Kiana

When user's fill-in their blackout memory gaps with fabrications that they actually believe are true, does it mean that they have permanent brain damage to some extent? Or can "confabulation" be part of a temporary effect?

Kiana

I'm speaking of actual confabulation, done without intent to deceive (as in dementia). I know they lie. =}

Windmills

How do you know the difference between the two though? Genuine question, don't mean to sound snarky.

Kiana

I'm not trying to determine the difference between the two, rather, if actual confabulation means there's permanent brain damage to some extent or if it's temporary.

wicked

the Google has all the answers!

Hmm, they do not mention alcohol, but do mention brain damage.
Interesting though. In my experience with my ex (alcoholic and crack addict) I think he did both. But when it was confabulation, he was not defensive about it, because it was true to him. "confident about his recollections despite evidence contradicting it truthfulness."
Either way, it sucked. because his lies or confabulations affected me and the kids in a bad way.

Beth

Kiana

I asked here because there's so many people here with information on how alcohol/drugs effects the brain (frontal lobe damage etc) and I thought some might know whether or not that means there's permanent brain damage. I was not asking the question in order to somehow justify or reason-away an addict's behavior. I think my sister has permanent brain damage from the booze and drugs.

Thanks.

DesertEyes

Hello Kiana, and pleased to "meet" you

I had brain surgery a few years ago, and I've been involved in the medical side of addiction for some time, so I will share what I have learned.

Confabulation by itself is not proof of brain damage. It works the other way around, MRI's and PET scans will show brain damage, and _then_ you know that confabulation is plausible.

Also note, the brain damage caused by alcoholism is very different than aneurysms or accidents. Alcohlism is more like Alzheimers, it affects _all_ of the brain so there is apparent damge in all kinds of brain activity. Aneurysms and accidents happen at a specific part of the brain, and so you know what kinds of brain activity are affected and which are relatively safe.

Whether it's temporary or permanent is a whole different issue. Depends on the type and extent of the damage, the location in the brain, etc. Most brain damage heals very quickly the first year, and then slows down considerably.

If I am not being too forward, can I ask why you are asking?

Mike
Moderator, SR

DesertEyes

No worries Please understand that some of our members have done exactly that for many years, so they tend to have knee-jerk reflex to anything that reminds them of their own, unhealthy behaviors.

Unless it's hugely obvious, brain damage is very difficult to diagnose. I suggest you talk with your own physician and see if he can give you some suggestions. After that you will have to see a neurologist and get their advice.

If your sister's behavior is a danger to herself, or others, you can force the issue and have her assesed against her will. Otherwise you need to do an "intervention", and that is a huge amount of work to do properly. We have several folks on staff here at SR that know all about interventions, and if it comes to that there's a whole list of people and facilities that can help you out on the front page of SR.

Mike
Moderator, SR

Kiana

Hi Mike, I'm pleased to meet you too. Thank you for that information.

Kiana

Thank you, again. We had my sister committed against her will.

Krys

I don't know much about confabulation, but I definitely believe that brain damage happens with drug/alcohol abuse. My sister has "memories" of our childhood that I know for a fact never happened, but she believes them. She even inserts me into them, and I can argue till I am blue in the face that I was not there, but it is useless. My ABF claims that he has a harder time concentrating/learning ever since his bout with Oxycontin a few years back. His drug of choice now is alcohol...it's not helping.

Kiana

My sister has done the same thing with "memories", and the AB, too...he got to where even simple math was a challenge or too confusing. My sister has drank a lot and would take 30+ pills at a time mostly morphine and clonazapam by the time any of us discovered what was going on. She would see people and things and beg me to get the spider web fibers off her that were popping out of her skin. Still she can't figure out the simplest of problems and has mind-skips, like she tripping.

sugarbear1

Was the diagnosis confirming confabulation?

Kiana

Sugarbear, I'm not sure what you mean.

Kiana

The last diagnosis she had was liver failure.

sugarbear1

Was your sister diagnosed with brain damage and confabulation? Was she a harm to herself or others? I was just curious. I hope she is doing well and that you are all visiting her often.

Peace,

Kiana

After her last mri they told us there was some damage but we did not get details. Thank you, yes, she was a threat to herself and others at that time that she was committed. This happened a while back. I stayed locked in a room while she destroyed some of the rest of house and furniture, and when help arrived she attacked them. I did not visit her and still we have a light touch with her, taking care for her medical and daily needs but my sister is long gone.

DesertEyes

Wow, Kiana, I am so sorry to hear that. I can't even imagine as to how awful that must have been for you. And still must be from how you describe that your sister is long gone. You have my respect for having survived that, and for still caring about your sister enough that you are caring for her needs.

As to your original question, a neurologist is your best resource. Since the damage was visible in the MRI you can ask for all the details this time. A good neuro will put the images up on the screen ( if they are digital ) and show you exactly what they can see.

The general rule is that the brain does heal, but after the first year the healing is much slower. How _much_ healing is something that a neuro will have to figure out. Normally they take an MRI every year, or every other year, and compare them. They will ask for the exact same machine, and the same "settings" so the images are easier to compare.

Thank you for sharing your story with us, and your strength. I hope you find SR helpful and supportive.

Mike
Moderator, SR

Kiana

Mike, thank you for your kind words and support, and the support in general of this site. Those things really do mean the world to me as I'm sure they do for countless others here. This is the only supportive place where I can read all the time and occasionally post with others that might understand.

I will always love my sister and we will make sure her needs are cared for to the end no matter what. It's sad to say but I've experienced extremely traumatic times much more so than spending a few days locked in a room without hope of help, and probably more than just a handful of people could ever relate to, which is a good thing, yet, through all those things losing my beloved sister to addiction is something that I never would have fathomed.

Until her condition is worse we will not have access to info that she chooses to keep private. The last time I took her to the ER was because she came to me scared and sick with obvious signs of liver failure.

Thank you again. This site is a true support for me.

Verbena

I'm no expert. But here's what I've noticed with my husband who has been sober for nine weeks now. He still believes a couple of his favorite confabulations, but brings them up much less often. He appears to have stopped making up new ones. I've also not seen him try to twist situations sot that they fit his alcohol tainted reality. I think that's what the AA people call stinking thinking (or something like that).

He's suffered severe memory loss (both short term and long term).

I hope this helps.