Addictions and Personality Disorders
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Addictions and Personality Disorders
Following is a re-post of a response I just wrote on a different thread. I thought it might be useful here:
My feeling is that at least some of the behaviors people view as being caused by addiction are in fact caused by personality disorders, in particular antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder. These personality disorders very often co-occur with addictions.
Here is a cut and paste from a brief article I found on the internet explaining what I mean:
"Addiction can be a serious problem for any relationship to endure. It is easy to get into a mode as a partner of rescuing and shielding the addict form the consequences of his or her behaviors. Sometimes the addiction is the main issue, but there are also instances where an addiction can signal a larger problem. Personality disorders frequently involve compulsive behaviors, which can include addictions. Keeping in mind that using addicts can show behavior that may mimic personality disorders, here are 9 signs that your partner may have more going on than simple addiction, and may be afflicted with a personality disorder such as narcissism or sociopathy:
1. Lack of remorse of a true guilt response for doing something wrong. Lacking a conscience, a person with sociopathy is likely to be upset of caught, if he or she thinks faking a response will return you to his or her control. the true repentance for the act is lacking, and the sociopath may even feel entitled to harm others if they are weak enough to "set themselves up."
2. Lack of empathy for the emotional needs of others. Your partner may be incapable of placing him or herself into someone else's shoes and acts callously as a result.
3. A lack of proper behavioral controls. This can result in compulsive behaviors related to sexuality, drugs, and alcohol.
4. A tendency to act violently, such as fistfights or other explosive events.
5. A consistent irresponsibility is displayed, such as being unable to hold down a steady job, pay bills on time, or honor marital commitments.
6. Your partner might feel a grandiose sense of a self worth, exaggerating what he or she has accomplished, expecting others to offer excessive raise, and adopting a haughty attitude toward others.
7. Shallow emotions and a glib and superficial kind of charm. Your partner may be able to motivate people and con them, lie, or otherwise get what he or she wants, but true depth of emotion is lacking.
8. Idealized thinking, such as in relation to power, beauty, and love. Once the object of the idealization "falls from grace," it is quickly devalued and rejected completely as worthless.
9. A failure to conform to the normal rules and expectations of our society. Your partner may feel as if he or she is above the rules and does not have to obey them like everyone else.
Article Source:]Addiction and Personality Disorders - 9 Signs of a Bigger Issue"
There are two reasons I think it is important to keep this in mind when talking about the behavior of people with addictions and people who have recovered. First, most people with addictions, present or past, do NOT have personality disorders; it is inaccurate to assume that all of us share these traits. Second, understanding that there may be something more than addiction going on may help family members to understand that they are dealing with something larger and frankly much more difficult to address than addiction.
My feeling is that at least some of the behaviors people view as being caused by addiction are in fact caused by personality disorders, in particular antisocial personality disorder and narcissistic personality disorder. These personality disorders very often co-occur with addictions.
Here is a cut and paste from a brief article I found on the internet explaining what I mean:
"Addiction can be a serious problem for any relationship to endure. It is easy to get into a mode as a partner of rescuing and shielding the addict form the consequences of his or her behaviors. Sometimes the addiction is the main issue, but there are also instances where an addiction can signal a larger problem. Personality disorders frequently involve compulsive behaviors, which can include addictions. Keeping in mind that using addicts can show behavior that may mimic personality disorders, here are 9 signs that your partner may have more going on than simple addiction, and may be afflicted with a personality disorder such as narcissism or sociopathy:
1. Lack of remorse of a true guilt response for doing something wrong. Lacking a conscience, a person with sociopathy is likely to be upset of caught, if he or she thinks faking a response will return you to his or her control. the true repentance for the act is lacking, and the sociopath may even feel entitled to harm others if they are weak enough to "set themselves up."
2. Lack of empathy for the emotional needs of others. Your partner may be incapable of placing him or herself into someone else's shoes and acts callously as a result.
3. A lack of proper behavioral controls. This can result in compulsive behaviors related to sexuality, drugs, and alcohol.
4. A tendency to act violently, such as fistfights or other explosive events.
5. A consistent irresponsibility is displayed, such as being unable to hold down a steady job, pay bills on time, or honor marital commitments.
6. Your partner might feel a grandiose sense of a self worth, exaggerating what he or she has accomplished, expecting others to offer excessive raise, and adopting a haughty attitude toward others.
7. Shallow emotions and a glib and superficial kind of charm. Your partner may be able to motivate people and con them, lie, or otherwise get what he or she wants, but true depth of emotion is lacking.
8. Idealized thinking, such as in relation to power, beauty, and love. Once the object of the idealization "falls from grace," it is quickly devalued and rejected completely as worthless.
9. A failure to conform to the normal rules and expectations of our society. Your partner may feel as if he or she is above the rules and does not have to obey them like everyone else.
Article Source:]Addiction and Personality Disorders - 9 Signs of a Bigger Issue"
There are two reasons I think it is important to keep this in mind when talking about the behavior of people with addictions and people who have recovered. First, most people with addictions, present or past, do NOT have personality disorders; it is inaccurate to assume that all of us share these traits. Second, understanding that there may be something more than addiction going on may help family members to understand that they are dealing with something larger and frankly much more difficult to address than addiction.
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There's no separating the two once the addiction takes charge. Mid to advance addiction has all 9 of those conditions. So you have to be well in recovery to be able to determine if a personality disorder caused the addition or the addiction mimics a personality disorder.
Personality disorders though are rooted in childhood, so if you have a great person who suddenly at age 40 develops alcoholism and exhibits a PD, then you know it's the alcoholism. And if you have a person who's been histrionic, violent, hateful, and selfish and without conscience since childhood then develops alcoholism in then he's probably has PD induced alcoholism.
I think the important thing though is for family and friends, it doesn't matter, whether it's PD induced alcoholism, or alcohol induced PD--the behavior is unacceptable and the family member needs to protect himself/herself from it.
Personality disorders though are rooted in childhood, so if you have a great person who suddenly at age 40 develops alcoholism and exhibits a PD, then you know it's the alcoholism. And if you have a person who's been histrionic, violent, hateful, and selfish and without conscience since childhood then develops alcoholism in then he's probably has PD induced alcoholism.
I think the important thing though is for family and friends, it doesn't matter, whether it's PD induced alcoholism, or alcohol induced PD--the behavior is unacceptable and the family member needs to protect himself/herself from it.
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Thanks for sharing this, OTT.
I've seen a variety of statistics on the dual diagnosis stuff... and it seems pretty high on average.
I also have a lot of experience with mental illness (in my family) and yes, the behaviors are often the same. I was amazed at how much alcohol my manic family members could put away while in the midst of full-blown mania. Take away the symptoms, though, and the alcohol abuse also went away. So in my immediate family, alcohol was a symptom of a bigger problem in the brain, vs. an actual addiction.
When they are manic, they are completely incapable of having empathy, are callous and cruel if anyone gets in their way, etc. The brain is obviously misfiring. Yet it seems hard for society to see that addictions are also a mental illness, in the sense the substances affect the brain's neurological pathways as well. I know I came to this forum and to Al-Anon thinking that stopping drinking was the answer for my ex-AH. But what happened was a realization that there was some seriously messed up thinking going on even when sober.
Anyway - just musing on your post while I nurse my own coffee addiction. I am shutting up now! ; )
Thanks again for sharing.
~T
I've seen a variety of statistics on the dual diagnosis stuff... and it seems pretty high on average.
I also have a lot of experience with mental illness (in my family) and yes, the behaviors are often the same. I was amazed at how much alcohol my manic family members could put away while in the midst of full-blown mania. Take away the symptoms, though, and the alcohol abuse also went away. So in my immediate family, alcohol was a symptom of a bigger problem in the brain, vs. an actual addiction.
When they are manic, they are completely incapable of having empathy, are callous and cruel if anyone gets in their way, etc. The brain is obviously misfiring. Yet it seems hard for society to see that addictions are also a mental illness, in the sense the substances affect the brain's neurological pathways as well. I know I came to this forum and to Al-Anon thinking that stopping drinking was the answer for my ex-AH. But what happened was a realization that there was some seriously messed up thinking going on even when sober.
Anyway - just musing on your post while I nurse my own coffee addiction. I am shutting up now! ; )
Thanks again for sharing.
~T
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Actually, sadheart, I have not found this to be true, which is why I posted this.
It is not true that people with moderate to advanced addiction exhibit these behaviors, and it absolutely matters whether a behavior is rooted in a PD rather than an addiction. Addictions are actually much easier to treat, and to recover fully from, than PDs. It can be very useful to recognize the difference.
It is not true that people with moderate to advanced addiction exhibit these behaviors, and it absolutely matters whether a behavior is rooted in a PD rather than an addiction. Addictions are actually much easier to treat, and to recover fully from, than PDs. It can be very useful to recognize the difference.
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Certainly I think that anyone who struggles with addiction should also seek help to determine if there is anything else going on like a personality disorder or other mental illness. That would be very helpful to know for the addict/alcoholic.
However, from the point of view of a loved one, perhaps not. If someone is on the receiving end of torrents of abuse, it doesn't make any difference why. From this side of the equation, we need to work on getting ourselves away from the abuse and learning why we have returned to it over and over again. We need to learn to establish our own healthy boundaries and to recognize and honor those put in place by others.
Just my random, also coffee fueled, thoughts.
However, from the point of view of a loved one, perhaps not. If someone is on the receiving end of torrents of abuse, it doesn't make any difference why. From this side of the equation, we need to work on getting ourselves away from the abuse and learning why we have returned to it over and over again. We need to learn to establish our own healthy boundaries and to recognize and honor those put in place by others.
Just my random, also coffee fueled, thoughts.
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I definitely think axbf was a narcissist and coped with that by drinking; now that I look back on it he drank a lot more after a perceived injury or insult to his ego and then he would "rage" a lot too when things were going badly. Unfortunately I didn't realize what was going on until after we broke up and everytime I read a book about narcissism I see he had most of the signs.
Unfortunately most therapists think it is uncurable and most of the time you can't even get a narc to agree to go to counseling, mine would never go because he perceived everyone else to be the problem. Not that it matters now, but if I had known what I was getting into I would have run the other way... I guess I was pretty naive.
It's difficult enough for someone to stop drinking, if they have a whole host of other issues that the alcohol is simply masking, no wonder they don't want to get sober. But yeah, from the POV of a loved one, abuse is still abuse no matter why.
Unfortunately most therapists think it is uncurable and most of the time you can't even get a narc to agree to go to counseling, mine would never go because he perceived everyone else to be the problem. Not that it matters now, but if I had known what I was getting into I would have run the other way... I guess I was pretty naive.
It's difficult enough for someone to stop drinking, if they have a whole host of other issues that the alcohol is simply masking, no wonder they don't want to get sober. But yeah, from the POV of a loved one, abuse is still abuse no matter why.
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Thank you OTL great thread!!!!!
I do believe both you and Sadheart are correct. You are saying the same things using different words, ie coming to the same problem from different angles.
I started drinking at age 12. It was not until I got sober 24 years later and was sober and clean for a while that I started to understand that I had been self medicating for all those years.
It was not until I was 9 years sober, yes 9 years that I was finally diagnosed with besides being an alcoholic I was Bi Polar. Bi Polar also produces the above personality traits.
Now, here is something else for you to contemplate. Although I started drinking at age 12, the above personality traits did not start to exhibit themselves until I was well into my 20's. Now did I have those PD's before I started drinking and the alcohol finally allowed them to appear, or were they caused solely by the alcohol and not the underlying Bi Polar? roflmao
Which came first, the chicken or the egg?
To me it does not matter. When I found recovery, I was slowly given some 'tools' that helped me to once again become a 'civilized' human being living in today's society. As I stayed sober and clean I found more tools and more tools yet again when I started seeing my Psych Doctor.
Some A's work hard on themselves in recovery and do change (I believe I am one of those) and other A's get sober and clean and stop there. They are still the same a-holes they were while they were drinking.
Now I'll put on my codependent hat and say that yes, being a friend and family member of several A's I had to become totally aware that the A might not change too much if they did find recovery, or they may change a lot. They have a crossroads when they seek recovery and it will be their decision which road to take, whether to get professional help or not. In other words, I have to stand back, continue to work on me and WATCH THE A's ACTIONS.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
I do believe both you and Sadheart are correct. You are saying the same things using different words, ie coming to the same problem from different angles.
I started drinking at age 12. It was not until I got sober 24 years later and was sober and clean for a while that I started to understand that I had been self medicating for all those years.
It was not until I was 9 years sober, yes 9 years that I was finally diagnosed with besides being an alcoholic I was Bi Polar. Bi Polar also produces the above personality traits.
Now, here is something else for you to contemplate. Although I started drinking at age 12, the above personality traits did not start to exhibit themselves until I was well into my 20's. Now did I have those PD's before I started drinking and the alcohol finally allowed them to appear, or were they caused solely by the alcohol and not the underlying Bi Polar? roflmao
Which came first, the chicken or the egg?
To me it does not matter. When I found recovery, I was slowly given some 'tools' that helped me to once again become a 'civilized' human being living in today's society. As I stayed sober and clean I found more tools and more tools yet again when I started seeing my Psych Doctor.
Some A's work hard on themselves in recovery and do change (I believe I am one of those) and other A's get sober and clean and stop there. They are still the same a-holes they were while they were drinking.
Now I'll put on my codependent hat and say that yes, being a friend and family member of several A's I had to become totally aware that the A might not change too much if they did find recovery, or they may change a lot. They have a crossroads when they seek recovery and it will be their decision which road to take, whether to get professional help or not. In other words, I have to stand back, continue to work on me and WATCH THE A's ACTIONS.
J M H O
Love and hugs,
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I like what everyone is saying here and have always had the chicken or the egg approach that Laurie mentions above. My AH started drinking when he was 14, but no one in his family thought he had a problem so he didn't either since they were all alcoholics, go figure. AH was the youngest and always getting into trouble, always had problems with authority, struggled in school, got into all kinds of trouble, had hit and runs, got his license taken away, etc. All before the ripe old age of 17.
I guess these things should have been red flags to me, but his personality disordered stuff really didn't start getting bad until he was in his mid to late 20s, after we had already been together for a few years. I started thinking he was bi-polar or had a personality disorder, but didn't even factor in the alcoholism stuff because he was dry, and had been since before we got married.
I swear I've bounced this theory around so many countless times. I used to think: Well, if he's going to blame me for one more thing, he might as well start drinking again so at least I can blame the alcohol for his behavior. I just never was able to put it all together, mainly because one day he acted like a narcissist and the next day it was like he fit the profile for obsessive compulsive personality disorder, and then the next day he fit the antisocial personality disorder profile. Anyway, I just chalked it up to personality disorder, in general, mixed in with some depression, ADHD, and anxiety. He's always had quite the cocktail. And, now that he's started drinking I can see where he's completed the circle of what he started when he was a teen......or did he? And, does it really matter in the end? I think what's most important is that people(addicts and non addicts alike) get help for their mental health problems. I'm basically in the camp of; treat the symptoms, never mind the chicken or the egg because it's so far removed from the present that it doesn't matter anymore. Does that make sense?
I guess these things should have been red flags to me, but his personality disordered stuff really didn't start getting bad until he was in his mid to late 20s, after we had already been together for a few years. I started thinking he was bi-polar or had a personality disorder, but didn't even factor in the alcoholism stuff because he was dry, and had been since before we got married.
I swear I've bounced this theory around so many countless times. I used to think: Well, if he's going to blame me for one more thing, he might as well start drinking again so at least I can blame the alcohol for his behavior. I just never was able to put it all together, mainly because one day he acted like a narcissist and the next day it was like he fit the profile for obsessive compulsive personality disorder, and then the next day he fit the antisocial personality disorder profile. Anyway, I just chalked it up to personality disorder, in general, mixed in with some depression, ADHD, and anxiety. He's always had quite the cocktail. And, now that he's started drinking I can see where he's completed the circle of what he started when he was a teen......or did he? And, does it really matter in the end? I think what's most important is that people(addicts and non addicts alike) get help for their mental health problems. I'm basically in the camp of; treat the symptoms, never mind the chicken or the egg because it's so far removed from the present that it doesn't matter anymore. Does that make sense?
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The subject of addiction/alcoholism and personality disorders has come up many times here. So many folks who live with addicted people say how closely the addict in their life matches the personality traits of those with NPD and Sociopathy. This tells me they are related somehow. Good thread, thanks.
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Originally Posted by lizatola 
And, does it really matter in the end? I think what's most important is that people(addicts and non addicts alike) get help for their mental health problems. I'm basically in the camp of; treat the symptoms, never mind the chicken or the egg because it's so far removed from the present that it doesn't matter anymore. Does that make sense?
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Addiction is classified by the AMA as a mental illness. Often addicts suffer from other mental health problems like depression and bipolar but in the end it's irrelevant because the onus is on me to deal with my codependency. I'm the one who has to take action to take care of myself and deal with my issues. I'm also a recovering alcoholic (21 years) who suffers from major depressive disorder. For that I have a wonderful shrink. For the rest I go to AA.
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