seek

My grandson is alcoholic and working a program - he is young. His alcoholism caused a huge rift in the family - lots of trauma around interventions, rehab, counseling. The family kind of formed factions - I suspect others are drinking to cope - some withdraw, some attack - all-in-all, it's not healthy, but people coping the best they can.

I am pretty isolated now and try to live "one day at a time." I do not go to meetings - they are not my cup of tea - though I used to go - years and years - and I have read a lot of the literature. I just do not choose to live my life "in the problem" - I want a life free from alcoholism . . .

When I get too close to my grandson it causes me strife - the games are outrageous and I get concerned about his health issues . . .he tends to self-neglect.

Today I was thinking that this could go on for a very, very long time - like all of my remaining life . . .most of the time, I don't think like that but the thought did occur to me. It's like a sentence that cannot be escaped.

Family get-togethers are now full of strife - nothing to look forward to, but something to dread.

Same with family counseling sessions where a lot of secrets go untold and unhealthy people step up to be the ones "in power." Lots of unhealthy dynamics . . .

I turn to prayer, which is life-saving for me, but today I am feeling like I have been "slimed" by the disease of alcoholism . . .that I can't get away from it.

I wonder about the literature that says ". . .even if the alcoholic is drinking you can be happy." Really? How is that possible if you care about the person and they are killing themselves? Or if their actions are poisoning other relationships in your family? How can that ever be ok?

I know it's about acceptance - BUT how do you accept the unacceptable - that some people are unhealthy, that some people act out, that some people play dirty, that some people don't take care of themselves and are unable to care for others, that some people can't have healthy relationships and if you try to interact with them you are probably going to be frustrated . . .etc., etc.

Ok. That's all for now.

Learn2Live

I don't allow those kinds of people into my life. (Except when I relapse).

Cyranoak

You say you don't go to meetings because you choose not to live your life "in the problem," but YOU ARE living your life in the problem. You go on to describe that in the rest of your post and then cap it off by asking how to "accept the unacceptable."

Alanon, if you open your mind to it, answers that question and will teach you how to live a life free of alcoholism or, if you don't choose that path as you choose today, teach you how to find some serenity anyhow.

It's your choice.

Good luck,

Cyranoak

Florence

Oh, I have so many mixed feelings on this subject.

Right now I feel cheated, I resent the disease and the fact that my RAH is an A and how it's affected my life. I'm trying to figure out how to be okay with the fact that I have little to no control over a good deal of what happens to me (this is terrifying) outside of making the best choices I can. I don't trust myself to make good choices considering the choices that got me here. Sometimes I feel like it's too late for me to have a normal life with normal, healthy relationships. I have finally come to terms with the fact that my family is WAY dysfunctional, and his is too. I feel like I can't get away from mental illness. I really worry about my kids.

Then I have this little kernel of hope that the steps I'm taking today to piece myself back together will give me the tools I need to get myself and my kids away from this madness. It's livable right now, but my RAH and I are lumped in the same house, in the same town as our messed up families, and that slime of mental illness touches everything. I hate it with a white hot heat.

I'm learning to "accept the unacceptable" in the healthy way. I'm not going to figure out a way to "accept" unacceptable behavior in my home, with my things, and my children any more. But if it's happening outside of my sphere and I can't control it with boundaries, or if I have the choice of interacting with the crazy or not, I'll accept that someone I know is being crazy somewhere else, and they get the dignity to make their own drama and mistakes. I just don't want it anymore.

m1k3

Hi Seek and ((((hugs))))

For me at least acceptance is not about saying it's OK. It's about accepting things as they are. I can't change my AW, I can't change the family dynamics caused by her pills and drinking, I can't change the past.

What I can do is accept that these things have happened and this is the way they are. I can accept that this is her nature and for the others that is their nature and the way I reacted in the past was my nature.

I can also accept that I have the power to change me, no one else, just me. By doing that and working my program I can be happy and sane again. For me at least it works. Also by doing this and just getting better my daughter has started to go to Alanon. She sees it working for me and she wants what I have. I can't change anyone but I can lead by example.

Please reconsider Alanon. It has worked miracles for me and many others here. Try different meetings, it took me a while to find the right fit for me but it was well worth it.

If nothing else keep reading and posting here. I have found this forum to be a refuge from the chaos and a place where I can learn from the wisdom of others.

Your friend,

seek

Don't know what you are referring to.

seek

My post was a vent, not an invitation to argue about the merits of Alanon. I wish people could be respectful of differences.

When I say "live with the focus on the alcoholic," FOR ME, going to Alanon is consciously delving into that arena.

Most of the time I am able to live my life free of that constant focus - I personally just don't wish to make it such a primary focus.

Thank you

seek

In the end, it is all about coping - coping with problems that were not of your making. Remember: I didn't cause it and I can't control it - but I have to learn to accept it and it is difficult.

Learn2Live

I was referring to these kinds of people:

At a certain point in my life I came to realize that certain kinds of people are just toxic to me and that it is not healthy for me to keep them in my life. They may not be toxic to others, but that's OK because I am not them. I am me. And people who are unhealthy, act out, play dirty, don't take care of themselves, or can't have healthy relationships don't belong in my life.

I choose to surround myself with healthy, supportive, drama-free people who are willing to work hard to have health, some measure of success, and happiness in their lives.

seek

Oh. The problem is when you love someone who is unhealthy - and when I say "love someone," I mean you have a familial bond with them (as opposed to a contractual bond) . . . in nature, a mother and grandmother and relatives are hard-wired to care about the well-being of their relatives . . .it's like if my left arm suddenly "went bad." I wouldn't be able to cut it off without putting the rest of my body at risk. If it were cut off, I would miss it. That's how I experience it, anyway . . .not saying it is like this for everyone.

I have good days and bad days and just feel sad that my fate is linked to that of unhealthy people I love.

Hypatia

I can fully understand what you're saying. Detaching with love, caring about a person and yet accepting that there is absolutely nothing that you can do to help them, is really difficult when it is a close blood relation who hasn't angered you enough to cut off all contact. But there comes a point where you just have to accept that you are completely helpless.

It doesn't mean that you don't continue to cheer for them, or feel bad when they have difficulty. What it means is that you no longer feel in any way responsible for their situation and acknowledge that it is not in your power to change a darned thing that is happening to them. You can only change how you react to what is happening to them.

Kind of like watching the Olympics. You celebrate wins, you commiserate with the losers, but you know that you absolutely cannot do anything at all to affect the athlete's performance.

Learn2Live

I am sorry you are feeling so sad. Believe me, I understand this feeling.

I also have family members who I was attached to like they were a body part. But I did have to finally accept that having that diseased part of me was killing me. And I had to let them go. Reminds me of what Jesus said at Matthew 5: New American Standard Bible 29 “If your right eye makes you stumble, tear it out and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to be thrown into hell. 30 “If your right hand makes you stumble, cut it off and throw it from you; for it is better for you to lose one of the parts of your body, than for your whole body to go into hell.

I have been to hell and I do not like it there. I have to do what I have to do to save myself and keep me from going back there.

seek

Yes. Good advice above . . . both posts. The thing is that it is not a conscious process . . . I can consciously choose, x, y, and z and then have a dream that creates connection or feelings . . .or hear about the person being sick and feeling sad and helpless. The responses are involuntary.

With the Olympic athlete analogy, there is no connection and certainly no emotional connection or bond.

The Matthew quote is a good reminder, but again, this is dealing with things on a conscious level.

Thanks

Learn2Live

I hope you feel better soon.

Hypatia

Ok then, how about an example from my own life. My mother is suffering from dementia. It isn't very advanced yet, but she's no longer just a little forgetful. She's also got several other more serious health problems, including Parkinsons which is starting to affect her speech. Considering that I live thousands of kilometers away across the Atlantic, my main contact to my mother is by phone. Gradually it is becoming more and more difficult for me to communicate with her long distance.

I truly wish I could wave some magic wand and turn her back into the mother I remember from 10 years ago when she was still relatively healthy.

But I can't. I cannot do a damn thing about it. She will continue to deteriorate until there is just an empty shell of a human being left who will resemble my mother but will no longer truly be my mother.

seek

Yes, that must be very sad, frustrating, and disappointing. I do not minimize the grief around grappling with it, but I do think there is a difference between an elderly person's demise (which is expected at some point if they live long enough) and a young person you helped raise and did everything to instill love and good moral values in . . . seeing someone younger not value their health is so difficult to grasp, process, and accept. It seems unnatural and such a needless loss.

seek

Me too. Thank you very much.

Hypatia

What does morality have to do with it? Alcoholism is an illness. You can't love an illness away, and how you raised a person often has very little effect on a disease which is genetically predisposed.

My mother is also manic depressive. I've watched her cycle since I was 4 years old. I truly understand the helplessness of watching someone not value their health and self-destruct unnaturally.

m1k3

Seek, you are right, the thoughts and feelings come from somewhere deep inside, you can't choose what to think and you can't choose what to feel.

But, and there is always a but isn't there, I found that I could choose how I will react to them. I could grab that thought and focus on it and hop on the treadmill of crazy thinking and just keep going and going and going or I could learn how to recognize when I was about to hop on the treadmill and choose not to.

The same with emotions. I can grab that emotion and cling to it or I can recognize that is just a feeling, figure out where that feeling is coming from and let it go.

I choose to learn how to avoid the crazy thinking and become more sane. It is called mindfulness.

I know it works because it works for me. If you are interested there are lots of good articles on the web and books about mindfulness. This is a skill you can develop to actively pay attention to your thoughts and emotions and learn to derail them before they take over.

While mindfulness is used by Buddhism, Taoism, and other religions it is not religion. It is a skill, a tool that anyone can use no matter what you believe or don't believe. I have even read articles and books where they have before and after images of peoples brain scans showing how by using mindfulness they have literally changed the way their brain works and how the brain begins to function in a much more healthy way.

Maybe this is a tool that could help you as much as it has helped me.

Your friend,

LaTeeDa

Very good advice above from Mike. There are many tried and true methods for dealing with the things you are dealing with. You can resist them, insisting that they don't apply to your situation because it is so unique, or you can try them out until you find something that works for you. My suggestion, because it worked for me, is an experienced, professional counselor with many years of background in addiction and codependence.

One of my favorite Buddhist quotes is "in life, pain is mandatory, suffering is optional."

L