changeschoices

I talked to a friend about XABF's behavior when his drinking was spiraling out of control. It was delusional, mean, monstrously selfish and entitled, just not acceptable. My friend said, Honestly, that sounds sociopathic.

It got me thinking. Was I living with a sociopath, or an alcoholic who did anti-social things because of what alcohol did to his brain? Or both? Do ALL alcoholics act so selfish and deceptive?

womaninprogress

Speaking for myself, this question is what kept me on the merry go round so long. Is he an ass because of alcohol? Or is he just an ass?

I think if I could just have an honest answer to that question it would be so much easier to either walk away, or stay. The not knowing if he really does love me, and he's sick with alcoholism? Or does he really not have a heart? I hate the not knowing.

Charon

When alcoholics quit drinking they are still the same person. That's what AA is all about - getting rid of character defects. Many alcoholics become melancholy, happy, cheerful, friendly, considerate, etc. when they drink. Someone who gets mean, angry, hostile, abusive, etc. has issues other than alcohol. Alcohol simply breaks down the inhibitions, it doesn't change who we are.

witharealwinner

I wanted to come out of my lurkdom to answer this.

I'd agree with Charon.

My abf (I don't even want to call him that anymore) has been unable to drink bc I am refusing to buy him alcohol (he's unemployed and his unemployment checks very recently stopped) so he's been sober for a few days now.

He's still a nasty jerk when he gets angry about something. When he asks me for money to pay his car loan so his car doesn't get repo'd and I refuse, he becomes a nasty, horrible person. When I suggest he go back home to maybe look for work with his nephew, he becomes a jerk....flipping me off, calling me names, etc.

So, yeah, it seems the ones who are jerks when drunk have other issues going on. At least that's my experience.

BillyPilgrim

I am afraid I dont agree. Alcohol is an intoxicant. All human beings have flaws, if someone is drunk they can be unpleasant and nasty.
Alcohol inhibits your judgement.

frstnm

I was one of the alcoholics. I wasnt EVER physically violent but Im sure I did some emotional and verbal damage. I have made my amends but it doesnt change the past.
Also, I just wasnt there emotionally for myself of anyone else.

frstnm

Turns out Im a halfway decent person when Im not using/drinking. Always room for growth ! Im gonna need alota room !

Tuffgirl

Thanks for sharing this. You explained my expereinces to a T. Especially the last line.

What may look like complete self-centeredness, lack of caring about others, etc. is probably someone who simply can't be there emotionally for themselves or anyone else.

My dearest friend, a pretty bad off alcoholic, is also mean and nasty when drunk. I know that is not her, necessarily, but she does have issues underneath that helped her turn to alcohol to begin with.

BillyPilgrim

Totally agree, it takes all sorts in this world. Some people turn to drink after personal tragedies in their lives, some like the feeling of being drunk.

It has nothing to do with your underlying character, just with your ability to cope with alcohol

I cant cope with booze I had to stop. I also hurt people when drunk, for which I am ashamed

Winston Churchill drank to excess, Hitler didnt, I know who I would rather chew the fat with.

Lilmssunshine

I agree with this. I said and did things drunk I would NEVER do while sober. I wouldnt want someone thinking I was a certain way because of the intoxication. But I dont blame people in my life for being confused by my past inhibited judgments.

Lilmssunshine

I like this analogy.

Spes

Your post has made a big difference in my life; you have just made me face something I have not wanted to face. I don't have anything else to say other than you have really described my life with my AW. I'm speechless.

Mavis1

my husband would just fall down and make very bad decisions, dui, loss of job/family etc...then he died. he was not a bad person at all, he was a good person, just a very sick person. even when he drank he was not abusive - ever, he just fell down, where ever he was. so sad...

Katiekate

My xabf was a wonderful man when he was sober, meaning after a nights sleep he was really okay for the most part.

One drink and down the tubes.

Of course he has his flaws, but I actually liked him as a friend when he wasn't drinking.

The inconsistencey was enough to make me a crazy woman.

Cyranoak

...some are terrible all the time, some are terrible none of the time, and some are terrible only when they drink. It's all over the board. It also doesn't matter.

What matters is how your alcoholic behaves and how you are affected by it.

Very often, alcoholics change their behavior when drunk vs. sober. Very often they don't. We argue here all the time about which is "the real person," the drunk one or the sober one. Based on what I've read here there is no definitive answer. It's different for each alcoholic.

My wife, when drunk, is very, very mean. Did the alcohol simply reveal the true her? IMHO yes and no. What it did was drop the filters she uses to keep herself from expressing her anger, disappointment, outrage, etc. When sober, as she has been for well over a year, her nature remains direct and she still brooks no ********, but she is no longer mean. Is that simply the true her? IMHO yes and no. I still think she is sometimes pissed somewhere down there-- how can she not be? She lives with me and my daughter and that's no easy thing. But we now live with each other in a way my life before her taught me was and is "normal," and I like it (most of the time).

However, here's what she never was, drunk or sober-- physically violent, promiscuous (as far as I know), or destructive of the possessions of others.

Again, however, it doesn't matter. What matters for you is you, your life, and how it is being affected by somebody else's drinking. If you haven't already, please keep an open mind and consider Alanon. It, more than anything, will give you the answers you need.

My two cents,

Cyranoak

djayr

My AW is an angel sober, and a crazy person drunk. Crazy: unrealistic, romanticizing, clueless, naive, lost, and all goofed up. It's basically an on/off switch. What I can't figure out is if drinking completely screws up her life, friendships, relationships, finances, etc. -- why doesn't she STOP?

But who is the "real" person? -- I think the real person is the sober one. The alcohol is an evil poison (possibly the devil himself) which just kicks her butt in every possible way.

choublak

My opinion, it seems like a lot of what I read on here is people who are dealing with sociopaths who happen to also be alcoholics.

BuffaloGal

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I agree-- my aexh was not particularly a jerk when sober or drunk. He was mainly depressed in both states. If anything, he had more access to his emotions while drunk... they were still 90% negative though, so it didn't make for great company, but he was not deliberately cruel, aggressive, or angry when he was drinking.

Anappleaday

When my AH is sober, he is a great person. Kind, helpful and considerate and loving.

If he has just 1 or 2 drinks he becomes withdrawn, keeps to himself and pretty much ignores me. More than a few and he becomes negative, saying insulting things and everything that is wrong becomes my fault. if he put the blame on me, he will find justification in his own actions. He has never been physically abusive but honestly the emotional abuse is bad and wreaks it's own kind of special havoc.

I also have a brother that is a alchoholic that is always more often than not a total jerk. Often times his actions are clearly deliberate, he uses words to cut as deep as he can. He did however get sober for 5 years and during that time he was working on being a responsible, employed tax paying citizen. He worked the steps, made ammends and treated people good. He returned to the drinking, quit working, lives off his girlfriend and the previous personality returned. My other brother is a recovering drug addict. He quit because he had a heart attack but still has the same addict behavior, lying and manipulating, blaming others for his circumstances. He constantly plays the poor pity me violin.

I have known or been around a number of alchoholics/addicts and it seems they can be one way or the other, but what I have found is that when drinking/drugs are their main priority over family, working and being financially responsible - they tend to have some or all of the traits connected with addiction; selfishness, physical aggression, emotianal abuse, lying, manipulating, stealing, cheating, etc, etc etc.

mattmathews

When my RAW was drinking, I thought she was an angel when she was sober but I really started to dislike her drinking persona.
When she quit drinking, and when I started my own recovery, I gradually came to understand that she really had a lot of personality issues...sober. I think in my own codependent way, I'd put her on a pedestal and just assumed that any problems in our relationship were either my fault or the alcohol's fault. I made her my higher power.
Seems crazy now, but that's how it was.