dandylion

I am wondering if anyone on the board is or has been in a close relationship with anyone with asperger's?

I guess that I am just needing some validation that I am not "crazy"--LOL. I am still reeling from a conversation that I had, yesterday with my ex-husband.

In a nutshell--we have been divorced for a few decades, but he is still a very entrenched member of my extended family. Attends family holidays, and, has contact with them o n regular basis. As a matter of fact we have maintained a friendship relationship. He doesn't drink or do drugs. He is very high functioning. He is a cardiologist (recently retired) and very accomplished professionally and very socially active--although I think all his relationships are fairly "superficial" and nobody seems to know the "real" him---except for me.

Whenever I express any irritation or frustration about him---people don't understand because he has such a "good guy" image!!!

The conversation that I am referring to is this: My 92yr. old mother has a 21yr. old cat that is going into renal failure. This cat belonged to my sister who passed from MS 21/2yrs ago. She is very attached to the cat, and knows that he doesn't have a lot more time. My ex asked me if I felt that my mother would grieve or feel relieved when the cat passes. I replied that she will grieve terribly, and has already begun to grieve to a certain extent--in anticipation.

He became quite irritated at my reply, and launched into a "lecture" about how ridiculous this was---because cats don't live forever, and that we should realize that it's life-span is over. He feels that excess emotion--other than a momentary sadness is a pathological excess of emotion.

I was so angry at his lack of sensitivity that I sharply reprimanded him for his cold and intellectual approach. He was P***** at m e for being angry back at him. I told him that I could no longer continue this upsetting conversation---and hung up.

WTF!!!! At times, he can be very kind and generous--other times, it is as if he just landed from MARS!!!

Can anyone relate to what I am talking about?


dandylion

lizatola

My AH has said many times that he thought he had Aspergers. Who knows, but I can totally relate. My dad was like that, too. The minute I shed a tear, I was wrong because the emotion wasn't what HE was feeling and he couldn't handle it being different from his own reaction.

At least, as an adult, you have a choice to hang up the phone and just chalk it up to his lack of insensitivity. It reminds me that even non-A's can be difficult and have problems with personality issues and emotions.

bamboo10

From what I have understood about aspbergers-they have a different mindset. They don't feel emotions in the same way as we do. I know people with aspbergers personally but If you don't I reccommend watching the show parenthood. The little boy max has aspbergers. When his family. Tells him his mom has cancer he says ok and walks away. Then he thinks about it-does his research-and starts asking questions about if she will need chemotherapy and all that stuff. He doesn't respond with a single but of emotion-just facts. That's the way a person with aspbergers mind works. He most likely sees it as your moms car has lived a long life and this is just the circle of life closing for the cat. He doesn't think about how much of a part of your moms life the cat was, or that the cat may remind you all of its connection to your sister. There isn't much you can do besides realize this-and try to discuss only very important emotional things with him and know Going in that he will most likely not give you the emotional response one would expect. Hope this helps a little.

dandylion

Dear bamboo10, Yes!, I love the program, Parenthood. I am fascinated with the presentation of max. The show does a fabulous job of realistically depicting the asperger's---and that actor is fabulous. The way he goes through all the "changes" is difficult for any actor!!

I agree with your post very much. This kind of reaction is one of the reasons that we are no longer married--LOL. It is so frustrating, though, because most people don't pick up on this stuff with him. Even though he knows a lot of people, I probable got closer to him than any other person has. Therefore, I can cite more emotion in him---he hates any negative emotions (or overly strong emotions). I point out that he is very high functioning. Amazing that he has been such a successful doctor. Of course, he is very intelligent and can be very charming at times--especially in environments where he is the one in control.

I appreciate being able to "talk" about this.

Thanks, LIZ and bamboo10.

dandylion

knarfia

I'm a little confused by this. From my understanding, people with Aspergers usually aren't well understood by people, so having everyone thinking of him as the "good guy" seems strange to me. I say this because I've often suspected that I have it, and I don't think anyone would describe me that way. They'd probably say, "That girl who's a little... off," or something like that. I'm just no good socially. His response about the cat seemed more on the sociopathic side... or is it just realistic? I don't know. It seems that westerners tend to view death in such a different way than other cultures, which actually celebrate it. I don't know. I guess I don't see anything so wrong with what he said. If he'd said it to her, than yes, absolutely, that would be inappropriate. But maybe I just really do have Aspergers and that's why I can't see it. I digress.

Thumper

I think both your responses and reactions were completely valid, expected, and typical for your individual brains. It is really the only response you could each produce. Difficult at best I would imagine.

dandylion

Dear knarfia, as I said, he typically doesn't typically get close to many people. And, he is very low-key. He occupied a high status position at a university medical school (never in private practice). He recieved a lot of deference from people--rarely challenged. He could basically "glide" along. A lot like people who can do well at a cocktail party---where conversations are generally superficial, but without getting deeply engaged at a personal level. He did have a few "quirky" mannerisms, at time, but most people would just assume that it was an individual variant. They were more evident at some times more than others (especially in stressful or unusual circumstances). (people often overlook quirkieness in professors).

One time, I had a ruptured ectopic pregnancy and drove myself to the hospital. I arrived in shock from hemorrhage and was rushed to the OR for emergency surgery. The E.R. doctor called him to tell him. He didn't come to the hospital until many hours l ater--after walking the dogs, doing some catch-up paperwork, etc... When I asked him what took him so long--he replied that he wasn't a surgeon, so he couldn't do anything and, besides, he knew I would be in recovery for a long time. He thought it didn't make any practical sense to hang around the hallways.

Does this help any?

dandylion

MTBChick

I teach special education and thus know quite a bit about aspebergers and Autism. Individuals who are High Functioning Aspebergers and have learned to take other people perspectives into consideration can get by with out most people being non the wiser that something is a little off with them. So yes doesn't surprise me that many thought he was a great guy and that he did well in his career. Where one would notice more of the quirks if you will would be in more closer relationships like marriage and intimate relationships. Even with the quirks it's important to realize that it doesn't make them wrong it's just their way of viewing the world... And sometimes it's hard for them to be able to take a different perspective. So in this instance I don't think either of you are wrong in your views. He is likely to never realize how his view hurts or frustrates you that being said why not just detach and accept him for who he is that he is going to say insensitive things not bc he is trying to hurt you but bc that is just who he is and how he says things. Maybe that will help you not take it so personally. I know it's hard. If I could do it myself I wouldn't be affected by the alcoholics in my life.

knarfia

I'm sorry. I'm sure you have been through a lot with him.

amooseoncebitmysister

Dandylion, I have close relationships with several Asperger-diagnosed people. What you describe sounds exactly what I would expect from them; they don't really understand other people's emotions, and they have had to learn that other people *have* emotions. They've had to learn that other people's feelings are important, and learn how to civilly cope with other people's feelings.

It sounds like you know who he is. One can't get blood from a stone. It sounds like he has many strengths; empathy is obviously one of his weaknesses (and boy do I understand how frustrating that can be).

I admire your ability to maintain a friendship with your ex, after your divorce/separation.

(and I'm sorry to hear about your mom's CRF cat)

lillamy

I've worked with several people with Aspergers (as coworkers), and actually am in the middle of a project right now where the woman I'm working with is extremely high-functioning Aspergers. I think it's important to remember that part of the syndrome involves that the Aspergers person doesn't seem to be able to relate to, or have sympathy with, other people's feelings. They also often have problems expressing or even understanding their own feelings, let alone the feelings of others.

To me, your XH's behavior seems to be textbook Aspergers -- he's highly rational, and to him, the rational facts are that cats don't live as long as people and your mother should therefore be aware that the cat will die before she does. Ergo, her feelings make no sense and making sense, rationally, is often the only thing people with Aspergers have to navigate after.

My coworker has trained herself to mimic sympathy and emotional understanding, but when you spend significant time with her, you can tell that other people's expressions of emotion are like a foreign language to her, and she often comes across a bit "robotic" in her attempts at relating. I've seen her be kicked from project to project simply because she's so incredibly RATIONAL that people are uncomfortable around her. For some reason, she and I work well together -- and she can accept when I tell her things like "most people find it rude when you walk into their office and start straightening their papers or pick up their personal items or try on their glasses" but she doesn't understand that on her own.

choublak

Ever watch The Big Bang Theory? Sheldon Cooper is believed to have Aspergers.

onlythetruth

My mother has Asperger's. She's 85, and also has Alzheimer's now, which is an interesting mix to say the least.

I always knew that my mom was "off"--we all did. She was in her "own little world" most of the time, pursuing the focused interests that most people with Asperger's have, which definitely interfered with her parenting. And while she wasn't intentionally mean or vindictive, she was socially unaware--so she often said tactless and hurtful things but could not understand why others were upset. To her, if her comments were empirically true there was no reason she shouldn't say them.

I have mixed feelings about being raised by a person with Aspergers. For the most part it was difficult, because she was truly "different", very detached, and often behaved in ways that made me think she did not care about me. It would have helped if I had known that her behavior had nothing to do with me, that it was caused by the Aspergers, but we had no diagnosis until I was well into middle age. When I did find out, I had a huge sense of relief that there was a reason for her behavior--other than me being unloveable.

lillamy

That's just about the most on-the-mark statement I've heard about people with Asperger's.

Helenlee

I have several family member who are on the asperges spectrum & am living with an asperges partner who is very much like your ex-husband. I have at times questioned wether I also qualify for the diagnosis ... I've done several tests that indicate I do, but my psychologist disagrees. After being raised by an asperges/alcoholic & a co-dependent parent, raising an asperges son, & now living with an asperges partner - maybe I'm just plain old crazy
I did find a blog written by a guy with asperges that provided me with some very useful insights into their thought process & helped me understand things better from the aspies perspective.
My suggestion for your situation with your ex is to just let it go. He is who he is. You are who you are. The frustration comes when you expect him to function as a non-aspie ... something of which he is incapable. You however, are capable of having objectivity & perspective about what is occurring & you're the one who is going to have to do the accommodating. It sucks to ALWAYS be the one accommodating - but the alternative is to always be the one who is tearing their hair out - which is not fun unless you happen to be aiming to become bald & stressed

keepingmyjoy1

Very interesting discussion. It makes me sincerely wonder if my AH has it. Hmmm...

choublak

So, how is Aspergers different from sociopathy? In both, feelings are absent...

dandylion

Dear Choublak, I am not an expert on this---but I think yours is a good and logical question to ask!

I am hoping that some other members who have more experience with this than I do can come along and give you a good understanding of this.

I, also, am interested in the answer.

dandylion

wantabe

I have a 17 year old son who has Aspergers.

The way I see it is that no two Aspies are the same, it is a diagnoses that covers a range of behaviors.

I believe that their brain is wired differently from NT(neurological typical) brains, but it is not that they don’t experience emotions. They do have trouble reading other’s emotional states and “reading between the lines”.

If you think about how babies and kids use this to learn to relate to other people, you can see how it not having this ability can affect an aspie and how he relates to other people.

My son went from a 3 year old that hid under a table at preschool to great young man who has great grades, just became an eagle scout and has learned through years of therapy(SLP not consoling) how to relate to other people(still not normally, but way closer than we thought he ever would).

He is still not NT and won’t ever be, but who really is.

onlythetruth

They are very different. Antisocial personality disorder/sociopathy is a personality disorder. Aspergers is a neurological condition.

People with APD are extremely manipulative. They "use" others to reach their desired ends and have little or no feelings of guilt about doing so. To them, people aren't people: they are tools to be used.

People with AS are not typically manipulative. Instead, they are unaware, "clueless" as to social cues, and when they hurt others it's because they don't understand why what they say or do could be hurtful.

In some ways AS the opposite of APD, because a person with APD is keenly aware of the impact of his behavior on others: he has to be, in order to effectively manipulate.