Is he crazy or am I?

Old 03-08-2012, 09:02 PM
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Is he crazy or am I?

Hi! I am new to this board and just don't know where to turn anymore. Let me start by giving you my background. I am an only child that lived with a functioning (for the most part) alcoholic father my entire life....vodka, hiding bottles, constant fights with my mom...the whole thing until he eventually got cardiomiopathy (sp?) and died suddenly a month before my wedding day. My dad drank every single day and I spent my entire childhood embarrassed and wishing that my mom would divorce him...he died when I was 25, and my mom never divorced him. He could never kick the habit and my mom could never seem to give up hope that he would. Now I have been married to my husband for 5 years and we have two wonderful children (ages 2 and 3 1/2) together. We both work and have great jobs that bring in good money. We have the 4 bedroom house and all that American dream crap. Now I am dealing with my husband's drinking....how can I be so lucky (sense the sarcasm). Let me tell you a little about him. I know he is not like my dad (yet) because he does not drink every single day and because he can stop drinking during the week he thinks he has no problem. The problem is that when he does drink, he does not know when to stop. He has admitted to me that when the alcohol is in the house, he will drink it, and has asked me on past occasions to get rid of the beer or not keep it in the house. He thinks that because he does not drink during the week that he should be able to do what he wants on the weekends. He is always the most drunk person at parties, holidays and even just casual get togethers. He just can't seem to contol it when he starts. He ruined Christmas Eve this year because he got wasted at his Uncle's house...I had asked him earlier in the evening to slow down because we had to be "Santa" later on, but that just pissed him off. Once we got in the car he screamed at me the whole way home with our kids in the backseat (I drove, btw). I BEGGED him to just stop yelling since it was Christmas Eve, but he just wouldn't quit. We got home and he went to bed and I had to put all the presents out by myself. He did not apologize the next day, nor did he think he did anything wrong...I was the wrong one for nagging him. He always tries to turn things around and tells me that I am just this crazy person and my dad screwed me up when it comes to alcohol. Sometimes he actually makes me think that I am the one with the problem (meaning, I make it all up in my head) and that I am just paranoid because of my dad. So, you tell me....I go to the store and leave him with the kids and he will have an entire 6-pack of beer gone by the time I come home a few hours later...mind you, this is not every time, just on the weekends. Is this normal? Tonight, we were home just doing the normal stuff with our kids and chores. He stopped and had a few beers while he was waiting to get his haircut on his way home from work and then he bought a 6-pack of beer on the way home and drank the 6-pack of beer all by his lonesome. Is this normal? BTW, he is off of work every other Friday, so this is considered part of his weekend. He is clearly buzzed, and I mentioned to him where he got the beer and he flipped out and said that he can't live his life like this anymore and can't stand me...he has become verbally abusive (not physically though) over the years and tells me that he hates me and said that he won't live his life like this with me constantly nagging him and being a bitch. He thinks when he stops drinking Mon, Tues & Wed that is supposed to be good enough. He doesn't get it. Or, am I the one that is over-sensitive to drinking? I just one time want him to be the DD when we go somewhere or not to be drunk in front of our kids. Why when we are home by ourselves with our childrend does he have to drink at least 6 beers?? I know I lived with an alcoholic, but don't normal fathers/husbands/people not drink by themselves on a regular basis, especially if they know their wife hates it? We went over another couples house a few Sunday's for a get together with 2 other couples and our kids. Yes, all the men were drinking, but somehow my husband manages to drink about 5 beers in less than an hour and as usual looks the worst of the men. Then he proceeds to tell me that he called off work for MOnday and is going to continue drinking with his friends...this is the 2nd time he called off for drinking in a month. I was obviously mad at this...we both work, but he is the breadwinner, but how dare I get mad? What am I, his mother? That is what he says to me, but if he loses his job down the line that affects all of us. The evening ended with me packing my kids up and going home alone and he continues drinking with his friends and they drive him home around 10:00. How dare I be mad for having to be the responsible person and take care of the kids all by myself? I could go on, but I hope you get an idea of where my frustrations are coming from. Am I just paranoid because of my dad or do I have a legitimate right to think that he has a problem? Can you have a problem with alcohol and still not drink every day? I just don't know what to do! I don't want to break up our family and sell this house. My kids adore their father! To tell you the truth, I am afraid of divorcing him and wondering if he is drinking on the days he has custody of them and not being able to see what is going on. What do you mothers do in this kind of situation? My kids are my world and I just want to do the best thing for them, but I just have no idea what that is at this point. He will not listen to me and try to understand...everything is my fault. Please help me!!!!!!
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:13 PM
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Hi frustrated. There are many wise people on this board who will be along to help. SR was my lifesaver over this past year with my own husband who is an alcoholic. It took me a while to come to grips with that. I had a lot of the same questions as you, ie, "Is this normal?"

There are answers to your questions and you are not crazy! You are also not alone. I send you hugs as you begin this part of your journey.
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Old 03-08-2012, 09:51 PM
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Thank you! This is the first time I am reaching out and I guess I am looking for other people and stories that I can relate to. I have just felt all alone for so long. I mainly struggle with the fact that he does not drink every day and in January stopped drinking completely on his own for weeks. He thinks that means he does not have problem, but that is not necessarily the case, right? My dad drank every single day, so it was very clear that he had a problem, but not as clear with my husband. I am afraid he will get to that point someday....my mom always tells me that it wasn't like my dad drank in the morning his whole life...he worked his way up to that point. That scares the heck out of me, for both my children and me. I don't want to live like this again, and I want better for my children.
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Old 03-08-2012, 11:52 PM
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You are not crazy just codependent.

Your husband is very ill and can't hear a word you say as his addiction is more important than you the kids his work himself etc...

As are amazing at manipulating so they can continue to justify their drinking hence it's YOUR fault and YOU are sensitive a nag.

Read though this forum and you will see how common your husbands behavior is along with all if his comments and tactics.

What is best for you and your kids safety and peace at this time?

BIG hug to you
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Old 03-09-2012, 05:29 AM
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You're not crazy, you're bothered by someone else's drinking, and you're allowed to feel that way regardless of whether he considers it a problem. Many similar situations here. My AH would binge on the weekends, feeling he deserved a break after working hard. Would always be the drunkest one at the party. Always had to drag his sorry drunk butt home. Same feelings. Difference was that he has never been verbally or otherwise abusive, but lots of the same rationalizations about being able to control it etc. to leave him alone, why do I pay so much attention and nag him.

We have a 4 yr old. When she was barely a year I came to a breaking point with his behaviour and asked him to leave. He sobered up and got some help, but it's been a struggle over the years. Although there is very little drinking except for his occasional 'slips', he still pines after the fact that he can't be a 'normal' drinker and hasn't addressed many of the core issues that led him to continue drinking. After another slip last weekend, I'd had enough and told him that one way or another we had to get out of this funk. He either starts truly addressing his drinking or he doesn't. Either way, I'm working on a healthy happy life for me and my 4 yr old. She is just at the age where she can interpret our behaviours, and I simply do not want his unaddressed issues to start silently rubbing off on her. As much as there may be love there, I recall something dr. phil once said - it's better to have come from a broken home than to be from a broken home.

Al Anon really helps you get some perspective outside your home, where everything feels so contained and unique. Speaking with folks here and in al anon helps you realize that he, and your dynamic, is like thousands of others. That's really powerful because it proves you're not crazy. They will just do anything to protect their drinking, and his tactics are ways of allowing him to continue. Get help for yourself, do what you need to do to protect your kids.
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:09 AM
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((((hugs))))

Something that really helped me was the 3 c's.

I didn't cause it.
I can't control it.
I can't cure it.

Your AH will quit drinking and start recovery when he is ready and not 1 second sooner and there is nothing that you can do to change that.

For me, once I really understood this I realized that the only thing I could change was me and that is when my recovery began.

Give Al-Anon a try, it was a life saver for me and keep posting here.

Your friend,
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Old 03-09-2012, 06:56 AM
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I struggled for a long time with if my husband had a drinking problem.

I have come to realize that if it impacts me negatively it does not matter what the drinking looks like (my ex binge drank, held a job). Impacting me is enough. I heard many of the same things that it sounds like you did.

Learning about alcoholism helped, as did Al-anon and learning about codependency. Though I did not grow up with active alcoholism in my home, both of my parents did. I have also found that learning about being an adult child of alcoholics has been helpful.

I am glad you found us but sorry for the reason you are here.
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Old 03-09-2012, 03:57 PM
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I feel like, when we were in the thick of it, we both were crazy. My wife's crazy was completely detached from reality because of her alcoholism. My crazy was because of reality, my efforts to bend it and her to my will, and my inability to distinguish what I could control and what I could not control.

Things are much better now because of Alanon, AA, and my wife and I each working the programs vigorously. Crazy rarely comes to my home now, and when it does it's a guest of our teenage daughter.

Take care,

Cyranoak
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Old 03-09-2012, 08:50 PM
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Thanks to all of you. Your words mean so much. Silkspin, I am sorry that your AH slipped up again. Can I ask you how you protect your 4 year old from his drinking? I don't want to leave the house and deal with the fact that he would be alone with our kids and I wouldn't know what was going on. I just can't do that. I don't trust him. He was 0.01 below the legal limit with our son in the car last year....too close for comfort. I absolutely hate seeing him drunk and interacting with out children. It disgusts me, but I would rather have that with me keeping an eye on things. Trust me, he is a great father and is NEVER abusive or mean towards them when he is drinking (or at all), but I am just afraid of him carrying them up the stairs and falling or drinking and driving with them. Right now, I just don't know how I can live in this house, make it clear that I will not be a part of his drinking and still protect my children from all of it. When I act like I don't care about him, he just drinks more and tells me, "I will just start drinking during the week again then since it's never good enough". I don't want to set him off, but I don't want to pretend like I don't have a problem with his drinking either. If we didn't have children I would have been out of this house already and starting a new life, I am 100% sure about that, but the kids make this a whole new situation. I just want to do what is best for them.
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Old 03-17-2012, 05:05 PM
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veryfrustrated, my breaking point came when she was just a baby. One afternoon I took the baby to see a friend along with another friend visiting from out of town. It was a tuesday night (and he was a weekend binger) and when me and my friend came home, he was drunk as a skunk (because he'd been home alone, he saw it as an opportunity). My girlfriend awkwardly said goodbye, and I put baby to bed, he went up and passed out and I finally found an al anon group. Then, some months later, me in al anon regularly, we'd visited some friends who lived a ways from us, so we stayed the night. Set up the portable crib. They also had a baby. Us girls hung out, put babies to bed, went to bed ourselves. Boys stayed up and drank to oblivion. When he came into the room he tried to undress for bed, lost his balance and stuck out a hand to grab on to something - i.e. the portable crib, to steady himself. If he'd put too much weight it could have tipped, or folded, either way it just proved to me that he was not safe to be around. I was so angry and a day or so later I told him we were done. He stopped drinking then, and there hadn't been any active drinking until the first slip about 8 months later. He went out playing with a softball team so when he came home she was in bed. She never saw it. One day he was too hungover to go to a preplanned event - we went on our own. Later I was going to my sisters, but when I got home he had had a beer. He claimed he was fine, but of course I couldn't trust him, so last minute grabbed the portable and we both went to my sisters. I couldn't in good conscience leave her with him. After that incident (he got help again and stopped for another year) I stated my boundaries clearly - if I'm ever out and come home and realize he's been drinking while with her alone, I will pack us up without another word and walk right out the door. His next slip he pretended to be a normal drinker, having wine with dinner at family occasions for example. He would drink like anyone else while everyone was around, so she doesn't even notice. But after everyone was gone, she was asleep, he'd retire to his cave in the basement and finish the job.

So in our situation, there is no 'drunken' drinking in front of her because of the boundaries I've given him. If there would be a time where he'd start drinking on a saturday afternoon, I'd leave with her, plain and simple. If he wants time with his daughter, it's sober or not at all, and thankfully it's never happened.

What I do realize now is that his behaviour when he's not drinking still affects us. As much as I'm in recovery and pass those good habits to my daughter, he hasn't sought recovery so much of how he acts is coloured by this disease. It's not just about protection, it's about not having to worry about protection and what I have to do to achieve this. This is what I'm facing now.

My take on his telling you that he'll drink more if you ignore his drinking or him - ignore that too. When they start feeling uncomfortable with you no longer engaging with them, they start trying to hook you because under the old rules, the dynamic allowed them to keep drinking. Your new detachment threatens that and they don't like it. I started walking away at all costs - no matter what he said. Left it squarely his problem and he didn't like it but too bad so sad. It forced him to address the drinking, even though the problem isn't solved it's worlds better than what it was and he currently has respected all boundaries despite the slips. They throw fishing lines - don't bite.
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Old 03-18-2012, 12:04 AM
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Hi veryfrustrated,
I am glad that you reached out. I did about 10 years ago to these forums, and to Al-anon. It seems that many of us that are here have had more than our share of alcoholics in our lives. I personally am an alcoholic magnet. That is why I need a lot of help keeping a positive attitude and outlook. I need people who don't look at me crazy, talk behind my back, or give me a lot of B.S. advice. I need people who have been through it and gotten better.

I would encourage you to check out Al-anon. It helped me when I had hit rock bottom with the alcoholism. Al-anon looks at alcoholism as a family illness. It affects everyone. The problem is that everyone is focused on the alcoholic and no one else is getting what they need. We have to start focusing on ourselves, little by little, until we can gain back our sanity, our self worth, and our happiness.

I couldn't do that without a lot of help. Alcoholism is so negative, depressing, isolating, and crazy that I couldn't pull myself up on my own. Going to a meeting was an hour that I felt positive and sane. When I left, it all fell apart. If someone had gotten between me and a meeting when I first started, I probably would have ripped them a new one right quick! It took a little while for the things I was hearing and talking about in meetings (and reading) to start creeping into my daily life. When it did, it was amazing.

Life hasn't been all roses and chocolates for the ten years since I started, but I have a lot more support and answers when the s*** hits the fan these days. When things are good, I don't worry so much about when the next upheaval is coming. I can enjoy the good times and withstand the bad. I am not alone today. I have people that I can lean on when things are not going well.

I don't have kids, but I know it is a big worry for spouses. There are meetings that welcome children, or have a nursery. There is Al-anon literature that is written for children very young, up to older teens. Even if you can't get to a meeting, get some literature. The website is posted below. I am not one that believes that there is only one way that can help. My help was Al-anon. Yours may be another way, but Al-anon might be as helpful to you as it was to me. It is definitely worth checking into further. Hugs, Magic
Welcome to Al-Anon Family Groups
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Old 03-18-2012, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by veryfrustrated View Post
Thanks to all of you. Your words mean so much. Silkspin, I am sorry that your AH slipped up again. Can I ask you how you protect your 4 year old from his drinking? I don't want to leave the house and deal with the fact that he would be alone with our kids and I wouldn't know what was going on. I just can't do that. I don't trust him. He was 0.01 below the legal limit with our son in the car last year....too close for comfort. I absolutely hate seeing him drunk and interacting with out children. It disgusts me, but I would rather have that with me keeping an eye on things. Trust me, he is a great father and is NEVER abusive or mean towards them when he is drinking (or at all), but I am just afraid of him carrying them up the stairs and falling or drinking and driving with them. Right now, I just don't know how I can live in this house, make it clear that I will not be a part of his drinking and still protect my children from all of it. When I act like I don't care about him, he just drinks more and tells me, "I will just start drinking during the week again then since it's never good enough". I don't want to set him off, but I don't want to pretend like I don't have a problem with his drinking either. If we didn't have children I would have been out of this house already and starting a new life, I am 100% sure about that, but the kids make this a whole new situation. I just want to do what is best for them.
Dear Veryfrustrated,

My dad was an alcoholic. He died two years ago and was an alcoholic his entire life. Guess it was almost his entire life, the last two years he couldn't drink because we had to place him in a nursing home because of alcohol related dementia.

The way my mother protected us from him was by divorcing him when I was 15 years old. Even then, so much of the damage was already done. The unpredictability of an alcoholic home causes children to often blame themselves and to rely on dysfunctional coping mechanisms. For example, I still to this day apologize for things that are not my fault. I also dated many boys/men who were just like my father. Kept trying to find someone I could actually successfully "save".

My father would drive around with me drunk all the time and it was terrifying. I think I was around 8 years old when I realized the danger I was in. I would sit in the front seat and pretend to be asleep because I heard that people who were asleep during car accidents were injured less. "Great dads" do NOT drive around drunk with their children.

Children absorb so many things in their home. At an early age, I learned to walk on eggshells in order to not set off the alcoholic. This is why alcoholism/co-dependency is a generational diseased. You learn from a very young age to not question unacceptable behavior.

Children NEED safe environments and mentally healthy parent(s) in order to grow into mentally healthy adults.

There are so many brave people here on SoberRecovery. There are parents that have gotten out of horrific situations in order to create a safe environment for themselves and their children. It doesn't seem easy. I have actually gained a lot more respect for my own mother by reading the stories here. I've gained a new appreciation for everything that needs to be put in place before you leave. There are so many inspirational stories here.

I agree, active alcoholics should not be left responsible for children. I have read about moms/dads getting court ordered supervised visits in situation like these.

Sending you strength.

db
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Old 03-18-2012, 07:36 AM
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Well...you're not crazy.

It does sound like your husband has an addiction to alcohol that is progressing. I expect that your background has made you very sensitive to this issue and perhaps it has become a problem for you before it has dawned on your husband that he has a drinking problem.

I drank much as your husband does but my wife never really twigged to the issue. As such our marriage was never dramatically affected by the issue.

Someone else mentioned that your husband will not quit till he is ready...this is absolutely true. You're in a tough spot, I really do with you all the very best.
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Old 03-18-2012, 10:30 AM
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“He always tries to turn things around and tells me that I am just this crazy person and my dad screwed me up when it comes to alcohol. Sometimes he actually makes me think that I am the one with the problem (meaning, I make it all up in my head) and that I am just paranoid because of my dad. So, you tell me....”

First let me say that I am by no means an expert on alcoholism or addiction. I’m quite new to this myself. What I can say, however, is that this scenario seems to be the norm in a relationship where one partner is an alcoholic/addict and using. I experience the same mind bending blame all the time from my AGF.

“he has become verbally abusive (not physically though) over the years and tells me that he hates me and said that he won't live his life like this with me constantly nagging him and being a bitch.”

Verbal abuse is another characteristic I see frequently when my AGF is using. Although it is very hurtful, it seems to me to be a way of venting the frustration she feels with herself for “failing” in her own eyes by drinking/using again. I’m trying to learn to detach when this takes place and focus on my well-being and sanity rather than allow the emotional beat down to debilitate me.

“He thinks when he stops drinking Mon, Tues & Wed that is supposed to be good enough.”

How do you know he’s not drinking Mon, Tues, & Wed? I thought the same about my AGF, that she was sober most of the time and only had occasional slips. I thought that until I started really paying attention and found that she was simply hiding it from me. That said, I’m not encouraging you to further attempt to manage his drinking. I did that and all it did was begin to be an obsession that ultimately was destroying ME. I’m just suggesting that you take an honest assessment of the situation and recognize where your focus needs to be. Long story short, it sounds like he needs to seek help. You have to understand that you cannot fix this, he has to. What you can do is work on yourself. Keep yourself strong and at peace. Strangely enough that will help him. Maybe give Al-anon a shot. That’s what I’m doing.

Good luck and just know that you’re not alone in this situation.
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