Junebugapril

I have heard that you have to reach bottom before you can come back up.

I have not lost my home
I have not crashed my car
I have not alienated my friends
I only drank one bottle of wine a night
I do not go on benders
I do not hide my liquor

Can I truly say I am an alcoholic?
Can I qualify to say I need to quit drinking now?
Or will I go right back to it because I have not given it up to a higher power?
Maybe I just need a sponsor. Or maybe not.

The two meetings I went to yesterday did not sit well with me. I didn't like that they are not in a circle. I thought they should have been, rather than with the leader in the front, and everyone else facing the leader.

Excuses. I am coming up with excuses not to go to AA

I like it here. I like the forums. I already made a good friend here that we are communicating by private message and we are helping each other.

Maybe I don't HAVE to go to AA. Maybe I don't HAVE to give it up to a higher power. I believe in the universal spirit we all tap into when we create beauty. When we create incredible ideas, together and alone. When we create art, dance, theater, architecture, music. But a god sitting in heaven? And that we go to this place after we die? Or that we will to to a bad place called hell if we are not good? Or is this just a convenient story people tell to get each other to behave well? The religion I was born into does not believe in heaven and hell. Does that mean that all Jews will go to hell? Religion bothers me. I do believe in our higher purpose, and that we do have an incredible universal spirit to tap into when we create. But I am not sure if that is God and that if it is a higher power. Maybe that is what higher power is.

Sorry for rambling.

Fernaceman

I was told your bottom only has to be when you stop digging. When that is, is up to YOU!

MidnightBlue

Hi, Junebug.

IMHO we are free to choose the recovery program that works personally for us. Provided it really works

Luckily, I did not do any of the things mentioned either. I do not know how to call myself - alcoholic, addicted, person who likes wine too much (a bottle of wine a night became a huge rad flag for me). I know I can't control it.

I believe, a person can come up from any level, if required even to build a rocket and explore space. When you hit the bottom, you just have no choice but to come up, if you still can and it's not too late.

Do not look at the bottom, look up.

Take care.

eumenides

Yes, I think you are coming up with excuses but no you do not have to go to AA. You don't have to do anything, but stop drinking. That's why you are here aren't you? You should be proud and happy you have not reached some of the more dubious *milestones* people hit when they are abusing substances. However, there is some part of you that finds your drinking to be troubling or why would you be here? You don't have to believe in anything that goes against your nature as long as you want to quit drinking.

Since you mentioned your being Jewish, Chabad has great resources for dealing with alcohol. They examine AA lore through the lens of Hassidic teaching. Perhaps that might be more suitable? There are also other options in the Secular Connections.

You asked a lot of questions in your thread except for the crucial one: Do you need to quit drinking?

FamilyMan2153

An alcoholic does not have to ask if he is one. He knows! People get sober a ton of ways. When you accept what you are then you can move forward. I do know this, we cannot do it alone. How ever you find help, use it, and stay sober. Good luck.

MIRecovery

The problem with alcoholism is that it is cronic, progressive, and fatal. Cronic means you never get over it, progressive means it only gets worse, and fatal means it always ends in death.

The good news is we can get off the ride anytime we want or like most of us things had to get really really bad before we would give up our best friend/worst enemy. By the time I choose to get off I was close to dieing. I fell into late stage alcoholism and it was not a pretty picture but I still never had been arrested, had a house, had a job, had a wife, had two kids, had two dogs but my life was managable at a fifth of vodka a day.

Are you an alcoholic? Only you can answer that question but I have found people without a problem do not ask if they have a problem.

I have been to a 1000+ AA meetings and how they are set up varies but it makes absolutely no differance. I am pretty sure you could arrive early and arrange the chairs in an octagon and it would not ruffle anyone's feathers. I will say you wanting to fix an AA meeting that has used the same format for many years is alcoholic thinking. AA does not have an exclusive on recovery but I can say that I tried other methods and failed

The question to ask yourself is do I want to get better before I get worse?

inlalaland

i hear you about AA...and the religion thing. but, i was born catholic & grew up with the heaven/hell thing (ha, look at all the disgusting things about catholic priests)

just saw this on FB Intervention post...you’ll never leave where you are until you decide where you’d rather be

guess i'm waiting for that revelation...

Junebugapril

You guys, these are terrific replies. Thank you all so much. I learned much from them. I think I am feeling resentful. Of what? I don't know, everything. Resentful that I can't drink. Resentful of AA. Resentful that the people at the meetings said they have to go forever. Not for awhile. Resentful that this will never be over. Resentful that I will be forever addicted to alcohol, even if I don't drink. Resentful that I probably will always want a drink. Resentful that when I am feeling good and am no longer feeling addicted, that alcohol will sneak in and say "You can have a drink, you are better now". And Resentful that I will have to say "Go eff yourself, alcohol, you sneaky little jerk!"

I do have four days sober. My doctor told me yesterday that I can never drink. Not one drop. Because I have liver disease. It made me want to go have a drink. I am glad I had already decided not to drink anymore or I would have gone out and gotten sloshed after that.

Thank you all for listening to my rambling.

SavingSelf

What helps me if I think of things I haven't done while drinking is I now put a "yet" afterwards. I am someone who knows for sure I am an alcoholic and usually would stop at a six pack or a bottle of wine a night. At the end I did add one or two drinks here or there to get where I really wanted to be.

As for AA, I have recently attended 4 meetings--all of them were women's meetings and everyone sat in a circle. No one had slips to sign etc. I do know what you are talking about as 15 years ago I attended a few meetings like the ones you described and it totally turned me off--never went back and decided I didn't like AA anyway due to all the god stuff. My drinking has changed since then and it was only the last year that I drank every night...or most nights. I would guess 8 out of 10 nights most of the time.

As an alcoholic myself--it does worry me that you use the word "only" in front of "a bottle of wine". I don't think it's recommended for anyone to drink that much per day.

I haven't gotten a sponsor yet but I do want to. I am not trying to rush things and I have some difficult life circumstances right now so it makes attending as many meetings as I would like to (just to get an idea of as many as I can) a bit difficult.

As to your question...I don't think everyone has a bottom. I tend to see my bottom as a cumulative thing. I tried to moderate drinking on and off for years and it never really worked. It seems like it is getting worse, and if I don't stop now I worry that I never will. So, no time like the present I guess.

I don't think you have to have all of the answers today. Just keep reading and reaching out when you need to. Also, definitely try to find other AA meetings. My therapist was nice enough to ask around (my guess is her other clients who identify as alcoholic although she never said who she asked) and provided me with the info of the meetings i attended. And even if you don't use AA--you can still stop drinking if you would like.

Hang in there.

doggonecarl

The Chinese finger trap. Do you know what that is? It’s the braided toy where you stick your fingers in each end. When you pull, you can’t get out. The puzzle is trying to figure how to escape.

Those days, weeks, or months leading up to recovery reminds me of the finger puzzle…the more we resist the idea of alcoholism, that we have it, and fight against all the tried and true methods of addressing it, the more we are trapped in the addiction.

How do you get out of a finger trap? You quit fighting it.

How do you get out of alcoholism? Same way, you quit fighting it.

Accept.

Bottom line, if you aren’t an alcoholic, you can quit drinking. Period. If you can’t quit, and you continue to resist calling yourself an alcoholic, then at least examine your relationship with alcohol and ask yourself, why is this so hard?

MIRecovery

Do not feel bad that you are pi$$ed off about not drinking. I still have temper tantrums from time to time. It just does not seem fair that 90% of the world can do something I can not. My sponsor pointed out to me, "Whoever said life was fair." Not what I wanted to hear but that does not make it less true. My mother died of liver failure due to alchoholism. I highly recommend that you do not choose this route. It is not a pretty death.

AA is so much more than not drinking. It teaches you how to live life by exorcising your demons and being of service to others. It has nothing to do with religon but it does have everything to do with spirituality. It took over a year to have a concept of a higher power I could live with

I have been going for 3 years an still consider myself a beginner. My advice in AA is to stick with the people that are happy and have long term sorbriety. Ask them how they stay sober and then do what they do.

Remember you do not have to stay sober forever you just have to stay sober today. So far I have put together over 1000 todays but I still only do what I need to for today

tomsteve

Resentful that I will be forever addicted to alcohol

no, you wont. you will be recovered from the hopeless state of mind that made you drink and free from the bondage of alcohol.

Fernaceman

Yet again, Tom is able to state the obvious is such simplistic terms. You're awesome, Tom.

JJay

Junebug, you should try to stop now BEFORE any of those things happen. When I first THOUGHT I hit bottom I said those exact words. I went to a meeting and heard about all these people who had done and lost everything you listed. I thought, "Okay, I have a car, I have an awesome job, I have a great apartment, I have a gorgeous girlfriend, what in the hell am I doing here??" That was about five years ago. Now I've lost everything. I mean EVERYTHING. I'm starting from scratch. And I've had so many "rock bottoms" that I've lost count. Do yourself a favor and if you even think for a split second you have a problem you should probably stop and get help. Just me $.02.

IndaMiricale

Those are just some of the "Yets" that the disease wants to take you to. We have raised the bottom, you dont have to go down the long ugly road I did. I had those and many more severe consequences before I surrendered.

Fandy

I think that your liver disease might be your salvation.

you can resent the hell out of it. it's really a matter of your quality of life. If you drink you will NOT be considered as a candidate for a liver transplant and you cannot LIVE without a liver.

take a walk through a hospital where people are undergoing treatment to stay alive while WAITING for a liver donar....it's a real eye opener. these people are barely alive, but they hope for a chance to have a choice of not drinking.

you still have a choice and the liver has remarkable CHANCE to rejuvenate if you treat it with respect.

so do you...no matter how you decide to do it....whatever program you choose. you might be thankful...(my personal choice in recovery is to be grateful every day, very simple, no hoopla, no meetings, i connect with people here)

IndaMiricale

That is your higher power. AA does not affliliate with any religion that is person options for outside the rooms.

God is simply Good Ordrely Direction.

Keep it simple dont over complicate it.

Junebugapril

Wow, you guys are simply amazing. These replies keep convincing me that I am doing the right thing by not drinking, even though it aggravates the eff outta me to not drink.

MI, I am humbled to hear that I am not the only one who can't get a handle on the higher power thing right away.

Today I thought I was done with cravings. Wine O'Clock came and I didn't want a drink. But now that I am home, all I can think of is that glass of wine. But it is better than it was yesterday.

I drank when I was happy. I drank when I was stressed. I drank when I got home. All these triggers, who knew?

I am sitting here with my kiddie cocktail of peach juice and ice, and telling myself that the stress of walking in the door does not require a drink.

This will be five days if I make it through tonight.

JJay

Fixed it for you

Fandy

when you wake up tomorrow morning you will feel glad that you did not drink. have some dinner, take a bath?