Counseling Not Working
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Counseling Not Working
Right now as I type this my mom is shivering in bed, out of some kind of fear or anxiety. She smells of urine and thighs, her lip is wobbling, I can't look at her without an intense fear of anger and hopelessness. She admitted that she had 2 cans of Olde English and got out of work at 5:30, but didn't show up here till about 45 minutes ago.
Me and my parents have been going to see a counselor on a weekly basis. The counselor focuses on our family as a whole rather than the source of most of the problems, my mother's drinking problem.
She denies her problem to the counselor and only says that she has about 2 drinks a week. Occasionally during the session she'll admit to having a problem, but denies it when I mention it.
I find myself wasting my time going to see this counselor because my mother is downplaying her problem. I also find myself doubting my own sanity because she denies that she has a problem.
Me and my parents have been going to see a counselor on a weekly basis. The counselor focuses on our family as a whole rather than the source of most of the problems, my mother's drinking problem.
She denies her problem to the counselor and only says that she has about 2 drinks a week. Occasionally during the session she'll admit to having a problem, but denies it when I mention it.
I find myself wasting my time going to see this counselor because my mother is downplaying her problem. I also find myself doubting my own sanity because she denies that she has a problem.
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risingsun318 omg,,, how old are you? I don't know anything about you at all, I just hope you are an adult bc this stuff would be really too hard for a kid to handle and I will suggest if you are a kid maybe you need to talk with someone at your local social services for some help. If you are a minor this is not a situation you need to be in and sounds like your mom needs some serious help.
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So sorry this isn't working out for you. Have you told the counselor what you just explained here? Counseling works best when you communicate honestly and don't hold anything back. It may take a while for anything to click, since this problem has been ongoing for some time. Or maybe you could try counseling for yourself alone to learn how to deal with this. By the way have you gotten any of the books about being an adult child of an alcoholic? They have a lot to offer. You might be noticing that I have not addressed your Mom's behavior and that's because we can only help ourselves. We cannot really control the alcoholic's behavior at all. I know it's frustrating but it's important to take care of yourself first. We understand how you feel because we have all lived it.
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Originally Posted by rinky 
risingsun318 omg,,, how old are you?
Have you told the counselor what you just explained here?
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Originally Posted by Risingsun318
Yes, however my mom denies it and takes up most of the session interrupting and putting in her own two cents. She'll bluntly say that she has only 2 drinks a week, but admits that once she has a drink she has an urge to have another one. The counselor suggested that she seek individual counseling for her own personal problems, but I doubt my mother will go.
There is nothing you can do about that.
T
*Or might not be, depending on the circumstances. My "qualifier" was, at one time, being considered for a liver transplant, because she had shot her liver to h3ll and back with booze. She sat there and told the doctors, in all apparent honesty, that she didn't drink. They consulted specialists, looked up rare diseases, and otherwise wracked their brains trying to figure out what on Earth could be causing this massive liver damage without alcohol. Trouble was, it wasn't without alcohol!
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Originally Posted by tromboneliness
My "qualifier" was, at one time, being considered for a liver transplant, because she had shot her liver to h3ll and back with booze. She sat there and told the doctors, in all apparent honesty, that she didn't drink. They consulted specialists, looked up rare diseases, and otherwise wracked their brains trying to figure out what on Earth could be causing this massive liver damage without alcohol. Trouble was, it wasn't without alcohol!
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The older someone is the tougher it will be to get them to change simply for the amount of time they've been doing things a certain way. You have 2 battles with older adults:their age and their substance.
I'd say just keep after her and keep recommending although she will have to actually make the choice to change. Rather than preach against alcohol I try to load my alkie father up with health information and simply call things like I see em. Seniors in particular will try to get away with stuff like kids. You have to call em on things, they don't want to badgerd or preached to just like a teenager. So there is a fine line between trying to help or harassing them in their eyes.
Pick your battles here. You stay healthy and GOOD LUCK!
I'd say just keep after her and keep recommending although she will have to actually make the choice to change. Rather than preach against alcohol I try to load my alkie father up with health information and simply call things like I see em. Seniors in particular will try to get away with stuff like kids. You have to call em on things, they don't want to badgerd or preached to just like a teenager. So there is a fine line between trying to help or harassing them in their eyes.
Pick your battles here. You stay healthy and GOOD LUCK!
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Risingsun, if your counselor has an email address, I would ask if you could email copies of the pictures/videos. The counselor can only work with the information they have, and if they're lacking the severity of the problems, then they won't be able to help much.
That being said, if your mom is that deeply in denial, there may be no counseling that will work *for her*. In which case, the counseling really becomes about you and what you can do to protect yourself from the crazy.
My dad is currently in jail and probably going to die in prison because of alcohol and the related crazy that went with it. Nothing I did or tried to do made any difference at all. We can love them with all our heart, but that doesn't mean that they love themselves enough to want to change. If they don't want to change, nothing we do will make that change happen. And if nothing changes? Nothing changes.
I hope you can find a way to support yourself outside of your family home - a job and a houseful of roommates maybe? I found I was significantly happier living in a dumpy little apartment in a bad part of town than I had ever been before. I've lived in many environments, and even the most horrid, cockroach infested, grease covered, prostitute laden places I've lived were all happier and healthier for me than being near my parents.
If that's truly not at all possible, then I hope you can find a way to let go of the hope that your mom will change, and instead focus on what you can do to change you so that you don't get sucked into her crazy. AlAnon works for many. For me, years of therapy and a lot of years of navel gazing is how I'm getting through life.
Know that you're not alone - many of us were where you are now. Some of us manage to break out of the cycle and out of the crazy-making and learn how to be "just me" without our emotions being tied up in the actions of our parents.
That being said, if your mom is that deeply in denial, there may be no counseling that will work *for her*. In which case, the counseling really becomes about you and what you can do to protect yourself from the crazy.
My dad is currently in jail and probably going to die in prison because of alcohol and the related crazy that went with it. Nothing I did or tried to do made any difference at all. We can love them with all our heart, but that doesn't mean that they love themselves enough to want to change. If they don't want to change, nothing we do will make that change happen. And if nothing changes? Nothing changes.
I hope you can find a way to support yourself outside of your family home - a job and a houseful of roommates maybe? I found I was significantly happier living in a dumpy little apartment in a bad part of town than I had ever been before. I've lived in many environments, and even the most horrid, cockroach infested, grease covered, prostitute laden places I've lived were all happier and healthier for me than being near my parents.
If that's truly not at all possible, then I hope you can find a way to let go of the hope that your mom will change, and instead focus on what you can do to change you so that you don't get sucked into her crazy. AlAnon works for many. For me, years of therapy and a lot of years of navel gazing is how I'm getting through life.
Know that you're not alone - many of us were where you are now. Some of us manage to break out of the cycle and out of the crazy-making and learn how to be "just me" without our emotions being tied up in the actions of our parents.
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Originally Posted by Risingsun318
I have proof (vids, pics, soundclips) of her drunk. It's just that it doesn't seem right to show them to the counselor.
T
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Saw this post today from Rising Sun -when I was in the same postion at 23yrs old, I found my first Al-anon therapist,(must stress I didnt know or realise that back then) it was only when I'd married an A and that I started to go Al-anon that I gained prespective about my childhood issues living within and A home. At 23 yrs old it took me a a year to open up or even talk to this therapist,as I was taught at home you dont talk about your family.It's disloyal.
I do still have issues concerning my childhood but I share and get it off my chest when I share at meetings as I've become aware that I am important person too to me .Also that from time to time I do still have to go and see a therapist concerning matters about childhood issues,and the one thing I insist on now when I do see a therapist is that they understand about Alcoholism issues,could be because I am older now and more out spoken,and also that I'm seen alone at therapy sessions,and that no A comes with me as they over talk me,
Hope this may help-sending all my hope ,strength and experience to you.
I do still have issues concerning my childhood but I share and get it off my chest when I share at meetings as I've become aware that I am important person too to me .Also that from time to time I do still have to go and see a therapist concerning matters about childhood issues,and the one thing I insist on now when I do see a therapist is that they understand about Alcoholism issues,could be because I am older now and more out spoken,and also that I'm seen alone at therapy sessions,and that no A comes with me as they over talk me,
Hope this may help-sending all my hope ,strength and experience to you.
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Myself, my husband and my 2 daughters went for family counselling. We all hated it and my oldest daughter has been put off of therapy for life. It may have worked in conjuction to individual therapy. It turned into a family taking turns trying to prove their point and pointing fingers. It was so stressful for all of us.
Group therapy works when the group consists of people going through what you are. Individual therapy is good too. Family therapy must work for some families because our session were 40 years ago - if they're still doing it there must be some success stories. If it's a bad experience for you bring it up at the next session and ask about individual therapy for yourself.
Group therapy works when the group consists of people going through what you are. Individual therapy is good too. Family therapy must work for some families because our session were 40 years ago - if they're still doing it there must be some success stories. If it's a bad experience for you bring it up at the next session and ask about individual therapy for yourself.
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Originally Posted by GingerM
Risingsun, if your counselor has an email address, I would ask if you could email copies of the pictures/videos. The counselor can only work with the information they have, and if they're lacking the severity of the problems, then they won't be able to help much.
That being said, if your mom is that deeply in denial, there may be no counseling that will work *for her*. In which case, the counseling really becomes about you and what you can do to protect yourself from the crazy.
That being said, if your mom is that deeply in denial, there may be no counseling that will work *for her*. In which case, the counseling really becomes about you and what you can do to protect yourself from the crazy.
Originally Posted by tromboneliness
When you call them on their ****, alcoholics just tend to get even angrier, blame everything on you, and assert their right to drink themselves into oblivion, if they feel like it, because who the h3ll are you to tell them what to do?
Originally Posted by jOSE2
I do still have issues concerning my childhood but I share and get it off my chest when I share at meetings as I've become aware that I am important person too to me .Also that from time to time I do still have to go and see a therapist concerning matters about childhood issues,and the one thing I insist on now when I do see a therapist is that they understand about Alcoholism issues,could be because I am older now and more out spoken,and also that I'm seen alone at therapy sessions,and that no A comes with me as they over talk me,
Hope this may help-sending all my hope ,strength and experience to you.
Hope this may help-sending all my hope ,strength and experience to you.
It kind of keeps me alienated from other people my age. I've grown to look at all of my classmates, friends, and everyone else as fools. I.e. Every conversation is about how much fun they had getting drunk at some club. Not being able to relate to them gave me a feeling of inferiority. Now I've grown to feel morally superior to every one else. I'm not sure if it's a good thing or a bad thing.
Originally Posted by danielleinto
Myself, my husband and my 2 daughters went for family counselling. We all hated it and my oldest daughter has been put off of therapy for life. It may have worked in conjuction to individual therapy. It turned into a family taking turns trying to prove their point and pointing fingers. It was so stressful for all of us.
I myself despise it because it doesn't focus on the main problem which is the drunkenness. Last session I just sat in the chair leaning from side to side laughing from sheer embarrassment. Not only that, I had to ride the subway back home with my mother and father arguing about what was talked about during the session.
Group therapy works when the group consists of people going through what you are.
Individual therapy is good too. Family therapy must work for some families because our session were 40 years ago - if they're still doing it there must be some success stories. If it's a bad experience for you bring it up at the next session and ask about individual therapy for yourself
Thank you all for your input, it's nice to feel that there's other people you can relate to.
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What an itelligent girl you are!,
You are trying to find your bounderies and who you are as a person,when you live in that sort of enviroment(I speak for-myself)because A's have no bounderies I became very mixed up ,my spirit was telling me something was very wrong,and I was shouted down all the time,that there was something wrong with me,There was nothing wrong with me,It was just that, I didnt want to do the things that my peers did,if they wanted to do all the alcohol and sex stuff that was their business-I had seen enough in my child-hood to put me off for life,and I didnt have to go around explaining to people either why I should or shouldnt engage in that sort of stuff.I was no different to millions of other people with the same views -If now I have anyone telling me there's something wrong with me, trying to tell me I dont fit in- I have to laugh now when I say this, they usually have alcohol issues-took me a lot of years to figure that one out.
Nice people do eventually come into your life, as I never thought it would, Do a bit of research to get the proper help,ask pertinent questions,concernng what the councellor/therapist knows or doesnt know about alcohol related matter's(dont be scared to ask)the help is for you! and about how the family of origin may have affected you! I didnt know until I started researching-and listening very carefully at Al-anon meetings.Wow what an eye opener that was ! they gave me their strength love, hope and experience that there was a better life just waiting for me-it wasnt a magic pill and an over-night fix on one meeting for me, I need and still do need help and I'm not ashamed any-more to say that.
All my best wishes
You are trying to find your bounderies and who you are as a person,when you live in that sort of enviroment(I speak for-myself)because A's have no bounderies I became very mixed up ,my spirit was telling me something was very wrong,and I was shouted down all the time,that there was something wrong with me,There was nothing wrong with me,It was just that, I didnt want to do the things that my peers did,if they wanted to do all the alcohol and sex stuff that was their business-I had seen enough in my child-hood to put me off for life,and I didnt have to go around explaining to people either why I should or shouldnt engage in that sort of stuff.I was no different to millions of other people with the same views -If now I have anyone telling me there's something wrong with me, trying to tell me I dont fit in- I have to laugh now when I say this, they usually have alcohol issues-took me a lot of years to figure that one out.
Nice people do eventually come into your life, as I never thought it would, Do a bit of research to get the proper help,ask pertinent questions,concernng what the councellor/therapist knows or doesnt know about alcohol related matter's(dont be scared to ask)the help is for you! and about how the family of origin may have affected you! I didnt know until I started researching-and listening very carefully at Al-anon meetings.Wow what an eye opener that was ! they gave me their strength love, hope and experience that there was a better life just waiting for me-it wasnt a magic pill and an over-night fix on one meeting for me, I need and still do need help and I'm not ashamed any-more to say that.
All my best wishes
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Originally Posted by Risingsun318
Most of my problems (social alienation, loneliness) revolve around my problems at home. For example I feel as if I'm not able to go out, out of fear something will happen to my mother. Though this wasn't always the case, as it is now. It's been this way since I was 13, and since I have a hostility towards the activities that people my age do (drinking, partying, sex) I tend to have a hard time talking to people my age.
Thank you all for your input, it's nice to feel that there's other people you can relate to.
Thank you all for your input, it's nice to feel that there's other people you can relate to.
I agree with jOSE2 that you are a smart girl, viewing your peers and avoiding the party scene. Good luck.
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For the most part, I'm a guy you guys lol. It's ok.
Anyways yeah we went to the counselor today and she suggested that my mother go and seek individual counseling. It was not I who sought a family counselor, it was my mother who chose to go to family counseling. Rather than her problem with alcohol, she sees the turbulence between her and my father and my father and me as the main problem.
It's pretty hard finding people to relate to me at my age, I think attending a meeting with people who have problems similar to my own would result in making some friends. I just really need to find the time and courage to go..
Yeah I felt this sort of panic of hopelessness and inferiority. I remember being so so restless, however something came about that day that made me ditch the inferiority. Now it's just alienation, which isn't as bad..
As far as the group counseling goes, I can't ditch it just yet. I have to prove one final point to my mother that her drinking is effecting her and those around her. If she chooses not to put some effort into changing I'm going to give up on her once and for all.
Anyways yeah we went to the counselor today and she suggested that my mother go and seek individual counseling. It was not I who sought a family counselor, it was my mother who chose to go to family counseling. Rather than her problem with alcohol, she sees the turbulence between her and my father and my father and me as the main problem.
Originally Posted by jOSE2
Nice people do eventually come into your life, as I never thought it would, Do a bit of research to get the proper help,ask pertinent questions,concernng what the councellor/therapist knows or doesnt know about alcohol related matter's(dont be scared to ask)the help is for you! and about how the family of origin may have affected you!
Originally Posted by Kialua
I started this panic when I was 13 as well. It lasted quite a while. One thing I learned is that it is totally unnecessary. It's simply a panic attack. It makes no sense and can terrorize you. Ditch the group counseling and get into one that focuses on you and your needs. You are tearing yourself up inside for things you have no control over. Right now you can't see how to get out of this emotional turmoil because you are still living there. This is what a counselor can help you with if you choose one for you. Have you found an Al-anon group for you to attend? I know right now is very busy for you but it could help you survive.
I agree with jOSE2 that you are a smart girl, viewing your peers and avoiding the party scene. Good luck.
I agree with jOSE2 that you are a smart girl, viewing your peers and avoiding the party scene. Good luck.
As far as the group counseling goes, I can't ditch it just yet. I have to prove one final point to my mother that her drinking is effecting her and those around her. If she chooses not to put some effort into changing I'm going to give up on her once and for all.
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Hi Risingsun,
Still think your an intelligent guy.
It hard to find people to relate to what you are living through at 22yrs,is there an ACoA near or in your area,? maybe take someone with for support to a meeting.Or you could ring someone from ACoA and have chat over the phone first,they have lived through the same sort of things and are very understanding,
Maybe a new therapist or councellor may help you find one for you in your area.
Just a few suggestions ,hope they help
Sending best wishes to you
Still think your an intelligent guy.
It hard to find people to relate to what you are living through at 22yrs,is there an ACoA near or in your area,? maybe take someone with for support to a meeting.Or you could ring someone from ACoA and have chat over the phone first,they have lived through the same sort of things and are very understanding,
Maybe a new therapist or councellor may help you find one for you in your area.
Just a few suggestions ,hope they help
Sending best wishes to you
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Join Date: Nov 2011
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Rising Sun,
I'm 23 and my addict/alcoholic is my brother. I'm facing some of the same problems that you are - my mother is an ACoA and carried much of the dysfunction into our family in addition to the family addiction problems where my parents frequently left me to deal with the addict. (what came first, the chicken or the egg?) One day, things became too much and I found the courage to emotionally walk away - after destroying a relationship with my ACoA issues and family dysfunction. Now, I find myself at a loss trying to repair the damage done in myself and my life.
its hard for me to relate to people who don't understand what I'm going through, but most people in a situation like this at our age aren't ready, willing, or aware enough to seek help. You need to find an Al-Anon or ACoA meeting near you, I have found that it is the only thing that helps me through. Though there aren't many people our age there, they still understand at a deeper level that my social friends do not understand.
I will tell you some good advice given to me in another forum...be ready to view everyone in your family and life differently, because once you begin the journey away from the system of dysfunction, it is like a security blanket being taken away. You will feel like your world has turned upside-down - just take comfort in that you are not alone.
Remember this about addiction/alcoholism...You didn't cause it, you can't control it and you can't cure it...it's time to take care of yourself, and stop trying to manage your mom. I hate to say it, this includes showing the video at family therapy. Until your mom decides to help herself, it will do no good. She will either get the help she needs or she won't, and your responsibility now is to take back control of your life...
I'm 23 and my addict/alcoholic is my brother. I'm facing some of the same problems that you are - my mother is an ACoA and carried much of the dysfunction into our family in addition to the family addiction problems where my parents frequently left me to deal with the addict. (what came first, the chicken or the egg?) One day, things became too much and I found the courage to emotionally walk away - after destroying a relationship with my ACoA issues and family dysfunction. Now, I find myself at a loss trying to repair the damage done in myself and my life.
its hard for me to relate to people who don't understand what I'm going through, but most people in a situation like this at our age aren't ready, willing, or aware enough to seek help. You need to find an Al-Anon or ACoA meeting near you, I have found that it is the only thing that helps me through. Though there aren't many people our age there, they still understand at a deeper level that my social friends do not understand.
I will tell you some good advice given to me in another forum...be ready to view everyone in your family and life differently, because once you begin the journey away from the system of dysfunction, it is like a security blanket being taken away. You will feel like your world has turned upside-down - just take comfort in that you are not alone.
Remember this about addiction/alcoholism...You didn't cause it, you can't control it and you can't cure it...it's time to take care of yourself, and stop trying to manage your mom. I hate to say it, this includes showing the video at family therapy. Until your mom decides to help herself, it will do no good. She will either get the help she needs or she won't, and your responsibility now is to take back control of your life...
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Also, something else about showing the video at therapy...you don't have to give up on your mom...you just have to let go, which means accepting that you cannot control the results of the situation. Al Anon will really help you, or even just looking up the 12 steps will be a huge help...I'm a beginner at this and it's already my new foundation.
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