Codependent
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Join Date: Nov 2012
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no. some are counterdependent and push people away entirely.
not everyone who os codependent is so with an addict, many of the moms in my support group are with their special needs children, some people become so with their elderly parents.
I am not a professional, but I believe that addicts are attracted to codependents and vice versa simply because sick attracts sick and healthy attracts healthy.
I wonder if it is easier for a mother of an addict to become codie for thier child.
I find it ironic, that god, knowing I was a codie, gave me a special ed son...
just my two cents
not everyone who os codependent is so with an addict, many of the moms in my support group are with their special needs children, some people become so with their elderly parents.
I am not a professional, but I believe that addicts are attracted to codependents and vice versa simply because sick attracts sick and healthy attracts healthy.
I wonder if it is easier for a mother of an addict to become codie for thier child.
I find it ironic, that god, knowing I was a codie, gave me a special ed son...
just my two cents
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Join Date: Apr 2013
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No. I think some learned codependent traits as children. Some became codependent in prior relationships. Some are situationally codependent. Some demonstrate occasional codependent behaviors. And few (3 or 4) were healthy enough to avoid codependency alltogether. IMO, I think being in a close relationship with an addict brings about unhealthy thinking that often turns to codependency.
I also think many wrongly associate codependency with weakness or stupidity, of which it is neither. Ironically, those that fight the "label" the most are those whose thinking and words appear the most unhealthy.
I also think many wrongly associate codependency with weakness or stupidity, of which it is neither. Ironically, those that fight the "label" the most are those whose thinking and words appear the most unhealthy.
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After taking a course/class on codependency, I have to agree with the instructor that most people have traits unless they are narcissistic or anti social.
I think it can become magnified when dealing with an addict, if you do not have the education or knowledge of what addiction is.
I think it can become magnified when dealing with an addict, if you do not have the education or knowledge of what addiction is.
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I was watching Dr. Drew the other night on HLN to hear the latest on the Jodi Arias case. He cracked me up when kept referring to himself as codependent.
I could take or leave him but I found it interesting because of his association with celebrity rehabs. I hope he is working a recovery too.
I could take or leave him but I found it interesting because of his association with celebrity rehabs. I hope he is working a recovery too.
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Join Date: May 2012
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The short answer is NO. Early on codependency became linked with family members of alcoholics, and I think therefore, the 12 step programs. Ive read it was also tied in with enabling behaviors, and the idea family members enabled because they were codependent and had a need to “help” or “control”. But in my opinion even that idea is open for personal opinion and interpretation.
Being involved with someone who has an addiction does not mean you are automatically codependent. One thing is drug addiction is progressive. In early stages, there may not be significant impact on family members. There are many functional users who keep a low profile with their use. Family members may not become obsessive over their loves ones drug use, or be on the receiving end of poor treatment.
Codependency is a serious problem no doubt, but it has also become big business, with therapy being offered, rows of books on the subject. These days, almost everyone can make a case for a situation where codependency might exist, even outside of addiction.
I also think it's very subjective to personal opinion. If a person is a codependent then they may be more likely to believe they see characteristics in another person, compare it to their feelings, their situation, what they thought, what they experienced. And then following along with the concept of codependency being a form of addiction; if people deny being a codependent then some believe the person is only in denial of their codependency. Then pressure can mount to convince the person they are truly codependent. And in my opinion, that behavior circles back to being codependent also.
Personally I think lots of people have codependent tendencies from time to time. Certain situations can bring it out. But I think true codependency only occurs when it is a chronic problem, often defined by a series of dysfunctional relationships, and often has symptoms starting in childhood. And then like other addictions I think it is progressive unless a person becomes aware and works on their own relationship with self.
Being involved with someone who has an addiction does not mean you are automatically codependent. One thing is drug addiction is progressive. In early stages, there may not be significant impact on family members. There are many functional users who keep a low profile with their use. Family members may not become obsessive over their loves ones drug use, or be on the receiving end of poor treatment.
Codependency is a serious problem no doubt, but it has also become big business, with therapy being offered, rows of books on the subject. These days, almost everyone can make a case for a situation where codependency might exist, even outside of addiction.
I also think it's very subjective to personal opinion. If a person is a codependent then they may be more likely to believe they see characteristics in another person, compare it to their feelings, their situation, what they thought, what they experienced. And then following along with the concept of codependency being a form of addiction; if people deny being a codependent then some believe the person is only in denial of their codependency. Then pressure can mount to convince the person they are truly codependent. And in my opinion, that behavior circles back to being codependent also.
Personally I think lots of people have codependent tendencies from time to time. Certain situations can bring it out. But I think true codependency only occurs when it is a chronic problem, often defined by a series of dysfunctional relationships, and often has symptoms starting in childhood. And then like other addictions I think it is progressive unless a person becomes aware and works on their own relationship with self.
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Originally Posted by cynical one 
I also think many wrongly associate codependency with weakness or stupidity, of which it is neither. Ironically, those that fight the "label" the most are those whose thinking and words appear the most unhealthy.
Also, although I found some of my codependent behaviors unacceptable - in hindsight, I have found working on me and the personal growth that accompanies it to be amazing. I almost feel sorry for those who never have that opportunity.
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Join Date: Mar 2010
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I think many people may not start off as co-dependent, but become more and more so as the addiction continue. If the addict is demanding more and more and accuses the loved ones of not loving and caring about them, it is difficult for many people to not give in at least initially. Having said that, I think one has to be predisposed to it.
I watched a lot of Intervention Canada episodes on Youtube this last week and there seems to be at least one very co-dependent person in each of those addicts lives. It shocked me to see how dads gave their daughters money for drugs to keep them from prostitution and how mothers would do the same to keep their boys close to them. It showed how bad co-dependency really is. I also found it interesting that the majority of addicts agreed to go for treatment because everyone in their lives made it clear that they would not enable them any longer.
I was a co-dependent long before my son became addicted. I almost always put my needs after that of every one else. I was very keen to please others, keep them happy, concentrate on doing whatever I could to make their lives easier. I sometimes think co-dependency is empathy run amok. It was not a happy life as there was no time or energy for me. No wonder I was always exhausted, carrying the problems of so many with me day after day.
Thankfully I am not that person anymore. I am still very attuned to the feelings of others, but I simply leave their problems with them and do not take it on as if it is my own. This does not mean I will not help someone, but when I offer help, I comes from a place of clarity as opposed to a place of guilt or lack of self-worth.
So no, not everyone who has an addict in their life is co-dependent, but it seems as if most addicts do have a couple of co-dependents in their life.
I watched a lot of Intervention Canada episodes on Youtube this last week and there seems to be at least one very co-dependent person in each of those addicts lives. It shocked me to see how dads gave their daughters money for drugs to keep them from prostitution and how mothers would do the same to keep their boys close to them. It showed how bad co-dependency really is. I also found it interesting that the majority of addicts agreed to go for treatment because everyone in their lives made it clear that they would not enable them any longer.
I was a co-dependent long before my son became addicted. I almost always put my needs after that of every one else. I was very keen to please others, keep them happy, concentrate on doing whatever I could to make their lives easier. I sometimes think co-dependency is empathy run amok. It was not a happy life as there was no time or energy for me. No wonder I was always exhausted, carrying the problems of so many with me day after day.
Thankfully I am not that person anymore. I am still very attuned to the feelings of others, but I simply leave their problems with them and do not take it on as if it is my own. This does not mean I will not help someone, but when I offer help, I comes from a place of clarity as opposed to a place of guilt or lack of self-worth.
So no, not everyone who has an addict in their life is co-dependent, but it seems as if most addicts do have a couple of co-dependents in their life.
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Join Date: May 2013
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I am working on myself and my codependency issues. I'm reading the books, have a counselor and have attended some meetings and love SR.
Having said that, I was talking with a psychiatrist who helps me with my bipolar disorder. This psychiatrist is in private practice and works with a lot of addicts and their families. When I told her I was doing all the codependency stuff she said yes, it is important but also it is important to know caring for another is also part of being human and thank God their are people on this earth who are able to empathize and care about others. I got what she was saying and liked it. Kind of like if you take something to an extreme that it is harmful then it is a problem. Sort of like if you can go out and have a glass of wine or beer every so often with friends and know when to quit and don't drink or drive you are good. If you need to go get trashed and drink and drive and it effects family and work responsibilities it is a problem to be addressed. Not all drinking is an issue. I got it. I still want to be a deeply caring, empathetic human but I don't want to go whole hog into unhealthy relationships to the point that it causes me pain, loss of self, or to behave in unhealthy ways. Unlike the drug addict or alcoholic I don't need to completely cease being empathetic, loving, caring and sometimes helpful. That is where I'm at with this right now.
Having said that, I was talking with a psychiatrist who helps me with my bipolar disorder. This psychiatrist is in private practice and works with a lot of addicts and their families. When I told her I was doing all the codependency stuff she said yes, it is important but also it is important to know caring for another is also part of being human and thank God their are people on this earth who are able to empathize and care about others. I got what she was saying and liked it. Kind of like if you take something to an extreme that it is harmful then it is a problem. Sort of like if you can go out and have a glass of wine or beer every so often with friends and know when to quit and don't drink or drive you are good. If you need to go get trashed and drink and drive and it effects family and work responsibilities it is a problem to be addressed. Not all drinking is an issue. I got it. I still want to be a deeply caring, empathetic human but I don't want to go whole hog into unhealthy relationships to the point that it causes me pain, loss of self, or to behave in unhealthy ways. Unlike the drug addict or alcoholic I don't need to completely cease being empathetic, loving, caring and sometimes helpful. That is where I'm at with this right now.
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Join Date: May 2013
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"Thankfully I am not that person anymore. I am still very attuned to the feelings of others, but I simply leave their problems with them and do not take it on as if it is my own. This does not mean I will not help someone, but when I offer help, I comes from a place of clarity as opposed to a place of guilt or lack of self-worth."
Well put. Agree. Thank you!
Well put. Agree. Thank you!
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 154
Well the reason I ask is because I got defensive when everyone kept telling me I was codependent. I can tell you that I WAS very much so with my ex husband and idk when we got divorced its like a light went off and I refused to be like that again. So now I'm in a relationship with an addict in recovery and we've been together almost a year and I just don't display those codependent tendencies. At first when I found out about his addiction I did but then once someone said hey your getting a little codependent. I snapped right back out of it. We have such a great relationship. We communicate well. We are a team. We make decisions together. Through his first and last relapse we've become stronger and our bond has grown. We talk about everything. He teaches me about addictions and involves me in his steps. Although he's not actively using when he was he never treated me how some addicts treat their loved ones I've seen around here. So idk. Not that I'm special or anything but he knows and understands if he doesn't continue the steps and continue living sober that I'm gone. That's my choice. Not given him an ultimatum.
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No. Not everyone who has an addict in their life is codependent. My husband is not and my daughter is not, yet I am. We all share the same addict. lol
Addiction is big business. REALLY big business.
Unfortunately, just as some people associate addiction with a broken moral compass and weakness......some people associate codependency with ignorance or weakness. In both cases nothing could be further from the truth.
Being codependence is nothing to be ashamed of......just as addiction is nothing to be ashamed of.....it is what it is and it can be dealt with......just like addiction. I won't "accuse" anyone of being codependent but I freely admit that I am. When we make the suggestion that people read "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie, that is not an accusation....it is a suggestion so that they can make a self assessment and begin to take control of behaviors that can be absolutely toxic for the addict and themselves.
gentle hugs
ke
Codependency is a serious problem no doubt, but it has also become big business, with therapy being offered, rows of books on the subject. These days, almost everyone can make a case for a situation where codependency might exist, even outside of addiction.
I also think many wrongly associate codependency with weakness or stupidity, of which it is neither. Ironically, those that fight the "label" the most are those whose thinking and words appear the most unhealthy.
Being codependence is nothing to be ashamed of......just as addiction is nothing to be ashamed of.....it is what it is and it can be dealt with......just like addiction. I won't "accuse" anyone of being codependent but I freely admit that I am. When we make the suggestion that people read "Codependent No More" by Melody Beattie, that is not an accusation....it is a suggestion so that they can make a self assessment and begin to take control of behaviors that can be absolutely toxic for the addict and themselves.
gentle hugs
ke
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Well I will expand on Anvil's post. She is a very wise woman.
You have miles and jail bars between you. He has limited if no access to his DOC.
How about you tell us how its going AFTER y'all have been actually living together 24/7 for a while, facing all the vicissitudes of life every day. How he handles the 'stress' of finding a job so that he can be 'self supporting through his own contributions.' How you both handle the stress of the 'little irritants that arise from living 24/7. How he is 'working a program' of recovery for him and how you are working one also.
Right now, of course, you are getting along, you have DISTANCE.
I don't say this to be mean or hurtful, neither does Anvil, but it is out of our own experiences both for ourselves and others I have worked with. Things most of the time seem to go down hill, sometimes rapidly and sometimes more slowly after the A gets out of jail.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
You have miles and jail bars between you. He has limited if no access to his DOC.
How about you tell us how its going AFTER y'all have been actually living together 24/7 for a while, facing all the vicissitudes of life every day. How he handles the 'stress' of finding a job so that he can be 'self supporting through his own contributions.' How you both handle the stress of the 'little irritants that arise from living 24/7. How he is 'working a program' of recovery for him and how you are working one also.
Right now, of course, you are getting along, you have DISTANCE.
I don't say this to be mean or hurtful, neither does Anvil, but it is out of our own experiences both for ourselves and others I have worked with. Things most of the time seem to go down hill, sometimes rapidly and sometimes more slowly after the A gets out of jail.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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IMO, codependency is a fairly untouched field and not big business at all. In fact, I often joke about how I wish insurance companies would pay for a cushy 60-90 day rehab for codependency.
Wouldn't that be a hoot with many of us there. Oh, the thought of it has me laughing out loud.
Ann handing out cheesecake with her bunny slippers, Kindeyes giving out gentle hugs, Anvil and Cynical calling us out on our BS, Laurie just rofl, lily being our DJ, to name a few. Lol
Wouldn't that be a hoot with many of us there. Oh, the thought of it has me laughing out loud.
Ann handing out cheesecake with her bunny slippers, Kindeyes giving out gentle hugs, Anvil and Cynical calling us out on our BS, Laurie just rofl, lily being our DJ, to name a few. Lol
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Join Date: Nov 2012
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Originally Posted by laurie6781
Well I will expand on Anvil's post. She is a very wise woman.
You have miles and jail bars between you. He has limited if no access to his DOC.
How about you tell us how its going AFTER y'all have been actually living together 24/7 for a while, facing all the vicissitudes of life every day. How he handles the 'stress' of finding a job so that he can be 'self supporting through his own contributions.' How you both handle the stress of the 'little irritants that arise from living 24/7. How he is 'working a program' of recovery for him and how you are working one also.
Right now, of course, you are getting along, you have DISTANCE.
I don't say this to be mean or hurtful, neither does Anvil, but it is out of our own experiences both for ourselves and others I have worked with. Things most of the time seem to go down hill, sometimes rapidly and sometimes more slowly after the A gets out of jail.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
You have miles and jail bars between you. He has limited if no access to his DOC.
How about you tell us how its going AFTER y'all have been actually living together 24/7 for a while, facing all the vicissitudes of life every day. How he handles the 'stress' of finding a job so that he can be 'self supporting through his own contributions.' How you both handle the stress of the 'little irritants that arise from living 24/7. How he is 'working a program' of recovery for him and how you are working one also.
Right now, of course, you are getting along, you have DISTANCE.
I don't say this to be mean or hurtful, neither does Anvil, but it is out of our own experiences both for ourselves and others I have worked with. Things most of the time seem to go down hill, sometimes rapidly and sometimes more slowly after the A gets out of jail.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
we saw each other once a week. wrote letters so we communicated often, but you are right.
there were no arguments over spilt milk or dealing with life on lifes terms because if the milk was spilled on either side of The street then the other did not know about it.
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Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 1,618
Originally Posted by LoveMeNow
IMO, codependency is a fairly untouched field and not big business at all. In fact, I often joke about how I wish insurance companies would pay for a cushy 60-90 day rehab for codependency.
Wouldn't that be a hoot with many of us there. Oh, the thought of it has me laughing out loud.
Ann handing out cheesecake with her bunny slippers, Kindeyes giving out gentle hugs, Anvil and Cynical calling us out on our BS, Laurie just rofl, lily being our DJ, to name a few. Lol
Wouldn't that be a hoot with many of us there. Oh, the thought of it has me laughing out loud.
Ann handing out cheesecake with her bunny slippers, Kindeyes giving out gentle hugs, Anvil and Cynical calling us out on our BS, Laurie just rofl, lily being our DJ, to name a few. Lol
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 924
I think that there is a huge tendency to want to resist labels...and people often suffer as a result. Like most life issues people have there are a lot of human beings on each continuum...I consider myself, for example, on an Attention Deficit continuum.
Codependency can be seen quite basic and simply as being in relationship with someone who is dependent on a substance. And, like a few intimated above, the more seriously dependent on a substance that loved one becomes the more enmeshed we can become in that dependency...thus "co". AND like the substance abuser or addict...the CO person can suffer mirror image delusion, denial, frustration, depression, isolation, anger, grandiosity...etc., etc., etc. There is a plethera of symptoms that worsening addiction and codependency "displays".
For example...when my ex went to jail (which is pretty reliable red-flag symptom of addiction...not recovery) I was actually somewhat relieved because I thought "at least it was clean time" not to be confused with recovery...even though he called with promises of recovery. My being relieved that the man I loved was in jail, and mistaking it as "clean time" and the "beginning of recovery" is a classic mirror image of how addiction and codependency inter-relate.
Dysfunction.
A normal healthy relationship does not function when one member is in jail.
Codependency can be seen quite basic and simply as being in relationship with someone who is dependent on a substance. And, like a few intimated above, the more seriously dependent on a substance that loved one becomes the more enmeshed we can become in that dependency...thus "co". AND like the substance abuser or addict...the CO person can suffer mirror image delusion, denial, frustration, depression, isolation, anger, grandiosity...etc., etc., etc. There is a plethera of symptoms that worsening addiction and codependency "displays".
For example...when my ex went to jail (which is pretty reliable red-flag symptom of addiction...not recovery) I was actually somewhat relieved because I thought "at least it was clean time" not to be confused with recovery...even though he called with promises of recovery. My being relieved that the man I loved was in jail, and mistaking it as "clean time" and the "beginning of recovery" is a classic mirror image of how addiction and codependency inter-relate.
Dysfunction.
A normal healthy relationship does not function when one member is in jail.
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Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Minneapolis
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BTW...
fashion is big business
the diet industry is huge
bottled water is a mega biz
movies?
lawn products?
home improvement...
sports...don't even go there!
if something is "big business" it probably just illustrates that there is a need or want for it
those who are too self reliant, or want to be too unique to admit that they might have some small part of their beautiful, vulnerable, humanity to have something in common with millions of other human beings...well, god bless their closed off, or shutting down, heart and soul.
fashion is big business
the diet industry is huge
bottled water is a mega biz
movies?
lawn products?
home improvement...
sports...don't even go there!
if something is "big business" it probably just illustrates that there is a need or want for it
those who are too self reliant, or want to be too unique to admit that they might have some small part of their beautiful, vulnerable, humanity to have something in common with millions of other human beings...well, god bless their closed off, or shutting down, heart and soul.
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