It REALLY Has Become Easier
Hears The Voice
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Unshackled
Posts: 7,901
It REALLY Has Become Easier
Since making my Big Plan it really has become easier to deal with that alcoholic beast living in my head. Why didn't you guys tell me it would get easier?
Oh, wait - YOU DID!
Well, what can I say, I am hard-headed. A trait that didn't serve me well while I was still drinking, but one that seems to be an ally in battling my beast.
Urges last only a few seconds now that my relationship with alcohol has been simplified to "I will never drink it". The Beast flashes me a thought or visual about drinking and as soon as it registers what it is I smile, pat him on the head, maybe call him a sneaky bastadge for getting that thought up to the top of my mental deck, and then go on about my day. Why dwell on it when it's never going to happen?
Oh, wait - YOU DID!
Well, what can I say, I am hard-headed. A trait that didn't serve me well while I was still drinking, but one that seems to be an ally in battling my beast.
Urges last only a few seconds now that my relationship with alcohol has been simplified to "I will never drink it". The Beast flashes me a thought or visual about drinking and as soon as it registers what it is I smile, pat him on the head, maybe call him a sneaky bastadge for getting that thought up to the top of my mental deck, and then go on about my day. Why dwell on it when it's never going to happen?
Member
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NJ
Posts: 20,458
when i see a glass of wine, i have replaced that image with the visualization of a fatty scarred liver.
(what can i say, I work in surgery, it works for me and i know how tired my liver must be from all the abuse i gave it previously....it needs to rest and rejuvinate).
oh Nons, i was shopping in Costco yesterday and there were snack ladies demo. foods everywhere...one of them was freshly fried BACON....i nibbled a 1/2 strip and thought about you!
(what can i say, I work in surgery, it works for me and i know how tired my liver must be from all the abuse i gave it previously....it needs to rest and rejuvinate).
oh Nons, i was shopping in Costco yesterday and there were snack ladies demo. foods everywhere...one of them was freshly fried BACON....i nibbled a 1/2 strip and thought about you!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Athens, Georgia
Posts: 962
This is an older post, by Morning Glory:
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...anagement.html
It is one of those resources that is worth keeping in a reference database, like the video 'Pleasure Unwoven'
It emphasizes why it is so important for us to realize what is going on in our 'dysfunctional' brains, and why it is so important that we take responsibility for re-establishing healthy brain & thought functions.
Thanks for the post Nonsensical.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...anagement.html
It is one of those resources that is worth keeping in a reference database, like the video 'Pleasure Unwoven'
It emphasizes why it is so important for us to realize what is going on in our 'dysfunctional' brains, and why it is so important that we take responsibility for re-establishing healthy brain & thought functions.
Thanks for the post Nonsensical.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: East Coast, The States
Posts: 12,162
Congrats Nonsensical!
Yes after awhile the AV realizes there's "no vacancy" in our mind.
Back when I was working with very young but troubled children in groups, a new young child joined the group. A child who was quite the troublemaker just a few weeks prior noticed the new child was going to start challenging me.
He turned to the new kid and said: "Dude, You better not do that. ....Miss EQ DON'T play."
LOL
I always think AV has figured that out.
"No point acting up" AV thinks: "Miss EQ don't play!!"
All the best, EQ.
Yes after awhile the AV realizes there's "no vacancy" in our mind.
Back when I was working with very young but troubled children in groups, a new young child joined the group. A child who was quite the troublemaker just a few weeks prior noticed the new child was going to start challenging me.
He turned to the new kid and said: "Dude, You better not do that. ....Miss EQ DON'T play."
LOL
I always think AV has figured that out.
"No point acting up" AV thinks: "Miss EQ don't play!!"
All the best, EQ.
Not The Way way, Just the way
Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: US
Posts: 1,413
Great feedback Paul and Tammy!
I found that AVRT works best as a stand alone method; and any attempts to suggest that in order to stay stopped I also need to understand the brain neurology of emotions and what is going on in my "'dysfunctional' brain", or buy into the arguments of an expensive video trying to claim I have a disease of my very ability to choose deliberate voluntary activities - well - THAT is ALL 100% INSTITUTIONAL ADDICTIVE VOICE (IAV).
Yes, the IAV would have us hoist with our own petards adding on complex conditions for permanent abstinence. I will have none of it. Our society is permeated by the IAV, and frankly, weeding out the IAV is the hardest part of AVRT, because it labels other peoples' beliefs in ways they might not like or understand at first. To me this is the ART of AVRT - navigating around and sometimes exposing other peoples' ingrained AV for the benefit of new AVRT learners without being too uncivil.
All the scientific/academic stuff may have a place in quasi-scientific debates, but NOT in quitting for good with AVRT. All I needed to know was the the Beast was an inappropriate appetite for pleasure that is biologically primitive and timeless, and being timeless, IT can only be squashed with NEVER.
I believe, for the sake of people newly coming to understand AVRT, it's important to make this clear.
The Big Plan is unconditional.
The Big Plan WILL force you to separate from your AV.
Understanding AVRT puts the AV (and the IAV) within a perfectly manageable context.
The Big Plan WILL make quitting for good easier and faster than any other way I know.
Also, posting here on SR, for me, has nothing to do with my abstinence. It has only to do with exposing the AV in any form I see it for the benefit of addicted people wanting to quit for good.
I found that AVRT works best as a stand alone method; and any attempts to suggest that in order to stay stopped I also need to understand the brain neurology of emotions and what is going on in my "'dysfunctional' brain", or buy into the arguments of an expensive video trying to claim I have a disease of my very ability to choose deliberate voluntary activities - well - THAT is ALL 100% INSTITUTIONAL ADDICTIVE VOICE (IAV).
Yes, the IAV would have us hoist with our own petards adding on complex conditions for permanent abstinence. I will have none of it. Our society is permeated by the IAV, and frankly, weeding out the IAV is the hardest part of AVRT, because it labels other peoples' beliefs in ways they might not like or understand at first. To me this is the ART of AVRT - navigating around and sometimes exposing other peoples' ingrained AV for the benefit of new AVRT learners without being too uncivil.
All the scientific/academic stuff may have a place in quasi-scientific debates, but NOT in quitting for good with AVRT. All I needed to know was the the Beast was an inappropriate appetite for pleasure that is biologically primitive and timeless, and being timeless, IT can only be squashed with NEVER.
I believe, for the sake of people newly coming to understand AVRT, it's important to make this clear.
The Big Plan is unconditional.
The Big Plan WILL force you to separate from your AV.
Understanding AVRT puts the AV (and the IAV) within a perfectly manageable context.
The Big Plan WILL make quitting for good easier and faster than any other way I know.
Also, posting here on SR, for me, has nothing to do with my abstinence. It has only to do with exposing the AV in any form I see it for the benefit of addicted people wanting to quit for good.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,090
That's one of the many things I appreciate about you, G&R. You go right to the meat and guts. No obfuscation, contradictions, or patting yourself on the back. No pontificating.
It helps me a lot to "watch" you try and help someone process something that is so simple but can be so complicating for many of us, especially those that have attended recovery programs or are looking to psycho-analyze every little thing.
Right now, for me, it's about never drinking again and never changing my mind. That decision has been made and is no longer an issue. Now I will let my brain heal, be good to myself, see my therapist who is very RR friendly and save all the deep stuff for later.
Soberlicious and FreshStart and Non and so many others have helped me too.
For the most part, this is a wonderful forum and frankly all those that introduced me to AVRT, who watch out for me, pm me when get a bit out of sorts or respond to my posts when I'm getting confused has been amazing to me.
It helps me a lot to "watch" you try and help someone process something that is so simple but can be so complicating for many of us, especially those that have attended recovery programs or are looking to psycho-analyze every little thing.
Right now, for me, it's about never drinking again and never changing my mind. That decision has been made and is no longer an issue. Now I will let my brain heal, be good to myself, see my therapist who is very RR friendly and save all the deep stuff for later.
Soberlicious and FreshStart and Non and so many others have helped me too.
For the most part, this is a wonderful forum and frankly all those that introduced me to AVRT, who watch out for me, pm me when get a bit out of sorts or respond to my posts when I'm getting confused has been amazing to me.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: Athens, Georgia
Posts: 962
For me it helps to have an understanding of complex brain functions, and how they are affected by drug use and intense emotionally charged memories.
A basic understanding of brain functions is the basis for Jack Trempy's structural model of addiction. That is how he explains the basis for AVRT, that abstinence is a choice made by the rational mind, which has control over the 'Beast' brain, if I choose to exercise that control.
Trempy's model is just so simplistic, but just a simple basic understanding is enough to realize I can have control over my choice for abstinence. And I recognize it is true, that over-complication can be just another form of letting the AV have ground that is not acceptable.
A basic understanding of brain functions is the basis for Jack Trempy's structural model of addiction. That is how he explains the basis for AVRT, that abstinence is a choice made by the rational mind, which has control over the 'Beast' brain, if I choose to exercise that control.
Trempy's model is just so simplistic, but just a simple basic understanding is enough to realize I can have control over my choice for abstinence. And I recognize it is true, that over-complication can be just another form of letting the AV have ground that is not acceptable.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,090
Yeah, RDB, I found that video very interesting and I really appreciated you posting about it. Thing is, I didn't need to know any of that stuff to quit drinking. I didn't give a rats butt why I drank I just wanted to stop and stop for good.
Now that I'm permanently abstinent I can, in time, look further into the whys.
But yeah, that was a real cool video.
Now that I'm permanently abstinent I can, in time, look further into the whys.
But yeah, that was a real cool video.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 1,090
Originally Posted by RDBplus3 
Actually, what I posted on this thread was a link to a post by one of the SR Administrators, about Emotional Memory Management. I did not think it was off-topic, but I apologize if it was.
http://www.soberrecovery.com/forums/...addiction.html
Sorry about that. I really liked your opening post on that thread.
ETA: I didn't think it was off topic (the post on this thread). Just a little too deep for me at the moment.
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Wales
Posts: 147
Thanks for the thread-I had cravings earlier where I thought I'd loose my mind if I didn't drink. I decided to be stubborn and not drink! Partly your encouragement to be stubborn-the cravings are finally subsiding-an hour later! It felt like a week-the battling in my mind, it's good to know eventually it will be less:-)
Member
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Texas
Posts: 177
I'm only a couple weeks in, and already my AV is leaving me alone for longer periods of time. It does seem to be like a child who is figuring out that it's not going to get its way.
When I used to quit drinking, I would plan to avoid any possible triggers. I say "plan," because I didn't make it more than a day for many years. This time (the last time!), using AVRT, I have done all the "wrong" things. Since the AV is a paper tiger, why not rattle its cage? I think AVRT has actually been more effective this way. It's like taking a child who throws tantrums straight to a toy store to get the biggest fit out of the way.
When I used to quit drinking, I would plan to avoid any possible triggers. I say "plan," because I didn't make it more than a day for many years. This time (the last time!), using AVRT, I have done all the "wrong" things. Since the AV is a paper tiger, why not rattle its cage? I think AVRT has actually been more effective this way. It's like taking a child who throws tantrums straight to a toy store to get the biggest fit out of the way.
Marchia in Aeternum
Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: Georgia
Posts: 11,094
Originally Posted by GerandTwine
Great feedback Paul and Tammy!
I found that AVRT works best as a stand alone method; and any attempts to suggest that in order to stay stopped I also need to understand the brain neurology of emotions and what is going on in my "'dysfunctional' brain", or buy into the arguments of an expensive video trying to claim I have a disease of my very ability to choose deliberate voluntary activities - well - THAT is ALL 100% INSTITUTIONAL ADDICTIVE VOICE (IAV).
Yes, the IAV would have us hoist with our own petards adding on complex conditions for permanent abstinence. I will have none of it. Our society is permeated by the IAV, and frankly, weeding out the IAV is the hardest part of AVRT, because it labels other peoples' beliefs in ways they might not like or understand at first. To me this is the ART of AVRT - navigating around and sometimes exposing other peoples' ingrained AV for the benefit of new AVRT learners without being too uncivil.
All the scientific/academic stuff may have a place in quasi-scientific debates, but NOT in quitting for good with AVRT. All I needed to know was the the Beast was an inappropriate appetite for pleasure that is biologically primitive and timeless, and being timeless, IT can only be squashed with NEVER.
I believe, for the sake of people newly coming to understand AVRT, it's important to make this clear.
The Big Plan is unconditional.
The Big Plan WILL force you to separate from your AV.
Understanding AVRT puts the AV (and the IAV) within a perfectly manageable context.
The Big Plan WILL make quitting for good easier and faster than any other way I know.
Also, posting here on SR, for me, has nothing to do with my abstinence. It has only to do with exposing the AV in any form I see it for the benefit of addicted people wanting to quit for good.
I found that AVRT works best as a stand alone method; and any attempts to suggest that in order to stay stopped I also need to understand the brain neurology of emotions and what is going on in my "'dysfunctional' brain", or buy into the arguments of an expensive video trying to claim I have a disease of my very ability to choose deliberate voluntary activities - well - THAT is ALL 100% INSTITUTIONAL ADDICTIVE VOICE (IAV).
Yes, the IAV would have us hoist with our own petards adding on complex conditions for permanent abstinence. I will have none of it. Our society is permeated by the IAV, and frankly, weeding out the IAV is the hardest part of AVRT, because it labels other peoples' beliefs in ways they might not like or understand at first. To me this is the ART of AVRT - navigating around and sometimes exposing other peoples' ingrained AV for the benefit of new AVRT learners without being too uncivil.
All the scientific/academic stuff may have a place in quasi-scientific debates, but NOT in quitting for good with AVRT. All I needed to know was the the Beast was an inappropriate appetite for pleasure that is biologically primitive and timeless, and being timeless, IT can only be squashed with NEVER.
I believe, for the sake of people newly coming to understand AVRT, it's important to make this clear.
The Big Plan is unconditional.
The Big Plan WILL force you to separate from your AV.
Understanding AVRT puts the AV (and the IAV) within a perfectly manageable context.
The Big Plan WILL make quitting for good easier and faster than any other way I know.
Also, posting here on SR, for me, has nothing to do with my abstinence. It has only to do with exposing the AV in any form I see it for the benefit of addicted people wanting to quit for good.
Hears The Voice
Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: Unshackled
Posts: 7,901
Originally Posted by GerandTwine
I found that AVRT works best as a stand alone method; and any attempts to suggest that in order to stay stopped I also need to understand the brain neurology of emotions and what is going on in my "'dysfunctional' brain", or buy into the arguments of an expensive video trying to claim I have a disease of my very ability to choose deliberate voluntary activities - well - THAT is ALL 100% INSTITUTIONAL ADDICTIVE VOICE (IAV).
Trimpey used the science to articulate a very simple modality for permanent abstinence. It's so simple it puts some people off. My wife has said a number of times, "Yeah, but there's not really a beast in your head..."
I enjoy knowing the underlying science - which has progressed since 1995, but continues to support Trimpey's conclusions. And I can use it to assuage people who like more complex answers.
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Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: NJ
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April Fools... but can we have it US ad for bacon mouthwash - YouTube
I had to put this here for Nons!
I had to put this here for Nons!
Member
Join Date: Jun 2013
Location: Big City
Posts: 3,895
Originally Posted by Nonsensical
Since making my Big Plan it really has become easier to deal with that alcoholic beast living in my head. Why didn't you guys tell me it would get easier?
Oh, wait - YOU DID!
Well, what can I say, I am hard-headed. A trait that didn't serve me well while I was still drinking, but one that seems to be an ally in battling my beast.
Urges last only a few seconds now that my relationship with alcohol has been simplified to "I will never drink it". The Beast flashes me a thought or visual about drinking and as soon as it registers what it is I smile, pat him on the head, maybe call him a sneaky bastadge for getting that thought up to the top of my mental deck, and then go on about my day. Why dwell on it when it's never going to happen?
Oh, wait - YOU DID!
Well, what can I say, I am hard-headed. A trait that didn't serve me well while I was still drinking, but one that seems to be an ally in battling my beast.
Urges last only a few seconds now that my relationship with alcohol has been simplified to "I will never drink it". The Beast flashes me a thought or visual about drinking and as soon as it registers what it is I smile, pat him on the head, maybe call him a sneaky bastadge for getting that thought up to the top of my mental deck, and then go on about my day. Why dwell on it when it's never going to happen?
Anyone?
I'm on day 11ish or so (not trying to count but know it was two Thursday's ago). I don't have physical cravings - but mentally I still get stuck in troughs with my AV plying it on - how much I want that sweet oblivion.
I am not drinking again. But it hasn't gotten all that much easier yet.
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