lil'bit

How much can a marriage grow and improve if the A is still actively drinking? Prodigal posted a similar question earlier, and it was exactly what has been on my mind these last 2 days. My H mentioned last night that he felt us growing apart -- this is true. I have been doing my darndest to detach healthily, but sometimes it ends up being me just shutting down. I've been under a tremendous amount of stress at work, and then I come home to him drinking -- sometimes it is okay, sometimes it is just too much to handle, so I go off in my own world.

So, H wants us to work on the relationship -- I'm afraid that there isn't too much we can do to make it better unless he enters recovery... am I right? Wrong? He's in denial still, though edging toward acknowledging the problem, I think. We haven't had sex in over a month, largely because he is usually either drunk (in the evening) or smelling of booze (weekend mornings), both of which turn me away.

Would it be completely futile to go into marriage counseling? I know some of this was already addressed on Prodigal's post, but I need to hear it again, I think. Maybe I just need a hug, or someone to listen to me....

smoke gets in my eyes

((( lil'bit! )))

There are lots of ways a living situation can get better, even if the drinker still drinks. Letting go doesn't have to mean shutting down, but that's how a lot of us have to start, just to get a little momentum going. Letting go takes time to really settle on you. That said, some people are satisfied to have a roommate instead of a lover. That call is yours. If you can't stand to be close to someone who reeks of alcohol, you can't. And that's a boundary. You don't have to.

Hugs!
Smoke

best

marriage counseling could be a tool that opens his eyes to the drinking being a problem.
Your not enjoying it makes it a problem in the marriage.
I see much hope in your post... "he" is asking to work on things. That could be a sign of him finding a open mind to what needs be done.

sunflowergal29

Hi, Lil'bit! I had a huge problem understanding how this was possible, and through my own journey in my recovery, it is slowly becoming clearer. I used to think that in order for my relationship to work, we'd both need to be doing the same thing- that being in recovery. JT's analogy of the "just for today, the good outweighs the bad" is a great start- this helped me out more than I can say and still does. My h is still not doing the actual recovery bit- he believes he has a problem, makes a decision to quit, then after a while he somehow gets convinced once again that he can drink like a "normal" person. By working step 1, I have learned to accept that I don't know what is good for him, that it isn't up to me to decide if he has hit his bottom with it, and what kind of "recovery" he needs. He doesn't believe that AA is the right route for him and counselling is not something he is willing to do at this point in his life. Today that is fine with me. I was in the program for 2 years (9 yrs ago) and no matter what I did then, I couldn't grasp how it would ever work without my husband (at that time)working a recovery program and being on the same wavelength as me. Anyways, I think it does get easier through working the steps and putting the focus on me. If you ask yourself what kind of a man he is minus the booze, you might get your answer more clearly.
Sorry for rambling, didn't mean for this to be so long!!
SFG29

Also, the more I realize that I can't depend on my spouse to make me happy, the better I feel. I have created my own contentment, and usually am doing alright now. But again, this is 9 years after I originally began the program. realized this until this time around

prodigal

I'm going to try the marriage counseling route next week with my AH. In the meantime, I see a counselor who specializes in addictions and codependency on an individual basis. The problem with marriage counseling you may encounter is that once you bring up your H's drinking, the counselor may very well say he won't continue any therapy with the two of you until your H quits picking up. At least that's the info. I've gotten from my counselor and a psychiatrist. I know during our initial counseling session I'm not going to hold back about how my H's drinking has put a strain on our marriage.

I don't have sex with my H if I can avoid it. He doesn't like that, but tough for him. I won't allow a drunk to paw and grope at me because it's a turn-off. Also, I don't want a man to make love to me that needs to get a jump-start with a few shots of Scotch before he can get in the mood.

Growth is possible - for you. How much growth your H decides to pursue is up to him. I'm certainly not one who can give you the best advice, particularly since I oftentimes don't follow the very advice I dish out!! But it sounds like your situation is moving in a positive direction.

Keep the faith, ask your Higher Power for divine guidance and peace of mind. Hugs to you ....

Blondie

I started counseling on my own and then finally told my AH what I was doing. He decided to come along and do the "counseling thing" with me in order to help our marriage. He lasted one session and said the counselor was the nut and that he (my husband) did not have a problem with depression or alcohol, etc, etc, etc. Though he stopped I kept going to counseling (which he tried to sabotage every chance he got). I kept going because I knew that that was the only way back to sanity for me. I've matured quite a bit in the last few years because of the counseling and my mind is much clearer. Our marriage, however, is still the same as it was. It seems time has stood still for my husband, I've changed, but he hasn't. In my situation, we couldn't work on our marriage because our biggest problem was not being addressed (I got help and he didn't). Is it just me or do alcoholics never mature into full adulthood and seem to be stuck in some kind of strange immature teenage state?

Lorelai

I don't know if this is off topic but I have found in my recovery that I have learned to look at the drinking and the marriage two separate things. Before, everything revolved around the drinking - that was the only problem. If only he would quit drinking, we would live happily ever after.

As I've been going through my recovery, I can more clearly see that, while the drinking has definately affected the other aspects of our marriage, it is not the only issue I have to deal with.

I can't see how marriage counseling would hurt. I think it is difficult to work on other aspects of your marriage while your H is drinking but I've learned to say that nothing is impossible.

Please don't let him convince you that the work you are doing on yourself is not important. Your marriage is important but you are important too.
L

hopeful0621

I've had some experience with this recently. My A and I broke up due to his drinking (I called the police to have him removed from the house the last time he came home very drunk - we have 2 little children). He left us, decided he could not live without us, then came back and suggested couples counseling. I found out at the first session that his objective was to expose my obsession with those who drink and my crusade to stop them. Instead what occurred was that he heard himself and actually listened to the counselor, who told him if it was a problem for me than it was a problem for our relationship. She told me I needed to be very clear about what would occur if he kept drinking. I told him I will leave with the children (which I will). He refused to quit at the session, we came home and I proceeded to start the process of leaving him. He then decided he would quit. The next session, we talk about how much better the relationship has been with him not drinking, him doing it without AA (which he is currently) and how he has changed his life and habits to not drink. I know many people think we don't have a chance of this holding up, but it's working right now, and it's something.

We have not been back since (our next appt's next week), and I believe he has not been drinking. His family is a trigger for him, and they always come around when they realize he is sober to get him to do as many errands and chores as possible for them. So we are struggling with that, and I see his behavior changing and him being very quiet and he seems to be struggling. His father is one to belittle him when he quits drinking that he's not a man if he can't drink in his house.

So I would say our counseling sessions have been helpful in a few ways, and he was not committed to giving up drinking when we started it. I think what has helped is he recognizes that he has no more options with me, and I am ready to leave tomorrow if it returns. Our think our commitment to attend these sessions makes us try a little harder at home to be nice to one another. A few fights we had we discussed in the sessions and I realize that he really has no idea what is eating at me most of the time, and I am very passive aggressive in communicating with him, which actually just serves to frustrate me all the more. It has also helped me learn how to discuss issues I have in our relationship like money, his family, etc - it feels safer to bring it up in front of the counselor because he will not fall back on his old tricks of blaming everything on me, and he actually has to listen and address it.

I was seeing an individual counselor who told me that couples counseling would never work because he was not actively in recovery. Then I did a little research on the internet and found there is a whole other school of thought out there that says that family therapy can work too. So I stopped seeing my individual therapist, who was doing nothing for me, but hope to find one who I can work with in the future.

So I think you should give it a try, and don't be discouraged by naysayers who say there is no way it could work.

whiplash

Counseling did help iodentity some problems in our relationship, but only after my AH was sober for a while. I don't think it would do any good while he's active because he can't even accept that it's a problem at all, and when it is, it's MY problem for not being an understanding, evolved person. ha! I think for marriage counseling to work, or for marriage to work, there has to be some effort from both sides, not just from us. To me, that means a real effort from him at recovery. Of course, in the end, it's just not my decision to make (I keep saying that hoping it will sink in).

JT

This is such a great thread with so many good suggestions.

For me my relationship improved when I got happier with myself. When I stopped "expecting" I started to appreciate what I did get. When I stopped focusing on the problem I was able to feel gratitude.

In fact changing focus is a huge part of my own happiness. Just for today I can focus on what is good in my marriage and meet my own needs instead of waiting for someone else to do it. That is important whether I am married to an alcoholic or not.

Hugs,
JT