I am not liked
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 235
I am not liked
So, I have been to Al-anon and working on myself. I have started with the detaching with love and not being an enabler by making my STBXRAH responsible for the kids. The next steps are supposed to be money, making him responsible for his bills, and getting the visitation out of my home. I have run into a snag.
He does not like this new girl and thinks I am brash and unreasonable. He is now fighting everything. Our custody order gives him two nights a week with the kids up to 4 hours. He was with them every Monday and Wednesday. I was going to zumba to exercise. He would come Tuesday so I could go to Al-anon. He told me last night AA is selflessness and Al-anon is selfishness. He is not going to work the schedule around me anymore. I need to find new times to do the things I want or get a babysitter for the kids. He is not living around me. I am a selfish b. and never cared about him.
Now, really if he wants the kids 4 hours it has to be Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday. Kids get home at 4. I am home from zumba at 8. He says I am using him to get away from kids because I can not handle it.
Really? I told him all I am hearing blah, blah, blah.
I have custody of our children and when they are sleeping it doesn't count as my time. So, really we have joint custody.
How do I deal with him not liking these changes? I know he is the selfish one but really? How can someone be that naive? It is so hard to ignore and have thick skin sometimes.
He does not like this new girl and thinks I am brash and unreasonable. He is now fighting everything. Our custody order gives him two nights a week with the kids up to 4 hours. He was with them every Monday and Wednesday. I was going to zumba to exercise. He would come Tuesday so I could go to Al-anon. He told me last night AA is selflessness and Al-anon is selfishness. He is not going to work the schedule around me anymore. I need to find new times to do the things I want or get a babysitter for the kids. He is not living around me. I am a selfish b. and never cared about him.
Now, really if he wants the kids 4 hours it has to be Monday, Tuesday, Wednesday, or Thursday. Kids get home at 4. I am home from zumba at 8. He says I am using him to get away from kids because I can not handle it.
Really? I told him all I am hearing blah, blah, blah.
I have custody of our children and when they are sleeping it doesn't count as my time. So, really we have joint custody.
How do I deal with him not liking these changes? I know he is the selfish one but really? How can someone be that naive? It is so hard to ignore and have thick skin sometimes.
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 3,095
My AH has been and continues to behave the same way. When I hope/expect him to be decent and reasonable and act like I would, I find myself disappointed. I fought him for a long time trying it seemed, to get him to want tol be cooperative. It was a waste of time and just made me crazy and he surely got pleasure from it bc it was a good distraction from his own issues.
Now I just try (sometimes easier than others) to roll with it. If he changes the terms of things and plays "well, since I am not getting my way, then I refuse to be helpful" I just say okay and make alternate plans. It means that I have little time to get to meetings or run and missing both those things DOES impact me. But fighting him to try and make him be someone he isn't (responsible, caring, considerate) just makes me miserable and no good comes from it even if he does ultimately help. The price I pay when I expect anything from him is too great.
I suppose it might sound like I am letting him get away with whatever he wants. I see it as me doing what's in my best interest in a no win situation.
You might not be able to make your meeting or zumba. You might have to get a video and do zumba at home and use this site more than you had. I am not getting to do many of the things I could when I had another body at home to "help" out, but I have to remind myself that the lack of drama is worth the sacrifices (and some days it's hard to remember that).
I'm sorry you have an AH who is as selfish and uncooperative as mine. Sounds like a common thread with lots of us.
Now I just try (sometimes easier than others) to roll with it. If he changes the terms of things and plays "well, since I am not getting my way, then I refuse to be helpful" I just say okay and make alternate plans. It means that I have little time to get to meetings or run and missing both those things DOES impact me. But fighting him to try and make him be someone he isn't (responsible, caring, considerate) just makes me miserable and no good comes from it even if he does ultimately help. The price I pay when I expect anything from him is too great.
I suppose it might sound like I am letting him get away with whatever he wants. I see it as me doing what's in my best interest in a no win situation.
You might not be able to make your meeting or zumba. You might have to get a video and do zumba at home and use this site more than you had. I am not getting to do many of the things I could when I had another body at home to "help" out, but I have to remind myself that the lack of drama is worth the sacrifices (and some days it's hard to remember that).
I'm sorry you have an AH who is as selfish and uncooperative as mine. Sounds like a common thread with lots of us.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 235
Thanks wantto! It would be so much easier if he would just go away! I know that is terrible and my kids need him. But, I could just get a sitter and move on. He is also not stable with them. He is laid off right now and expected back to work in a few months. I am afraid he is going to dissappear and hurt them then, anyway. I am sick am sick of being the rational one when he calls me names and is a jerk back. Thanks. I am just over all the drama and hate everytime I get in a good place he brings me down again. My reality is I am never going to get away from him and this disease!
Living in a Pinkful Place
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,545
((Brownhorse))
I understand the concept of "my kids need him" ~ but just from my experience ~ what our kids and grandkids NEED - is a healthy, responsible father/parent.
What my experience has taught me they don't need is someone just hanging around talking bad about the other parent/guardian, telling sob stories to try to make the kids feel sorry for them, the unpredictability and unreliable parent and/or the guilt that sometimes the A parent attempts to push off on children in this situation.
I'm not saying this is what your ex is doing ~ I'm saying this is MY experience with my ex and now with my step-son toward our granddaughter that lives with us.
Truly it does hurt the kids for a while ~ but as they grow the realize it is NOT their fault, it's not YOUR fault ~ as you present a healthy loving recovery home for them ~ they will know they are OK too!
PINK HUGS & prayers!
Rita
I understand the concept of "my kids need him" ~ but just from my experience ~ what our kids and grandkids NEED - is a healthy, responsible father/parent.
What my experience has taught me they don't need is someone just hanging around talking bad about the other parent/guardian, telling sob stories to try to make the kids feel sorry for them, the unpredictability and unreliable parent and/or the guilt that sometimes the A parent attempts to push off on children in this situation.
I'm not saying this is what your ex is doing ~ I'm saying this is MY experience with my ex and now with my step-son toward our granddaughter that lives with us.
Truly it does hurt the kids for a while ~ but as they grow the realize it is NOT their fault, it's not YOUR fault ~ as you present a healthy loving recovery home for them ~ they will know they are OK too!
PINK HUGS & prayers!
Rita
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: USA
Posts: 3,095
Brownhorse- I could have just written exactly what you did. I really wish my AH would a) lose interest in playing the parent card (bc he does it ONLY when he thinks it makes him look good to others or b) move far away. For months now he uses the girls like pawns to upset me after a period of total disinterest in the girls lives he'll suddenly decide to play Dad out of the blue.
I have to offer (right of first refusal thing with the mediator that we worked out) for him to stay with the girls before I call a sitter but he is soooooo manipulative that he won't answer, won't respond and then will have all this "proof" that he was busy and not intentionally dragging his feet. I wind up trapped, no different than when we were married, waiting on him. And this is sanctioned by the court. He is ALLOWED to do this and it's so hard some days to not let it affect me (this week has sucked and clearly it IS affecting me).
So, I totallllllly get your frustration.
I have to offer (right of first refusal thing with the mediator that we worked out) for him to stay with the girls before I call a sitter but he is soooooo manipulative that he won't answer, won't respond and then will have all this "proof" that he was busy and not intentionally dragging his feet. I wind up trapped, no different than when we were married, waiting on him. And this is sanctioned by the court. He is ALLOWED to do this and it's so hard some days to not let it affect me (this week has sucked and clearly it IS affecting me).
So, I totallllllly get your frustration.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 235
I know he is not stable for them. That is our government, though. Unless he is drinking, I can not take visitation from him.
He even told me he is rationing his wellbutrin because he can not afford it. In his head, he gets this feeling because he is an addict when he takes it. I took wellbutrin, I did not get a "feeling".
I wish I could run away with my kids and never look back. How do you go no contact with young kids?
He even told me he is rationing his wellbutrin because he can not afford it. In his head, he gets this feeling because he is an addict when he takes it. I took wellbutrin, I did not get a "feeling".
I wish I could run away with my kids and never look back. How do you go no contact with young kids?
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 447
Mistake one: expecting an A to act in a reasonable manner
Mistake two: expecting an A to be able to see outside their own wants/needs
Mistake three: telling him when you have 'plans'.
He does NOT get to decide on a daily basis whether he wants ie: is 'convienent' for him to take the children. You have an agreement...so stick with it. Have him pick his nights...and that's it. Be prepared though because now that he knows you have a life that is outside his influence he will do everything he can to prevent you from living it.
But just suck it up. If he wants them Mon and Wed... okay...EVERY mon and wed. then. Not oh gee...I want them this mon, but not next mon..but maybe tuesdays in feb.. etc.. BULLSH%$! He's TRYING to manipulate you. Don't let him.
Work out a childcare trade w/ a friend. If you take zumba at your local ymca most have free childcare... do what you need to but don't let him derail your life AND don't explain what your solutions are...he doesn't need to know you worked out a childcare trade off or that you found a way to do what you need to do, if you tell him he will try to switch it up again to keep you off balance.
He btw is being the selfish one here. AA is by nature a selfish program in that SOME (please note..I love AA, it got my A sober...but some groups are better than others)
groups tend to take the idea that an A should be selfish, only socialize with AA's and God forbid ...an A decline to attend a mtg when asked or turn down a service obligation that they can't meet due to family obligations.
Good luck!! and remember...it's YOUR life now...you don't have to tell him a thing about it.
Mistake two: expecting an A to be able to see outside their own wants/needs
Mistake three: telling him when you have 'plans'.
He does NOT get to decide on a daily basis whether he wants ie: is 'convienent' for him to take the children. You have an agreement...so stick with it. Have him pick his nights...and that's it. Be prepared though because now that he knows you have a life that is outside his influence he will do everything he can to prevent you from living it.
But just suck it up. If he wants them Mon and Wed... okay...EVERY mon and wed. then. Not oh gee...I want them this mon, but not next mon..but maybe tuesdays in feb.. etc.. BULLSH%$! He's TRYING to manipulate you. Don't let him.
Work out a childcare trade w/ a friend. If you take zumba at your local ymca most have free childcare... do what you need to but don't let him derail your life AND don't explain what your solutions are...he doesn't need to know you worked out a childcare trade off or that you found a way to do what you need to do, if you tell him he will try to switch it up again to keep you off balance.
He btw is being the selfish one here. AA is by nature a selfish program in that SOME (please note..I love AA, it got my A sober...but some groups are better than others)
groups tend to take the idea that an A should be selfish, only socialize with AA's and God forbid ...an A decline to attend a mtg when asked or turn down a service obligation that they can't meet due to family obligations.
Good luck!! and remember...it's YOUR life now...you don't have to tell him a thing about it.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 235
thanks, I am trying. That is the problem. He will not commit to days. He thinks he gets to dictate on a weekly basis what nights work for him. I actually have him watching them at my house. I have made it so easy for him now I managed to screw it up more. And I can not keep my mouth shut when I get angry.
Living in a Pinkful Place
Join Date: May 2006
Location: Louisiana
Posts: 7,545
Originally Posted by brownhorse 
And I can not keep my mouth shut when I get angry.
when you do this. . . he wins regardless.
I understand how difficult it is to remain calm when our exah's pull the "tricks" and the quacking that they do so often . . .
but I have learned when I remain calm and unrattled by his threats, actions and attitudes ~ it defuses the situation ~ it baffles them - they are use to the old reactions ~
When they throw a "wrench" in the plans - just be ready and maybe try to say "ok thanks for letting me know you aren't available to see the children, I'll let them know."
It steals his thunder ~ come and vent away here ~ just try not to allow him to see it
no reaction from you just may stop him from his unhealthy behavior toward - or maybe a least calm it down some - hopefully??
Just my e, s, & h -
Follow your HP's guidance for what is healthiest for YOU & the kids!
PINK HUGS,
Rita
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: New York, NY
Posts: 6,262
It's a drag for an alcoholic to start being responsible for his/her words and actions, it's much easier for someone else to be responsible for the big things in life. So what if he doesn't like you? Did he act like he liked you before?
The Big Book describes alcoholics as: selfish, self-willed, self centered, enormous ego with low self esteem, grandiose. And, it takes time to change. Remember, alcoholism is a mental illness.
The Big Book describes alcoholics as: selfish, self-willed, self centered, enormous ego with low self esteem, grandiose. And, it takes time to change. Remember, alcoholism is a mental illness.
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Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Alaska
Posts: 2,913
Sending hugs, brownhorse. I know how rough it is trying to walk that fine line between letting DS know his father in a safe environment and XAH's unreasonable expectations.
Before we had a court order in place, XAH's method of seeing our DS was to call the night before or morning of to tell me he's taking him. Initially, I caved; cancelled what ever DS and I had planned so that DS could see his father. But the unscheduled-ness of it all got incredibly wearing on DS, especially when XAH started no-showing for even his last-minute 'planned' visits. So I'd push to schedule something so DS would KNOW when he gets to see his daddy.
OMG, you'd have thought I asked XAH to cut off his left arm. "Do you know how it sounds? making me SCHEDULE time to see MY son?!!!!" I was called every name in the book. Was told I was a horrible woman for doing that to our son.
It got a little better once a court ordered visitation arrangement was set up. He'd still no-show, but at least he wasn't calling the day-of and expecting DS and I to drop our plans.
His visits have nothing to do with what you do with your time when he has the kiddos. He is being incredibly manipulative to suggest that you cannot use it as you need to. To go to the gym, grocery shop, go to AlAnon meetings, go rock climbing, start and lead an all-girl punk rock band, join a rollerderby team, take up skydiving... just as long as you're done by the end of the visit. I don't think you should or have to even tell him where you're going; just "I'll pick the kids up at X pm." or "I'll be home at Y pm when you drop them off."
Does the court order not specify days for the visits? Could you maybe file a modification asking that the visitation is on certain days / times?
Before we had a court order in place, XAH's method of seeing our DS was to call the night before or morning of to tell me he's taking him. Initially, I caved; cancelled what ever DS and I had planned so that DS could see his father. But the unscheduled-ness of it all got incredibly wearing on DS, especially when XAH started no-showing for even his last-minute 'planned' visits. So I'd push to schedule something so DS would KNOW when he gets to see his daddy.
OMG, you'd have thought I asked XAH to cut off his left arm. "Do you know how it sounds? making me SCHEDULE time to see MY son?!!!!" I was called every name in the book. Was told I was a horrible woman for doing that to our son.
It got a little better once a court ordered visitation arrangement was set up. He'd still no-show, but at least he wasn't calling the day-of and expecting DS and I to drop our plans.
His visits have nothing to do with what you do with your time when he has the kiddos. He is being incredibly manipulative to suggest that you cannot use it as you need to. To go to the gym, grocery shop, go to AlAnon meetings, go rock climbing, start and lead an all-girl punk rock band, join a rollerderby team, take up skydiving... just as long as you're done by the end of the visit. I don't think you should or have to even tell him where you're going; just "I'll pick the kids up at X pm." or "I'll be home at Y pm when you drop them off."
Does the court order not specify days for the visits? Could you maybe file a modification asking that the visitation is on certain days / times?
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Join Date: Oct 2006
Location: right here, right now
Posts: 6,516
He is not going to work the schedule around me anymore.
How do I deal with him not liking these changes?
When people-pleasers stop pleasing people, people are not pleased, someone here said...
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: somewhere better
Posts: 49
am just staring this process with my ex feel it will be long road, you are right to want set times and him to stick to them. really relate to the safety thing have that bridge yet to cross stay strong and stick to your guns, am learning to do the same.
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Join Date: Jan 2012
Location: new moon road
Posts: 1,545
Wishing you a peaceful life, brownhorse. Thank you for your story, I needed it.
It chills me when I hear about RA's twisting the program to inflate themselves even more. You'd think they'd just puff up and pop like a balloon, they are so inflated and grandiose when they pull this stuff.
I agree with all the advice and hope you know that the experts say that what the alcoholic has to learn is to GIVE and what the codependent has to learn is to TAKE.
Read "Getting Them Sober". It will help your resolve.
So glad you have support from SR!
It chills me when I hear about RA's twisting the program to inflate themselves even more. You'd think they'd just puff up and pop like a balloon, they are so inflated and grandiose when they pull this stuff.
I agree with all the advice and hope you know that the experts say that what the alcoholic has to learn is to GIVE and what the codependent has to learn is to TAKE.
Read "Getting Them Sober". It will help your resolve.
So glad you have support from SR!
Member
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 447
No. No. No.
repeat after me...
NO.
why is he having his visitations at your house?
and he's just picking and choosing his days whenever he wants?
not to be mean...but are you nuts?
I know your trying to be amlicable (spelled wrong I'm sure) but he's USING your guilt against you....
He can take them to teh mall, he can go to the park. ANYWHERE but at YOUR house...
so he's getting to pick when he sees them, basically how long...I'm sure if your a minute late he's a crazyman...and he is at YOUR house so he knows exactly what's going on in your life....
oh Hell no...
if you start letting him do this...he's ALWAYS going to expect it....it's his way or no way just like when you were married... (i'm not psychic..but am married to a RAH too!).
Follow the custody and visitation order. Plain and simple and if it isn't specific enough then modify it. He doesn't get to run your life and still get to run around being single A guy too!
No way.
Stand up for your rights....
you can do it without being mean or nasty but it has GOT to be done or he's going to be using you for a doormat til those kids are 18!
repeat after me...
NO.
why is he having his visitations at your house?
and he's just picking and choosing his days whenever he wants?
not to be mean...but are you nuts?
I know your trying to be amlicable (spelled wrong I'm sure) but he's USING your guilt against you....
He can take them to teh mall, he can go to the park. ANYWHERE but at YOUR house...
so he's getting to pick when he sees them, basically how long...I'm sure if your a minute late he's a crazyman...and he is at YOUR house so he knows exactly what's going on in your life....
oh Hell no...
if you start letting him do this...he's ALWAYS going to expect it....it's his way or no way just like when you were married... (i'm not psychic..but am married to a RAH too!).
Follow the custody and visitation order. Plain and simple and if it isn't specific enough then modify it. He doesn't get to run your life and still get to run around being single A guy too!
No way.
Stand up for your rights....
you can do it without being mean or nasty but it has GOT to be done or he's going to be using you for a doormat til those kids are 18!
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 235
Thanks All. Good advice. I am so much stronger. One step at a time.
He is at my house so that the kids do not have to get up at 6am and me take them to him or daycare. It will end soon when he goes back to work. Also, then they are not in smoke at his dad's house. I know it is messed up, but he is laid off every winter and I knew going into it that it would only be a few months.
He is back in pleasing me mode. How do they go up and down so often. He lives his live to make me upset or argue.
He is at my house so that the kids do not have to get up at 6am and me take them to him or daycare. It will end soon when he goes back to work. Also, then they are not in smoke at his dad's house. I know it is messed up, but he is laid off every winter and I knew going into it that it would only be a few months.
He is back in pleasing me mode. How do they go up and down so often. He lives his live to make me upset or argue.
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Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 447
He realized being an A##hole didn't work...and we wasn't getting you to bow down through intimidation and anger...
so he's moved on to being pleasant and nice...
maybe THEN your'll do what he wants....
when that doesn't work he will go to something new...possibly..the sympathy card.
WOE is me! I don't have a job, I live w/ my dad... (and pay no bills, and run around being single guy, with no responsibilities. I have all this free time for meetings but don't go. I could be parenting my kids but don't want to make my ex wifes life TOO easy for her..."
Do I need to go on?
so he's moved on to being pleasant and nice...
maybe THEN your'll do what he wants....
when that doesn't work he will go to something new...possibly..the sympathy card.
WOE is me! I don't have a job, I live w/ my dad... (and pay no bills, and run around being single guy, with no responsibilities. I have all this free time for meetings but don't go. I could be parenting my kids but don't want to make my ex wifes life TOO easy for her..."
Do I need to go on?
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