augustwest

is the fantasy of every problem drinker and drugger. Every person i've ever known with such a problem tried to moderate their use. Most posts i read here indicate prior attempts, current attempts, or fantasies of moderation.

Here's the drill. Change the external circumstances. Change the substance. Set rules. Control the frequency. Control the quantity. Ad infinitum.

My personal experience with this is vast, and painful. Years of failed attempts eventually morphed into a defeated nihilistic view that was desperate and confused. I literally wanted to die and was well on the way to achieving that end, just slowly as i was afraid to commit suicide.

But i have to acknowledge that my experience, while pretty extensive, doesn't even begin to touch the scope of humanity as a whole. There are people who develop a problem and then learn to moderate. I know one such person. He speaks of the experience as being careful, guarded, and methodical.

My question is why? By the time we reach the point of having to consider moderating our drinking and drug use there are real problems in our lives. Why do we all want to cling so dearly to something that has caused us such suffering? When i learned i was allergic to tomatoes i quit eating them. Thinking of eating them made me cringe because i knew it would hurt me. But with drugs and booze i followed the delusion of success until it nearly killed me.

BillyPilgrim

We pretend alcohol is our friend. We would never pretend that for a tomato. That is the problem, false friends

Terminally Unique

The only people who yearn to drink moderately are obviously problem drinkers. Why else would they yearn to drink moderately? It's like saying that you yearn to be taller, which is just another way of saying that you are too short.

augustwest

It seems we just have it in for ourselves. I know i did. Eventually i realized that i didn't want to moderate at all. I wanted license to get high and blot out my past, my current, my failings, insecurities, and fears without the negative consequences. I just wanted to be anything but me. Finally i gave that up, and my life has meaning and real happiness now even with the faults that i'm working on. But even 2 years later the occasional "i can handle it" thought enters my mind.

addiction is weird.

littlefish

If alcohol was just a beverage for me, all of those measures might have worked. But I didn't drink because I was thirsty or because wanted a nice wine to accompany my meal. Alcohol wasn't and isn't a beverage, for me. I drank because I wanted to be numb and avoid reality, which made alcohol a mind altering substance for me.

All the moderation in the world didn't help me address the question why I wanted to disconnect my emotions, or why I found everyday reality unbearable.

augustwest

this was my experience as well

Terminally Unique

If this thread grows, it might make for a good sticky...

augustwest

i'm hoping so

ErinErin

AugustWest, that would have been comical if I weren't so desperate. I had literally just hit "send" on my first post ever to this forum, in which I talked about wanting to moderate. Point taken.

I honestly don't feel that I'm avoiding anything- I just LOVE BOOZE. I love the way it makes me more talkative and free. I love abandon. I mean, I'm sure I have underlying issues just like anyone else, addict or no, but nothing terrible happened to me in my past.

Anyway. New to all this, wondering how to begin.

Love the Trey pic, BTW. I'm a phan myself, though I tend to prefer the 1996 - 2000 era.

augustwest

Welcome Erin. Who doesn't prefer 96-00?

But i say 1994 FTW! 94 machine gun trey is incredible.

ErinErin

All about, the funk, IMO. Have you joined that sober show group? I can't remember their names, but I've enjoyed their bullhorn action at shows before....

Taking5

Someone posted the other day, "if moderation worked, we'd have a moderation forum here, and you could browse through it to read all of the moderation success stories". That is a pretty darned good point.

There is a group called "Moderation Management" that is for people that want to moderate their drinking. The founder was Audrey Kishline. Google up her story and give it a read. I'd post the link but evidently some people don't like that story and the moderators here get slammed with PMs the last time I posted it.

If you try moderation and it doesn't work for you, come on back. SR will still be here as will AA, Smart, Rational Recovery, et al.

Missy7

I'm on day three of yet another attempt. Moderation is the most dangerous thing I can think of right now. I'm just feeling capable of working, making dinner, living my life. Moderation is slow suicide.

augustwest

Yes, i am a member of the phellowship.

augustwest

Well that's just silly. We should be able to talk about that here. Do you do "moderation management?"

Taking5

It wasn't talking about moderation management, it was the Audrey Kishline story that riled so many people up. Please google it first before you comment.

No moderation has no place in my life when it comes to alcohol. I'm either all out, or all in. Right now I am sober in AA.

Sapling

I don't think you could put it any better than Bill W. did in the 1930's..Big Book First Edition..First paragraph of "More About Alcoholism." These guys knew the game.

Most of us have been unwilling to admit we were real alcoholics. No person likes to think he is bodily and mentally different from his fellows. Therefore, it is not surprising that our drinking careers have been characterized by countless vain attempts to prove we could drink like other people. The idea that somehow, someday he will control and enjoy his drinking is the great obsession of every abnormal drinker. The persistence of this illusion is astonishing. Many pursue it into the gates of insanity or death.

DayTrader

drinking in moderation meant (to me): not drinking into a blackout, not going on a free-for-all, not getting totally wasted. I could drink good wine in moderation with dinner quite often. (8x out of 10 though, within an hour, I was jones'n for more.......big time)

I can't speak for everyone (obviously) but I can speak for a lot of ppl I know who share my experience........ I/we continued to drink in the face of all the problems, the trouble, the pain because I liked to drink. I liked how it made me feel & how it helped me not-feel a lot of emotional pain. For an immature selfish person like me, "how I feel" is THE MOST IMPORTANT THING IN THE WORLD....... so if I felt like drinking, I drank. It didn't matter if I knew it would hurt me later, I want to feel good NOW. I'll find some way to deal with the pain of "later" when it rolls around.

Of course, there's always the possibility that one really HAS lost the ability to control/moderate their drinking and they keep drinking (in the face of obvious danger/death) because they can't choose NOT to anymore. Not everyone has..........but many many ppl DO actually lose the power of choice.

augustwest

I see. I'll check it out.

Terminally Unique

Does anybody else find it interesting that when it comes to smoking cigarettes, we tell people to quit, but when it comes to drinking, we usually tell them to 'cut back' or to 'get help'?

Here's an official FDA warning on some cigarette packs:

Compare to: