-- don't trust, don't talk, don't feel-- is the real cross you are trying to figure out how to carry, and not the drinking history per se. Better maybe to learn to put that cross down because it does nobody any good, it just rolls the dysfunction down through the generations because nobody can live with the "don't talk, don't trust, don't feel" rules in place... not without doing crazy hurtful things to themselves and others. But recovery is a lot of work and you have to want it.
12 step worked beautifully for me when nothing else did, other people prefer therapy or other support group systems. Education is vital-- the ACA Red Book is amazing.
The pain of living as an ACoA without recovery and without some numbing compulsive behavior is intolerable.
The way you write about your drinking, it could be that you are trying to keep it in your life as a way to feel better about your pain so long as you don't expose your son to drunkenness. I am guessing that truly moderate drinking (defined as, you don't really care if you have it or not, alcohol doesn't provide your ability to relax and be comfortable in your own skin, you can do that holding a glass of water) would probably depend on addressing your pain somehow.
If we don't address the pain we end up doing crazy and hurtful things to live with it.
I think the pain of living in alcoholic family system ways-- don't trust, don't talk, don't feel-- is the real cross you are trying to figure out how to carry, and not the drinking history per se. Better maybe to learn to put that cross down because it does nobody any good, it just rolls the dysfunction down through the generations because nobody can live with the "don't talk, don't trust, don't feel" rules in place... not without doing crazy hurtful things to themselves and others. But recovery is a lot of work and you have to want it.
12 step worked beautifully for me when nothing else did, other people prefer therapy or other support group systems. Education is vital-- the ACA Red Book is amazing.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Thanks for the replies, everyone. I can tell I'm in the right place for beginning my recovery. I plan to stick around and make time to post in here regularly. First I'm going to try to get my hands on that ACA Red Book. Thanks again!
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
Originally Posted by deven 
Thanks for the replies, everyone. I can tell I'm in the right place for beginning my recovery. I plan to stick around and make time to post in here regularly. First I'm going to try to get my hands on that ACA Red Book. Thanks again!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Kialua
If that takes a while to get the Red Book, don't forget there is a wealth of information custom made for us in the stickies above. So glad you are taking charge of your recovery!
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 127
Hi Devin.
It's common that adult children blame themselves for their parents' defects.
Your mothers problems are not your fault.
Over 50% of alcoholics are adult children although many don't know it until later.
It seems the order if recovery here is to go to AA (you can go to any other 12-step fellowship you want also) and get the drinking done away with. That's first.
If you're trying to control something, it's already out of control.
We need to get rid of our addictions before we can recover emotionally at all.
I'm grateful I'm an alcoholic because the AA Big Book is where I found my solution for life. It's the most powerful beautiful FIRST book in all of 12-step recovery. If you can find a sponsor who will guide you through the steps using it, your life will never be the same.
After I did that work, I addressed more of my adult child issues.
But really, We're all adult children un the world. Dysfunctional families are the majority.
The best thing you can do for your son is allow AA to help you get sober and became the father you can be - all-around.
Best to you as you start your journey.
Be patient with yourself.
God is happy you're embarking on this with willingness to seek.
It's common that adult children blame themselves for their parents' defects.
Your mothers problems are not your fault.
Over 50% of alcoholics are adult children although many don't know it until later.
It seems the order if recovery here is to go to AA (you can go to any other 12-step fellowship you want also) and get the drinking done away with. That's first.
If you're trying to control something, it's already out of control.
We need to get rid of our addictions before we can recover emotionally at all.
I'm grateful I'm an alcoholic because the AA Big Book is where I found my solution for life. It's the most powerful beautiful FIRST book in all of 12-step recovery. If you can find a sponsor who will guide you through the steps using it, your life will never be the same.
After I did that work, I addressed more of my adult child issues.
But really, We're all adult children un the world. Dysfunctional families are the majority.
The best thing you can do for your son is allow AA to help you get sober and became the father you can be - all-around.
Best to you as you start your journey.
Be patient with yourself.
God is happy you're embarking on this with willingness to seek.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Reedling
The way you write about your drinking, it could be that you are trying to keep it in your life as a way to feel better about your pain so long as you don't expose your son to drunkenness. I am guessing that truly moderate drinking (defined as, you don't really care if you have it or not, alcohol doesn't provide your ability to relax and be comfortable in your own skin, you can do that holding a glass of water) would probably depend on addressing your pain somehow.
If we don't address the pain we end up doing crazy and hurtful things to live with it.
I think the pain of living in alcoholic family system ways-- don't trust, don't talk, don't feel-- is the real cross you are trying to figure out how to carry, and not the drinking history per se. Better maybe to learn to put that cross down because it does nobody any good, it just rolls the dysfunction down through the generations because nobody can live with the "don't talk, don't trust, don't feel" rules in place... not without doing crazy hurtful things to themselves and others. But recovery is a lot of work and you have to want it.
12 step worked beautifully for me when nothing else did, other people prefer therapy or other support group systems. Education is vital-- the ACA Red Book is amazing.
If we don't address the pain we end up doing crazy and hurtful things to live with it.
I think the pain of living in alcoholic family system ways-- don't trust, don't talk, don't feel-- is the real cross you are trying to figure out how to carry, and not the drinking history per se. Better maybe to learn to put that cross down because it does nobody any good, it just rolls the dysfunction down through the generations because nobody can live with the "don't talk, don't trust, don't feel" rules in place... not without doing crazy hurtful things to themselves and others. But recovery is a lot of work and you have to want it.
12 step worked beautifully for me when nothing else did, other people prefer therapy or other support group systems. Education is vital-- the ACA Red Book is amazing.
I have also been reading your blog posts about the order of the Steps and -- coupled with some of the other posts in this thread -- am still conflicted about which cross to "take up" first: the pain or the drinking. Again, I know both are relevant and I have to guard against both getting out of hand, but at this point I guess I just feel like it's the "don't trust, don't talk, don't feel" that is most damaging to my current relationships with my family and has the most potential to pass the dysfunction on to my kid. I think my wife would agree with me, too
She is right that I am more verbally abusive (toward her, not toward my kid...but he definitely picks up on it) than alcohol abusive.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
Originally Posted by deven
She is right that I am more verbally abusive (toward her, not toward my kid...but he definitely picks up on it) than alcohol abusive.
Just a side to your sentence quoted above. Anytime you are verbally abusive to your spouse, your child suffers. Not just sometimes or a little bit. The atmosphere created when the mother/father is disrespected sets the tone for the child. The child has to emotionally take sides, whether the child shows it or not. And he is being shown how to treat women by watching and hearing. You might want to take to heart this great phrase and let it guide you when you are discussing things with your wife:
One of the best things a father can do for his children is to respect their mother.*
Unfortunately I speak from experience. My husband and I were not always as kind to each other as we should have been, and unbeknownst to us our daughter suffered for it. So please don't think I am chastising you, just a heads up.
* Respect Your Children's Mother : How to Be a Dad : National Fatherhood Initiative
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: it's complicated
Posts: 99
What did I do... ok, I took the advice I'm about to give you here, because I was struggling with similar questions, minus the child. And it is just my ESH, and thankfully there are a lot of people here so you can get other points of view.
It's ok to stop drinking for six months then reevaluate whether or not to drink at that point, because you aren't sure now if you should drink or not and you want to do the most careful thing. Six months of recovery work if you work it should put you in a much better position to figure out if you can have a beer with dinner or not.
Meanwhile work recovery on the ACA issues.
I'm not suggesting a deal where if you can endure as a dry drunk for six months without doing recovery, then after six months you get to start drinking again. (I have heard so many stories in AA meetings of alcoholics doing six months dry no problem because they had to for one reason or another-- and then right back into drinking not knowing how they got home or who they ran down on the way home.)
I think a lot of ACAs with recovery learn that there are times when they simply don't need to be drinking/shopping/dating/adopting yet another rescue puppy, because they are not fit to handle it spiritually or emotionally, often when family issues are flaring up... you can screw up your life pretty badly and still not earn a seat over at AA because alcoholism is not your deepest problem, just one symptom among several.
That said, if you resolve to stop drinking for six months and can't do it, then you know, off to AA you go, and come back when your sobriety is steady.
Or, actually, here is another thing I did. I went to a lot of open AA meetings to help clarify the issue for myself and when asked said, I am not sure if I am one of you, but there is alcoholism in my family and I have had horrible bad experiences under the influence and I am worried about my drinking. I think sober alcoholics in 12 step actually sorted it out quite quickly that I was not really an A, but they were totally nice and welcoming anyway.
It's ok to stop drinking for six months then reevaluate whether or not to drink at that point, because you aren't sure now if you should drink or not and you want to do the most careful thing. Six months of recovery work if you work it should put you in a much better position to figure out if you can have a beer with dinner or not.
Meanwhile work recovery on the ACA issues.
I'm not suggesting a deal where if you can endure as a dry drunk for six months without doing recovery, then after six months you get to start drinking again. (I have heard so many stories in AA meetings of alcoholics doing six months dry no problem because they had to for one reason or another-- and then right back into drinking not knowing how they got home or who they ran down on the way home.)
I think a lot of ACAs with recovery learn that there are times when they simply don't need to be drinking/shopping/dating/adopting yet another rescue puppy, because they are not fit to handle it spiritually or emotionally, often when family issues are flaring up... you can screw up your life pretty badly and still not earn a seat over at AA because alcoholism is not your deepest problem, just one symptom among several.
That said, if you resolve to stop drinking for six months and can't do it, then you know, off to AA you go, and come back when your sobriety is steady.
Or, actually, here is another thing I did. I went to a lot of open AA meetings to help clarify the issue for myself and when asked said, I am not sure if I am one of you, but there is alcoholism in my family and I have had horrible bad experiences under the influence and I am worried about my drinking. I think sober alcoholics in 12 step actually sorted it out quite quickly that I was not really an A, but they were totally nice and welcoming anyway.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Kialua
Most all of us have had to deal with our own drinking issues. I'm glad you can see that as well.
Just a side to your sentence quoted above. Anytime you are verbally abusive to your spouse, your child suffers. Not just sometimes or a little bit. The atmosphere created when the mother/father is disrespected sets the tone for the child. The child has to emotionally take sides, whether the child shows it or not. And he is being shown how to treat women by watching and hearing. You might want to take to heart this great phrase and let it guide you when you are discussing things with your wife:
One of the best things a father can do for his children is to respect their mother.*
Unfortunately I speak from experience. My husband and I were not always as kind to each other as we should have been, and unbeknownst to us our daughter suffered for it. So please don't think I am chastising you, just a heads up.
Just a side to your sentence quoted above. Anytime you are verbally abusive to your spouse, your child suffers. Not just sometimes or a little bit. The atmosphere created when the mother/father is disrespected sets the tone for the child. The child has to emotionally take sides, whether the child shows it or not. And he is being shown how to treat women by watching and hearing. You might want to take to heart this great phrase and let it guide you when you are discussing things with your wife:
One of the best things a father can do for his children is to respect their mother.*
Unfortunately I speak from experience. My husband and I were not always as kind to each other as we should have been, and unbeknownst to us our daughter suffered for it. So please don't think I am chastising you, just a heads up.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: it's complicated
Posts: 99
Oh, p. s. I think bullying of one sort or another pops up on ACoA 4th step inventories quite often. We half die of shame to face it that we were that person, but it is common and you are not alone in having to address verbal abuse.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Reedling
What did I do... ok, I took the advice I'm about to give you here, because I was struggling with similar questions, minus the child. And it is just my ESH, and thankfully there are a lot of people here so you can get other points of view.
It's ok to stop drinking for six months then reevaluate whether or not to drink at that point, because you aren't sure now if you should drink or not and you want to do the most careful thing. Six months of recovery work if you work it should put you in a much better position to figure out if you can have a beer with dinner or not.
Meanwhile work recovery on the ACA issues.
I'm not suggesting a deal where if you can endure as a dry drunk for six months without doing recovery, then after six months you get to start drinking again. (I have heard so many stories in AA meetings of alcoholics doing six months dry no problem because they had to for one reason or another-- and then right back into drinking not knowing how they got home or who they ran down on the way home.)
I think a lot of ACAs with recovery learn that there are times when they simply don't need to be drinking/shopping/dating/adopting yet another rescue puppy, because they are not fit to handle it spiritually or emotionally, often when family issues are flaring up... you can screw up your life pretty badly and still not earn a seat over at AA because alcoholism is not your deepest problem, just one symptom among several.
That said, if you resolve to stop drinking for six months and can't do it, then you know, off to AA you go, and come back when your sobriety is steady.
Or, actually, here is another thing I did. I went to a lot of open AA meetings to help clarify the issue for myself and when asked said, I am not sure if I am one of you, but there is alcoholism in my family and I have had horrible bad experiences under the influence and I am worried about my drinking. I think sober alcoholics in 12 step actually sorted it out quite quickly that I was not really an A, but they were totally nice and welcoming anyway.
It's ok to stop drinking for six months then reevaluate whether or not to drink at that point, because you aren't sure now if you should drink or not and you want to do the most careful thing. Six months of recovery work if you work it should put you in a much better position to figure out if you can have a beer with dinner or not.
Meanwhile work recovery on the ACA issues.
I'm not suggesting a deal where if you can endure as a dry drunk for six months without doing recovery, then after six months you get to start drinking again. (I have heard so many stories in AA meetings of alcoholics doing six months dry no problem because they had to for one reason or another-- and then right back into drinking not knowing how they got home or who they ran down on the way home.)
I think a lot of ACAs with recovery learn that there are times when they simply don't need to be drinking/shopping/dating/adopting yet another rescue puppy, because they are not fit to handle it spiritually or emotionally, often when family issues are flaring up... you can screw up your life pretty badly and still not earn a seat over at AA because alcoholism is not your deepest problem, just one symptom among several.
That said, if you resolve to stop drinking for six months and can't do it, then you know, off to AA you go, and come back when your sobriety is steady.
Or, actually, here is another thing I did. I went to a lot of open AA meetings to help clarify the issue for myself and when asked said, I am not sure if I am one of you, but there is alcoholism in my family and I have had horrible bad experiences under the influence and I am worried about my drinking. I think sober alcoholics in 12 step actually sorted it out quite quickly that I was not really an A, but they were totally nice and welcoming anyway.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
Originally Posted by deven
I am actually a Catholic convert, so I have learned something about dying to myself...just need to sort out how much of what I'm doing is dying to self and how much is co-dependency...not necessarily an easy task!)
Wow that is great insight! I don't know if I have determined that yet. What a great topic that would make for a book. You sir are further along than you think.
Dying to self always puts the other first but so does codependency. There is fine line to be walked there.
Marriage counseling is always a good idea and you can start in your church if they have any ideas or recommendations. Here is one book
Sacred Marriage
by Gary Thomas
Sacred Marriage by Gary Thomas | Barnes & Noble
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 24
Originally Posted by Kialua
Wow that is great insight! I don't know if I have determined that yet. What a great topic that would make for a book. You sir are further along than you think.
Dying to self always puts the other first but so does codependency. There is fine line to be walked there.
Marriage counseling is always a good idea and you can start in your church if they have any ideas or recommendations.
I do feel through my work as a Catholic Christian that I have addressed a number of the Steps already, but I know there is a lot more work to be done.
I think the trick is that I need to learn to make more time for my own spiritual growth by attending Mass, ACA meetings, retreats, and marital counseling. Right now I have gotten myself in the position of taking care of so much for my dyspraxic/ASD son AND my wife, who we have learned has dyspraxia, too.
The time I have for myself, I have typically used for brewing beer...and drinking it afterwards....
Member
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 923
Originally Posted by Kialua
Wow that is great insight! I don't know if I have determined that yet. What a great topic that would make for a book. You sir are further along than you think.
Dying to self always puts the other first but so does codependency. There is fine line to be walked there.
Marriage counseling is always a good idea and you can start in your church if they have any ideas or recommendations. Here is one book
Sacred Marriage
by Gary Thomas
Sacred Marriage by Gary Thomas | Barnes & Noble
I started to 'take care of myself' and went along determined to do better with my own kids...addiction hit...threw myself into their rehabs, work, whatever it took to 'take care of them'...and, ended up in bad shape again...although back and knew this time what it was...it is when the crisis overtakes me that I 'forget' myself and the eating and shopping and working to make me feel better from over-caretaking is awful.
Thanks for opening my eyes to more...I want more!
I am in the right place...and happy to be here...happy to know you all!
A few weeks ago...I hit a bottom due to a family crisis...and finally realized that if I don't help myself and take care of myself...there isn't anyone else. I love my husband and kids, although we have our problems...but me doing this for me is critical.
Member
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 1,437
irisgardens taking care of kids is really dying to self! ha ha. It is very hard raising children and it will deplete us if we don't have a way to fill up again and take care of ourselves. I had very little help raising kids besides my husband, no family of origin would lift a finger to even answer a phone call after I was practically their nanny for their kids. But it goes by fast and then it's all over. It's great that you two are both open to working on that balance.
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
