Is it possible for them to change or is it another quack?
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: mission viejo, ca
Posts: 134
Is it possible for them to change or is it another quack?
My ex swears up and down that he has changed and that things will be better in the long run. He was addicted to pills and mixed it with alcohol back in the day, no he drinks beer but i notice it is not out of control just a few now and then. He has been like that for 6 months now, so that is great!
But, what i want to know...is can they change? It seems like they can but i am afraid to fall for it and him turn again. Its not just the addiction but the other things I fear as well, I mean I am a women and I want to know that a man will provide for his family. He is 35 years old, still works part time at Costco, no car (even though he is getting close to having one), in EXTREAME DEBT..already filed for bankruptcy, in financial trouble with bad checks ALL BECAUSE OF HIS PAST. Wow, when I meet him 7 years ago, he was sooooo different! He had his own place, his own car, in school to be a firefighter, was in youth ministry leader, ON TOP OF THE WORLD… its amazing with drunks and drinking can do to your life. 2 DUIs, a bankruptcy, 2 car accidents and 1000s of dollars spent on pills cant turn your life for the worst.
Family and friends of mine all turned there back to him and if I choose him, I would lose all respect from them and my family would not even want to talk to me or see him. What kind of life is that, but when you love someone, all you want to do is run away to another state and be with him and start your own family but only if its worth it….how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon. I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?! The love I have for this man is indescribable! I guess all iam looking for is advice, is all of the pain worth it. Can he change, or is him balling and telling me to fight for him another manipulation.
HELP!
But, what i want to know...is can they change? It seems like they can but i am afraid to fall for it and him turn again. Its not just the addiction but the other things I fear as well, I mean I am a women and I want to know that a man will provide for his family. He is 35 years old, still works part time at Costco, no car (even though he is getting close to having one), in EXTREAME DEBT..already filed for bankruptcy, in financial trouble with bad checks ALL BECAUSE OF HIS PAST. Wow, when I meet him 7 years ago, he was sooooo different! He had his own place, his own car, in school to be a firefighter, was in youth ministry leader, ON TOP OF THE WORLD… its amazing with drunks and drinking can do to your life. 2 DUIs, a bankruptcy, 2 car accidents and 1000s of dollars spent on pills cant turn your life for the worst.
Family and friends of mine all turned there back to him and if I choose him, I would lose all respect from them and my family would not even want to talk to me or see him. What kind of life is that, but when you love someone, all you want to do is run away to another state and be with him and start your own family but only if its worth it….how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon. I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?! The love I have for this man is indescribable! I guess all iam looking for is advice, is all of the pain worth it. Can he change, or is him balling and telling me to fight for him another manipulation.
HELP!
Member
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 3,796
If they truly change, then they have no need to keep saying how much they've changed, because it's evident in their actions. Furthermore, someone who changes is so busy actually doing (instead of just talking about) the changes, they don't have all that extra time to talk about changes. Someone can be talking about changing, but spend most of their time talking and not doing.
RIP Sweet Suki
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: In my sanctuary, my home
Posts: 39,872
Actions, not words. Words are meaningless. IF he has changed, it will be evident in his actions. Make him prove what he is saying. Make him do that for a minimum of one year before considering taking him back. If he truly has changed and is changing, that won't be a problem. If he says he can't do it without you, then it is manipulation.
You shouldn't have to fight for him. That is a ridiculous statement. He either is what you want in a relationship partner or he isn't. It's that simple.
You shouldn't have to fight for him. That is a ridiculous statement. He either is what you want in a relationship partner or he isn't. It's that simple.
Iceberg Ahead!
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Out at Sea
Posts: 1,177
Actions speak louder than words. Hear with your eyes. If the active A's lips are moving, guess what? Addicts lie, conceal and manipulate; that's what they do. Until they have a long history of sobriety and recovery. He's still drinking. He's probably working NO program. He's still got his "stinking thinking", the "isms" that survive even if he were to become physically sober. He's not emotionally sober. He's had a lot of trauma; has he gotten any counseling for it? If not, that's a red flag too. He needs a lot of time in recovery, working it.
Go to an Al-Anon meeting, and focus on YOU and what is good for your own emotional and future well-being. Moving out of state, and away from those who actually care about you is a huge red flag, for YOUR life. Best wishes!
Go to an Al-Anon meeting, and focus on YOU and what is good for your own emotional and future well-being. Moving out of state, and away from those who actually care about you is a huge red flag, for YOUR life. Best wishes!
Member
Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: SAN FRANCISCO
Posts: 1,176
Yes it is possible, but I would be very skeptical unless he is is a recovery program or getting some kind of counseling.
More importantly, why do you think are you attracted to someone with so many problems? Don't get me wrong, I have done the same thing myself but someone with lots of financial problems and a history of addiction - he could just be looking for a caretaker and it sounds like you are getting sucked into the co-dependent's role. In my case I realize it was due to my own low self-esteem.
My last two boyfriends had LOTS of problems. I stuck it out with the second one for three years and his financial problems got better, but the drinking and the emotional problems never really resolved themselves. Was it worth the pain? I have to say no.
More importantly, why do you think are you attracted to someone with so many problems? Don't get me wrong, I have done the same thing myself but someone with lots of financial problems and a history of addiction - he could just be looking for a caretaker and it sounds like you are getting sucked into the co-dependent's role. In my case I realize it was due to my own low self-esteem.
My last two boyfriends had LOTS of problems. I stuck it out with the second one for three years and his financial problems got better, but the drinking and the emotional problems never really resolved themselves. Was it worth the pain? I have to say no.
Member
Join Date: Aug 2009
Posts: 3,443
Sure it is possible.
When you see him debt free, full time job/career, no legal trouble, a car, a house, a happy and sober life, and when he quits talking about what he will do and shows you what he has done - it is only then that you will know it is possible for him.
When you see him debt free, full time job/career, no legal trouble, a car, a house, a happy and sober life, and when he quits talking about what he will do and shows you what he has done - it is only then that you will know it is possible for him.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Anchorage, Alaska
Posts: 4,719
We shouldn't have to "fight for" anyone. What a ridiculous, Hollywood movie and romantic novel fueled perspective (*said in general, not toward you*) It is also a very immature mind set - that real love looks like that. But ya know - it does make for good stories and plot lines.
Reality is - people who change don't need to go around convincing others of that. They are confident that their actions speak louder than their words, and go on living a life that makes them feel like a good person inside.
Can people change? Absolutely! Will they? And will it be the change you think you want to see? Who knows?! More to be revealed...
Reality is - people who change don't need to go around convincing others of that. They are confident that their actions speak louder than their words, and go on living a life that makes them feel like a good person inside.
Can people change? Absolutely! Will they? And will it be the change you think you want to see? Who knows?! More to be revealed...
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: mission viejo, ca
Posts: 134
YOUR ALL SO RIGHT MAKES TOTAL SENSE... i told him to show me before and he just says i shouldnt have to change for you, you should love me for who I am. I do love him for who he is, just not the choices he makes.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 696
Family and friends of mine all turned there back to him and if I choose him, I would lose all respect from them and my family would not even want to talk to me or see him. What kind of life is that, but when you love someone, all you want to do is run away to another state and be with him and start your own family but only if its worth it
This was what I thought: When my XAH got out of rehab, he came home, told me he was sober, went to AA meetings. Went on a weekend drunk - walked in the door the next morning and wanted me to move with him 2,000 miles away from our family & friends. It was tempting.
I thought, Geez, I wont have to live in shame, guilt and I wont have to be embrassed anymore. I can run and be free to love him, without everyone knowing our business. Of course, they dont know him. I love him with everything that I have. Life would be better and our marriage would be wonderful. If we moved away, he would be nicer and he wouldnt want to drink anymore. The pressures of everyone thinking that my wonderful husband would be gone - BUT - something inside of me to stay back and let him go...
how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon.
Almost 2 years later, my XAH is sober. He use to make lot's of money, have a nice home and all of the richest material thing's anyone could ask for in life. He was handsome, well built and everyone liked him - TODAY: He lives with his mom/dad, all he owns is the clothes on his back. Works part-time and has let his body go to waste. YES, even though he is sober. It's NOT all there. His drive, his passion, and his get up & go is gone. Everything he does, must be set in a routine, if not his brain cant quite understand how to juggle more than one thing. His "MIND" is simple. That's how I see it anyway's. - Me, well I still have "fire" in my drive.
I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?!
It took me awhile before I could walk away. But now that I've seen the truth of what he is and what I am. Im glad that I did it. Was it easy, HELLo NO!!! It was the hardest thing Ive ever done in my life. Being codpendent, female, mommy and all of those flavor's of life, didnt help me much either. - NOW, I look at things differently.
SELF PRIDE for beginner's - I am not a mushroom, why should I live in the dark?
It took me awhile before I realized, how much I needed and wanted out of life and a marriage. And what I was actually sacrificing for happiness & love.
When my friends and family, stayed away from my XAH. I wondered too. But the problem was: I never realized how much "Healthy Normal" people can see a relationship for what it is, especially one that includes, huge dysfunction. - And most people, dont' want to be around it, let alone listen to it or see it. Some take their behaviors as "abuse", not a easy one for most to understand. Kind of like, petting a snake!
Can he change?....Question is: Does he want too or is he even mentally capable of doing so? - Mine can't and he won't - Even though he is sober
Getting REAL with youself, Honesty with yourself, like spooning down bad cough sryup, only you can do it, for you!!! - Once you work on work and get yourself healthy, you will know exactly what you need to do for YOU! - I wish I had the answers for you and I wish I could hold your hand and turn you in the right direction, but if I did that, you would never learn who you are and what you deserve in life.....
The best advice that I can give you;
1. Alanon
2. Read- Read - Read - Lot's of good book's listed on the sticky's above!
Sometimes Alanon members will also have some that you can borrow
3. Educate yourself
4. Codependent classes or books
5. Church
6. Find a life coach or counselor
7. WORK YOUR BRAIN, OPEN YOUR HEART and BE TRUE TO YOURSELF
8. Learn to love yourself - (that is a deep - hard job to learn how to do, because we've gone so long, of not taking care of ourselves...It's alway's about them- Really, think about how much time you consume each day, about him - And how much did you spend on you???....just sayin)
Remember, just because you buy a membership to the gym, doesnt make you lose weight - Just like saying: you want a happy life and not doing a dang thing about it. You have to work at it - daily, live eat and breathe it....
.....No magic potion - wish there was.....Ask yourself all of the Why's...You will find the answer, sooner or later
This was what I thought: When my XAH got out of rehab, he came home, told me he was sober, went to AA meetings. Went on a weekend drunk - walked in the door the next morning and wanted me to move with him 2,000 miles away from our family & friends. It was tempting.
I thought, Geez, I wont have to live in shame, guilt and I wont have to be embrassed anymore. I can run and be free to love him, without everyone knowing our business. Of course, they dont know him. I love him with everything that I have. Life would be better and our marriage would be wonderful. If we moved away, he would be nicer and he wouldnt want to drink anymore. The pressures of everyone thinking that my wonderful husband would be gone - BUT - something inside of me to stay back and let him go...
how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon.
Almost 2 years later, my XAH is sober. He use to make lot's of money, have a nice home and all of the richest material thing's anyone could ask for in life. He was handsome, well built and everyone liked him - TODAY: He lives with his mom/dad, all he owns is the clothes on his back. Works part-time and has let his body go to waste. YES, even though he is sober. It's NOT all there. His drive, his passion, and his get up & go is gone. Everything he does, must be set in a routine, if not his brain cant quite understand how to juggle more than one thing. His "MIND" is simple. That's how I see it anyway's. - Me, well I still have "fire" in my drive.
I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?!
It took me awhile before I could walk away. But now that I've seen the truth of what he is and what I am. Im glad that I did it. Was it easy, HELLo NO!!! It was the hardest thing Ive ever done in my life. Being codpendent, female, mommy and all of those flavor's of life, didnt help me much either. - NOW, I look at things differently.
SELF PRIDE for beginner's - I am not a mushroom, why should I live in the dark?
It took me awhile before I realized, how much I needed and wanted out of life and a marriage. And what I was actually sacrificing for happiness & love.
When my friends and family, stayed away from my XAH. I wondered too. But the problem was: I never realized how much "Healthy Normal" people can see a relationship for what it is, especially one that includes, huge dysfunction. - And most people, dont' want to be around it, let alone listen to it or see it. Some take their behaviors as "abuse", not a easy one for most to understand. Kind of like, petting a snake!
Can he change?....Question is: Does he want too or is he even mentally capable of doing so? - Mine can't and he won't - Even though he is sober
Getting REAL with youself, Honesty with yourself, like spooning down bad cough sryup, only you can do it, for you!!! - Once you work on work and get yourself healthy, you will know exactly what you need to do for YOU! - I wish I had the answers for you and I wish I could hold your hand and turn you in the right direction, but if I did that, you would never learn who you are and what you deserve in life.....
The best advice that I can give you;
1. Alanon
2. Read- Read - Read - Lot's of good book's listed on the sticky's above!
Sometimes Alanon members will also have some that you can borrow
3. Educate yourself
4. Codependent classes or books
5. Church
6. Find a life coach or counselor
7. WORK YOUR BRAIN, OPEN YOUR HEART and BE TRUE TO YOURSELF
8. Learn to love yourself - (that is a deep - hard job to learn how to do, because we've gone so long, of not taking care of ourselves...It's alway's about them- Really, think about how much time you consume each day, about him - And how much did you spend on you???....just sayin)
Remember, just because you buy a membership to the gym, doesnt make you lose weight - Just like saying: you want a happy life and not doing a dang thing about it. You have to work at it - daily, live eat and breathe it....
.....No magic potion - wish there was.....Ask yourself all of the Why's...You will find the answer, sooner or later
I'm no angel!
Join Date: May 2005
Location: tampa, fl
Posts: 6,728
If was going to change he would have already done so. The man has nothing to offer you, I'd listen to my family & friends, they are thinking with their heads not their hearts.
The choices he makes are actually who he is, bad decisions=bad results. You are grasping in the air for something that is not there and probably never will be.
The choices he makes are actually who he is, bad decisions=bad results. You are grasping in the air for something that is not there and probably never will be.
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 696
My choice's are who I am and what I like to do
I see nothing wrong with what I do or how I act
Even if Im a jackss, I dont care, it's all about me
No one's going to change me
Don't most people really live like that?
Ive seen people in 12step programs change for alot of different reasons
I know for me, I have BUT my XAH has not
It's really about "learning who you are" and what you want in life
Don't forget about the word; Respect from others & Respect for ourselves
- We all need it to survive!!!
I see nothing wrong with what I do or how I act
Even if Im a jackss, I dont care, it's all about me
No one's going to change me
Don't most people really live like that?
Ive seen people in 12step programs change for alot of different reasons
I know for me, I have BUT my XAH has not
It's really about "learning who you are" and what you want in life
Don't forget about the word; Respect from others & Respect for ourselves
- We all need it to survive!!!
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: mission viejo, ca
Posts: 134
Thank you. He just keeps messaging me telling me not to lose hope and to keep fighting and why wont i stand up for him. Its just so hard cuz i want to but i myself have doubts, if he changed and i knew he did...i would stand up. 
Member
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 31,179
I'm both an RA and recovering codie. When I began recovery, I didn't expect anyone to fight for me. In fact, I expected (and got) distrust, anger, and resentments. I brought them on myself, and it was only time and my actions that proved I had changed.
I also learned that my family and friends were often right when they said someone wasn't good for me. My XABF#3's own family (including his mom) told me to get away from him and get my life back together (we were both using). Unfortunately, I had to dig the hole a bit deeper and gather a few more consequences before I listened.
Hugs and prayers,
Amy
I also learned that my family and friends were often right when they said someone wasn't good for me. My XABF#3's own family (including his mom) told me to get away from him and get my life back together (we were both using). Unfortunately, I had to dig the hole a bit deeper and gather a few more consequences before I listened.
Hugs and prayers,
Amy
Iceberg Ahead!
Join Date: Sep 2012
Location: Out at Sea
Posts: 1,177
Consider texting back: "I'm not losing hope, not giving up, and standing up ... for MY recovery. You do the same for yours, and work on yours. Let's give each other the space to work on one's own recovery. Give each recovery time. Then, surely more will be revealed."
Just a thought.
Just a thought.
Lord Have Mercy
Join Date: Dec 2010
Location: Upper Midwest
Posts: 242
The reason why it is hard to walk away, is that you see the good person who he is/was, who has been clobbered by addiction. You see the person "inside" and that moves you to compassion and caring. Unfortunately, you also have to look at the ACTUAL person who has created a mess of his life (and yours, if you choose to attach to him through a relationship, marriage, baby, etc.)
Just looking at what you had, who he used to be, who he "wishes" he was -- this is not looking at the real person. If you read these boards you will find out that most addicts and alcoholics relapse again, and again, and again, and this can go on for decades. That is usually the story, based on the dozens and dozens of real life cases here. Many of us who have put in 10-20 years or more in relationships, wonder what life "could have been" if we hadn't gotten married to an A. Many of us are having to start over from scratch.
After reading your post, I'll give the standard "RUN!" answer, IMHO, just my 2 cents worth, especially since he is playing with a few beers here and there, he will find an excuse to take it to another level and you might get sucked into the quicksand when you could have been FREE to take a more liberated path.
God bless and good luck to you! Keep coming back and posting and reading.
Just looking at what you had, who he used to be, who he "wishes" he was -- this is not looking at the real person. If you read these boards you will find out that most addicts and alcoholics relapse again, and again, and again, and this can go on for decades. That is usually the story, based on the dozens and dozens of real life cases here. Many of us who have put in 10-20 years or more in relationships, wonder what life "could have been" if we hadn't gotten married to an A. Many of us are having to start over from scratch.
After reading your post, I'll give the standard "RUN!" answer, IMHO, just my 2 cents worth, especially since he is playing with a few beers here and there, he will find an excuse to take it to another level and you might get sucked into the quicksand when you could have been FREE to take a more liberated path.
God bless and good luck to you! Keep coming back and posting and reading.
Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Feb 2012
Location: mission viejo, ca
Posts: 134
You see the person "inside" and that moves you to compassion and caring. Unfortunately, you also have to look at the ACTUAL person who has created a mess of his life (and yours, if you choose to attach to him through a relationship, marriage, baby, etc.)
Just looking at what you had, who he used to be, who he "wishes" he was -- this is not looking at the real person.
Just looking at what you had, who he used to be, who he "wishes" he was -- this is not looking at the real person.
Guest
Join Date: Feb 2007
Posts: 1,826
Yes it is manipulation.
[QUOTE=justrae83;3583261]My ex swears up and down that he has changed and that things will be better in the long run. He was addicted to pills and mixed it with alcohol back in the day, no he drinks beer but i notice it is not out of control just a few now and then. He has been like that for 6 months now, so that is great!
But, what i want to know...is can they change? It seems like they can but i am afraid to fall for it and him turn again. Its not just the addiction but the other things I fear as well, I mean I am a women and I want to know that a man will provide for his family. He is 35 years old, still works part time at Costco, no car (even though he is getting close to having one), in EXTREAME DEBT..already filed for bankruptcy, in financial trouble with bad checks ALL BECAUSE OF HIS PAST. Wow, when I meet him 7 years ago, he was sooooo different! He had his own place, his own car, in school to be a firefighter, was in youth ministry leader, ON TOP OF THE WORLD… its amazing with drunks and drinking can do to your life. 2 DUIs, a bankruptcy, 2 car accidents and 1000s of dollars spent on pills cant turn your life for the worst.
Family and friends of mine all turned there back to him and if I choose him, I would lose all respect from them and my family would not even want to talk to me or see him. What kind of life is that, but when you love someone, all you want to do is run away to another state and be with him and start your own family but only if its worth it….how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon. I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?! The love I have for this man is indescribable! I guess all iam looking for is advice, is all of the pain worth it. Can he change, or is him balling and telling me to fight for him another manipulation.
HELP![/QUOTE]
[QUOTE=justrae83;3583261]My ex swears up and down that he has changed and that things will be better in the long run. He was addicted to pills and mixed it with alcohol back in the day, no he drinks beer but i notice it is not out of control just a few now and then. He has been like that for 6 months now, so that is great!
But, what i want to know...is can they change? It seems like they can but i am afraid to fall for it and him turn again. Its not just the addiction but the other things I fear as well, I mean I am a women and I want to know that a man will provide for his family. He is 35 years old, still works part time at Costco, no car (even though he is getting close to having one), in EXTREAME DEBT..already filed for bankruptcy, in financial trouble with bad checks ALL BECAUSE OF HIS PAST. Wow, when I meet him 7 years ago, he was sooooo different! He had his own place, his own car, in school to be a firefighter, was in youth ministry leader, ON TOP OF THE WORLD… its amazing with drunks and drinking can do to your life. 2 DUIs, a bankruptcy, 2 car accidents and 1000s of dollars spent on pills cant turn your life for the worst.
Family and friends of mine all turned there back to him and if I choose him, I would lose all respect from them and my family would not even want to talk to me or see him. What kind of life is that, but when you love someone, all you want to do is run away to another state and be with him and start your own family but only if its worth it….how do I know its worth it to leave it all behind for a man who can go back to his old self so soon. I know what most would say…THEN WHY IS IT STILL HARD TO WALK AWAY?! The love I have for this man is indescribable! I guess all iam looking for is advice, is all of the pain worth it. Can he change, or is him balling and telling me to fight for him another manipulation.
HELP!
[/QUOTE]
Currently Active Users Viewing this Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
