baxter

Ok, one thing I've really worked at is the "defending myself" part. When AD would get into one of her rants about her childhood and I would see things differently I would immediately get on the defensive. I do realize that the way she remembers things are as real to her as my memories are to me and we probably both have them a little mixed up about what really happened so I give her an apology for any hurt I might have done then - it wasn't intentional.

But what about when it's things that are recent? My oldest daughter is 42 my AD is 40. Oldest loves being with family, family get-togethers and so on. AD has always hated them and usually either makes excuses to leave early or not come at all. When she was young I'd make her go and she'd sit and pout in a corner all day and be rude to anyone who tried to talk to her. I was told by her grandfather one time he'd appreciate me leaving her home.......

We have a camper at a local campground and stay there almost all summer. Everyone comes up on weekends, AD usually shows up drunk with her boyfriend, stays awhile then leaves to go party. The grandkids usually stay. Oldest one bought a camper behind ours a couple years ago and my husband's son also has a camper close by and travels from the city to stay most weekends. Last year hubby and I bought a new/used camper and oldest wanted to buy our old one, we sold it to her.

Now one of AD's rants is that we never asked her if she wanted it. This is the girl who can't wait to leave when she's up there, won't even spend the night with her girls, doesn't have a spare dime. I didn't, in my wildest moment, even think she'd want it.

Now a year later, the other day when she started in on me out of the blue that's exactly what I said -
Me: "I'm sorry, I didn't think you'd even want a thing to do with it, you hate camping."
I get back from her "No, of course you wouldn't think of me mom. You've never thought of me my whole life. It's always her, her, her. I'm never setting foot up there again and you can all BITE ME."

This is when I have a hard time either: 1) not driving right to her house and slapping her - not really and 2) driving to her house to defend myself and then I get even more upset thinking why should I have to. I did neither - all I said was "no more of these verbal attacks - you want to talk sense I will but I don't want to hear any more - got another BITE ME.

Don't the siblings that have never, ever brought a bit of trouble to the table deserve anything? After all AD has stole from me I should still keep bending over backwards to please her. One thing good though is everytime I get the threat she never wants to see any of us again is that a feeling of peacefulness comes over me.

That's the hard thing I have breaking away from - defending myself or is it that trying to talk sense to an addict? She really seems quite sober and drug free when she does these attacks.

laurie6781

She is QUACKING and 'manipulating' to push your buttons and get a response.

When we change our own actions, the reactions to us change.

You can choose NOT to discuss it. Simply answers, no apologies.

"Your problem, not mine."

"Not going there."

"That is your perception."

etc

and then change the subject.

She won't like it, and if she persists,

"I have to go now." (If on phone)

"You'll have to leave now, I have an appointment." (If she is at your home.)

She does this to get a 'rise' out of you.

So now, change your responses and actions (ie changing the 'playing field').

These are her perceptions and EXCUSES for everything in her life, which in her denial gives her permission to continue to use.

J M H O

Love and hugs,

ps: Have you tried Alanon, Naranon, private counseling?

Seren

Yep, just her using guilt and anger to keep you from talking about the real issues and to keep her from facing her own issues.

My A stepson would do EXACTLY the same thing. Once Mr. HG and I refused to play the game, it eventually stopped. Does it happen right away, no, but it did happen.

Someone here told me once, "He can't get your goat if he doesn't know where you tied it."

Good luck and much patience! Hugs, HG

Kindeyes

There is no need to defend yourself. My AS and XAH do the same thing. Just because they say it does not mean it is true.

A simple "I'm sorry you feel that way." can work well.

The A tries to get us to engage. They try to use our guilt and anger as a weapon against us. And we (at least speaking for myself here) often willingly hand our guilt and anger over to them so that they can continue to bash us in the head with it.

It reminds me of something my dear brother (who is a wonderful therapist) once told me after I told him about all the guilt, anger, frustration etc. I had towards my son and xah. He suggested that I should go downtown and find a large brick....hand it over to a stranger on the street and let him hit me in the head with it.

I thought.....what kind of wierdo therapist are you....but I asked him instead "Why on earth would I do that?"

He simply said "It would be less painful."

I thought about it for a while and realized that I was handing my guilt, anger, frustration, fear (and every other emotion) to them....and allowing them to bash me in the head with it. THEY were in control of my emotions...I wasn't.

I began to picture these emotions as "my brick". MY brick. And I don't hand it over to anyone that I don't trust with it.

gentle hugs
ke

dbh

At first I was hesitant to respond to this post. I'm not a parent of an addict nor do I currently have any active addicts in my life. However, I'm an adult child of an alcoholic and was able to relate to both sides on this post.

First of all, even though I'm not an addict I have said similar things to my own mother. Growing up in a dysfunctional home caused the members of my family of origin to interact in extremely unhealthy ways. My mother, sister, and I were codependent and developed a toxic way of interacting with each other. My mom would complain about my sister to me and about me to my sister. She would compare us and sort of pit us against one another. It created a lot of chaos and drama. Something that we were all used to. I didn't start to truly understand how dysfunctional our relationships were until I started my own recovery (attending Al-Anon/ACA), read "Codependent No More", and hung around on-line recovery groups.

What worked for me was to disengage from the drama. We've been playing these roles with each other for so long it's very hard to interact differently. I found that I had to not talk to either of them as often and I don't get together with both of them (it's better one on one). I've also set boundaries, like asking my mother not to talk about my sister's problems with me. Slowly our relationships have changed. It's different, but so much better.

I actually still think my mom favors my sister, but recovery has taught me that it doesn't matter. My mom is who she is and I have forgiven her for mistakes she has made. Just as I have forgiven myself. I have stopped looking towards my mother for approval and validation. I'm just learning to do this at the age of 48!

During the course of my own recovery, I've learned to accept my past and try to make the best future I can for myself. Until someone actually owns their recovery I don't think much progress can be made. Progress can also not be made as long as someone is still "using" (alcohol, drugs, food, sex, codependent behavior) whatever substance they're using to numb their emotions.

So, I work on the only person that I can change - myself. I know I can't change the members of my family of origin, but I'm also trying to not contribute to the dysfunction anymore.

My alcoholic father drank his entire life and recently died at the age of 71. A couple months before he died he was still blaming my mother for his drinking and they had been divorced for over thirty years!

I hope this doesn't happen to your daughter. I hope that she is eventually able to find a way past her anger and towards serenity.

Thank you for sharing and for letting me share.

db

dollydo

Sometimes we just need to remove the drama from our life. If she disrupts your peace when you are at your camper, I would not invite her. I would be clear and concise as to my reasons.

You are entitled to a life free of her toxic behavior, you raised her, she as an adult and made the bad choices, you did not, for every bad action there is a bad reaction.

Don't shortchange your other children because of her, that is just not fair. It is her problem to address, this nasty behavior reaches beyond your relationship with her, there are others that she dumps on, she is immature and spoiled and her behavior speaks for itself.

baxter

Another thing about my oldest. When she left home for college, got her Masters in Geology, she joined Alanon on campus. Never, ever knew about it until a few years ago. Although she watched me struggle with my AD she never said a word or that she works a program herself. Of course she was working it through in regard to me also. Only when I started working on myself did she say "I was hoping you'd find it sometime." It gives her strength, she's found herself, love and peace in her family and takes no flack from her sister. She has always had her boundaries set. She'll take her sister on a good day and leave her behind when she crosses the line.

I try not to talk to her much about AD except on some days I just tell her it's a rough day and we leave it at that.

dollydo

That is one of the positive things you learn from being in recovery, you gain the strength to set bounderies and stick to them.

You are still taking the flack from your AD, hopefully you too, will follow your older daughters lead and set and enforce your bounderies.