scrambled2012

Hey you know what's funny? I used the abreviation AV in one of my posts, and I was talking about my "alcoholic voice." Now I just figured out ya'll are speaking of an "addictive voice," as in AVRT. I'm slow like that!

What makes this interesting is that I've found a lot of things useful in dealing with this challange, and life overall. Things like "one day a time," or not putting myself into stupid situations (e.g., a bar) until I am stronger. That's avoiding a conditioned trigger. I have kept in mind things like HALT (hungry, angry, lonely, tired--emotional, inner triggers), and opened myself up to the value of pure support (being honest in these forums) and simple good advice (playing the tape to the end)--a form of social learning.

I guess what I"m pointing out is that I have been automatically synthisizing the different approches that folks use, and I havn't really found them in conflict. It surprises me to hear that on some threads folks get intense in thier disagreements about what does or doesn't work in a statistical way; its like when it comes to psychology, I'm fond of believing the field is full of specialized terms used to describe common human experiences. We have different names for things, but are describing the same phenomina.

On those rare times when strong disagreements may be taking place, that's always good to remember~~~


Happy Saterday~~~~!

stillsleeping

Nice! I did something very similar - I've always thought of my alcoholism as an alien that's invaded from outside, or a parasite, and talked about my AV only to get a bollocking from an ardent AVRT guy about using it incorrectly. Um, thanks dude, but I'm going to go ahead and do what I want.

I think you're exactly right about common experiences, and different approaches - I'll knock this thing with any and all weapons I can find in the room! If that means pinching a bit from AVRT and not quite using it like it says in the book, well, I'm okay with that!

So how's the weekend goin? We just survived our first hot sunny beach BBQ sober - it was awesome! Feelin groovy

xxx

scrambled2012

lol Alian I love it~~~!
The weekend is going well; I've been lazy, but once getting past the initial temptation to start off on the wrong foot, my mind has been clear of the whole notion of drinking.

Hey, did you know that Resident Evil has, like 6 films in the series???? Holy cow. I saw the first one years ago and it was great, this weekend found the rest of them woooohoooo and they are all posted on youtube. I'm a happy scifi guy~~~!

Sapling

I went to a really good meeting this morning...The topic was relapse...There were people in there that relapsed after 30 days...And people that relapsed after 15+ years... It always comes down to...Cutting out meetings...Not doing service work....No 11th step work...Prayer and mediatation...Just not working the program....I guess in AVRT you make a plan you aren't going to drink anymore and that's it...You don't drink....I imagine if you aren't practicing it right...You don't stick to the plan..You'll probably relapse....Same as in AA. I'm guessing you have to be vigilant with AVRT...I know you have to be in AA..In AA the idea that works for me is I have an allergy to alcohol...If I ingest it...I crave more till I pass out or get in serious trouble...Without fail. If I'm allergic to peanuts and I eat one my throat is going to swell up and I can't breathe...I'm not going to eat a peanut. It's the same for me with alcohol....It's not an option..I can't drink. The 12 steps aren't about making you stop drinking...They're about changing the way you think and live...Alcohol is but a symptom...Our thinking is the problem....I think that's the part that get's lost in this great debate. For me to drink is to die. That's how allergic I am to it.

Anna

We can grow by leaning on each other and focusing on our commonalities and not our differences.

scrambled2012

"I'm guessing you have to be vigilant with AVRT...I know you have to be in AA..In AA the idea that works for me is I have an allergy to...The 12 steps aren't about making you stop drinking...They're about changing the way you think and live..."
I know the whole idea behind "cognitive psychlogy" and cognitive therapy is the notion of changing one's thoughts leads to changes in behavior....and that part of that is recognizing habitual thoughts that are unhealthy or unreasonable, and then "thought stopping" along with replacing bad self-talk with better self-talk. The whole goal is change the way one approches life and sees things. From what you said, it sounds like AA does engage in this kind of reframing (actually any socializing group does, with respect to whatever it is that bonds the group together...the idea of worldview on a smaller scale!).

I sure do like the phrase "whatever works, work it!"

hypochondriac

As a newcomer I found all the different programs very confusing but it seemed like if I didn't pick one and stick to it then I was going to definitely fail! Not one to take sides and having a tendency to argue with everything this probably didn't speed up things for me. I started of with AVRT now I'm moving on to AA, totally backwards I know. But I fully intend to make both of them, plus maybe SMART as well, a part of my plan to stay sober. I reckon 3 programs are better than one! And now I'm gonna add the invading Alien theory too x

suki44883

Sapling

I came into AA a hopeless alcoholic that was spritually bankrupt. Those steps were a way for me to fix both those problems. That's what I needed...And that's what I got. I agree...Whatever works for you...Do it!

Sapling

I'm sure you can learn things from all of them...As long as you accomplish your goal...Who cares?

soberlicious

Well, I'm all about parallels and yes, many concepts are framed differently, but boil down to the same idea. I do see why people correct what they see as inconsistencies or misunderstangs of any given paradigm though, because there is something to be said for the purest version of anything really. Sometimes things appear to be the same, but there are in fact subtle differences. All things can become adapted, and sometimes in the adaptation, the original concept gets lost or worse yet even bastardized. (ie using the bible to promote hate). Personally, I rather enjoy a little bollocking from others. It demonstrates passion and that makes me take note.

That said, I do believe when something is not working for me in my life, it is my responsibility to seek out answers that make sense to me.

Programs and philosophies aside, I firmly believe that every single person that has the desire to quit an addiction is fully capable of doing so.

HitRockBottom70

I agree with you. I find the fighting distracting and of no use. People can succeed using a variety of techniques. Keep your mind open and you may find a tool to add to your war chest.

You have it right on. Alcoholism is not one size fits all so how can recovery be. If its working, do it!

I love it! Your description will help me with my AVRT big plan to make my reality "I am Never drinking again, and I'm not changing my mind". We certainly can help each other, especially when we keep our minds open.

Sapling

I think the only thing that could stop you...Would be dying from it.

Dalek

I haven't read your posts, scrambled, but I imagine that what you call your "alcoholic voice" is that noisemaker in your head that says "let's get a drink" or "you can have just one drink" right? While that does fall within the AVRT definition of the Addictive Voice, in AVRT, the AV is more than just that. The Addictive Voice of AVRT is "any thinking, imagery, or feeling that supports or even suggests any possible future use of alcohol or drugs -- ever."

Just because someone calls their thoughts of drinking "AV" doesn't necessarily mean that they are referring to AVRT. For example, to someone not using AVRT, "I can't drink" probably sounds very innocent, and probably doesn't even register on their radar as their alcoholic voice. To someone properly versed in AVRT, though, that would be the addictive voice. Why? Because it suggests that if you could drink, that you might drink.

So, yes, it can certainly get confusing on a forum where people are using the same abbreviations or terms for different things. The same thing happens when people use the word "craving" though. In general usage, "craving" usually means a powerful desire. In AA, though, the term "craving," much like the AV of AVRT, has a very precise meaning, and it does not mean the same thing as "craving" in general usage.

"Lost in translation" comes to mind.

stillsleeping

Hell yeah we knew! We bought every one in turn as soon as they came out! Milla Jovovich in shorts! Kicking ass! With evil mutated super-zombies! Can I get a woop woop!

Getting excited about Prometheus yet?

xxx