MTSlideAddict

Have I not had enough of this crap? Of course I did not go no contact when I left. That is something a sane person would do. That is something a person that has had enough would do.

After the latest- no longer recovering AH binged. and I left in the middle of the night with myself and the dog- I feel myself caving. Why? How could I ignore what the history has taught me to expect for the future? How can I allow all that strength to grow weak? How can it be so clear in my mind that the right thing to do is to say "no more" and to close that door for good, but instead yearn to follow the heart that says that there is hope?

Update:
I was doing so well. I left and told myself that I will not go back. I took him off Facebook, took half the money, spoke to my lawyer, found a different lawyer (however I had not agreed to move forward, but I really like this one), hunted for an apartment (with no luck yet), and got a PO Box. Then he gets a hold of me. He is of course apologetic. I didn’t buy into it; I’ve heard it all before. It was all blah, blah, blah, and it actually made me angrier. I have finally started going to Al-Anon.

After some communications with the husband my anger grew weak and is no longer fueling me. I agreed to marriage counseling. I was sure to look for one myself, so I was able to make sure the counselor specializes in addictions. We are attending and it is making me feel better. I am able to tell him how I feel. I am able to let it out finally. I am neither good or accustomed to letting out the pain, and she has helped me do this. He is sober and listens. He is apologetic and understanding. We go on dates and have lots of fun. He is now seeing his psychiatrist on a regular basis and attending AA. He says sobriety is the only way to be, and that he will not drink. I want to remain separated, as I figure out how I want to proceed. If I go home I will be looped back in for sure. Why is this so hard? I felt relieved and free when I left. Why am I wanting to continue in this? I know the cycle. However, seeing him with his bright blue eyes, his big smile, and with this devotion to pleasing me with wonderful surprises and tender words makes me melt all over again. Is this the ultimate wooing that will strap the seatbelt ever so tight for the next turn on the perpetual coaster? Or, is he one of the few that will actually remain alcohol-free this time?

Katiekate

Is this the ultimate wooing that will strap the seatbelt ever so tight for the next turn on the perpetual coaster? Or, is he one of the few that will actually remain alcohol-free this time?

Only time will tell. You sound so fearful.

I understand. You do not have to make a decision right now, take time, lots of time.

You don't trust, no one blames you.

Stay independent and strong, keep goint to al anon, and therapy.

Is there something that brought up all this anger???? Listen to it, it is telling you something.

webber1

Hi there

Your post echoed excatly what has happened to me. You write with such grace and from it deep deep down you know the answer..

Hope is such a good thing but I came to a point where the only hope was to save myself.. I look back and wonder how on earth I let it get to this... The numerous times I broke up with her because of drinking.. how she texted me for 6 months pleading, turning up in the middle of the night half naked, stalking the new girl I met all the while seeing a new bloke .. She ended up breaking up with him on my doorstep and he knocked her out - madness. 3 Duis, swearing at my friends the cycle of AH Behaviour..

Then rehab then more hope but then I realized is this the best I can do???.. Cant drink, socialising limited, a life of AA Meetings and always the spectre of the Sirens song. Her only friends are her rehab buddies who in there own way are as broken .. By the time she relapsed my anger went through the roof as its all I had heard about for 7 months..

Point is it will always be about them, not for positive reasons but the selfish merry go round that is an addicts life. You didnt mention his age but at 38 I believe she has no chance of changing/recovery. A leopard never changes its spots... And like you in times of hope you think what if ..

We both know the answer

Spes

The title of your thread says it all: Thought Tug-a-wars: Mind vs. Heart

I don't have any words of wisdom or the answers to your questions. Many years ago I was at the same place you are now except that I did not have the experiences and knowledge of everyone here at SR to learn from. I went the same route as you and when I finally had to decide...mind versus heart.....I followed my heart.

It's a difficult life and only by the grace of God did I find this place to help me cope. It's very difficult to watch the one you love slowly die from alcohol. It's very difficult to realize that I am the second most important person in her life; Mr Vodka being the first.

I went back to when you first got here and read your first thread. It broke my heart. Life is a series of choices; some we make with our minds and some with our heart. The one's with our heart can bring us absolute joy, or absolute misery. We just try to do the best we can.

I feel the dilemna you are in. To quote Katie above: You do not have to make a decision right now, take time, lots of time.

I truly wish you well.

sweetteewalls

I too, am in your boat. We want to believe in the happy ending. We want to think that all of our heartache was worthwhile. Its so hard and best advice is what I can give is to just proceed with caution.

SoaringSpirits

• Set your boundaries and live by them.
• Live apart for a year or two or three.
• See how it goes.
• If he is your soul mate and it's meant to be for you to live with him, you will.
• Work on YOU and live by Al Anon, SR and read everything you can about alcoholism and codependency. We make the best decisions -- for both heart and mind -- when we are educated.

JenT1968

there are many choices and options in your one and only life.

if he does stay sober, and you continue to enjoy each other's company you don't ever have to live with him, a wonderful, committed relationship can be enjoyed without arguing over the minutiae of whose turn it is to take out the bins.

you don't need to make any decisions about the long term now, but I would suggest pursuing that seperate living arrangement: physical distance allowed me to see things more objectively and work out what I wanted in life.

I now feel very uneasy about hanging my happiness and potential on the future actions of someone else, so working on finding out your needs and wants and inner happiness is win-win: you will be in a better, happier position independent of his path, whether you choose to stay with him in the long term or not.

also, I don't believe in soul-mates: I think it's a fiction that keeps us unhappily stuck either in a relationship, or alone. I believe we are all like marvellous multifacetted jigsaw pieces: two jigsaw pieces don't join on all sides, but there are many, many pieces that we could fit well enough with to have an intimate romantic relationship (and other ones that fit well enough as different types of friends, neighbours, family, etc). None will be a perfect fit, some will fit better than others, but it comes down to how much of a problem to you is the bit that doesn't?

I'm not sure I could "fit" with someone whose profession is in the armed forces: I don't think I could cope with the anxiety of them being away in danger and the intense black and white nature of here all the time then gone for long periods.

That doesn't mean that it would be a problem for someone else, or is wrong (for some poeple it's just what they're looking for), it would just be too big of a non-fit for me to hitch my life to.

CeciliaV

I've been asking these questions lately myself. I'm still living with my AH, and as far as I know, he's been sober one week. When you've been hurt so many times, you're conditioned to believe that it will keep happening. The hopeful part of you wants to believe that this time will be different. Part of me is holding on to that hope and part of me has given up hope. Right now, I can't tell which part is stronger/bigger.

For your sake and for his, I hope that his recovery continues to go well. Only time will tell. Just out of curiosity, how long has he been sober?

Hopeworks

Why do we do we all have the same pattern of blindly doing the same things over and over again? Why do we keep doing that very same thing over and over and over again even once the blinders are off and we know the chances of success are zero... because the A is obviously not in real recovery and we know we are being manipulated?

It is like being in a raging river headed to the falls you know are around the corner... you just can't swim to shore... yet.

The currents, the white water, the calm eddies in between are a combination of the A doing his best to convince you that the beautiful calm and clear waters are REAL and are going to be the future...it is always in the future the mirage we want so desperately to believe is true!

Then we have our hormones, emotions and brain chemicals and our pure addiction to the physical person whom we had (or still have) insane electrical attraction to... the sexual energy that we shared.

Thats some serious superglue and complicated stuff holding us to our A and our false beliefs...those hopes and dreams that sustained us for YEARS!

It takes time to paddle to shore and leave the A headed for the falls... but usually its the falls we tried to save ourselves from that actually does the saving... at least that has been my experience.

Understanding the why and being able to see it objectively brings the shore closer... and closer... and closer...its a journey and you have to walk or paddle it out one day at a time.

Wishing you a beautiful journey down a beautiful river sparkling in the sun very, very soon...

changeschoices

I can't speak for you, but I can say why I am no contact with my AX, even though I miss him terribly and he wants to stay in each other's lives.

I cannot get over the pain he caused me through his addiction if I continue to let him in my life in any way. I can't process the pain, the betrayal, the lies, the suffering, and the insanity as long as I am still potentially being snowed by his promises, his charm, and the hope of a future with him. I simply cannot heal if he is in my life. If we were still together, even if I was seeing a counselor and he and I were going to counseling together, it just would not give me the distance and space I need to heal. How could I take care of myself after this trauma if I was still involved in his life, worried about his relapse, etc.? I have to put myself first now.

We broke up for two months last summer and I realize now that it was a terrible mistake to get back together with him. Not because I don't love him, but because I needed to heal from the trauma of living with an alcoholic before I could ever get a grasp on how to proceed normally after the chaos. Two months is no where near long enough for me to recover and find myself and my strength again. Nor was it long enough for him to get his head on straight and be committed to sobriety. The only thing that happened in the two months that we were apart was that we missed each other and idealized our relationship, making us ready to jump back in for more while all of the pain and chaos remained in the background, ready to be activated again once he drank.

I miss my AX and I still love him. But I am in no shape to have a relationship after over two years of utter insanity with an alcoholic. I have gotten far enough in the grieving process this time (six weeks after ending our relationship) that it makes me feel physically sick to contemplate seeing him again, dealing with the intense fear and anxiety of life with an alcoholic, even if he's stopped drinking.

Sometimes I think about the wonderful aspects of our relationship, and I miss them. But the price I paid for those aspects was too high. With a cold eye, I can do the cost/benefit analysis and see that I should not have to pay that high a price for what comes much more easily and naturally in a relationship with a healthy, non-addicted person.

If I stayed, if I let him back in my life in any way, it would halt the healing process for me, or make it much more slow. I now feel a sense of urgency that I didn't have before, that too much of my life has been consumed by his addiction and I have to save myself NOW. And like the other posters have said, if it's meant to be, it will be. If he and I are meant to be together someday, it will surely never happen as long as we are in each other's lives right now, spinning our wheels in the pain and confusion of addiction.

NYCDoglvr

As my sponsor used to say "there are good days and there are learning days." This is a process; it's progress, not perfection. We learn that there's a big difference between love and need. God bless.

mattmathews

I was thinking to myself: "I don't have this experience...the leaving and going back yo-yo." And then I realized that I do have the experience, except I was so messed up that I didn't even get around to the leaving part. I just stayed and suffered. In my case, just before going over the falls, I grabbed a branch and saved myself.
In Al-Anon, eventually the thought has to cross your mind: "Why am I here?" No, "Why am I here?" At first, it's all about recovering from the effects of alcoholism. I knew my life had been miserable, I had been miserable. And as I went to meeting after meeting I could slowly feel myself healing, and to my surprise growing. After experiencing that growth, after finding tools that helped me in my marriage an in my personal life, I have come to believe that further progress is both possible and desirable.
I think all of us come to Al-Anon knowing that what we've been doing hasn't been working. We have to come to the program with an openness to trying a new way of living. We have to be willing to work, knowing that if we don't work at the program, it's not going to work for us. And at some point we have to be brave enough to step away from our old ways of living and behaving and try something new and frightening. We have to have the courage to change.
To quote one of the old-timers in my group: "Al-Anon is not for sissies." I didn't know how true that was, and I miss hearing him say it.

Anon12

I can relate to many of these posts, just feel I'm just at an earlier stage where XABF is about to move out.

Changechoices, it's like I could have written so much of your post, or can envisage me writing it in 6 weeks time. I hope I will be as strong as you sound.

I am struggling with the contact issue - I don't want to be with my ABF unless he has been properly addressing his drinking and other issues for at least a year. Even then, i'm wary I don't know if I will want to get back together with him, especially with the clarity i'm hoping space away from him will give me. I am not proposing to put my life on hold for a year - I have made clear this is a split not a year's separation and in a year one of us or both of us may not wish to be in touch.

Assuming I do want this, who makes that first move though in a year? Do I wait for him to get in touch? And what about in the meantime? I think I need to avoid any contact where possible with him until that year is up, as much as I know it will be painful. He is still the first person I want to talk to about anything but I know if we are emailing or texting, i wont' move on. I will just be asking about his recovery, looking for answers he can't provide, which is the hell I want to avoid living with him.

Cyranoak

...there's no way to know. And, if you are going to stay in the relationship there will never be a way to know. There's a gal in my Alanon group who's husband relapsed after 30 years of sobriety! 30!

The bottom line is that alcoholics, in my opinion, are ticking time bombs always. Always. Always. Always. So, for people like me who have chosen to stay with their alcoholic get used to the tick, tick, tick, and accept that it will always be a part of your life like Captain Hookos crocodile, or you will never, ever find a way to be happy.

Take care,

Cyranoak