Blackbear62

I am new to this forum. I have found myself in a situation that I wish I could run from but there is a part of me that says my AGF wants my assistance and help. Background: She has been charged with DUIs x 3 and now sits in jail serving out her time due to 2nd violation of probation. When we first met, she was sober or at least appeared to be and she was looking for a place to stay. Some friends of mine had a spare "mother-in-law" cottage that was just collecting dust so they offered her the place. She told us how she had been charged with DUI and the last one she actually hit another vehicle so she needed to pay off the fines. We suggested that she take her paychecks and pay off the fines rather than do community service which would take nearly a year to complete. She said "No, I got a plan". Well, she missed a few days at community service and ended up in jail. Judge said, " You seem to be a hard working individual, I will release you and you pay the fine." She agreed but within a couple of months she lost her job. She had gone back to drinking. She told us that she was not an alcoholic because she did not fit the profile. According to her, even a therapist stated that she did not fit the profile. I noticed that she drank when things worried her. She did not drink just a couple of shots, she drank the whole bottle. I mentioned that was a sign of an alcoholic. She disagreed. She said that she was not an alcoholic because she only drank when she was worried or upset. Actually she only drank when I mistakingly brought home a bottle because I occasionally like a couple of drinks. (seriously only a couple). I have not been with a person that drinks the whole bottle and then places the empty bottle back on the shelf. I think I have liquor when in reality I don't which makes me angry. So naturally, I would only get a single of whatever liquor I desired that month and drink it while she was asleep. Very frustrating, Anyhow, she is now in jail because she could not pay the fine and the judge did not look favorable on the situation. I visit her as often as allowed but she remains in denial about her alcoholism and it worries me. Before she had gone to jail, she had mentioned that she wanted to go to AA meetings but not alone and wanted me to go with her. I was reluntant because I am not the one with an alcholol problem. I am though a friend of an alcoholic whether she admits it or not. I do realize that Al-Anon meetings will be beneficial for me in other ways because I do tend to be a fixer and I have been the adjuster in this friendship. I found myself trying not to upset her so she would not drink but something always came up and she would be gone most of the night. I was not as worried except she has not learned her lesson about not driving after she drinks. I had loaned her my car for job interviews. Maybe not the smartest move on my part but I did try to trust her. She failed that trust she showed up at my work place to pick me up intoxicated (TWICE). I could not believe it. First one shame on her, second time shame on me. There is not a third chance. I am looking for support to be the person I need to be in this relationship without overstepping my boundaries. I know that I will give in easily and that sometimes I need a reality check. I feel like I already made an error when I told her that she had to quit alcohol or find another place. She told me to read the Blue AA book and it would tell me how to react appropriately to her drinking. I told her that alcoholism was like emphysema. Alcoholics don't need to drink and people with emphysema don't need to smoke. She was not impressed. So, here I am frustrated and angry because I swore to myself that I would never be friends with an alcoholic. They just can't be trusted. And I am friends with an alcoholic. When she is sober, she is so hard working and she bearly sits still it is a wonder she even sleeps. When she drinks, she is drunk, passed out, with more harm to her body than she ever imagined. I have found her in the bathroom passed out near the toilet, in the tub laying on top of the shower curtain, and in bed. She throws up sometimes and other times she may wet the bed. Thank God she sleeps on a cot. I just don't want her to return to the way she was before jail. Was I wrong to ask her to give up alcohol or leave? Is there another way I can tell her what my expectations are? I am no angel and I do have my faults but I don't like having to hide my alcohol because she has a problem. It is like serving two meals because someone is on a diet and hiding all the sweets from a diabetic. Any advice would be helpful.

redatlanta

I am a little confused is she your friend or your girlfriend?

No you weren't wrong to ask her to leave if she didn't stop drinking. Its called a boundary and the purpose of them is for you and not for her. If she stopped drinking that would be great but most don't. The statement means "I can't tolerate living with you drinking". If you have said it the best and kindest thing you can do for her is MEAN IT - and no longer continue to live with her. When you set a boundary and don't enforce it you are doing a huge disservice to the alcoholic and an even bigger one to yourself.

Unfortunately you cannot make her stop. It sounds that she is deep in her addiction and that her mentions of attending AA are nothing more than to placate you, and hope that you will continue to be a codependent and enable her drinking.

Its such a sad thing - the best advice I can give you is to run as far away from this situation as you can. You can't cure it, you didn't cause it and you can't control it.

Check out Al Anon - its a lifesaver. So sorry for what is happening and welcome to the forum.

AnvilheadII

sounds like she's HAD tons of CHANCES and isn't really interested in turning those into CHANGES.

MsPINKAcres

Welcome to our SR family

I hate so much that you have a dear friend affected by this awful disease - it is heartbreaking to watch someone you care for deeply continue to make unhealthy choices concerning their drinking.

What I have learned in my recovery journey is the best thing I can do to help them is to learn how to take care of me and allow them the dignity, self-respect and ability to find their own way.

It's not easy, but it is the most respectful - and everyone deserves love and respect.

Keep coming back, read the stickies at the top of our forum and if you can read some recovery literature, attend some al-anon meetings - I know for me - these things are great at helping me set boundaries and keep recovery focused in my life

pink hugs

marie1960

"I have found myself in a situation." (Blackbear)

Blackbear, I have walked in your shoes. I used to be in a "situation" also. Sorry to say it's not a situation , it's a CHOICE. You are choosing to be involved with this person. She has shown you who she is and you refusing to believe her.

You my friend, are in denial.

She's in Jail for the third time, she passes out all over the place, wets the bed, drives drunk, you hide your liquor from her, and you are questioning if there is a problem? Her actions are quite clear to me.

Educating myself about addiction changed my life. I was so very ignorant and had no idea what I was up against. You have free will and the choice remains yours, but from personal experience, the best I can offer........... CUT YOUR TIES AND RUN.

There is absolutely nothing you can do to help her. Don't fool yourself, we truly are powerless. If you truly want to help, step back and allow her the dignity to address her own needs.

Blackbear62

Thanks for responding so quickly. I appreciate all of your replies now I just have to be strong enough to stand my ground. According to her parents, she has worn out her welcome in several places. Her family are all alcoholics and she knows this but has problem with stating she too is an alcoholic. Her aunt stated that the only way they have managed is no alcohol in the house. She has told me that if she has to she will go back to living in a tent. Well, that is where my weakness comes in and YES she will and has lived and in a tent. It is not an idle threat but it does play on my heart strings. I hate to see anyone live in a tent it is just not that healthy. But neither is being an alcoholic. I go camping in tents there are outhouses but to camp in some woods and dig a hole to void in and eat with those same hands is ..... Sigh. Right now she is in the right place for both of us. She can stay sober and hopefully admit she wants a different life and I can learn to be stronger and stand my ground.

Cyranoak

expectations are just future resentments. alcoholics won't meet them anyways, nor should they. we aren't their parents, and they aren't children even if they are acting like it.

your job is to take care of you, and remove yourself from situations that are unacceptable to you. it's HER job to take care of herself, and to meet them for herself.

please consider trying a few alanon meetings.

good luck!

Cyranoak

Blackbear62

I have looked up the al Amon meetings in my area just need to go to one. I tend to procrastinate about some things. I also hope to purchase two books I saw posted on another thread about codependency. I will keep reading and update as I continue to learn how to live and let go.

CeciliaV

I don't think you were wrong to ask her to quit drinking or leave. And maybe it's just semantics, but this is not an expectation, but a boundary. And boundaries made for you, about you, and by you are healthy. It's not healthy to live with an active alcoholic. It's crazy-making, or at least that's what my experience has been. It's sad to see someone you care about devolve, but it's sadder to watch yourself devolve in the process. I've lost so much of myself living with my A. What little balance, self-confidence, and focus on myself I had before this spiraling roller coaster have been whittled away. I'm working to build myself back up again.

You can continue to set your boundaries, but not with words - with actions. TOUGH lesson, I'm still working on this one myself. She has made many decisions that have landed her in the situation she is in. She must carry the burden of the consequences of her choices and actions, even if it means spending time in jail.

I'm curious - what type of help is she asking of you? Is it more than attending AA meetings with her when she gets out of jail? I'm not sure that would be healthy for you to do that. You would likely benefit more from attending a meeting geared for those who have a loved one/significant other who is an alcoholic than you would from an open AA meeting.

I think you really need to ask yourself some hard questions here. Like whether you want her in your life and whether you're willing to deal with the struggles that come along with having an A in your life. Not trying to be a downer here, but just trying to be honest - it's a hard, hard thing. And I don't know if it's the codie in me, but if you DO want to have her in your life and you accept the possibly high emotional costs, the closest I would get to helping her at this point would be to find someplace that has an AA & an Al Anon meeting at the same time...again...probably the codie in me wanting to help out, but if you're getting something out of it, then maybe it's a little less codie? (Ugh, I'm still learning...I'm sure one of the other folks who's further along in their recovery will have better advice than me!)

You don't have to make the decision whether to cut or not cut ties today. It's okay to sit on it, to think. Either way, whatever you decide on whether you want to have her in your life, just be sure to work on YOU. We go through so much as F&F of A's, and it's easy to get lost in the mix. Find you and your joy.

wicked

So, Blackbear62, you find yourself here at Sober Recovery.
I hope you avail yourself of all the information available here. What you learn will be invaluable if you continue to have a relationship with an alcoholic.

I am a recovering alcoholic. Out of all the things you describe that she does, the thing that tears at your heartstrings is the possibility of her living in a tent?
She drives despite having DUI's? (others lives are at stake)
She vomits and falls asleep around the toilet or falls in the tub? (her life at stake, aspirating vomit, knocking herself out)
She wets the bed? (destroying other people's property)

Do you think it is possible she tells you she is going to live in a tent because she knows you do not want that to happen? It is springtime in Georgia, she is definitely not going to be cold. You are concerned she would eat with the hands that she voids with?
This is a perfect example of not seeing the forest for the trees.
I must agree that you are in denial.
Your friend has a very serious problem with alcohol. She takes chances with her life and the lives of others in order to keep drinking.

Please, Blackbear, get out of her way. You seem like a nice caring person. As an alcoholic myself, I can tell you that alcohol ruins nice caring people. It will destroy you.

You are not the one who needs to read the Big Book. This would be funny if it weren't so incredibly sad. Save yourself Blackbear.

Beth

wicked

Well, it looks like while I was typing my long response, you have already started working on yourself.
Excellent!

Beth

Recovering2

This is a progressive disease, she will only get worse if she remains in denial. And as long as there are people around her who enable her behavior, she can remain in denial. We all mean well, but when we continue to provide a place to live, a car to drive, etc...we are enabling. Until we get out of the way and let the A experience the natural consequences of their disease, there isn't a lot of hope.

You didn't Cause it, can't Cure it, and can't Control it. But you can seek a healthy life for yourself. She is in jail now? NOW is the time to set boundaries for yourself. IMO, this would include letting her know she needs to make other living arrangements when she is released. If she chooses a tent, as an adult, she has the right to make that choice. Don't get in her way deciding that YOU are not comfortable with that...it's her choice just like it's her choice to drink.

Go to an AlAnon meeting, read "Co Dependent No More" by Melody Beattie. Learn to set healthy boundaries for you.

I have to agree her comment about you needing to read the Big Book floored me! She's in denial about being an Alcoholic, but she's preaching about the Big Book to you??? That's crazy.

Blackbear62

Thanks for all your input. I did see that there were some AA and alanon meetings at the same time. I did realize that AA is not where I need to meet but she does. She had hinted that I probably should move on with my life and forget about our friendship. I am just insecure enough to think jail would make her realize the err of her ways I realize that as much as I hate to admit it ya"ll are probably right. I just wish that such a young, ambitious woman would find better things to do than drink her life away. But I need to learn I didn't cause I can't cure and I definitely can't control it.

redatlanta

"She has told me that if she has to she will go back to living in a tent."

AKA - "I will do whatever it takes to keep drinking even it means being homeless because alcohol is the most important thing in my life"

Please believe her.

BlueSkies1

My cousin lived in a tent for a year. He liked it. Walked the Appalachian trail. Who am I to say that living in a tent is a bad thing for somebody else?
Widened my view. Acceptable to me is not the same as acceptable to somebody else. So, my understanding now is, living in a tent isn't all that horrible. People do it all the time. People in third world countries do it for years. They survive. Heh...she might too! If she wants to live in a tent, who are we to tell her not to?

Hinting that you should move on and forget about your friendship. Hmm...a little reverse psychology to pull further at those heartstrings.

Blackbear62

Blue skies thanks for helping me to step outside the box and remind me that normal for one may be abnormal for another.

Justfor1

She has had 3 DUI's & she still does not think she is a alcoholic. States are cracking down on drunken driving with mandatory "community service" for the third or even the second DUI arrest. It sounds as if she is in the middle or even late stages of alcoholism. "Wetting the bed" is not a good sign & shows her body is no longer processing alcohol the way its suppose to.

Blackbear62

Well I visited her in jail today and menti