How to rebuild trust with RAH
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Join Date: Feb 2013
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How to rebuild trust with RAH
RAH is 14 months not drinking and attending AA. I attend Al Anon and have found it very helpful as well as this site.
There has been so much damage done to our marriage over the past 16+ years and my trust has been broken. RAH admitted to me a couple weeks ago that he had been talking to other women about our marriage problems (when he was drinking). That feels like a huge betrayal to me and on some level an emotional affair. On the eve of when he stopped drinking he had received a DUI. Eariler that evening he had called a woman 7 times. I've share with RAH that trust has been broken but he doesn't seem to care or know how to rebuild it. He's said "I'm sorry" but that doesn't seem like enough.
There is no communication between us. He barely talks to me when he comes home from work but acknowledges and speaks to our 14 yr daughter.
So, not sure where to go from here. It doesn't seem like RAH is concerned about saving our marriage or rebuilding the trust he's broken. I know we need to start communicating but very hesistant and exhausted to try. I understand he's still early in his recovery but what should I expect regarding the trust issue and rebuilding trust?
There has been so much damage done to our marriage over the past 16+ years and my trust has been broken. RAH admitted to me a couple weeks ago that he had been talking to other women about our marriage problems (when he was drinking). That feels like a huge betrayal to me and on some level an emotional affair. On the eve of when he stopped drinking he had received a DUI. Eariler that evening he had called a woman 7 times. I've share with RAH that trust has been broken but he doesn't seem to care or know how to rebuild it. He's said "I'm sorry" but that doesn't seem like enough.
There is no communication between us. He barely talks to me when he comes home from work but acknowledges and speaks to our 14 yr daughter.
So, not sure where to go from here. It doesn't seem like RAH is concerned about saving our marriage or rebuilding the trust he's broken. I know we need to start communicating but very hesistant and exhausted to try. I understand he's still early in his recovery but what should I expect regarding the trust issue and rebuilding trust?
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I have similar trust issues with my RABF, similar situation. I found a counselor who has a background in addiction issues, and we go as a couple. I also see him on my own. My BF is in AA, and I'm in AlAnon, but I think the counselor really helps us deal with our own specific issues as a couple. We're still working on it, but it has made a difference. If you or your spouse have counseling benefits through your employer, inquire as to who has a specialty in addiction.
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well, 14 months isn't long term recovery but it's plenty enough time to sober up, assess the damage and begin to make repairs! did you two EVER have a strong foundation of communication? or would this be new(er) to both of you?
it does sound very lonely for you, dear. to not really be acknowledged by your partner. that seems pretty rude and indicative of some other subcurrents. however somebody has to make a move of some sort in order to get some impetus. can you address these issues with him in a calm and neutral way? use "I" instead of "you" statements? ie "when you come home from work and do not speak to me, I FEEL....., and i was hoping WE could talk about this." you're gonna get one of at least three responses....NO, YES, NOT NOW.
it does sound very lonely for you, dear. to not really be acknowledged by your partner. that seems pretty rude and indicative of some other subcurrents. however somebody has to make a move of some sort in order to get some impetus. can you address these issues with him in a calm and neutral way? use "I" instead of "you" statements? ie "when you come home from work and do not speak to me, I FEEL....., and i was hoping WE could talk about this." you're gonna get one of at least three responses....NO, YES, NOT NOW.
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Try not to hold on to the past & "the other women" while he was an active alcoholic.
If you are to make a go of it you need to "start over".
Has he talked to other women about your marriage problems since he's been sober?
If not, let go.
If you are to make a go of it you need to "start over".
Has he talked to other women about your marriage problems since he's been sober?
If not, let go.
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I am at the same place you are. Although I am not thinking that there was an affair involved, I do not trust him, I do not like him, I do not want to be anywhere near him. I have so much anger it is ridiculous. I am starting to realize...I don't have to deal with this. I put enough effort and time into the relationship. And just when I am the one that needs something...he acts up. Well, fine. I don't need this, the stress is too much. The amount of absolute hate I have is too much for either of us to handle, and quite honestly, he will never be able to fix it.
It's easy for people to say, get over the past, but what if it's not even the past that upsets you so much, but what he is doing in the present? That is where I am.
I don't know about you, but I am at the level where it's better for everyone if I just walk away. That trust will never be regained, and the cost of losing potential happiness and serenity is not something I am willing to pay. And if you want to take a break from him, to find your own peace and serenity, then go ahead. If there is anything I should have done, it would be to take a break, before it got to this point.
It's easy for people to say, get over the past, but what if it's not even the past that upsets you so much, but what he is doing in the present? That is where I am.
I don't know about you, but I am at the level where it's better for everyone if I just walk away. That trust will never be regained, and the cost of losing potential happiness and serenity is not something I am willing to pay. And if you want to take a break from him, to find your own peace and serenity, then go ahead. If there is anything I should have done, it would be to take a break, before it got to this point.
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Join Date: May 2012
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Would he agree or have you asked him about counseling? I agree with Florence on this one - if he won't go, then maybe can go to counseling yourself. My RAH is fresh out of rehab - less than one week! - and I'm also concerned about how to rebuild trust. I wish I had some sage advice to offer...but as I'm still trying to figure out this question of trust myself, all I can offer is support, and strength & hugs. 
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As others have said, counseling is a good next step. The first year of recovery is REALLY tough. I was ready to divorce after 24 years of marriage when my AH finally confessed to drinking again (which I knew but could not prove). My oldest daughter told me to divorce him, that she needed one sane parent and i would be fine, but her father never would be if he continued. He voluntarily went to AA, mostly because I think he knew I was DONE. I was ready to "walk"! Staying and working on the marriage and recovery seemed like way more work. Fast forward 4 1/2 years and I'm glad I waited it out. It's taken a very long time, but life is much better, not perfect, but much, much better. Trust is the first thing to go, and the last thing to regain. Work with a counselor for a while, even if its by yourself. Give yourself some time and if its over, you will have a moment of clarity. If not, time will tell. I knew I would be fine no matter what direction I choose, and you will too. Be gentle with yourself. (((((Hugs)))))
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Thank you so much to everyone for your input. I truly appreciate it. Part of me feels done and that may be because he's been threatening me with divorce for a couple of months. For awhile he was telling me if I didn't get a job making xx$$ by xx time then he was going to divorce me. I said fine - go ahead. He's worried about $$ but he will be in a huge pickle because I now know how much I will get in alimony and child support! I went to an attorney a couple weeks ago and feel better about my future.
RAH has finally stopped with the threats but I am confused on whether we wants to work on our relationship or not. I have asked/suggested we go to marriage counseling. We have gone to counseling in the past when he was drinking but it was early stage of his drinking and I didn't realize it was a problem then.
I am slowly regaining myself back. I can't believe I lost myself in all this craziness!! I'm doing things for me and my daughter!! It feels great. I would just love to have less tension in the house when he's home. I LOVE the nights when he's not home!! It's only two nights a week right now and that will not last much longer. One night is his DUI class. It is not the environement I want for my daughter and I understand I can't control everything but I"m concerned what she's learning about how men treat women.
Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me? How long should I hang in there? Our daughter graduates high school in 4 yrs so I'm trying to hang in there for her but not sure if I'm making the right decision.??????
RAH has finally stopped with the threats but I am confused on whether we wants to work on our relationship or not. I have asked/suggested we go to marriage counseling. We have gone to counseling in the past when he was drinking but it was early stage of his drinking and I didn't realize it was a problem then.
I am slowly regaining myself back. I can't believe I lost myself in all this craziness!! I'm doing things for me and my daughter!! It feels great. I would just love to have less tension in the house when he's home. I LOVE the nights when he's not home!! It's only two nights a week right now and that will not last much longer. One night is his DUI class. It is not the environement I want for my daughter and I understand I can't control everything but I"m concerned what she's learning about how men treat women.
Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me? How long should I hang in there? Our daughter graduates high school in 4 yrs so I'm trying to hang in there for her but not sure if I'm making the right decision.??????
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Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me?
if you mean does "early" recovery justify being an asshat? NO. i think what you see is what you get. the threats of divorce, the demands that you do xxxx, the aloofness, lack of respect - that's the package. that's hardly a conducive environment for anyone, especially a young child going thru her formative years.
if you mean does "early" recovery justify being an asshat? NO. i think what you see is what you get. the threats of divorce, the demands that you do xxxx, the aloofness, lack of respect - that's the package. that's hardly a conducive environment for anyone, especially a young child going thru her formative years.
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Originally Posted by AnvilheadII 
Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me?
if you mean does "early" recovery justify being an asshat? NO. i think what you see is what you get. the threats of divorce, the demands that you do xxxx, the aloofness, lack of respect - that's the package. that's hardly a conducive environment for anyone, especially a young child going thru her formative years.
if you mean does "early" recovery justify being an asshat? NO. i think what you see is what you get. the threats of divorce, the demands that you do xxxx, the aloofness, lack of respect - that's the package. that's hardly a conducive environment for anyone, especially a young child going thru her formative years.
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Originally Posted by CAgirl9
Thank you so much to everyone for your input. I truly appreciate it. Part of me feels done and that may be because he's been threatening me with divorce for a couple of months. For awhile he was telling me if I didn't get a job making xx$$ by xx time then he was going to divorce me. I said fine - go ahead. He's worried about $$ but he will be in a huge pickle because I now know how much I will get in alimony and child support! I went to an attorney a couple weeks ago and feel better about my future.
RAH has finally stopped with the threats but I am confused on whether we wants to work on our relationship or not. I have asked/suggested we go to marriage counseling. We have gone to counseling in the past when he was drinking but it was early stage of his drinking and I didn't realize it was a problem then.
I am slowly regaining myself back. I can't believe I lost myself in all this craziness!! I'm doing things for me and my daughter!! It feels great. I would just love to have less tension in the house when he's home. I LOVE the nights when he's not home!! It's only two nights a week right now and that will not last much longer. One night is his DUI class. It is not the environement I want for my daughter and I understand I can't control everything but I"m concerned what she's learning about how men treat women.
Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me? How long should I hang in there? Our daughter graduates high school in 4 yrs so I'm trying to hang in there for her but not sure if I'm making the right decision.??????
RAH has finally stopped with the threats but I am confused on whether we wants to work on our relationship or not. I have asked/suggested we go to marriage counseling. We have gone to counseling in the past when he was drinking but it was early stage of his drinking and I didn't realize it was a problem then.
I am slowly regaining myself back. I can't believe I lost myself in all this craziness!! I'm doing things for me and my daughter!! It feels great. I would just love to have less tension in the house when he's home. I LOVE the nights when he's not home!! It's only two nights a week right now and that will not last much longer. One night is his DUI class. It is not the environement I want for my daughter and I understand I can't control everything but I"m concerned what she's learning about how men treat women.
Is it normal during RAH first couple years of recovery to be so cold and non communicative with me? How long should I hang in there? Our daughter graduates high school in 4 yrs so I'm trying to hang in there for her but not sure if I'm making the right decision.??????
Healthy boundaries are designed to invite people INTO your life in a healthy way.
Boundaries arent punishments to dole out.
Boundaries are requests, and not demands.
Boundaries help to build trust by agreements kept.
Boundaries are Positive statements that begin with "I" and are Understanding and Sharing
Setting Boundaries allow others to know your expectations and helps the other with Consistency
I just wanted to mention this as it sort of relates to my thought process. Like if you are disappointed your husband does not come home to eat dinner with you, or you never know when he will be home and its frustrating.. you can tell him that you would like to begin having a relaxing dinner together where you can talk about the day and just share that time together. Make a small thing like that something he can do to show you he has respect for your needs, and he too wants to make a commitment to family. And then work together to compromise a time. So this is just an example, but hopefully it helps with the idea. For us in the beginning little things meant a lot, and then bigger examples of trust and commitment worked their way in more easily. Oh and I almost forgot, if he doesnt respond to your request, then you would go ahead and eat without him, or take your daugher out to eat, or whatever to just carry on and have a good evening yourself.
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My ah confided in other women about "our problems " too.
Huge slap in the face if you ask me. However lets face it, they werent really not truly talking about "our problems" they were talking about "us" why? Because they were/are drunk selfish fools and deflected all responsibility to us and wanted someone (of course a female someone) to verify that they arent wrong and poor them. We are soo mean.
It hurts I know and highly disrespectful. How selfish of them to still not get on their knees and gravel like the dogs they are? (Atleast in my head thats what I would like to see)
Its not going to happen like that sadly and if it does...its not going to be on our time.
Once again we are waiting for them to make us happy. Or should we?
Why wait? Where is the recovery for you? Find a therapist and talk to her and once you do...the weight will slowly lift and in the meantime while working on him. Who knows maybe youll get the graveling you deserve
Ps : communicate one step at a time. Good things dont all happen at once.
Its not going to be sober and everything just falls together but in time...yes it could all just happen.
Huge slap in the face if you ask me. However lets face it, they werent really not truly talking about "our problems" they were talking about "us" why? Because they were/are drunk selfish fools and deflected all responsibility to us and wanted someone (of course a female someone) to verify that they arent wrong and poor them. We are soo mean.
It hurts I know and highly disrespectful. How selfish of them to still not get on their knees and gravel like the dogs they are? (Atleast in my head thats what I would like to see)
Its not going to happen like that sadly and if it does...its not going to be on our time.
Once again we are waiting for them to make us happy. Or should we?
Why wait? Where is the recovery for you? Find a therapist and talk to her and once you do...the weight will slowly lift and in the meantime while working on him. Who knows maybe youll get the graveling you deserve
Ps : communicate one step at a time. Good things dont all happen at once.
Its not going to be sober and everything just falls together but in time...yes it could all just happen.
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How to rebuild trust with RAH
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Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 95
I truly appreciate all the feedback. It helps to read others' experiences and words of wisdom/hope.
So this morning I attempted to talk to RAH -I asked, again, about going to marriage counseling. He basically said no -he has "terms" he wants me to meet before he commits. I told him he is not going to dictate "terms" - we need help with communicating. It turned into an argument. He told me he thinks I have a borderline personality disorder. I had to laugh inside because that would be living with an alcoholic!! My mom is bipolar and he keeps trying to diagnose me. I did say to him that he's an alcoholic and it has been difficult to live in that enviroment and I didn't always respond to things in the best manner and that I'm working my program and taking responsibility for my part. He wasn't even listening to me because he said "you blame me for everything and all you do is call out my defects" He is obviously very angry. Again, we cannot have an adult conversation -he always elevates it into yelling/anger. He said multiple times "I"m done with you" and was pointing his finger in my face.
Writing this out really helps me see how much crap I'm putting up with. I don't deserve any of this. I just need to get strong enough to walk away. Why is it so hard to do? I know I'm in A LOT of pain and I'm having a hard time letting go of it- I truly don't want to feel the pain but I've been told that is part of the process of healing. I just feel so overwhelmed with everything.
So this morning I attempted to talk to RAH -I asked, again, about going to marriage counseling. He basically said no -he has "terms" he wants me to meet before he commits. I told him he is not going to dictate "terms" - we need help with communicating. It turned into an argument. He told me he thinks I have a borderline personality disorder. I had to laugh inside because that would be living with an alcoholic!! My mom is bipolar and he keeps trying to diagnose me. I did say to him that he's an alcoholic and it has been difficult to live in that enviroment and I didn't always respond to things in the best manner and that I'm working my program and taking responsibility for my part. He wasn't even listening to me because he said "you blame me for everything and all you do is call out my defects" He is obviously very angry. Again, we cannot have an adult conversation -he always elevates it into yelling/anger. He said multiple times "I"m done with you" and was pointing his finger in my face.
Writing this out really helps me see how much crap I'm putting up with. I don't deserve any of this. I just need to get strong enough to walk away. Why is it so hard to do? I know I'm in A LOT of pain and I'm having a hard time letting go of it- I truly don't want to feel the pain but I've been told that is part of the process of healing. I just feel so overwhelmed with everything.
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Originally Posted by CAgirl9
I truly appreciate all the feedback. It helps to read others' experiences and words of wisdom/hope.
So this morning I attempted to talk to RAH -I asked, again, about going to marriage counseling. He basically said no -he has "terms" he wants me to meet before he commits. I told him he is not going to dictate "terms" - we need help with communicating. It turned into an argument. He told me he thinks I have a borderline personality disorder. I had to laugh inside because that would be living with an alcoholic!! My mom is bipolar and he keeps trying to diagnose me. I did say to him that he's an alcoholic and it has been difficult to live in that enviroment and I didn't always respond to things in the best manner and that I'm working my program and taking responsibility for my part. He wasn't even listening to me because he said "you blame me for everything and all you do is call out my defects" He is obviously very angry. Again, we cannot have an adult conversation -he always elevates it into yelling/anger. He said multiple times "I"m done with you" and was pointing his finger in my face.
Writing this out really helps me see how much crap I'm putting up with. I don't deserve any of this. I just need to get strong enough to walk away. Why is it so hard to do? I know I'm in A LOT of pain and I'm having a hard time letting go of it- I truly don't want to feel the pain but I've been told that is part of the process of healing. I just feel so overwhelmed with everything.
So this morning I attempted to talk to RAH -I asked, again, about going to marriage counseling. He basically said no -he has "terms" he wants me to meet before he commits. I told him he is not going to dictate "terms" - we need help with communicating. It turned into an argument. He told me he thinks I have a borderline personality disorder. I had to laugh inside because that would be living with an alcoholic!! My mom is bipolar and he keeps trying to diagnose me. I did say to him that he's an alcoholic and it has been difficult to live in that enviroment and I didn't always respond to things in the best manner and that I'm working my program and taking responsibility for my part. He wasn't even listening to me because he said "you blame me for everything and all you do is call out my defects" He is obviously very angry. Again, we cannot have an adult conversation -he always elevates it into yelling/anger. He said multiple times "I"m done with you" and was pointing his finger in my face.
Writing this out really helps me see how much crap I'm putting up with. I don't deserve any of this. I just need to get strong enough to walk away. Why is it so hard to do? I know I'm in A LOT of pain and I'm having a hard time letting go of it- I truly don't want to feel the pain but I've been told that is part of the process of healing. I just feel so overwhelmed with everything.
Theres more to the process of feeling pain and moving on from it.
Theres discussion about the pain caused. Sadly that discussion will not be with him anytime soon. Why is it hard to leave? I ask myself the same. It is hard to just get up and walk away.
I too have been blamed for everything and when trying to have an adult conversation my ah acts like I just kicked his dog. Blows up diverts reflects and shifts blame.
After all this time recovery or actively drinking ive tried to "fix" him or us.
The truth is I must fix me. It brings me back to when my mother would say to never rely on a man...you must be able to stand on your own.
Though married...that truth stands strong.
Why rely on him financially? Emotionally? Physically? Or spiritualy?
He has not relied on you. He has taken his own path. He drank when you didnt want him to
And stopped when he was ready and he recovers the way he wants too.
The answer to your own happiness is inside you.
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Thank you thislonelygirl! Yes, I understand the answer to my happiness is inside me.
I went to an Al Anon meeting today and that was helpful. I'm unable to speak at a meeting without crying - I guess that is letting some of the pain out ...???? At least it feels better to cry and release it.
I would like to give an update about what happened tonight when RAH came home from work. It was like he was a totally different person - happy, nice, acknowledged me when he came home (the guy I fell in love with and married). I asked if we would print something out for me and he did then playfully asked for a hug/kiss. It was nice to see that behavior but it has been so dr. jekyl / mr hyde it's hard to trust it. I'm sure it is me taking care of myself by putting up the protective walls. I've never been one to have walls but obviously I've learned to do that the past 10-15 years.
My goal is to journal more -that has always been a great outlet for me. I also have this vision of putting together a huge flow chart of the people in my life with pros/cons listed for each and include slogans/sayings to help me for each one. This idea came to me today and I think it might help me compartmentalize some of the craziness.
Thanks for listening and providing wisdom and kindness as I work on rebuilding and getting me back!
I went to an Al Anon meeting today and that was helpful. I'm unable to speak at a meeting without crying - I guess that is letting some of the pain out ...???? At least it feels better to cry and release it.
I would like to give an update about what happened tonight when RAH came home from work. It was like he was a totally different person - happy, nice, acknowledged me when he came home (the guy I fell in love with and married). I asked if we would print something out for me and he did then playfully asked for a hug/kiss. It was nice to see that behavior but it has been so dr. jekyl / mr hyde it's hard to trust it. I'm sure it is me taking care of myself by putting up the protective walls. I've never been one to have walls but obviously I've learned to do that the past 10-15 years.
My goal is to journal more -that has always been a great outlet for me. I also have this vision of putting together a huge flow chart of the people in my life with pros/cons listed for each and include slogans/sayings to help me for each one. This idea came to me today and I think it might help me compartmentalize some of the craziness.
Thanks for listening and providing wisdom and kindness as I work on rebuilding and getting me back!
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Join Date: Jan 2011
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You have had a lot of great comments but I will add that AA in its purest form of actually doing the steps and internalizing them will change the A and make it possible for the marriage to become truly happy and connected.
Just attending meetings isn't working the program of recovery as it was designed and his behaviors and attitude suggest he might be just going to meetings and that is not enough!
Did he complete the steps? Do step 4? Make amends to all (making amends to you might be going to marriage counseling!). Is he spiritually fit and giving back by helping others?
Those unselfish actions are what changes the A from asshat to decent human being worthy to share a life with....
More will be revealed... time tells all eventually. At some point you will know that you know. Keep going to Alanon and get yourself a great counselor and in time, you will become to see things with a "new pair of glasses" and that knowledge and wisdom will make it easier.... much easier to cope and or make the decisions you will need to make for you in the future!
That was a run on sentence...lol.... but if you keep working your recovery it will set you free no matter what he does!
Just attending meetings isn't working the program of recovery as it was designed and his behaviors and attitude suggest he might be just going to meetings and that is not enough!
Did he complete the steps? Do step 4? Make amends to all (making amends to you might be going to marriage counseling!). Is he spiritually fit and giving back by helping others?
Those unselfish actions are what changes the A from asshat to decent human being worthy to share a life with....
More will be revealed... time tells all eventually. At some point you will know that you know. Keep going to Alanon and get yourself a great counselor and in time, you will become to see things with a "new pair of glasses" and that knowledge and wisdom will make it easier.... much easier to cope and or make the decisions you will need to make for you in the future!
That was a run on sentence...lol.... but if you keep working your recovery it will set you free no matter what he does!
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Thanks Hopeworks! Yes, lots of great comments and I truly appreciate each and every one of them. I've lost hope that our marriage can be saved but after reading your post it gives me a hope. Of course it depends on what RAH decides to do with his recovery. All I can do is work on me.
I don't know if RAH is working the steps - I'm unsure on what is okay to ask him about his recovery. I guess I'm a little confused about where the line is about asking about his program. I think I'm concerned he's going to accuse me of trying to control things just by asking how things are going -does that make sense? I did ask him the other day if he thought he's made amends to me. I didn't really get a straight answer from him. I know I don't feel like amends have been made to me. What is that suppose to feel like anyway? If he thinks he's made amends but I feel like he has then what does that mean? He gave me a quick "sorry" for talking to other women about our marriage - that does not work for me. It doesn't feel like an apology or amends.
RAH is going through a class to become Catholic (I am as well as our daughter). I'm very excited he has taken this step, however not sure what he's really getting out of it, kind of like AA. I haven't seen a whole lot of changed behavior. Someone in Al Anon told me the first 2 years of sobriety are really tough because he's dealing with all the suppressed feelings deep inside. Not sure if I mentioned his dad was a physically abusive alcoholic. I know he's dealing with a lot. I've just been trying to give him his space and do my own thing! Thanks again for helping me through all this!
I don't know if RAH is working the steps - I'm unsure on what is okay to ask him about his recovery. I guess I'm a little confused about where the line is about asking about his program. I think I'm concerned he's going to accuse me of trying to control things just by asking how things are going -does that make sense? I did ask him the other day if he thought he's made amends to me. I didn't really get a straight answer from him. I know I don't feel like amends have been made to me. What is that suppose to feel like anyway? If he thinks he's made amends but I feel like he has then what does that mean? He gave me a quick "sorry" for talking to other women about our marriage - that does not work for me. It doesn't feel like an apology or amends.
RAH is going through a class to become Catholic (I am as well as our daughter). I'm very excited he has taken this step, however not sure what he's really getting out of it, kind of like AA. I haven't seen a whole lot of changed behavior. Someone in Al Anon told me the first 2 years of sobriety are really tough because he's dealing with all the suppressed feelings deep inside. Not sure if I mentioned his dad was a physically abusive alcoholic. I know he's dealing with a lot. I've just been trying to give him his space and do my own thing! Thanks again for helping me through all this!
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