Lying About Sobriety in AA for a Chip

Old 05-01-2012, 01:29 PM
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Lying About Sobriety in AA for a Chip

I came here needing to vent but reading just the titles of the first page here has broken my heart ... HUGS to all that needs one today.

I came here because I am so upset that my mom still lies about her so-called "birthday". She lied when she took her 90, which led to the lie about her 6 month chip plus she drank again, which of course negates her 1st year ... and I know she drank over the summer and in December.

Today, she is taking her 2 year chip. It just makes me sick. But, the extreme narcissist is alive ... something I didn't think I could say for long when I first moved her here. She hates me, I've disowned her, but she is alive and appears healthy.

I guess mission is accomplished. Right?

Leaving a lot out ... feel bad to complain about petty things today ... but my poor husband needs a break!
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Old 05-01-2012, 02:31 PM
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I bet a lot of the people in her AA group know that she's been drinking, probably a greater amount than you think! I mean think about it, who is best going to be able to spot an active alcoholic? People who are [recovering] alcoholics themselves. Don't let her compulsive, lying, addict behavior ruin your day!

Also welcome to the ACoA section . Feel free to share more when you're ready! You'll find lots of support here.
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Old 05-01-2012, 02:53 PM
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I don't know your story; if she's disowned you, how do you know if she still lying?

And this isn't a flippant question, but I'm really interested because I deal with this too, and think maybe there's an issue behind the issue (or maybe not), but...why does it matter? Why does it bother you, is it representing something else?

I'm not asking to be argumentative or to suggest in anyway it should not bother you. I am applying your situation to something that feels similar in mine (not that they would in reality be similar), and I know that kind of lie coming from a certain person I know would bother me because it represents all the times he got away with it. All the times he was not called out on it when he so richly deserved--needed--to be.

There's a thousand legitimate reasons why this would bother you, and my example is only one. But I was curious because your reason might give me more insight on my situation.

It's as meaningless as lying about your age (I'm really 39, that sort of thing when you are really 45), and it's self delusionary and as PP said, probably she's not fooling many people which is pathetic. But maybe that's the annoying part; the colusion of others. Her lies make liars out of them. And they lie to be polite and avoid conflict...and maybe that's the crux of the situation: we are trying so hard not to fall into that codie behavior anymore, to stop ourselves and get uncomfortable when others do it? Kind of like denying our dieting selves chocolate cake, and then being annoyed watching someone else eat it infront of us?

I'm groping. But it's an interesting topic to explore.
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Old 05-01-2012, 04:43 PM
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Yes welcome. It must be annoying to see her lie. But at least she is trying, does she have dry spells. That must be nice. My alcoholic Dad drank till he was incarcerated at 80!
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:18 PM
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I know she is lying because she lived with me two years ago and vividly recall her cornering me in my kitchen after I discovered the empty bottle of tequila she had hidden; she was quite vicious that day. I know because several times after that while she was house sitting for other people she would drink and I know because I "caught" her and it was stupid - she's not a child but acted like it. I know because after she moved out my kids "busted" her over the summer and just last December when I gave her a ride to the market she had that horrible smell and kept making comments about how alcoholics in AA don't drink because it is embarrassing to have to do the 1st 30 days all over again.

I was told by someone it was none of my business. That her lying about her actual sobriety date is between her and herself. It was just one more thing and I needed to vent.

She hates me for bringing her to my small town by the sea with an ocean view when she lost everything and we thought she was dying or might if someone didn't take her in instead of allowing her to hit true rock bottom and out on the street after she spent two years in bed - drunk. It's my fault she isn't living her life in the "Valley" where she had no friends but a BF that she had been dating for ummm ... 17 years or so without ever knowing where he lived. It is my fault for that too, by the way (eye roll).

We were horrible to her apparently. We had the nerve to ask her to not fall asleep with the living room TV on at night every night and leave it on because it kept my husband (the bread winner) up at night. Asking her to use a timer was rude as well ... I learned it is not okay to become emotional when your drunken chain smoking mother keeps letting your inside only cats outside even though every one including her knows someone is poisoning cats on our street. She claimed my husband was being emotionally cruel to her when he'd bring a water glass from our bedroom into the kitchen when he woke in the morning because she had already scrubbed the kitchen while we slept.

She's an extreme narcissist so everything she does even acts of kindness are really about her. "If it were me/mine, I would have, Why don't you, I wouldn't have" is how she begins every sentence to me.

Yeah .... fun times.

I disowned her within the last month. Befriending my child molesters wife on FB and allowing her to see photograph's of MY children crossed a line that can never be undone. Never mind the fact that she just told the world it was okay what happened to me, or to some that maybe it never happened (dad's side of the family rallied behind my abuser, sadly, it happens), she allowed a woman that KNEW I was being molested and turned a blind eye to see picture's of MY children. Stabbed in the back on so many levels ... and here I thought her trying to cause marital problems was bad.

And the latest is just lying to the small town I moved her into that she worked so hard for her sobriety and I am a horrible person. I am learning that everything I thought I knew is/was a lie. Not just that I know she doesn't really have 2 years of total sobriety. But in AA, every chip handed out is done so in a big celebratory way. So yeah, it really bothers me that she could stand up there and get star treatment.

My mom being alive sober and as healthy as possible is a really big deal considering where she was at when she came here. I'm probably over reacting on the chip thing ... it still hurts though.

Rambling ... can't focus. Sorry if I am not making sense.
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:21 PM
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Originally Posted by Kialua View Post
Yes welcome. It must be annoying to see her lie. But at least she is trying, does she have dry spells. That must be nice. My alcoholic Dad drank till he was incarcerated at 80!
She isn't any nicer sober but yes since living here she does have long dry spells as far as I can tell. My dad drank himself to death ...

You dad got to be 80?
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Old 05-02-2012, 12:47 PM
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I just read a book that might be helpful and healing to you, "why does he do that" by lundy bancroft. It really helped me see alcoholism and abuse are two different issues, not always combined, and that an abusive person will still be an abusive person even if she/he stops drinking.

It talked about how they fake a nice exterior so they don't look like abusers to anyone but the ones they abuse - the mask never slips.

I wonder if you are feeling upset because this is one more instance where you know the real abusive person and yet she gets to have this mask on in public that makes her look so good to others? And then others don't believe you, they believe her?

I was wondering that because that's kind of what has been going on in my family, my sister especially is good at putting on a fake front and appearing non-abusive so people don't believe me about the abuse unless they've witnessed it themselves. It makes me upset to see that fake front because it invalidates my knowledge of who that person really is.
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Old 05-02-2012, 02:01 PM
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Yes, he was 80 when he was in lock up treatment and became sober for the first time in his life. We were in different towns and I just saw them a couple times a year until he was 80. He always was a functioning drunk, held a job, but moved us yearly probably because he didn't pay rent, more money for drinking that way. (See my blog) I was so surprised when he died that so many people, relatives too, liked him. I never thought that they didn't know what he was really like. They do have a good act going on don't they?

I'm sorry you have to go through all this. I think emotionally disconnecting is vital as is forgiving the undeserving parent for our sake. See our stickies above if you haven't already.
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Old 05-03-2012, 04:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Kialua View Post
I was so surprised when he died that so many people, relatives too, liked him. I never thought that they didn't know what he was really like. They do have a good act going on don't they?
You can say that again! I have found out that -- contrary to the erroneous impression I had gotten, over 47 years of living with, and interacting directly with, my Dad, that he was the funnest guy around. Always had something funny to say, very entertaining, smart (that part is true -- and he never let you forget how much Smarter Than You™ he was), and so on and so forth.

No one -- including my sister, she of the rose-colored Norman Rockwell memory of our childhood -- gets how it was for me. Well, not quite no one -- I was visiting with an elderly friend (89, to be exact -- a retired musician I used to play with), and at one point when I was describing some of the interaction I had with my Dad, started nodding. "This sounds very familiar," he said. His own father, although not an alcoholic, showed a lot of the same behavior, with regard to his kids, as did mine.

It's good to get some validation -- even if it's only from 2% of the people, who can see through the curtain....

T
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Old 05-03-2012, 02:08 PM
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I saw her today. I walked into the bar next to my business (that sounds funny ... I walked in to order breakfast to-go but no one refers to them as a restaurant) and saw the back of her sitting at a table with mutual friends and I turned around and walked out. The cantina next door offers beans with their breakfast anyways ... and a healthier portion of hash browns. That's what I told myself at the time because we are a small town and I have to put on the happy face, you know?

My whole life, way before she started drinking, I was the adult. Part of me wishes I would have stayed and thrown a tantrum.

Too emotionally drained for typing and I need to put on another happy face for a BBQ but wanted to thank everyone for their thoughts. I will definitely look for the book mentioned!

Hugs to all that need one today.
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Old 05-04-2012, 04:44 AM
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Originally Posted by CookiesAreDone View Post
My whole life, way before she started drinking, I was the adult. Part of me wishes I would have stayed and thrown a tantrum.
I never got results from throwing a tantrum -- but boy, do I wish I'd had a smart phone or a pocket digital camcorder back in the day. If I'd been able to record my parents' behavior for later use, that might have been fun, although it wouldn't have changed anything, because they'd concoct a new excuse on the spot -- "IF YOU HAD TO LIVE WITH YOURSELF, YOU'D DRINK, TOO!" or something stupid like that.

If I were growing up today, I'd record my parents' drunk/stupid/abusive behavior and put it up on YouTube -- that would have made sparks fly... maybe not as much as the time I poured several hundred bucks' worth of booze down the drain (not recommended)...

T
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Old 05-04-2012, 05:54 AM
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You just made me laugh at a not funny thing which for me, is a good sign that today will be a better day.

A few weeks ago, just before Easter, I had given her a ride to the grocery store and had my 15y/o with us. She made a snide comment, I questioned her about it, long story short I was reminded that I wasn't very pleasant to be around when I was little. I was being sexually molested when I was little. Of COURSE I wasn't a perfect kid. Wish I would have said that to her (I bit my tongue in front of my son which in hinds sight was wrong as he is a push over - gets it from me) ... but then again it's just been my fault because you know, she did after all, tell me never to let anyone touch me.

Yeah ... smart phones would have been great to have around but somehow, it would still be our fault.
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Old 05-05-2012, 09:15 AM
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The one good thing is that now that you are grown up, you can have a happy, healthy life and she really can't do anything to stop that! You are free!

I hope that today will be a good day for you, and only one good day in a long line of many many many good days!
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Old 05-05-2012, 10:23 AM
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I never thought of it that way ... I AM FREE!! Wow. That sounds and feels wonderful.

I'm going to have to put sticky notes all over the house to remind myself of that LOL

Thank you!
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Old 05-06-2012, 09:17 AM
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Yes you can be who you want to be, not what she thinks you are. You don't need her version of you to control you.

My parents were physically abusive, my AF and enabling Mother both. She would fall into patterns late in life of gossiping about other people and what bad parents they were. Strangers, neighbors, relatives. And they were just normal, nothing abusive. It was like she had been the best parent in the world. More than once I had it out with her and told her that what she allowed and participated in with me and my sibs was far worse and that today SHE would have been jailed. Then she would say she didn't remember any such thing, she has had mini strokes that conveniently took all the abuse memories but kept all the other minutia of daily life. In my case, when I really pressed her and got angry, the next day she would land in the hospital with another unconfirmed mini stroke. And so it went until she died at 97. I saw that I was not going to get anywhere with recompense from her so I gave up and was a dutiful forgiving daughter for my sake. Kept her at arms length but no longer had any bitterness or expectations. Just pity.

I hope you can emotionally detach from your Mom. It will save you.
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Old 05-20-2012, 06:22 AM
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Emotionally detaching is very hard ... how difficult it must have been for you to do it while maintaining contact. You are much braver than me.

I found out yesterday that she is telling people I have a self medication problem. Apparently, I abuse Xanax.

While it is true that I have Panic Disorder, I am prescribed to take as needed which ends up being half of the mg prescribed and half as often, plus I see an Osteopathic Doctor who prescribes essential oils and an Acupuncturist ... so yeah, I self medicate in the sense that I take half of what I was told to and try natural things including yoga to heal my body so I do not need chemicals to not feel like I am have a major heart attack and menopausal hot flashes at the same time.

Her AA buddies (small town here) totally buy into her story and wouldn't ya know it? They've been "watching it happen for a while now". Um excuse me, but what they have been watching is me spiraling down while putting up with her abuse.

Well now I know what she has been telling people. She couldn't tell people the truth, which is that I cut her out of my life after she became FACEBOOK FRIENDS with wife of the man who sexually molested me ... and allowed this woman to see pictures of my kids when they were younger.

I am having a hard time NOT going around defending myself. I'm just going to go about my business as usual.

Luckily I get to keep busy today so I can't wallow in it. :-)
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Old 05-20-2012, 01:24 PM
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Her life is her life. This should be of no concern to you, except for you to have some compassion for her - that she's having such a hard time being honest. Underneath her smile etc is probably a terrified little girl who wants so badly to be real.

Also, this is not uncommon, and most people eventually tell the group the truth (and damn is it hard) and laugh about it a year later. Don't worry. Don't judge.
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Old 05-21-2012, 05:32 AM
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Originally Posted by gplmdyw View Post
Her life is her life. This should be of no concern to you, except for you to have some compassion for her - that she's having such a hard time being honest. Underneath her smile etc is probably a terrified little girl who wants so badly to be real.

Also, this is not uncommon, and most people eventually tell the group the truth (and damn is it hard) and laugh about it a year later. Don't worry. Don't judge.
The other thing is that at the end of the day, it does not matter what someone else is saying about us. They can say what they like -- and if it manages to convince some fellow AAs that we're crazy, so freaking what? She's only fooling herself, going to AA, collecting medallions, and drinking on the side. I'm sure most of the people in her AA group see right through her anyway -- they probably used to do the same thing, and although she thinks she's fooling them, she really isn't.

I keep reminding myself that it really isn't all about me -- not that many people really care what I'm doing on a given day, what meds I take, what I'm doing with my life (as opposed to what I "should" be doing), and all that. Those people out there are more concerned with themselves than with me -- which, of course, is as it should be!

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