Anyone Familiar with Self Sabotage?

Old 12-03-2011, 01:30 AM
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Anyone Familiar with Self Sabotage?

I know I have likely always had Codie tendendencies, but I DID used to know what normal was. Even though my other relationships were not the best for me - in different ways - I maintained who I was. I didn't feel sick like I do now. I was able to function fully and maintain myself and had my own sense of autonomy. I had a standard I lived up to, financially and otherwise. A good moral code. A sane outlook (most of the time - that is). I took good care of myself and I was generally comfortable. I feel that I had a sense of normalcy about my life or at least I felt like an individual. I felt a sense of control over my own life and looking back, that was priceless.

I don't think it was more than 6 months with my AB that I started changing. My whole world felt thrown upside down, and yet I couldn't put my finger on it. It was the control, lots of 'little things' and several big ones here and there, but yet I still didn't relate it to the alcohol on such a huge level. I knew he drank heavily and that his moods changed, but I was still blind to how much the alcohol was destroying ME - even more than it seemed to be destroying him.

Now, 15 years later, I am able to look back on it all and realize that I have become an insane 'addict' of sorts (yet nothing to do with MY drinking any alcohol). Crazy spending sprees that make me feel sick. Extreme behavior with food. Extreme behavior with all sorts of things. Having no control or willpower over anything. I'm tougher than I've ever had to be and while that's a bonus from the little 'Codie' who was afraid of her own shadow - am I in this place to teach myself a lesson or something? Things I would NEVER have tolerated before, I constantly must.

But I am now broken. My will is broken. I may be wiser, but I don't know how I'm ever going to get out of this. I want to go - I'm afraid to leave. I've learned that relationships are tougher than anything, yet I don't want to live alone. I don't want to live with anyone else, because I've forgotten what it's like to be normal and I have trust issues. I feel that only another 'sick' person could 'put up with me'. I don't want another relationship to have to 'work on'. While half the time AB is telling me to 'pack my bags' if I don't like it - the other half he's 'telling' me that he loves me, needs me and can't live without me. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because I don't know where I'd go or what I'd do with myself, and other times I can't wait 'til the day this is OVER. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because of how he might react, while others I'm afraid he'd let me go too easily.

Is this where the first STEP comes in? 'We admitted that we were powerless over alcohol - that our lives had become unmanageable'? Why am I still having so much trouble admitting this, when I, myself, haven't had a drop in over 10 years? I've been to Al-anon, but have not felt comfortable there. I don't like the structure of it. I don't feel as though I belong there. When I'm there, I can't believe that's what is going to help change my 'stinkin' thinkin'. I know I need help and almost everyone here raves about it, but it doesn't feel like the 'right' help for me. I do know that I need to do the Steps and not by myself at first - but I don't like that setting. I DO learn some things but have trouble integrating them into my daily life (I try). I also feel that it is not enough and I need something more intensive. I need more personal attention and interaction. I need a sort of 'rehab' of my own. Has anyone found another way? Why do I keep avoiding this? I just feel it isn't going to work for me. Talk about confusion ... I know I'm sabotaging myself, yet I feel helpless to stop it.
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Old 12-03-2011, 04:16 AM
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So sorry for how things are going with you, I used to do the same things, I was diagnosed with depression and placed on Prozac, it made a huge difference in my outlook, it allowed me to function like a "normal person", I stopped sabotaging my relationships and my career. If you have not seen a psychiatrist and a therapist then please consider going, it could make a huge difference.

I will be here if you need someone to vent to or talk with.

Best of luck to you,

Bill
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Old 12-03-2011, 09:14 AM
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Try these on for size. The Proactive Twelve Steps (printable)

If they make more sense - find a good therapist to visit weekly who can set a regimen for you (activities and readings between sessions).

Try a class at your local college - one in psychology. Always fascinating to learn more about oneself through the study of the field.

Take a few personality tests - like the Myers-Briggs - get more in touch with yourself and what motivates you.

Read! There are so many books out there in the self-help world.

Find a mentor - someone who embodies the qualities you want to have.

It seems to me that you are confusing the steps of Al-Anon with alcohol itself. It's not about alcohol at all for the program. But I know for me - it took a while to wrap my head around the steps and only with the help of some fellow Al-Anon members and a good therapist. And I am not a stupid person - just not my kind of approach until it finally made sense. Now I see the wisdom in Al-Anon but it is not my only tool in my toolbox.
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Old 12-03-2011, 09:44 AM
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[QUOTE=tryintosmile;3192398]I know I have likely always had Codie tendendencies, but I DID used to know what normal was. Even though my other relationships were not the best for me - in different ways - I maintained who I was. I didn't feel sick like I do now. I was able to function fully and maintain myself and had my own sense of autonomy. I had a standard I lived up to, financially and otherwise. A good moral code. A sane outlook (most of the time - that is). I took good care of myself and I was generally comfortable. I feel that I had a sense of normalcy about my life or at least I felt like an individual. I felt a sense of control over my own life and looking back, that was priceless.QUOTE]

WOW! I could relate to your thoughts EXACTLY. I mean those words could seriously have come from my lips in every sense. In fact, 4.5 years ago, when I started seeing my current ABF, friends and family were shocked because I had always had it soooo together. And then, I met this guy who seemed exciting, fun, on the edge and I hadn't experienced anything but normalcy in so long that I lept in without even thinking about the consequences. I did NOT know his circumstances because he didn't reveal to me that his job sucked and he barely went, that his mom paid his rent, that he had had to move three thousand miles away from his birthplace to escape the throws of heroin addiction after overdosing a few times, did not know that all he thought about was partying, going out and that his dreams of grandeur of being a music producer were just talk to make him seem more than he was. I had NEVER hung out with this type of person. All my friends were of a working variety, though some drank on the weekends and did the occassional "let's go out and party once every five years." But on workdays and for most of life it was about responsibility. I had firefighters as friends, construction workers who operated big tractors, accountants and vice presidents of BIG corporations as family members and friends.

I was really blindsighted. My ABF's mom kind of 'enlisted' me to help her son. She would take me on trips because she said she knew her son 'wanted' to but just couldn't afford it (ya think??). She would buy me gifts for him. She lives in another state but visits often and so she always made it seem like they were such a nice and close knit family who liked to have a good time. Very surreal after I realized that she is his main enabler in life and basically validates his behavior and treats him like he is 10.

So, I completely understand where you are coming from when you say you were always kind of co-dependent. I think the difference in my prior life was that the people I was surrounded by were generally good people who cared about me and would never EVER lay their problems at my doorstep. So, when our parents used to tell us to choose our friends wisely, their was a lesson to learn there for sure. I had always, before ABF, only let people into my life who served some kind of positive purpose in my life experiences. Perhaps, that is what Al-Anon is about you know, or some other kind of therapy. It is to enhance what we know and what we should be expecting from ourselves in terms of what is acceptable company. We can bond with others, as we do here on SR, who have had these very same things happen to them. What happened in almost all of our instances, I believe, is that we allowed someone toxic into our lives that are just not very responsible and have found someone who is. In our cases, we are helpful, genuine people who have been taken for granted for that very kindness. Because we would never lay our problems at someone's feet, we can't understand why this person we care so much about seems to not care that they are destroying US with THEIR problems.

Sorry to ramble on and on, but your post really touched me because I could so much relate to you and what you are going through. I know I need to go to Al-Anon but I keep finding excuses. Maybe it is that I still feel like I can FIX this situation. I am really getting over that feeling to fix things and to just accept them. But, I know when I go to Al-Anon, and I know I will, or I go to a therapist again, I know that I will finally have to face MY feelings and my own guilt for allowing this into my life. I don't agree with going to get meds from a psychiatrist unless you really feel your imbalanced and can't work on yourself and can't function. I think those things are addictive and that kind of brings us to the same level of disfunction that we are trying to escape from with our A's. I don't want to be there, but I do understand that some people need them.

Just keep posting, keep reading, keep reflecting and keep in your mind a vision of what you want and need out of life.

HUGS and thinking of you this morning.
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Old 12-03-2011, 10:34 AM
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I can so relate to these paragraphs below, except i never had the "normal before" life. I regret never making it on my own-going straight from my codie relationship with my Mom to my husband. I have never been on my own.

My income is intertwined with my AH, as we have owned our small business together for 20+ years-more of it is in my name now, but i know nothing OF the business really, it has changed so much in the past couple years. I love my home & don't want to leave it-we spent 2 years of blood, sweat & tears fixing itn & 6 years here now. WHERE i live (in the woods, 2.5 acres) is part of what helps me deal-i have learned to love & appreciate all of the beautiful things in the world-wildlife, the sky, the smell in the air. It is a big part of my "therapy".

I know we may lose it all anyway-the hardest part is just repeating to myself i have no control over the future-i can do what i can day by day, deal with each thing as it comes. While my husband has been handling himself the best yet in a long time-i know better, i know "that day" is coming again.

Sometimes i get so scared i will lose control of myself-i am trying so hard to prepare myself, for whatever could be. Be happy in the moment & not take anything for granted. Times in the past when he didn't come home, i thought i would lose my mind from loneliness or that feeling of "being alone forever". I feel most times i have a much better grip on that now, but not always.

I have worked so hard on how i deal/will deal with him when he drinks again-i want to be able to go about it the smart way, from all i have learned reading here on this board. But sometimes i doubt my strength...

Originally Posted by tryintosmile View Post
I'm tougher than I've ever had to be and while that's a bonus from the little 'Codie' who was afraid of her own shadow - am I in this place to teach myself a lesson or something? Things I would NEVER have tolerated before, I constantly must.

But I am now broken. My will is broken. I may be wiser, but I don't know how I'm ever going to get out of this. I want to go - I'm afraid to leave. I've learned that relationships are tougher than anything, yet I don't want to live alone. I don't want to live with anyone else, because I've forgotten what it's like to be normal and I have trust issues. I feel that only another 'sick' person could 'put up with me'. I don't want another relationship to have to 'work on'. While half the time AB is telling me to 'pack my bags' if I don't like it - the other half he's 'telling' me that he loves me, needs me and can't live without me. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because I don't know where I'd go or what I'd do with myself, and other times I can't wait 'til the day this is OVER. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because of how he might react, while others I'm afraid he'd let me go too easily.

Is this where the first STEP comes in? 'We admitted that we were powerless over alcohol - that our lives had become unmanageable'?
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Old 12-03-2011, 11:47 AM
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You don't have to like it...

...you just have to do it.

Or, enjoy the rest of your life exactly as it is now. That's the beauty of it-- it's your choice. Your life now or a better life?

Cyranaok

Originally Posted by tryintosmile View Post
I know I have likely always had Codie tendendencies, but I DID used to know what normal was. Even though my other relationships were not the best for me - in different ways - I maintained who I was. I didn't feel sick like I do now. I was able to function fully and maintain myself and had my own sense of autonomy. I had a standard I lived up to, financially and otherwise. A good moral code. A sane outlook (most of the time - that is). I took good care of myself and I was generally comfortable. I feel that I had a sense of normalcy about my life or at least I felt like an individual. I felt a sense of control over my own life and looking back, that was priceless.

I don't think it was more than 6 months with my AB that I started changing. My whole world felt thrown upside down, and yet I couldn't put my finger on it. It was the control, lots of 'little things' and several big ones here and there, but yet I still didn't relate it to the alcohol on such a huge level. I knew he drank heavily and that his moods changed, but I was still blind to how much the alcohol was destroying ME - even more than it seemed to be destroying him.

Now, 15 years later, I am able to look back on it all and realize that I have become an insane 'addict' of sorts (yet nothing to do with MY drinking any alcohol). Crazy spending sprees that make me feel sick. Extreme behavior with food. Extreme behavior with all sorts of things. Having no control or willpower over anything. I'm tougher than I've ever had to be and while that's a bonus from the little 'Codie' who was afraid of her own shadow - am I in this place to teach myself a lesson or something? Things I would NEVER have tolerated before, I constantly must.

But I am now broken. My will is broken. I may be wiser, but I don't know how I'm ever going to get out of this. I want to go - I'm afraid to leave. I've learned that relationships are tougher than anything, yet I don't want to live alone. I don't want to live with anyone else, because I've forgotten what it's like to be normal and I have trust issues. I feel that only another 'sick' person could 'put up with me'. I don't want another relationship to have to 'work on'. While half the time AB is telling me to 'pack my bags' if I don't like it - the other half he's 'telling' me that he loves me, needs me and can't live without me. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because I don't know where I'd go or what I'd do with myself, and other times I can't wait 'til the day this is OVER. Sometimes I'm afraid to go because of how he might react, while others I'm afraid he'd let me go too easily.

Is this where the first STEP comes in? 'We admitted that we were powerless over alcohol - that our lives had become unmanageable'? Why am I still having so much trouble admitting this, when I, myself, haven't had a drop in over 10 years? I've been to Al-anon, but have not felt comfortable there. I don't like the structure of it. I don't feel as though I belong there. When I'm there, I can't believe that's what is going to help change my 'stinkin' thinkin'. I know I need help and almost everyone here raves about it, but it doesn't feel like the 'right' help for me. I do know that I need to do the Steps and not by myself at first - but I don't like that setting. I DO learn some things but have trouble integrating them into my daily life (I try). I also feel that it is not enough and I need something more intensive. I need more personal attention and interaction. I need a sort of 'rehab' of my own. Has anyone found another way? Why do I keep avoiding this? I just feel it isn't going to work for me. Talk about confusion ... I know I'm sabotaging myself, yet I feel helpless to stop it.
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Old 12-03-2011, 07:28 PM
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Not the true step 1 but this worked for me

I am powerless over people, places and things (and other people's use of alcohol), and my life had become unmanagable.

I believe that I have always struggled with co-dependent issues....and that I needed my loved on in my life because the other lessons had not been "big" enough.

I suspect though if I had not gone through what I did, and gotten the HELP AND SUPPORT I so desperately needed I would continue to repeat the pattern I had done previously getting sicker and sicker and deeper and deeper. Having some compassion for myself (cause goodness knows most of us are really hard on myself) has really helped me.

Finally one book that has helped (the sponsor situation is tough where I live, but I am working the steps) is A Gentle Path through the Twelve Steps. I have gotten a lot out of it (in addition to the two from Al-anon).
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Old 12-04-2011, 01:21 AM
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Thanks for the amazing thought provoking replies!

I must change that to say that I was never really normal in the sense that I have experienced all kinds of turmoil over the years, but rather that I could deal with it. I made decisions. I earned a good living. I survived endings of relationships, and most of all - I didn't walk on eggshells. I believed in the future, beyond what I was going through, and felt that I would survive for a new chapter.

Now, I'm constantly in a tailspin. I've lost both my parents within the past 5 years (my mother just 2 1/2 short months ago), and was so caught up with the A that I doubt I grieved 'properly'. It's like the A's life consumes me and I don't have time or energy to deal with my own issues.

Yes Willy - I've seriously considered antidepressants, but have been on them before and the side effects create a whole new level of dysfunction.

Where at one time I was highly sensitive, I now feel like a bit of a shell. Just going through the motions without much feeling, yet every once in a while I get very angry and that almost motivates me to make a change. The A gets scared when I am angry, but then gets angry that I am 'emoting'. So I am not 'allowed' to experience any negative emotions where he's concerned and yet that's where most of them stem from (so I suppress).

Thanks Chronsweet for relating and sharing your story. It is difficult to plunge into this 'world'. I've been through a lot in my years, but nothing like dealing with an addict and it has damaged my good boundaries. For that, I am so disappointed in myself.

And Anvil - thanks for calling a spade - a spade. I must have that willingness to do whatever it takes, yet admit that I am so overwhelmed that it's difficult. I do not understand why I should stay another day and feel I would be at least 50% better if I left immediately. I'm currently getting him to the door of help, yet I wonder if I really want to stay the course if or when he starts to work on himself. I can imagine that the eggshells would get even crunchier than they already are and I don't know that I would even be able to stand it. I believe that his illness IS what keeps us together and without it there is no connection. We're opposites in almost every aspect.

Like it or not, I have become addicted to the drama - it has been a great diversion from having to work on myself. The problem now is that I am far sicker than he is and I really DO need help ...

I try to work on myself for short periods of time, but they don't last long enough for there to be any real results. I read all the time, but if I cannot take action and follow through, I am no further ahead. This is where I am stifled ... inaction
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Old 12-04-2011, 01:27 AM
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Originally Posted by anvilhead View Post
healthy people choose healthy people.
Thanks - and at least I finally realize this. I just hope it isn't too late for me.
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:22 AM
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Great thread.

I too feel like I initially had it "together", but then ended up in a therapist office when I was in my mid-thirties.

I think my ACA traits just couldn't sustained me for a long period of time. I tried throwing myself into work/school, I was a huge people pleaser, tried to control people & situations, gossiped, got pulled into drama, etc.

All of these behaviors simply served as a distraction for my underlying problems. Since I wasn't truly addressing the source of my pain, my coping mechanisms worked less.

I'm thinking that codependency is probably a progressive illness as well (just like alcoholism). The longer it is left untreated the worse your symptoms become.

Thanks for letting me share.

db
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Old 12-04-2011, 06:30 AM
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Tryintosmile, have you ever been single for awhile? I'm under the impression that you don't stay single for long and move from relationship to relationship.
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Old 12-04-2011, 09:20 AM
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Originally Posted by choublak View Post
Tryintosmile, have you ever been single for awhile? I'm under the impression that you don't stay single for long and move from relationship to relationship.
How do you know me so well? Just one comment and you've hit to the heart of the matter. After my 3rd live-in relationship (one was a marriage) I lived with my sister for 3 years. I would have been GREAT on my own, but I was too scared to be fully self sufficient. It was really stupid, because I had no faith in my own abilities. It was a chance to really get myself together and I was pretty smart financially. Spent within my means. Great job, etc.

Instead, I was constantly looking for 'someone'. At the bars, on the phone telepersonals (no internet back then) and well - anywhere. I didn't believe that I could take care of myself but I was doing fine. I DIDN'T BELIEVE IN MYSELF! My sister 'threatened' to move out to live with her boyfriend so I said he could move in. Gawd - I wish I'd just let her move out. I wish I'd kept going and worked on myself and waited until the 'right one' came along. Then I met the A - and the rest is history. HUGE MISTAKE! Fear ruled my life and I guess it still does now - more than ever, as I am even less self sufficient financially as I was back then. I don't want to end up going from having a beautiful home and everything (materialistically) to living in a rooming house or something. My nightmare ... sad
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Old 12-04-2011, 10:04 AM
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Now, 15 years later, I am able to look back on it all and realize that I have become an insane 'addict' of sorts (yet nothing to do with MY drinking any alcohol). Crazy spending sprees that make me feel sick. Extreme behavior with food. Extreme behavior with all sorts of things. Having no control or willpower over anything. I'm tougher than I've ever had to be and while that's a bonus from the little 'Codie' who was afraid of her own shadow - am I in this place to teach myself a lesson or something? Things I would NEVER have tolerated before, I constantly must.
I was deeply moved by your honest post. What I've learned from my own addictions is that they are a way of not feeling my feelings. Of not being present for the sadness, fear, anxiety and self-hatred. And because of these feelings self-sabotaging is part of it ... it is part of self-hatred.

It's a big step that you understand these things about yourself, trust me. Because now you can change and grow. I strongly suggest Al-anon and therapy. Trust me, you will change and you are a valuable person. Everyone knows that but you but I promise, when you do the work self-esteem grows quickly.
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Old 12-04-2011, 11:11 AM
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Why was your sister threatening to move out on you?
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