"Love is selfless, not selfish" (and other dangerous thoughts)
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Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 179
"Love is selfless, not selfish" (and other dangerous thoughts)
Been gone for a while due to some anonimity concerns. Thank you mods for changing my username, the problems seems solved.
Had some bad things happen over the past couple years. Won't go into detail, but let's just say it was a rude awaking. You can read prior posts if you wan't perspective. But to summarize, codependancy is bad, mkay?
The quote in my title post is how I was raised. How I vowed to love my wife and why I would put others needs above my own. I did this for so long that I lost myself.
I started therapy last year when life caught up with me. My therapist suggested ACOA and I recognized (as many of us do) the immediate fit. I've been going to meetings now for six months. I've learned a lot, and begun to see how very far I have to go.
I've learned how my actions have fed the behaviour cycle that put me into the circumstances I am in. I've learned that the only way to break that cycle is to control the half of the equation that I can. That half is me! Not anyone else. Controlling others is a losing proposition.
I've also learned that as I repair myself, other issues will be uncovored. My recovery will be a journey mixed with both joy and pain. My loved ones may not like that selfless and selfish both have a place in my life. It's can't be black and white. It's impossible to be selfless 100% of the time. There are times that I will reserve the right to be selfish.
I've begun my exploration of selfish pursuits. I can't let the journey to discover myself consume me. But, I do need to purposfully put time aside to try new things, and investigate further those things that I find enjoyable.
Soon, when someone asks, what do you want to do? I will be able to confidently answer something other than, "I dunno, what do you wanna do?"
Had some bad things happen over the past couple years. Won't go into detail, but let's just say it was a rude awaking. You can read prior posts if you wan't perspective. But to summarize, codependancy is bad, mkay?
The quote in my title post is how I was raised. How I vowed to love my wife and why I would put others needs above my own. I did this for so long that I lost myself.
I started therapy last year when life caught up with me. My therapist suggested ACOA and I recognized (as many of us do) the immediate fit. I've been going to meetings now for six months. I've learned a lot, and begun to see how very far I have to go.
I've learned how my actions have fed the behaviour cycle that put me into the circumstances I am in. I've learned that the only way to break that cycle is to control the half of the equation that I can. That half is me! Not anyone else. Controlling others is a losing proposition.
I've also learned that as I repair myself, other issues will be uncovored. My recovery will be a journey mixed with both joy and pain. My loved ones may not like that selfless and selfish both have a place in my life. It's can't be black and white. It's impossible to be selfless 100% of the time. There are times that I will reserve the right to be selfish.
I've begun my exploration of selfish pursuits. I can't let the journey to discover myself consume me. But, I do need to purposfully put time aside to try new things, and investigate further those things that I find enjoyable.
Soon, when someone asks, what do you want to do? I will be able to confidently answer something other than, "I dunno, what do you wanna do?"
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Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: South Pacific
Posts: 171
Hmmm, yes- self is a big topic in ACA/AcoA.
I was fairly self-less as a kid. Our mum called me "Big Hearted Arthur". There were five of us kids. My first younger brother always said "everyone for themself". And that was his philosophy.
Inside of recovery I hear early- "its a selfish programme!" I could not go with that. I set my goal- "not to be self centred, but centred on self."
It was a wounded, crippled self. But this has changed over time... one day at a time...
There is no ACA here and I do online forums,,, successfully I think. I encourage people to be as anonymous as they like- not to disclose their home town etc. on the open board.
Its an individual thing- it comes down to trust- the right to know and the need to know.
-DavidG.
I was fairly self-less as a kid. Our mum called me "Big Hearted Arthur". There were five of us kids. My first younger brother always said "everyone for themself". And that was his philosophy.
Inside of recovery I hear early- "its a selfish programme!" I could not go with that. I set my goal- "not to be self centred, but centred on self."
It was a wounded, crippled self. But this has changed over time... one day at a time...
There is no ACA here and I do online forums,,, successfully I think. I encourage people to be as anonymous as they like- not to disclose their home town etc. on the open board.
Its an individual thing- it comes down to trust- the right to know and the need to know.
-DavidG.
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: it's complicated
Posts: 99
I still value selflessness highly, but it seems very important to do real service rather than pander to the disease and pour my life down that black hole. It usually works out somehow to be a win-win.
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Join Date: Mar 2013
Location: it's complicated
Posts: 99
Originally Posted by Reedling 
I still value selflessness highly, but it seems very important to do real service rather than pander to the disease and pour my life down that black hole. It usually works out somehow to be a win-win.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 179
There will always be a place for selfless acts in my life. I like the feedback on step 11. Discernment. I think that's a big issue that I need to wrestle with in my life right now.
The dynamics of the relationship I've created with my wife have her expectations high, and emphisis on my needs either non-existant or irrelevent. My 'selflessness' has enabled her to take advantage of me and protect her from the consequences of her poor choices. My 'selflessness' has become 'self denial'. I don't want to hurt her, but to be whole I need to be willing to let her get hurt. She didn't become like this because she is mean, or manipulative, she got this way because I trained her that it was okay. I trained her to neglect my needs by not tending to them myself and denying they even exsited.
As an emotion stuffing ACA I'm good at hiding my pain. I hide it from the world, my family and my wife. I suffer alone because I don't want to burden anyone with something as trivial as 'how I feel'. I can be on the verge of dying from the pain, but when asked will say I'm 'fine'. I do this because I believe my emotions are meaningless, or unworthy of expression, not normal or wrong.
But the truth is my emotions are my own. They are what they are and I need to express them so they don't rot my insides. If that hurts someone close to me, so be it. Chances are if it hurts them, it's because they had a hand in creating it!
I guess I need to identify selfless from self denial from selfish. The Selfless things I should continue provided they don't cause me to deny myself, especially when my needs are great. The selfish I should enjoy without shame or guilt as long as I take care not to go to excess or become a glutton.
It's a hard thing for me, and I feel lost. But I'll figure it out as I go.
The dynamics of the relationship I've created with my wife have her expectations high, and emphisis on my needs either non-existant or irrelevent. My 'selflessness' has enabled her to take advantage of me and protect her from the consequences of her poor choices. My 'selflessness' has become 'self denial'. I don't want to hurt her, but to be whole I need to be willing to let her get hurt. She didn't become like this because she is mean, or manipulative, she got this way because I trained her that it was okay. I trained her to neglect my needs by not tending to them myself and denying they even exsited.
As an emotion stuffing ACA I'm good at hiding my pain. I hide it from the world, my family and my wife. I suffer alone because I don't want to burden anyone with something as trivial as 'how I feel'. I can be on the verge of dying from the pain, but when asked will say I'm 'fine'. I do this because I believe my emotions are meaningless, or unworthy of expression, not normal or wrong.
But the truth is my emotions are my own. They are what they are and I need to express them so they don't rot my insides. If that hurts someone close to me, so be it. Chances are if it hurts them, it's because they had a hand in creating it!
I guess I need to identify selfless from self denial from selfish. The Selfless things I should continue provided they don't cause me to deny myself, especially when my needs are great. The selfish I should enjoy without shame or guilt as long as I take care not to go to excess or become a glutton.
It's a hard thing for me, and I feel lost. But I'll figure it out as I go.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 179
Leaving for my 'self-cation' next week. Just me and a buddy visiting the northwoods fishing and hiking. I've done this for a number of years, but always felt guilty and ashamed for devoting a week of my vacation time to myself.
Some things are different this year, and I'm now looking forward to this escapist activity guilt free.
1.)I've been in the program now for six month, and I've eliminated non-productive escapist activities (video game addiction, compulsive web surfing and porn).
2.) I've spend more time with family the past few months, taking the kids out, date nights with the wife and projects around the house together. So, I feel I have earned the right to be a little selfish, vs the past when I was just hoping from one escape to the next.
3.) The past week was stressful, so I can really use a break. Last week had me dealing with aging and ailing grandparents, hospitals, nursing homes and the government. Oh, yeah, and flooding. Not just my house, but my grandparents too.
Some things are different this year, and I'm now looking forward to this escapist activity guilt free.
1.)I've been in the program now for six month, and I've eliminated non-productive escapist activities (video game addiction, compulsive web surfing and porn).
2.) I've spend more time with family the past few months, taking the kids out, date nights with the wife and projects around the house together. So, I feel I have earned the right to be a little selfish, vs the past when I was just hoping from one escape to the next.
3.) The past week was stressful, so I can really use a break. Last week had me dealing with aging and ailing grandparents, hospitals, nursing homes and the government. Oh, yeah, and flooding. Not just my house, but my grandparents too.
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