for those of you who are still with the A.
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 10
for those of you who are still with the A.
If you don't mind, i'd like to ask a question.
My mom has been married five times, three were physically, emotionally, mentally abusive, thus the divorce, one passed away, and now she has finally found someone who treats her with respect, love, and adoration. I have five brothers and sisters, and i have seen the affects of divorce in all of us. Thus, i am kinda pretty much terrified of having my boys going through the same thing of not having a father. I will not put them in any danger, just to escape divorce, so no worries there, and i will do what is best for them regardless of my feelings, but i would like to know why you stayed, for those of you that did. And how you get through it, every day.
My mom has been married five times, three were physically, emotionally, mentally abusive, thus the divorce, one passed away, and now she has finally found someone who treats her with respect, love, and adoration. I have five brothers and sisters, and i have seen the affects of divorce in all of us. Thus, i am kinda pretty much terrified of having my boys going through the same thing of not having a father. I will not put them in any danger, just to escape divorce, so no worries there, and i will do what is best for them regardless of my feelings, but i would like to know why you stayed, for those of you that did. And how you get through it, every day.
Abnormally normal
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: Los Angeles, Ca.
Posts: 306
Because sometimes you want to believe that ur doing the best while having ur kids intentions at heart. Some realize it early enough, and some don't. Thus, having the kids go through what they shouldn't. Making excuses for the sake of a stable "family".
I had my dad til I was 13. Have been ever since, trying to find that father figure. Its just unfortunate that it fell on my kids for a while. Also unfortunate that it took a while before realizing what I was doing to my kids and how just having them in that environment is dentramental to their mental stability. And it took a while before I realized that what I was doing wasnt right.
Yet, Sometimes..its just not about the kids. As much as it should be...
at least thats what i have to believe. That i wasnt left bcus of something I did!!
I had my dad til I was 13. Have been ever since, trying to find that father figure. Its just unfortunate that it fell on my kids for a while. Also unfortunate that it took a while before realizing what I was doing to my kids and how just having them in that environment is dentramental to their mental stability. And it took a while before I realized that what I was doing wasnt right.
Yet, Sometimes..its just not about the kids. As much as it should be...
at least thats what i have to believe. That i wasnt left bcus of something I did!!
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,294
Originally Posted by justanotherfool 
... i am kinda pretty much terrified of having my boys going through the same thing of not having a father.
You are not talking about a father. You are talking about an active alcoholic, and a cloistered system of enablers, and then a basket-case resentful low self-esteem unhappy mother (perhaps you are not this now, but you will become this in this system). THIS is the system you would be giving your sons, not the happy go lucky "intact family." The best you are likely to get with the present system is that your sons will grow up to be just like their dad, and you will STILL be the outsider, held at arm's length and given second-rate status.
The damage your sons will sustain by developing in an alcoholic family will make any adjustments to a divorce pale in comparison. And who's to say if you were to divorce that you would not then find a wonderful new partner who could provide a healthy role model for your sons? This will never happen if you cling to the alcoholic father, and a dream that isn't reality.
CLMI
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Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Illinois
Posts: 23
I stayed because my AH is not abusive, he worked and he loved our kids and they loved him. I viewed it as every family has problems. No one is perfect. It could be alcohol, it could be gambling, it could be health issues or being constantly unemployed. Any abuse would have been a game changer. I believe that the grass is not always greener on the other side and I feel staying was the right thing for our family. My kids are now 25 and 22 and they are completely aware of their father's alcoholism (and have been). Have there been some issues and some embarrassing situations? Certainly. But that can occur with a multitude of problems like a parent that is too controlling, suffers from a mental illness, etc.
I have no regrets about staying with the A for the sake of the family and strongly feel I did the right thing for my family and my situation. My kids have never questioned me about it and are happy to have us for parents, BOTH of us.
Now that the kids are grown, I do not feel I need to hold anything together, but that is a story for another day.
I have no regrets about staying with the A for the sake of the family and strongly feel I did the right thing for my family and my situation. My kids have never questioned me about it and are happy to have us for parents, BOTH of us.
Now that the kids are grown, I do not feel I need to hold anything together, but that is a story for another day.
Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 1,243
I am ACOA and grew up in an extremely unstable and on occasion scary and dangerous home. I begged my mother to leave my alcoholic father and she refused because he had threatened to burn the house down and kill us all if she did... as a codependent and product of her generation she didn't have the resolve or courage to protect us children. We are all emotionally scarred from the experience and our lives all reflect this.... too long to share our stories but it is not good.
In my own life my own addiction is work and I am textbook workaholic. Additonally I have always subconsciously sought relationships with addictive personalities while they instinctively have sought me out (like a magnet we always seem to find eachother even when the addiction itself is in the future and isn't evident at the time of courting). My first husband became a cocaine addict after we married and for eight years I stayed in the marriage trying to keep it together for the kids.
My kids are now grown and I raised them myself with zero help from their dad. I did make sure they had good therapists and strong role models growing up. I never trashed their dad and in fact worked hard at allowing them the luxury of believing their dad was a great guy until they discovered differently on their own. They respect me so much for not trying to poison them against him and the extremes they know I went to in order to make sure they were always safe when with him.
My son has been in a long term relationship with an extremely needy girl (she has depression issues) and he is planning on marrying her. Looking back my codependency issues became a part of how I raised my children and I think it has now passed onto the next generation.
Both my son and future daughter in law are in counseling with a very good therapist and both are aware of their problems and issues.
So... my advice to you is to spend a lot of time reading good literature on the complex subject of addiction and codependency and healthy relationships. Find a great counselor and if at all possible get your kids in a situation where they can start evaluating their own thoughts and feelings about the issues and relationships they are forming with counseling.
Al-anon has been very helpful for me and I am still in counseling for myself.
My prayer is that when my own children have children they will not suffer the consequences of any addictive behaviors by any adults in their lives... completely normal family dynamics!
No one can tell you whether it is better for your kids for you to leave or to stay or what the right timing may be ... but counseling will help your evaluation process and better understand why we feel and act the way we do as individuals.
Only your HP knows what you need to do... for me connecting with God has dropped all the puzzle pieces into place and I now understand so much but it took decades! Wish this site had been available when I was 13 and struggling as a child ... maybe things would have been different!
In my own life my own addiction is work and I am textbook workaholic. Additonally I have always subconsciously sought relationships with addictive personalities while they instinctively have sought me out (like a magnet we always seem to find eachother even when the addiction itself is in the future and isn't evident at the time of courting). My first husband became a cocaine addict after we married and for eight years I stayed in the marriage trying to keep it together for the kids.
My kids are now grown and I raised them myself with zero help from their dad. I did make sure they had good therapists and strong role models growing up. I never trashed their dad and in fact worked hard at allowing them the luxury of believing their dad was a great guy until they discovered differently on their own. They respect me so much for not trying to poison them against him and the extremes they know I went to in order to make sure they were always safe when with him.
My son has been in a long term relationship with an extremely needy girl (she has depression issues) and he is planning on marrying her. Looking back my codependency issues became a part of how I raised my children and I think it has now passed onto the next generation.
Both my son and future daughter in law are in counseling with a very good therapist and both are aware of their problems and issues.
So... my advice to you is to spend a lot of time reading good literature on the complex subject of addiction and codependency and healthy relationships. Find a great counselor and if at all possible get your kids in a situation where they can start evaluating their own thoughts and feelings about the issues and relationships they are forming with counseling.
Al-anon has been very helpful for me and I am still in counseling for myself.
My prayer is that when my own children have children they will not suffer the consequences of any addictive behaviors by any adults in their lives... completely normal family dynamics!
No one can tell you whether it is better for your kids for you to leave or to stay or what the right timing may be ... but counseling will help your evaluation process and better understand why we feel and act the way we do as individuals.
Only your HP knows what you need to do... for me connecting with God has dropped all the puzzle pieces into place and I now understand so much but it took decades! Wish this site had been available when I was 13 and struggling as a child ... maybe things would have been different!
Member
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 588
My AH became a closet drinker after one of our first conversations regarding my concern that maybe his drinking was becoming a problem. He stayed a participating and active father, kept employed, was respectful to me and did his drinking initially late at night after I was gone to bed. He would very infrequently binge (like once in six months) and even that was mild compared to some of the stories I've read here. There was so little evidence of his drinking much less being an alcoholic that I was unawares for years and when I started to have suspicions I wondered if I was crazy for having them.
He maintained for years and years and the whole time was a good father and a respectful husband.
(I know some say the lying about drinking is disrespectful, but I think if you accept that someone is an alcoholic you accept that they will lie about the drinking. That's what they do. I have not found him to lie about anything else.)
When the kids went away to college his drinking escalated. I determined to tell the children at that time because I didn't want them to ever get in the car with him because I had caught him driving drunk. One of the kids had figured it out (she was the last to leave) and the other two did not know. (The kids and I have talked about this alot and they tell me they truly did not know and they don't feel they were raised in an alcoholic household. I know others will say this isn't possible. I am just saying what I experienced and what they tell me they experienced.)
After this revelation, we had a bit of a crisis when he tried to detox cold turkey. He was hospitalized for two weeks, during which I put a breathalyzer on his car. After that, he went back to closet drinking /maintaining at a much lower level. I haven't actually seen him drink for years. Even relatives that were finally told of his alcoholism when he was hospitalized think he's still quit. When he drinks in the evening he just gets quieter, and then goes to bed around 9:30 p.m.
He still keeps his kids at the top of his concerns (as much as an active alcoholic can) and he is still respectful of me, contributes around the house, is employed, etc. It can be lonely sometimes when I know he's drunk and I really don't want to talk with someone who's not "there", but on the whole he's polite, considerate, helpful and accommodating. We don't argue. There's no drama.
My story, for the most part, is not what I read here although there have been certain snapshots and descriptions I can really identify with. I am aware that alcoholism is progressive (I saw it progress when the kids left) and I wonder for the future. He has no program and I have Alanon. I am breaking out of the isolation I imposed and starting to live a fuller life.
It's not ideal, but I'm okay with things as they are today. That may change.
He maintained for years and years and the whole time was a good father and a respectful husband.
(I know some say the lying about drinking is disrespectful, but I think if you accept that someone is an alcoholic you accept that they will lie about the drinking. That's what they do. I have not found him to lie about anything else.)
When the kids went away to college his drinking escalated. I determined to tell the children at that time because I didn't want them to ever get in the car with him because I had caught him driving drunk. One of the kids had figured it out (she was the last to leave) and the other two did not know. (The kids and I have talked about this alot and they tell me they truly did not know and they don't feel they were raised in an alcoholic household. I know others will say this isn't possible. I am just saying what I experienced and what they tell me they experienced.)
After this revelation, we had a bit of a crisis when he tried to detox cold turkey. He was hospitalized for two weeks, during which I put a breathalyzer on his car. After that, he went back to closet drinking /maintaining at a much lower level. I haven't actually seen him drink for years. Even relatives that were finally told of his alcoholism when he was hospitalized think he's still quit. When he drinks in the evening he just gets quieter, and then goes to bed around 9:30 p.m.
He still keeps his kids at the top of his concerns (as much as an active alcoholic can) and he is still respectful of me, contributes around the house, is employed, etc. It can be lonely sometimes when I know he's drunk and I really don't want to talk with someone who's not "there", but on the whole he's polite, considerate, helpful and accommodating. We don't argue. There's no drama.
My story, for the most part, is not what I read here although there have been certain snapshots and descriptions I can really identify with. I am aware that alcoholism is progressive (I saw it progress when the kids left) and I wonder for the future. He has no program and I have Alanon. I am breaking out of the isolation I imposed and starting to live a fuller life.
It's not ideal, but I'm okay with things as they are today. That may change.
Member
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 1,294
Be careful, also, of comparing your situation to those of both-American couples who are living in American culture.
In your situation, cultural forces are an equal consideration to the Alcoholism.
You are isolated. You are and will remain an outsider in Japanese culture. You are second tier as a female, and moreso as an outsider. You have produced sons, but at the same time are nowhere near the Japanese daughter-in-law your in-laws most likely really wanted. You challenge your husband's behavior, and his parent's culture - both taboo in that culture. You did produce sons, but they are not pure Japanese, so they also are unfortunately docked status due to this, as is their father for marrying a foreigner, and a "disrespectful" one at that.
Do not underestimated these forces! Your window where YOU get to make decisions is FAST closing, after which you are STUCK, period. Do not underestimate going up against a culture and family system, even in the ABSENCE of alcoholism. You have both!
This is not meant to be disrespectful of Japanese people or to disparage their culture, only to recognize that their cultural values are very different from American values, and unless you are willing to give up your American values you will never prevail in this set of circumstances staying there in that setting.
Said with respect,
CLMI
In your situation, cultural forces are an equal consideration to the Alcoholism.
You are isolated. You are and will remain an outsider in Japanese culture. You are second tier as a female, and moreso as an outsider. You have produced sons, but at the same time are nowhere near the Japanese daughter-in-law your in-laws most likely really wanted. You challenge your husband's behavior, and his parent's culture - both taboo in that culture. You did produce sons, but they are not pure Japanese, so they also are unfortunately docked status due to this, as is their father for marrying a foreigner, and a "disrespectful" one at that.
Do not underestimated these forces! Your window where YOU get to make decisions is FAST closing, after which you are STUCK, period. Do not underestimate going up against a culture and family system, even in the ABSENCE of alcoholism. You have both!
This is not meant to be disrespectful of Japanese people or to disparage their culture, only to recognize that their cultural values are very different from American values, and unless you are willing to give up your American values you will never prevail in this set of circumstances staying there in that setting.
Said with respect,
CLMI
Member
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Quebec
Posts: 2,708
Originally Posted by justanotherfool
I will not put them in any danger, just to escape divorce, so no worries there, and i will do what is best for them regardless of my feelings, but i would like to know why you stayed, for those of you that did. And how you get through it, every day.
As CatLoverMi has stated, be careful not to disregard the dangerous elements in your particular situation and do not understimate the power/influence of an Asian family in protecting its honor against someone who would tarnish it. I have two male cousins who both have gone against the grain, and the family has done its utmost to hide their "misdeeds"; one is obviously gay and cohabitating with his partner, but no one ever dares to mention his sexual orientation, nor will they allow others to do so. The other cousin is a lazy spoiled drug addict; his 65 year old mother continues to work full-time to provide him with a place to live, a BMW and a job. Everything surrounding his life that isn't on the up and up has been buried.
This may be a biased assessment, but from where I stand, Vietnamese culture, especially Vietnamese-American culture, is nowhere near as strict or extreme as Japanese culture. I do hope you take that into account when you consider your options.
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