the ocean isn't big enough
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the ocean isn't big enough
Hello. Thank you for all your submissions to this site. I am reading everything I can here and this really helps me so much in coming to understand this crazy place I'm in.
17 years of marriage with my AH and four children later, I've finally gotten to the place of no return.
LONG STORY.
In the meantime, I'm living on one side of the ocean while my lying, cheating, manipulating, controlling AH tells everybody back home how I'm CRAZY and that's why my suggestions that he is aggressive and scary and alcoholic are completely invalid. He is so convincing that even the family doctor, my midwife, my mother, the police - everyone gets convinced by him, at least for the time they are under his spell - that it's me and not him that might need help.
Oops, sorry, but that's not the point.
This is what I need help figuring out, if there is anyone out there with children whose been in this predicament - and I sincerely hope no one has been through this. It's this: last time he was here, for three nights, after not seeing us for 5 weeks. I didn't know how he'd be, but while we were all together this summer he was scary and the neighbor called the police and I didn't let him stay in the house over night for weeks. This time, he was okay for the first day. As in, seeming sober, genuine, trying clearly very hard to stay with it for us. Day 2, totally superficial, not making eye contact, asking questions but ignoring responses - but not scary. Day 3 - late coming home, scary, stressed, I didn't sleep all night because I was afraid for me and the children. Final morning before departure...psychotic, coming at me, not responding to the children, threatening me - I had to go and get the neighbors and then the police.
Sorry, trying to keep this short!!! OK, now 5 weeks later and he is returning for four nights. I told him that after last time, he cannot stay in our place and he will have to stay in a hotel in another town. He agreed finally. He arrives in a few days.
The younger children were here with me when I had to get the neighbors. They were completely freaked at the time, but seem to have put it aside. I have a psychologist working with me to help them and she says I should stay with the children while they are with my AH. I never want to see him again, but the children want to see him and the oldest weren't there so they aren't sure whether I am exaggerating things quite a bit or not.
I would never see him again but I know that my children want their father. Until I started detaching and he got more out of control, he spent lots of time with them doing fun things and they miss him.
I would be grateful for any feedback you can give me about this upcoming situation!!!
17 years of marriage with my AH and four children later, I've finally gotten to the place of no return.
LONG STORY.
In the meantime, I'm living on one side of the ocean while my lying, cheating, manipulating, controlling AH tells everybody back home how I'm CRAZY and that's why my suggestions that he is aggressive and scary and alcoholic are completely invalid. He is so convincing that even the family doctor, my midwife, my mother, the police - everyone gets convinced by him, at least for the time they are under his spell - that it's me and not him that might need help.
Oops, sorry, but that's not the point.
This is what I need help figuring out, if there is anyone out there with children whose been in this predicament - and I sincerely hope no one has been through this. It's this: last time he was here, for three nights, after not seeing us for 5 weeks. I didn't know how he'd be, but while we were all together this summer he was scary and the neighbor called the police and I didn't let him stay in the house over night for weeks. This time, he was okay for the first day. As in, seeming sober, genuine, trying clearly very hard to stay with it for us. Day 2, totally superficial, not making eye contact, asking questions but ignoring responses - but not scary. Day 3 - late coming home, scary, stressed, I didn't sleep all night because I was afraid for me and the children. Final morning before departure...psychotic, coming at me, not responding to the children, threatening me - I had to go and get the neighbors and then the police.
Sorry, trying to keep this short!!! OK, now 5 weeks later and he is returning for four nights. I told him that after last time, he cannot stay in our place and he will have to stay in a hotel in another town. He agreed finally. He arrives in a few days.
The younger children were here with me when I had to get the neighbors. They were completely freaked at the time, but seem to have put it aside. I have a psychologist working with me to help them and she says I should stay with the children while they are with my AH. I never want to see him again, but the children want to see him and the oldest weren't there so they aren't sure whether I am exaggerating things quite a bit or not.
I would never see him again but I know that my children want their father. Until I started detaching and he got more out of control, he spent lots of time with them doing fun things and they miss him.
I would be grateful for any feedback you can give me about this upcoming situation!!!
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
I don't have children so I can only respond in the capacity of an opinion.
Take heed that your AH is scary. I think children adapt to situations better than we adults because for them it becomes "normal" - didn't we all have that moment when we went to someone else's house and lost the sense that what happened in our homes (be it good or bad) wasn't the same (as we think) in other people's homes? Abuse can be that way too - it can become "normal".
My question is in the times that you have called the police have you gotten a report? Is all this being documented? You may need this in the future - maybe sooner rather than later so please document what has been happening.
I have 3 cats that are my children. When I go out of town I take them with me instead of leaving them in the care of AH. If I had children and this was happening I would not leave them in his care. No way. Maybe he isn't abusive to them, maybe he is only abusive to you - but it could turn on them too. More than that I wouldn't be able to lose the fear that he was driving drunk with them. Or not watching them, or that he was pissed off and would take them back to where ever he lives.
Tough situation - especially if they want to see him. But we are adults and they are children and sometimes (or most often) Mama knows best.
Good luck with this.
Take heed that your AH is scary. I think children adapt to situations better than we adults because for them it becomes "normal" - didn't we all have that moment when we went to someone else's house and lost the sense that what happened in our homes (be it good or bad) wasn't the same (as we think) in other people's homes? Abuse can be that way too - it can become "normal".
My question is in the times that you have called the police have you gotten a report? Is all this being documented? You may need this in the future - maybe sooner rather than later so please document what has been happening.
I have 3 cats that are my children. When I go out of town I take them with me instead of leaving them in the care of AH. If I had children and this was happening I would not leave them in his care. No way. Maybe he isn't abusive to them, maybe he is only abusive to you - but it could turn on them too. More than that I wouldn't be able to lose the fear that he was driving drunk with them. Or not watching them, or that he was pissed off and would take them back to where ever he lives.
Tough situation - especially if they want to see him. But we are adults and they are children and sometimes (or most often) Mama knows best.
Good luck with this.
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,243
Love the name! Used to love Pippi as a kid...
Sorry about your situation. My first XA, father of my kids was not always stable enough for the kids to be around and at many points he had to see them supervised.
You are seperated and not divorced? And he is one country and he is in another and flys over just to see the kids?
Is he stable during the day or is he an A that drinks every waking minute?
Do you have an attorney? Document, document, document... keep a diary. save voicesmails etc, etc...
Sorry about your situation. My first XA, father of my kids was not always stable enough for the kids to be around and at many points he had to see them supervised.
You are seperated and not divorced? And he is one country and he is in another and flys over just to see the kids?
Is he stable during the day or is he an A that drinks every waking minute?
Do you have an attorney? Document, document, document... keep a diary. save voicesmails etc, etc...
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,038
Thank you for your replies! Ah, to be not alone in this! 
I can't write a lot of details write now, because I'm still on the computer I think is bugged. Maybe later I can get to a friend's house and I'll explain more.
My AH has become scary at times, so scary to me that the last time I feared for my life because he came at me saying he was finally going to get me and I barely made it out the door. I later had the police verify that he had left to the airport and wasn't lurking around town waiting to get me or snatch one of the children.
But no one but me - and now my two youngest - has ever witnessed him like that. The world still believes that he is the nicest, smartest fellow, although he is beginning to mess up more. My mother was furious with me when I told her what was happening this summer, until she came to stay with us and see for herself. She didn't leave for 3 weeks, totally against her nature to stay more than a day or two, because she feared so for us.
But our two oldest children - teens - keep rolling their eyes at me which makes my life incredibly difficult. This is worse in some ways than having to deal with my AH. The oldest somewhat understands but yes, it has all been normalized for them as it was for me.
All the drinking is done in secret and it is the rare instance where I catch him or where he loses it completely so it is obvious that he has been drinking. In fact, I'm not sure if drugs aren't perhaps involved as well.
We have been mostly separated for over a year now, but as a function in part of my AH's work and my wish to remain here with the children.
The legal piece I'll write about later on another machine!
He is going to be in a rage to have me remain with the children, rather than drop them off with him. However, I am, contrary to some opinions
completely in my right mind and I can't imagine leaving them unattended. We have no legal agreement/protections around this for the time being. I think we'll have to hang out in public places all 6 of us while he is around. Go to the park, skating rink - stuff like that.
In the meantime, the stuff he's been doing back on the other side of the ocean makes my skin crawl. I find his behavior beyond repugnant and I've never known anyone in my life to be so, so cruel.
I can't write a lot of details write now, because I'm still on the computer I think is bugged. Maybe later I can get to a friend's house and I'll explain more.
My AH has become scary at times, so scary to me that the last time I feared for my life because he came at me saying he was finally going to get me and I barely made it out the door. I later had the police verify that he had left to the airport and wasn't lurking around town waiting to get me or snatch one of the children.
But no one but me - and now my two youngest - has ever witnessed him like that. The world still believes that he is the nicest, smartest fellow, although he is beginning to mess up more. My mother was furious with me when I told her what was happening this summer, until she came to stay with us and see for herself. She didn't leave for 3 weeks, totally against her nature to stay more than a day or two, because she feared so for us.
But our two oldest children - teens - keep rolling their eyes at me which makes my life incredibly difficult. This is worse in some ways than having to deal with my AH. The oldest somewhat understands but yes, it has all been normalized for them as it was for me.
All the drinking is done in secret and it is the rare instance where I catch him or where he loses it completely so it is obvious that he has been drinking. In fact, I'm not sure if drugs aren't perhaps involved as well.
We have been mostly separated for over a year now, but as a function in part of my AH's work and my wish to remain here with the children.
The legal piece I'll write about later on another machine!
He is going to be in a rage to have me remain with the children, rather than drop them off with him. However, I am, contrary to some opinions
completely in my right mind and I can't imagine leaving them unattended. We have no legal agreement/protections around this for the time being. I think we'll have to hang out in public places all 6 of us while he is around. Go to the park, skating rink - stuff like that. In the meantime, the stuff he's been doing back on the other side of the ocean makes my skin crawl. I find his behavior beyond repugnant and I've never known anyone in my life to be so, so cruel.
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Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 1,038
Hopeworks,
As to how often he drinks. He seems to be way more out of control with his drinking since last spring. I think he binges, and he can be terrible at 7am as well as in the evening.
If there is any pattern at all, it's that he drinks fast in the afternoon, after hitting the liquor store. Then he drives home. He starts washing dishes or does other chores to avoid contact, especially eye contact, with me. He likes to take the children outside and likes me to go away during that time. He doesn't eat dinner although he may make a quick dish for the children. Late at night he may sober up enough to start work on the computer and then can stay up until 2 or so writing.
But when he completely and utterly lost it this last time that I saw him, he couldn't have been just drinking. He worked until 2am on his computer. Then I stayed awake all night while he lightly slept, afraid that he'd do something - I don't know what. So I know he wasn't drinking after dinner and beyond. And he went beserk at 7:30am.
He seemed to be psychotic. Even the neighbors couldn't snap him out of it, really.
As to how often he drinks. He seems to be way more out of control with his drinking since last spring. I think he binges, and he can be terrible at 7am as well as in the evening.
If there is any pattern at all, it's that he drinks fast in the afternoon, after hitting the liquor store. Then he drives home. He starts washing dishes or does other chores to avoid contact, especially eye contact, with me. He likes to take the children outside and likes me to go away during that time. He doesn't eat dinner although he may make a quick dish for the children. Late at night he may sober up enough to start work on the computer and then can stay up until 2 or so writing.
But when he completely and utterly lost it this last time that I saw him, he couldn't have been just drinking. He worked until 2am on his computer. Then I stayed awake all night while he lightly slept, afraid that he'd do something - I don't know what. So I know he wasn't drinking after dinner and beyond. And he went beserk at 7:30am.
He seemed to be psychotic. Even the neighbors couldn't snap him out of it, really.
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Join Date: Apr 2012
Posts: 326
Sooner or later everyone will see what you see. First it was just you, then your mother, now your two younger kids. And the neighbors who couldn't snap him out of 'it' (even if they don't know what 'it' is, they know something is wrong). And you said your oldest is starting to get a clue.
So eventually all will be revealed.
I had kids with a crazy alkie too. They lose interest after a while, although my oldest recently spent an afternoon with my ex after not seeing him in 8 years. The other two have no interest at all.
In your shoes, I'd insist when he visits he stays in a hotel and only arrange visits with the kids who want to spend time with him in a public place. The last year my kids did visitation with my ex, it was always at a restaurant like Denny's. That way the kids can get their dad fix and be safe and their are witnesses. They can also skype and text and call. Let them lead on what they want and don't want to do with dad.
If the psychologist says not to leave them alone with dad, you can do what I did. They sat at one table at Denny's and I sat at another so they had privacy.
There's no reason ever to have him on your property if he is not a co owner. No reason ever to be alone with him.
The kids will catch on eventually.
So eventually all will be revealed.
I had kids with a crazy alkie too. They lose interest after a while, although my oldest recently spent an afternoon with my ex after not seeing him in 8 years. The other two have no interest at all.
In your shoes, I'd insist when he visits he stays in a hotel and only arrange visits with the kids who want to spend time with him in a public place. The last year my kids did visitation with my ex, it was always at a restaurant like Denny's. That way the kids can get their dad fix and be safe and their are witnesses. They can also skype and text and call. Let them lead on what they want and don't want to do with dad.
If the psychologist says not to leave them alone with dad, you can do what I did. They sat at one table at Denny's and I sat at another so they had privacy.
There's no reason ever to have him on your property if he is not a co owner. No reason ever to be alone with him.
The kids will catch on eventually.
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Thanks Sadheart.
The restaurant idea is a good one. I'll bring a book.
When you say that your ex was a crazy alkie - what exactly differentiates an alkie from a crazy alkie?! Mine definitely seems to share traits with psychopaths, from my reading. The children's psychologist says he may have narcissistic personality disorder, or worse.
Either way, he terrified me and I felt like I was witnessing a psychotic break.
I can't believe I'm going to have to see him again.
The restaurant idea is a good one. I'll bring a book.
When you say that your ex was a crazy alkie - what exactly differentiates an alkie from a crazy alkie?! Mine definitely seems to share traits with psychopaths, from my reading. The children's psychologist says he may have narcissistic personality disorder, or worse.
Either way, he terrified me and I felt like I was witnessing a psychotic break.
I can't believe I'm going to have to see him again.
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Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: atlanta, ga
Posts: 3,581
Crazy behavior is crazy behavior period. Alcohol involved or not. My intital thought is bipolar but that's because I live with one and his actions kind of seem familiar though he hasn't threatened to "get" me..... I probably shouldn't say that because it could be a myriad of things.
Good suggestions on here how to handle this. Again so sorry.....
Good suggestions on here how to handle this. Again so sorry.....
My emotional baggage
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Northern CA
Posts: 285
Pippi,
I am not sure if you are here in the states but if so you can get a ex parte order to see the judge and get supervised visits or no visits set up. Your husband does not even have to be there, mine was not. This will be just temporary until the courts can determine what is going on. Just a suggestion but coming to the court with the information that you and or your neighbors had to call the police on him should be more than enough......
4MyBoys
I am not sure if you are here in the states but if so you can get a ex parte order to see the judge and get supervised visits or no visits set up. Your husband does not even have to be there, mine was not. This will be just temporary until the courts can determine what is going on. Just a suggestion but coming to the court with the information that you and or your neighbors had to call the police on him should be more than enough......
4MyBoys
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Thanks so much to everyone here for all of the good advice.
I really feel like I am moving forward. It is incredibly grounding to communicate with all of you who have lived with an active alcoholic.
This morning I really want to write to my AH (I no longer agree to speak with him on the phone. We communicate by email, and I only do this out of necessity at this point). A few days ago, he wrote to say that he wants to spend as much time with the children and myself as he can while he is here. I feel like what I need to respond with is that time is not the most important thing that we need from him, especially given that he was scary around the younger ones the last time he visited. I want to write that he needs to get intensive treatment for his alcoholism, and having their dad sober and squarely on the path of recovery is the only solution. Otherwise, this time with him could just serve to disappoint, and even traumatize them (and me).
Does it even make sense to communicate this? I feel like I might as well write to my 2-foot-thick kitchen wall.
The legal advice I get says that if he is drunk or scary around the children, I should take them home and then write to him to explain that the children can't be around him while he is behaving in that way or under the influence.
Thanks so much for your help! I find it much easier to get information about being the spouse of an alcoholic than to learn what to do as the mother of children with an alcoholic parent.
I really feel like I am moving forward. It is incredibly grounding to communicate with all of you who have lived with an active alcoholic.
This morning I really want to write to my AH (I no longer agree to speak with him on the phone. We communicate by email, and I only do this out of necessity at this point). A few days ago, he wrote to say that he wants to spend as much time with the children and myself as he can while he is here. I feel like what I need to respond with is that time is not the most important thing that we need from him, especially given that he was scary around the younger ones the last time he visited. I want to write that he needs to get intensive treatment for his alcoholism, and having their dad sober and squarely on the path of recovery is the only solution. Otherwise, this time with him could just serve to disappoint, and even traumatize them (and me).
Does it even make sense to communicate this? I feel like I might as well write to my 2-foot-thick kitchen wall.
The legal advice I get says that if he is drunk or scary around the children, I should take them home and then write to him to explain that the children can't be around him while he is behaving in that way or under the influence.
Thanks so much for your help! I find it much easier to get information about being the spouse of an alcoholic than to learn what to do as the mother of children with an alcoholic parent.
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